# Prowl with 2-4D?



## Edd in KY (Jul 16, 2009)

I have read you past posts on using Prowl for foxtail. I think I will give it a go in the spring (March), worth a try. I read that prowl will prevent 90% of the seed bank from emerging. But, I was wondering if I could have my commercial sprayer mix Prowl with 2 -4 D or Crossbow to get both pre and post emergent in the same spray application? Have any of you tried this? I am also a bit confused when reading the label about grazing restrictions. Can I use Prowl safely on horse pastures? I could not find it in the literature.


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## calico190xt (9 mo ago)

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=&ved=2ahUKEwi9iZG8-br6AhV5pIkEHV8MDxgQFnoECAcQAQ&url=https%3A%2F%2Fagriculture.basf.us%2Fcontent%2Fdam%2Fcxm%2Fagriculture%2Fcrop-protection%2Fproducts%2Fdocuments%2FBASF_TechBulletin_ProwlH20_Alfalfa_HighPlains_medres.pdf&usg=AOvVaw2wY_n1JK60KpFtI9rEjjLS



Hope this link works. Here is a link I found for Prowl H2O. This answered a few of my questions related to alfalfa. I think the pre-harvest interval is the number of days you need to wait until you harvest it. If you put on 2 qt/Acre then it is 28 days. If you use greater than 2 Qt/Acre then it is 50 days. I don't know how different Prowl h2O is from Prowl. If you sprayed it in March, you would be good assuming you cut in late May or early June. It does say on this document that it could be applied in the fall after dormancy. I think it might still be better to wait until Spring.


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## calico190xt (9 mo ago)

I forgot to mention that I am guessing that you could use it on Horse Pastures but they would have to stay off of it for 50 days after application. I don't know about mixing things either. I thought Prowl H2o was a 2,4D derivative.


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## AndyH359 (Jan 3, 2012)

Per the Prowl H2O label related to cool season grasses:
-There is no preharvest or pre-grazing interval (yes the time between chemical application and mowing) for ProwlH2O treated grass forage, green chop, silage, hay, pasture, or rangeland.
-Mixed stand alfalfa/cool season forage grasses may be grazed or harvested for forage or hay 14 or more days after applying ProwlH2O.
-Do not apply ProwlH2O to mixed stands of cool-season forage grasses with other forage legumes besides alfalfa.

The 28/50 day pre-harvet/pre-grazing intervals are for pure alfalfa stands.

I have been using ProwlH2O for several years in my orchard grass/timothy hay. Works great in eradicating foxtail and keeping it under control. I have done a single 4Qt/Ac application at the end of March (I am in Western PA) as soon as the fields are dry enough to get on. I have done split application of 2Qt/Ac end of March and 2Qt/Ac immediately after first cutting. PSU research says the split application is more effective, but to me the difference was minimal. It was easier to do a single 4Qt/Ac application in March and be done with it for the year. Yes, you could do a fall application but as calico190xt pointed out, probably better to wait until Spring (and not loose chemical potency over the winter.) Only way I could see fall application being useful is if you don't think you can get over the spray down early enough in the spring. No chemical is effective on weeds sitting in a jug in your barn.

ProwlH2O and 2-4,D work in vastly different ways that make combining them in a single pass/tank mix a waste of one or the other from my perspective. ProwlH2O works by preventing weed seeds in the ground from germinating. Once they germinate, ProwlH2O does nothing for them. 2-4,D works by being absorbed by the weed foliage that the spray lands on. So if the weed plant isn't there, the 2-4,D does nothing to prevent the broadleaf weeds.

ProwlH2O is a BASF product. Google it and you can usually find the product label on line. If you have questions, you can always take it to your local Extension Agent and he can help you interpret it for your specific situation.


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## Edd in KY (Jul 16, 2009)

My goal with the prowl application is to control foxtail. That is why I thought perhaps I cold spray late enough in March to nip the early sprouting weeds with 2-4,D, but also control the foxtail which (as I understand it) does not germinate until mid-summer heat ...ground temp 70F. I am not sure about the foxtail germination. In your experience does the Prowl also have a big impact controlling broadleaf weeds? Getting a spring spraying done at the right time is a challenge due to soft ground, weather and busy custom sprayers.


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## AndyH359 (Jan 3, 2012)

I have not noticed a big difference in my broadleaf weed pressure since I started on the ProwlH2O. But then again, I was using a 2-4,D/Dicamba for several years before I started the ProwlH2O so my broadleaf weeds were pretty suppressed already. I can tell you that the ProwlH2O made no difference in the canadian thistle, milkweed, and hemp dogbane weeds that have been my biggest issue the last few years. The 2-4,D and Dicamba, on the other hand, have been whacking them back pretty good.


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## calico190xt (9 mo ago)

AndyH359 said:


> Per the Prowl H2O label related to cool season grasses:
> -There is no preharvest or pre-grazing interval (yes the time between chemical application and mowing) for ProwlH2O treated grass forage, green chop, silage, hay, pasture, or rangeland.
> -Mixed stand alfalfa/cool season forage grasses may be grazed or harvested for forage or hay 14 or more days after applying ProwlH2O.
> -Do not apply ProwlH2O to mixed stands of cool-season forage grasses with other forage legumes besides alfalfa.
> ...


Thanks for all of this info, particularly the difference on Prowl H2O and 2-4,d. I am new to applying this stuff so great help. My new concern is getting it applied correctly since I am using my own custom built sprayer. I am sure I can get the tank mixed right. Just getting my ground speed to match my nozzle size will be the next challenge. My idea is to fill the tank with water for 1 acre and take a guess at ground speed and where the 1 acre line is on the field. Spray it until I get it about right. I am not sure there are any other tricks to figure it out. EDD to Ky's point, I had trouble getting my local ag sprayer to spray my fields in the past since they were so busy handling guys that farm 1000s of acres. They basically ignored me so I had to get a sprayer if I was going to be in control of my spraying.

I think I like the idea of spraying once in March with the heavier application in light of your comments. However, if I get it done later than March 15th and I want to cut Alfalfa in May, I will have to watch out for the 50 day pre-harvest timeline. I only seem to have fox tail in Alfalfa and foxtail/crabgrass in my OG fields so 2,4D might not be needed. I am thinking about spraying2,4D around the outside edges of my fields to keep the other nasties away though.

My plan for next year is coming together. Thanks.


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## danwi (Mar 6, 2015)

There are formulas out there for how to calibrate a sprayer. You need a measured distance based on nozzle spacing, given in a chart then you need to travel that distance at the ground speed you want to travel, time yourself in seconds. Then while stationary collect the output of a nozzle in a container and measure onces then plug into the formula and it will give you gallons per acre. Off the top of my head I think you divide by 2 have to check that. You can adjust output a little by pressure otherwise you have to change tips or ground speed. You should also check all tips for equal output. Or at least a sampling not just one. Hard to calibrate using one acre of water because you will have a gallon of water in hoses and at 20 gallons per acre you would be off by 5 percent, if you did say 10 acres you would get closer.


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## calico190xt (9 mo ago)

danwi said:


> There are formulas out there for how to calibrate a sprayer. You need a measured distance based on nozzle spacing, given in a chart then you need to travel that distance at the ground speed you want to travel, time yourself in seconds. Then while stationary collect the output of a nozzle in a container and measure onces then plug into the formula and it will give you gallons per acre. Off the top of my head I think you divide by 2 have to check that. You can adjust output a little by pressure otherwise you have to change tips or ground speed. You should also check all tips for equal output. Or at least a sampling not just one. Hard to calibrate using one acre of water because you will have a gallon of water in hoses and at 20 gallons per acre you would be off by 5 percent, if you did say 10 acres you would get closer.


Danwi, thanks for good advice. I should have done a search on boom sprayer calibration which is what you suggest above. I will watch a couple of Videos, run the numbers and figure this out. One of the formulas I found helps you figure out total herbicide and water that you should need to use which is handy too. I might still run a water test once I come up with something, just to put a reasonableness check in my findings. 

Everytime I have had to use this sprayer, I have to clean all tips and there is always one that gives me trouble but will have to make sure they all work equally. Water test will give me that too. Thanks.


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## PaulN (Mar 4, 2014)

Calico, if you have a smartphone, download a GPS app. That will give you your ground speed.​


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## Edd in KY (Jul 16, 2009)

Calibration videos and formula. I have a couple small boom sprayers. I used the calibration formula and process below.
Pick a gear and set the RPM's on the tach that match a speed that you want to drive....for comfort and good turning control....write it down. Then use that gear and RPM for your calculations and also use that RPM to set your pump pressure for the calibration. That will calculate how many gallons of water you are applying per acre. So say your calibrate that you are applying 18 gallons per acre and if you want 1 quart of chemical per acre....add 1 qt. for every 18 gallons of water.

I did it that way and I have been amazed how accurate it set the spray. If I put in 2 acres worth of water...it will be running out of spray just as I finish a paddock known to be 2 acres.

I used this method.


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## calico190xt (9 mo ago)

I kind of hijacked this post for Edd in Ky that he started but thanks for all of the suggestions and I will be ready to spray. I already own one 2.5 gallon jug of Prowl h2O that I will keep in the house.


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## AndyH359 (Jan 3, 2012)

calico190xt said:


> I already own one 2.5 gallon jug of Prowl h2O that I will keep in the house.


ProwlH2O can tolerate freezing. Just make sure it is fully thawed before use. So storage in an unheated barn corner over the winter is fine.

To me, letting it freeze is preferred over risking chemical spill/exposure to the family by having it in the house.


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## Markpnw (Dec 27, 2019)

Also when spraying make sure to download or find what your state requires to keep for records of what you sprayed. That way if they ever inspect you can show all the records. It’s very simple and straightforward. E.G product name, location, wind speed, time, etc. Read the label thoroughly of the product you’re using. Label is law when it comes to how to use the product properly.


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