# Bermuda grass hay



## cbradley88 (Jan 8, 2010)

I was looking at planting bermuda grass for hay , in texas what can I expect . Yield with some irrigation is this a good money idea or a bust never grown hay before. Was looking @ maybe morhay or cheyenne II. Really have just started looking at this so if there is something better let me know . thanks


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## hay wilson in TX (Jan 28, 2009)

Bermudagrass hay is the state standard at least for the eastern half of the state. 
The standard that all bermudagrass hay is judged against is Coastal Bermudagrass. Depending on where you are, there are better varieties but not many. In East Texas Jiggs might be. The one that is head and shoulders better than any and all is Tifton 85. 
If you are in East Texas look to the people at the Overton Experiment Station. Check with your County Agricultural Extension Office for a list of Texas Bulletins on Bermudagrass for hay. 
If you are handy to Waco, TX try to get to the BIG conference and attend the Forage Session.

A brief introduction. 
Conference - Urban Solutions Center - Texas AgriLife Research and Extension

The Forage Session 
http://urbansolutionscenter.tamu.edu/media/1749/BIG Forage Release 2010.pdf

The over all Conference with where to and registration information. 
http://urbansolutionscenter.tamu.edu/media/1749/BIG Forage Release 2010.pdf

You may have to copy and paste the links.

The Bar B Q is worth the price of admission and the trip.

One thing I should mention, hay production can be as demanding as cotton if done correctly.


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## lewbest (Dec 9, 2009)

when is the big conference? I usually her about it on the news after it's over.









Lew


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## cbradley88 (Jan 8, 2010)

Well I live in the panhandle of Texas and don't know if tifton 85 will work here. I found something on the net that showed where you are loosing about 250$ / acre or more if spriged the first year if this is true not going to be able to make this work with the bank. Anybody got anything that shows anything else that was figuring tractor cost ,plowing, fertilizer and planting. How many tons / acre should I estimate. Maybe another thought would it be better to go with alfalfa?


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## RCF (Sep 14, 2009)

We shipped some Tifton 85 sprigs out towards Lubbock this year I think that guy put in about 100-200 acres in under pivot. Tifton 85 is going to be the best grass it yields more than Coastal bermuda, better drought resistance, and better nutrition. Here is our website Jim Russell Hay & Sprig Farm, Inc. - Tifton 85, Tifton 44 and Coastal bermuda grass hay and sprigs for sale feel free to give us a call (the number is on the website) and we will answer any question we can for you.


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## hay wilson in TX (Jan 28, 2009)

The over all Conference with where to and registration information.

http://urbansolutionscenter.tamu.edu/media/1745/BIGConference2010final.pdf

February 9-10, 2010 at the Heart of Texas Fair Complex in Waco, Texas. The Conference is held in conjunction with the Mid-Tex Farm and Ranch Show. Concurrent session on grain, horticulture, beef, forage, cotton, and wildlife will be featured. Registration for the February Conference will be $15 and include lunch and educational materials. Registration will be taken at the door on February 9, 2010.

Tifton 85 in the Pan Handle, this should be the year if proves if it can survive in the Pan Handle. Tech has some plots out on the north side of Lubbock. 
As for the cost a well maintained bermudagrass field should prosper for 50 years with no problem. Putting in bermudagrass cost roughly the same as it does to establish alfalfa and alfalfa usually persists for 5 years.

The trick with the better varieties of bermudagrass is to find someone who can do a good job sprigging it.

Near Temple it is difficult to start T-85 except in a wet spring. This coming spring may be a good year for getting it planted.

T-85 has fiber that is more digestible than coastal and it spreads faster and grows faster. One thing though it requires the same amount of fertilizer to produce feed value as does coastal.


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## vhaby (Dec 30, 2009)

cbradley88,

Apparently my attempt to post a reply to you did not make it so I'm trying again. Click the following web site to see bermudagrass varieties (Table 8) that survive north of Dimmitt, TX, in the OK panhandle.

http://pss.okstate.edu/research/vtr/bermudagrass/PT2005-5.pdf

vhaby


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## cbradley88 (Jan 8, 2010)

link not working


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## hay wilson in TX (Jan 28, 2009)

Folks allow me to introduce a certified authority on forages & a man who is able pass on some great information. A true Gentleman and Scholar.

Thanks to you I got to looking at some of the science involved in hay production. The resulting search resulted in my finding some really good references for hay harvesting.

Something you may not wish to know is I have found a good deal of research done at Texas Experiment Stations may have been published and forgotten. At least this is true at the Blackland Research Center. The result is a continuing reinventing the wheel. It is both sad and disturbing.

I hope you will be a generous contributor to these pages. Plus they are looking for knowledgeable articles.

Bill Wilson
jfbw at aol dot com


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## hay wilson in TX (Jan 28, 2009)

Let me tell you that there is a Mark Marsalis, [email protected] , now at Clovis NM. He did some interesting work at Texas Tech with bermudagrass just north of Lubbock.

He studied under the world renown Vivian Allen, [email protected] at Tech.

In addition Calvin Trostle, [email protected] , a PhD in the Extension Office in Lubbock can direct you to knowledgable Growers as well as Extension Specialest for the Panhandle.

There is some interesting reading here from California. 
http://alfalfa.ucdavis.edu/+symposium/proceedings/2001/01-197.pdf


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## Customfarming (Oct 8, 2009)

i work at the station north of lubbock in new deal hay wilson is talking about. the t-85 is growing good but it is irrigated by subsurface drip irrigation and is always stopping up the emitters. when we sell sprigs out west we recomend pivot irrigation. they have to run acid through the lines to burn off the roots from the emitters on t-85 while its growing. so that hurts the growth.

they also overgraze it and put steers on it to late or cut it for hay late. its research and the steers are still gaining weight and keeping up with 15 ~900# steers on 2 ac plots for about 2-4 weeks before moved to another 2 acre t-85 plot.


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## vhaby (Dec 30, 2009)

This reply initially was sent to cbradley88 by email not connected to hay talk, but for other interested persons, I should have sent it via hay talk...

Last night (Sunday night) I also could not open the web site to these variety trials. This late morning, I entered into Google the following:

Oklahoma State University forage variety trials

This gave me the option to click on a site that included forage variety trials, and I was able to access the Department of Plant and Soil Sciences in the Division of Agricultural Sciences and Natural Resources. Once there, I clicked on Research. This allowed me to click on Variety trials, and then on forages. When the forages web site came up, I clicked on trials 2005 and the following came up:

http://pss.okstate.edu/research/vtr/bermudagrass/PT2005-5.pdf

If you can get to this site, you want to go to Table 8 to see the results of variety trials in the OK panhandle for 2004. If not, I have attempted to copy the important data from that table below:

Variety Total yield
lb dry matter/acre

Ozark 10.47*
Midland 99 10.33*
Tifton 44 10.16*
Vaughn's #1 8.99
Greenfield-Nokes 8.90
World Feeder 8.71
Experimental var. LCB 84X 16-66 11.57**

At the time of this report, the exp. variety was not available to producers for sprigging. You might attempt to contact Dr. Charles Taliaferro Emeritus Professor at OK State Univ. to determine if it is now a named variety for producer use.

Also, you might access the following web site for additional production information and economics of bermudagrass hay production: overton.tamu.edu.

Once on this web site, click on download under Overton Center Publications, and then click on Adjusting to High Fuel and Fertilizer Prices, and then on Lime and Fertilizer Strategies for Forage Production. This article is a couple of years old, but you may be able to obtain some information from it to help with your decision regarding getting into bermudagrass hay production. For what it's worth from my prospective and I now am in ranching and hay production for our own small herd of cattle, most people sell their hay for much less than what they have in it. Our second cutting was valued at $58 per large round bale just for what I have put into it including fertilizing, weed control, and haying, not counting my time managing the growth or moving and stacking the bales in the barn. I hired the haying done at $25 per bale.

Vincent Haby
Emeritus Professor
Texas AgriLife Research
(now in my retirement from Texas AgriLife Research, formerly Texas Agricultural Experiment Station, my wife and I own and operate the Sundance Ranch a few miles NE of Tyler, TX)


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## hay wilson in TX (Jan 28, 2009)

> * irrigated by subsurface drip irrigation and is always stopping up the emitters*
> 
> I find that idea very interesting. Interesting because SDI was thought to be ideal if ever irrigation was put in. Bermudagrass would not be the crop of choice, but my alfalfa fields would.
> 
> Hopefully I will be able to attend another of Calvin Trostle's alfalfa sessions this summer, and I can make a side trip to New Deal. Maybe visit.


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## vhaby (Dec 30, 2009)

HayWilson,
Thank you for the introduction on 1/11/10, I am humbled to be able to participate in forage discussions with all the haymasters in HayTalk. In response to your finding that much of the Blackland Research Center's previous research data may be lost to most people, before I retired from the TAM AgriLife Research Center (literally went out to pasture) I initiated the idea of putting all my career field day reports on the TAM-Overton web site. What followed was that all field day reports published at that center were put on the web site. You can access them by clicking the following web site:

Texas AgriLife Research and Extension Center at Overton

Once in the site, click on AgriLife Article Search Database at the lower rightr and you can locate historic articles (two pagers) by author, title, keyword, or year. The listing of authors and data is not yet perfected, but much data can be viewed. Happy browsing!


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## hay wilson in TX (Jan 28, 2009)

I Thank You for the link, it is now filed under Agriculture & Orginizations.

I have looked at one article about calcium concentrations in bermudagrass. It confirmed my notion that calcium concentrations are contrary to nitrogen and potassium. Here with our calcareous soils,calcium is not often considered.


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## bchudalla (Sep 17, 2011)

I have alicia /jiggs /native bermuda /Callie /tifton 85. I run cattle on the native & the alicia.. I made 16 round bales om 2 1/2 acres on the Tifton 85 & it has been DRY here in Wharton Co. Don't know how it would do where you are (a lot colder) up there.. I have had it as high as 18" to 24" & runners over 6ft..


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## hay wilson in TX (Jan 28, 2009)

First off I wish to thank you for your interest in this thread as it brought it again to the head of the line. 
It does us all some good to review what has passed.

As my handle suggest I am strictly in the hay business, no row crop & no livestock. I am also aware that well managed grazing is a more efficient utilization of forages than harvesting as hay.

It is my personal prejudice, that Tifton 85 is a better forage for grazing than for machine harvesting. I say this because T-85 will cure standing and here in Central Texas will be a nutritious forage even as late as February or March as a dry standing forage. The State NRCS people did a feed sampling of standing forages and T-85 was still testing in the 12% CP range and was equal to or better than the native range grasses. Grasses that have a reputation as a good source as a Stockpiled Forage.

The so called native or Common varieties of bermudagrass have their advantages if we are lucky and observant. Most bermudagrass pastures are greatly overstressed with abusive management. With the Biodiversity inherent in a common variety buried in there will be a plant that overcomes our management style and will not only survive but will thrive. We just have to notice the difference and provide that plant protection. Out there is the worlds best low maintance putting green grass as well as the next Super Giant variety.

Today I was visiting with a friend who will be purchasing some Highly Fertilized grass hay, which by inference means high quality hay. Really hay quality is a factor of maturity and management. Grass that is one week between cuttings will yield a superior grade of rabbit feed, while a grass that is harvested every three months will be mostly stems and really sorry hay. Not saying fertilizer does not come in to the equation. It does but more on the quantity than quality.

Yield. There is a good bit of research to tell us that 600 or 1,000 lbs/A of actual nitrogen will out yield 120 lbs/A & if enough other essential elements are present will yield a ton of hay for 2 to 4 inches of rain, in a dry year. Do not expect that yield, per inch of water, in a wet year!

In March of 2011, I was suggesting that anyone who had to feed hay, then, was over stocked. 
I have ONE neighbor who has not fed any hay to his cattle to date. His stocking rate is about a fourth of what is considered optimum, for here. 
As I was told a long time ago, you make money selling calves by weight, not by feeding hay to cows. 
I had my doubts in 1951, but I am convinced in 2011!

Thank you for bringing this thread to the top.


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## bchudalla (Sep 17, 2011)

Thanks: You are like me. I do not FEED. I let them eat Grass. I sell at 450 -650lbs. Not as much per Lb. But more $ in my pocket.. I run from 30 to 40 head on 100ac. My neighor has 15 head on 12ac. & feeds all year. In most yrs. I feed from 6 -10 rnd. bales over winter. Right now I have cracks 4-6in wide every where except the 5ac I can irrigate. Right now my Callie is doing better than the Tifton 85 or Jiggs..


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## hay wilson in TX (Jan 28, 2009)

This from Alabama may be useful. 
Just remember where you are and what will grow near THERE.

https://store.aces.edu/ItemDetail.aspx?ProductID=13430

Agriculture > All Agriculture > ANR-1357
Extending Grazing and Reducing Stored Feed Needs
Don Ball

Quantity Requested must be less than available quantity

$0.00
Providing grazing animals with pasture rather than stored feed is highly desirable. Reasons include better nutrient recycling, environmental soundness, lower labor requirement, typically better nutrient intake, and lower cost. This publication provides strategies for minimizing stored feed by extending grazing.

Department(s): Agronomic Crops
Pages / Length: 20
Publication Date: 04/2010
Copies in Stock: 0

Available for free in the following format(s):

purdy pitchers did not copy and paste, but the link will get them for you.


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