# Unrealistic Expectations...



## ARD Farm

Square bales are at a premium here, latest input from the local hay auction was 10 bucks a bale for small squares of mixed legumes.

Anyway, the lady across the road called my wife with a 'deal'. She had a friend who found small squares 4 hours away on the other end of the state for 4 bucks a bale but she has to buy 2000 bales..

Of course my wife understands the logistics of hay and what it takes to transport it, store it and all the not so wonderful labor aspects. This lady has some kids who would never throw a bale, let alone 2000 bales. They might throw a gameboy, but thats about it.

I understand her dad has a 40 foot gooseneck, tandem axle so they are all geeked about hauling back 2000 bales. My wife tried to explain it was about 8 trips give or take but she never heard that.

I'm sure this is going to be very interesting and amusing to watch and no. I'm not going to offer any assistance or barn storage space.

They are horse people BTW.

I have this feeling that it will be 2000 bales from hell.

I'm wondering how stupid the prices will get around here by Christmas.... and just how much I'm going to make on small squares.....

They never buy hay from us BTW, we are always 'too expensive'.....lol


----------



## somedevildawg

Lol, funny, let us know how that works out for her....people are so flipping stupid sometimes....and has no idea what the hell she's buying....go figure,


----------



## JD3430

Sounds like some video of her kids "throwing hay" is in order!!!

Horse-owning neighbor to one of my fields came over and introduced herself. Said she gets hay for $3/bale. I've been hearing that from quite a few people around here. I tell them "that's a great price-you should keep buying hay from them". 
Strange how most of them end up paying me $5+/bale just a few weeks after they make that statement.


----------



## Tim/South

I am always amused when people out side the hay business think they have out smarted those who have been doing it for years. Like they are the only ones trying to think outside the box.

Farming must look a lot different from the road than from behind the check book.


----------



## Mike120

Tim/South said:


> Farming must look a lot different from the road than from behind the check book.


Everyone else's business is easier than your own.....


----------



## Teslan

There probably is a reason it's $4 even for 2000 bales. I bet your neighbor will do just one load and figure it out.


----------



## JD3430

prolly a bunch of milkweed.....lol


----------



## ARD Farm

JD3430 said:


> prolly a bunch of milkweed.....lol


Probably. I don't believe they know good green from not so good green.


----------



## steve in IN

Get a keg of beer and a BBQ grill then sell tickets for the hay producers to watch. At 250 bales a load and 200 miles one way the freight on the cheap side will be 2 bucks a bale then add in labor and WOW I can see why they think 5 dollars is too expensive . Gotta love people who are smarter at math then me.


----------



## somedevildawg

They are using what my momma called "new math"..... " fuzzy math" I think Reagan called it?


----------



## mlappin

somedevildawg said:


> They are using what my momma called "new math"..... " fuzzy math" I think Reagan called it?


Know known as Obama math. 50...57 states...what's the difference.


----------



## ARD Farm

Flash Newsbreak....
Update on the trip to the west end of the state for 'cheap' hay....

The lady across the road called my wife this morning from Ludington (where they went with her dad's gooseneck to pick up this 2000 bales of $4.00 hay that they expect to bring back and make a profit on (I think that is.....)

They were 'loading' up the gooseneck this morning. We haven't heard anything since. Knowing their stupidity, they are probably impounded at n the weigh station in Ionia, Michigan on I-96 or blew a tire and went in the ditch somewhere.

Problem is, it's raining here and has been. They have no idea what a tarp is or even how to tarp a load. Wet hay gets heavy (iier) real fast and the quality goes down hill real fast too.

Our hay fields are exploding. Looks like I'll get a first cut on third ot just opposite of a normal year. They could have gotten hay locally at a much better cost per bale, just not from me.

I'm an innocent bystander.

I'll keep everyone updated as the 'saga' unfolds. I'm sure it will get uglier and more interesting......


----------



## Mike120

Well, after this trip they'll have seven more to go.......At the end of this saga, you may have enough material for a book.


----------



## steve in IN

They are probably picking the load up off the interstate, while trying to figure out what an unsafe load ticket is.


----------



## ARD Farm

Well, they got in late last night and went to bed. Called this morning for my hay elevator (I'm getting real tired of being a good neighbor, be nice if the bought their own....)

According to the wife, the plan is selling enough at auction to pay for the fuel up and back. Scratch the labor. They brought back 350 bales on the traler. At my usual 50 per bale, thats 17,500 punds and I don't see that happening on a gooseneck so the bales must be lighter, much lighter.

Again, according to the wife, if they can sell enough to pay for the fuel, they will go again (and use my bale elevator again.....)


----------



## rjmoses

Ah, yes! Reminds me of that old car dealer joke: They lose a little on every car, but make it up in volume!

Maybe they should have bought 4,000 bales.

Ralph


----------



## swmnhay

_I think I seen them







_

_https://skydrive.live.com/?cid=4bb44fe93d88857e&Bsrc=Photomail&Bpub=SDX.Photos&resid=4BB44FE93D88857E!133&id=4BB44FE93D88857E%21133&sff=1_


----------



## ARD Farm

I took a gander at it from a distance..... It appears to be last years hay It's as brown as my deck is.

Don't matter. Horses are colorblind anyway and their owners are too I hear.

The local auction was pulling in the high nines per bale last week but I suspect thats not year old hay. It might be worth 4 bucks to some sucker but I doubt it.

We've had plenty of rain over a couple days so I'll be getting into some serious square bailing I suspect.


----------



## steve in IN

Just remember that to an outsider its all profit. Thy donit write a check for labor,fuel, or equipment(hay elevator) sorry bout that couldnt help it. The will get the check from the auction and think thyre rich.


----------



## ARD Farm

Thats all right. When it craps out (and it will) I'm not fixing it. I wish they'd buy it. I have no use for it. The loft in the barn has been devoid of hay for at least 10 years. I'm half tempted to cut it up and scrap it anyway.

I understand their motivation for horses. They have 2 really sharp teenage daughters and horses are a lot safer than country boys.


----------



## Mike120

If they are unloading, stacking, and planning on reloading and hauling to auction, even with your elevator they have a lot of labor in this business venture. You might consider offering them simular work at $2-3 per hour. Considering fuel, equipment miles, etc. That's probably a lot more that they'll make on this deal. But, the horses will get fed and I guess you can't put a price on a labor of love.


----------



## country boy

how many bolts does the motor on your elevator have on it ( you know a crackhead will take the damnest things )


----------



## somedevildawg

My horsey neighbor, who I've given hay to more times than I can count, busted bales, overage on squares etc. Wanted some hay last year, told them my price, now I should say I'm a bit higher than most around these parts, they drove 35 miles with a 16 ft trailer to buy 3 round rolls and "saved" a whopping 10 dollars a bale off the purchase price! Got home with it and wanted to borrow my FEL to unload.......never ceases to amaze me


----------



## RockmartGA

somedevildawg said:


> My horsey neighbor, who I've given hay to more times than I can count, busted bales, overage on squares etc. Wanted some hay last year, told them my price, now I should say I'm a bit higher than most around these parts, they drove 35 miles with a 16 ft trailer to buy 3 round rolls and "saved" a whopping 10 dollars a bale off the purchase price! Got home with it and wanted to borrow my FEL to unload.......never ceases to amaze me


Yep, set your expectations low for folks and you'll never be disappointed.... LOL

Which is why one of my favorite bumper sticker reads:

"I'm not anti-social. I just like my dog better than you"


----------



## swmnhay

somedevildawg said:


> My horsey neighbor, who I've given hay to more times than I can count, busted bales, overage on squares etc. Wanted some hay last year, told them my price, now I should say I'm a bit higher than most around these parts, they drove 35 miles with a 16 ft trailer to buy 3 round rolls and "saved" a whopping 10 dollars a bale off the purchase price! Got home with it and wanted to borrow my FEL to unload.......never ceases to amaze me


Isn't that the Obamamy way?They are entititled to yout FEL.


----------



## JD3430

I have about 100+ bales of "hit and miss" hay. Bale strings broke, little higher in moisture, little more weeds, etc. I sell it for $2/bale as opposed to $6.50/bale for good hay. Around here, $2/bale is unheard of. It's probably better quality than I give it credit for.

Naturally, I had a guy call me and ask me for a break on the $2/bale price.


----------



## Tim/South

JD3430 said:


> Naturally, I had a guy call me and ask me for a break on the $2/bale price.


You could be giving hay away and someone would want you to pay them to haul it away.


----------



## swmnhay

JD3430 said:


> I have about 100+ bales of "hit and miss" hay. Bale strings broke, little higher in moisture, little more weeds, etc. I sell it for $2/bale as opposed to $6.50/bale for good hay. Around here, $2/bale is unheard of. It's probably better quality than I give it credit for.
> 
> Naturally, I had a guy call me and ask me for a break on the $2/bale price.


Thats why I have cattle around.Feed up the mistakes.Why give it away,turn it into beef and sell that.


----------



## ARD Farm

Intrerestingly, the gummit is releasing CRP ground here for harvesting / bailing of forage. We are about to bid on 15 acres of CRP ground in clover and grass to bale and offer for sale for the landholder. The CRP payoff will drop a bit to offset the sale of the forage but at leat the landholder will receive some revenue.

CRP ground is usually a big No as far as cutting for profit. Interesting.

I imagine my neighbors will want the CRP produce for nothing......

Probably want my elevator to put it up too......


----------



## slowzuki

We get 3$ a bale here on the upper end. I have seen second cut going for 4-5$ but there isn't much brought in. I try to hold to 3$ a bale and feed anything that isn't worth selling.


----------



## somedevildawg

Wow, i can't make a $3 bale of Bermuda grass, unless it was 20" long and weighed 35 lbs. Just can't do it, math won't work out for ya....


----------



## ARD Farm

Small squares here are averaging between 7 and 11 bucks each at local hay auctions as of this week and I expect prices to be in the 12 - 15 buck range when the snow flies.

4x5 rounds of mixed legumes are at 65 to 100 per round, net wrap.

If I had a barn full, I'd be in Bermuda for Christmas and unlike the Prince, not playing at strip billiards............


----------



## slowzuki

How about this, I'm competing with people that sell for 1.50 a bale (45 lb thrower bales) People will quote this guys price all the time when I'm selling, I tell them thats great, you go buy some from him then. He sold out his dairy herd and quota (like a contract to supply a certain weight of milk) and just makes hay now with his paid off equipment. I think he makes 10,000+, not sure how he pays for breakdowns.



somedevildawg said:


> Wow, i can't make a $3 bale of Bermuda grass, unless it was 20" long and weighed 35 lbs. Just can't do it, math won't work out for ya....


----------



## JD3430

ARD Farm said:


> I imagine my neighbors will want the CRP produce for nothing......
> 
> Probably want my elevator to put it up too......


Where did it get engrained in the American psyche that the farmer is supposed to loan all his equipment for free, or do work for his wealthy neighbors for below market wages?
Should we show up in old coveralls, straw hat and pitchfork in hand to complete the presentation?


----------



## somedevildawg

slowzuki said:


> How about this, I'm competing with people that sell for 1.50 a bale (45 lb thrower bales) People will quote this guys price all the time when I'm selling, I tell them thats great, you go buy some from him then. He sold out his dairy herd and quota (like a contract to supply a certain weight of milk) and just makes hay now with his paid off equipment. I think he makes 10,000+, not sure how he pays for breakdowns.


Well here's my take on your local village idiot, the reason he sold his dairy herd and quota was because he was going broke, probably a combination of poor feed quality and an inability to process mathematical problems like calculating time, fuel, depreciation, etc. he fell asleep in those classes.....now the best thing is he thinks of breakdowns like health care, maybe the gov. Will come out with a program for that nonsense, breakdowns, don't worry about no stinkin breakdowns....besides he's making 15,000 by selling 10,000 square bales, what a bunch of dumbasses.....


----------



## ARD Farm

........but (and not defending the 'dumbass', if a quantity buy, it's desireable to offer below current price and it gets it moved. Case in point, last year we did a 5K bale run for the local road commish in wheat straw and gave them a deal. They needed a specific length for their berm blower. No problem. They got their bales we got paid.

That don't apply to small potato buyers. This year is unique in that it's a sellers market (especially here). Not into gouging but certainly into making a tidy profit. After all, I did turn off the water spigot.


----------



## mlappin

Have the same thing around here, most years always hear about somebody selling $1 small squares or $20 round bales. If I can't get at least $35 a round for my cheapest stuff then it sits in the barn till next year or gets fed to my cows.


----------



## ARD Farm

God we need some moisture. The soybeans have a bad case of mites, the corn is falling over, dead.

I just ran 17 acres of alfalfa-grass and bailed a whole 66 small squares. Thats desperation on my customer's part. I get paid no matter. It's interesting running a 575 high capacity fast enough across a field to keep the chamber half full and get a half assed good bale....................

Looking at 100 dollar rounds and 10 buck squares here.

I'm kind of suprised the well hasn't went dry yet. It did in 88. I punched it down as far as my finances allowed then. I made myself a promise I'd always have water. Not good water, but water nonetheless.


----------



## somedevildawg

Let em sell it for nothing.....and when they are gone out of business......hammer time!

Agreed on the quantity pricing, will do the same on wheat straw or peanut (not perennial ) hay, these are a bonus and a byproduct of another crop, when talking about alfalfa or Bermuda grass (I guess with alfalfa) you can only sell at an above cost equation or you stand to lose exponentially more $ if you can't do the math. That means factoring even more and I'm not sure some of these guys can spell factor....IMHO. By the way, if I can't get 3 $ a bale I'm going in reverse....need to average 5 to make a little money, 6 to be able to pay some bills, and 7 to buy Christmas for the chillen.....


----------



## ARD Farm

None of it is mine as in owned acres.

It's all customers acres that I machine for them.

I never loose. I don't get rich either. I feel their pain this year.

In a normal year like last year, I pull the excess and feed my wife's nags, usually on shares for machine work. This year that never happened but I had a preminition last year that this year was going to be different so I 'salted' away an extra 50 rounds of clover over wheat straw and I'm glad I did.

Don't ask how I knew because I can't explain. Jusr a feeling I guess.


----------



## somedevildawg

Farmer premonition? I had a surplus until the village kids decided to set off fireworks in the middle of my rounds.....you know the rest of that story


----------



## ARD Farm

No kid issue here. It's too remote. I'm 2 miles off the pavement. Townies don;t come out here. They don't want to get their 'rides' dirty.


----------



## T & R Hay Farms

ARD Farm said:


> Well, they got in late last night and went to bed. Called this morning for my hay elevator (I'm getting real tired of being a good neighbor, be nice if the bought their own....)
> 
> According to the wife, the plan is selling enough at auction to pay for the fuel up and back. Scratch the labor. They brought back 350 bales on the traler. At my usual 50 per bale, thats 17,500 punds and I don't see that happening on a gooseneck so the bales must be lighter, much lighter.
> 
> Again, according to the wife, if they can sell enough to pay for the fuel, they will go again (and use my bale elevator again.....)


My dad and I run a 40 ft gooseneck trailer. We roughly put up 55lb-60lb bales. We average 450 bales a load. The gooseneck will be fine.







Its the bale stackers (aka people) that I would be worried about


----------



## Mike120

richardtlewis said:


> My dad and I run a 40 ft gooseneck trailer. We roughly put up 55lb-60lb bales. We average 450 bales a load. The gooseneck will be fine.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Its the bale stackers (aka people) that I would be worried about


That's a 24-27K load........All depends on the capacity of the running gear under the trailer and the truck that's pulling it.


----------

