# Vermeer 605M Belt Tensioner Idler Roller bearing replacement



## jsh12144 (Jul 22, 2016)

One of the belt tensioner rollers in our 605M is out! What is the best method of getting the tensioner raised up to the access holes on the sides so we can get a socket on the end to take the roller out? We thought of unlacing the belts, but didn't want to do that if it's unnecessary. Do we disconnect the springs and hydraulic cylinders on each side and raise manually from above? Please help!!! I called our local dealer and they aren't sure either...Vermeer is not that big around here anymore.


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## Tx Jim (Jun 30, 2014)

Welcome to HT

I don't know correct answer for replacing tension roller brg on a Vermeer but on a JD rd baler one uses attached tractor's hyd control lever to center roller retaining bolt in access hole in side of baler. There is no need to disconnect belts and be sure gate is "locked open".


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## Tightwad (May 29, 2016)

I haven't done one on my M yet, but on my old L the belt tension is what raises the tensioner arm up to the point you can access the bolts through the holes in the side panels. Removing them without something holding the tensioner arm in place would be ugly.

The service manual doesn't mention bearing replacement in those rollers and a couple of mine are tight. I'm planning to service them this winter and figured I'd just remove the belts, unhook the tensioner arm from the spring/cylinder and raise with a chainfall. If there's a better way, I'd be interested in hearing about it, also.

Best of luck.


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## E220 (Feb 10, 2016)

It is easy.

Step 1. close the tailgate.

Step 2. Back off the springs.

Step 3. Remove spring clevis bolts and cylinder rod pins.

Step 4. Open the tailgate and lock it.

Step 5. Have a fat guy climb up on the belts (That's what I do. A hoist/strap also works.). The belt tensioner will raise to the holes.

Step 6. Throw a chain around a good tensioner roller and a stationary roller to hold it in place.

*Please note: *The roller bolts have red loctite on them. You will probably need to heat them to remove them. Don't forget to reapply it.


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## Tx Jim (Jun 30, 2014)

Man I'm glad I own a JD rd baler as changing tension roll brgs doesn't require a hoist,strap or FAT MAN :lol:


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## Tightwad (May 29, 2016)

E220 - Thank you for posting the procedure. I appreciate it very much.


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## Tightwad (May 29, 2016)

Jim - Don't feel bad, I'm still looking for the fat man that came with my baler. The original owner must have misplaced him.

What holds the tension arm up on a JD baler while you're removing the rollers? Hydraulic pressure?


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## E220 (Feb 10, 2016)

@Tx Jim Hey, if I got it, I might as well use it.  The process really isn't that hard.

@Tightwad. I drive a service truck equipped with a fat guy. Let me know if you need him.


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## jsh12144 (Jul 22, 2016)

Thanks alot for all of the comments. Ordered the parts just a few minutes ago and will begin E220's instructions this weekend! I'll reply back on how it went and what we learned from it TIGHTWAD.

Also, a big shout out to SWMHAY for talking with me on the phone this morning. For someone to talk with you and take a few minutes out of their day to help someone out says alot.

My guys helping me said I'm the fat guy that should crawl in on the belts, Jim.


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## IHCman (Aug 27, 2011)

Tx Jim said:


> Man I'm glad I own a JD rd baler as changing tension roll brgs doesn't require a hoist,strap or FAT MAN :lol:


Man I'm glad I own a Vermeer. I don't like changing pickup teeth and haven't had to change one yet in 5 years. I'd bet you have to replace bent, broken teeth in a JD baler more often than changing any bearing on a Vermeer baler.


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## Tx Jim (Jun 30, 2014)

E220 said:


> @Tx Jim Hey, if I got it, I might as well use it.  The process really isn't that hard.
> 
> @Tightwad. I drive a service truck equipped with a fat guy. Let me know if you need him.


Poor or tight as I am I repair all my breakdowns except the major ones.


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## Tx Jim (Jun 30, 2014)

Tightwad said:


> What holds the tension arm up on a JD baler while you're removing the rollers? Hydraulic pressure?


Yes hyd pressure on JD rd balers holds tension rollers where one needs them to replace parts.


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## cannonball (Jun 23, 2012)

jsh12144 said:


> One of the belt tensioner rollers in our 605M is out! What is the best method of getting the tensioner raised up to the access holes on the sides so we can get a socket on the end to take the roller out? We thought of unlacing the belts, but didn't want to do that if it's unnecessary. Do we disconnect the springs and hydraulic cylinders on each side and raise manually from above? Please help!!! I called our local dealer and they aren't sure either...Vermeer is not that big around here anymore.


Helped my neighbor do his, sure glad i ran Deere...his had about 400 rolls on it..Like how Deere uses the tractor hydraulics to charge tensioner


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## Tx Jim (Jun 30, 2014)

IHCman said:


> Man I'm glad I own a Vermeer. I don't like changing pickup teeth and haven't had to change one yet in 5 years. I'd bet you have to replace bent, broken teeth in a JD baler more often than changing any bearing on a Vermeer baler.


How often one needs to replace broken teeth depends on a lot of variables such as follows:

How LOW one operates pickup attach AKA using PU teeth similar to a plow

How many times one plugs baler

How many bales one bales in a given period of time.

My '05 baler has baled over 22,000 bales and yes it's had a few teeth replaced. How many bales has your Vermeer baled in 5 yrs?

I think I've read somewhere that after so much time/bales Vermeer PU teeth need replaced because the rubber mountings get weak causing poor core(bale) starting. Am I remembering correctly or do I need to do some research. BTW the fact my JD baler weighs less than a comparable Vermeer I'll bet I don't have to fill my fuel tank as often or pack the ground as HARD!! I have no clue how often one needs to change brgs on a Vermeer but it would surprise me if you could change many witout the aid of a cutting torch but I can change brgs on a JD without a TORCH..

I think it boils down to each brand has it's pluses & minuses and which ever brand satisfies their owner(operator) is all that really matters!

Have a wonderful day,Jim


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## IHCman (Aug 27, 2011)

Tx Jim said:


> How often one needs to replace broken teeth depends on a lot of variables such as follows:
> 
> How LOW one operates pickup attach AKA using PU teeth similar to a plow
> 
> ...


You said it right, each brand has their pluses and minuses. All I've ever run is Vermeer and have been satisified. I've said in other posts that if I didn't have a Vermeer I'd have a John Deere, (I would really miss the rubber mounted teeth though)

This baler has 12k bales on it, should have another 2k by the end of this year. This year will be its 5th. Our old M had 21k in 5 years. That one got upgraded to the newer heavy duty teeth at 17k bales. Had a J baler with unknown number of bales on it. That one we did have to replace all the teeth in it for the reasons you stated that eventually the teeth look good but give or bend back more than they should. Takes along time till that happens. Weight is also not an issue with large flotation tires they use now. They carry really well. Years ago I remember driving into soft areas empty, starting the bale and baleing out to the higher drier ground, now I just bale, don't ever worry about getting stuck or leaving ruts.

I should rib you one more time about JDs netwrap system but I won't.


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## Tx Jim (Jun 30, 2014)

IHCman said:


> I should rib you one more time about JDs netwrap system but I won't.


Go ahead and ask(rib) me as questions aka ribbing doesn't phase me as long as it doesn't bother the one doing the ribbing IE if one can't accept ribbing then they shouldn't dish it out! I have experienced only minor surface wrap problems with my 467 such as ever so often(once in 500-600 bales) it will kick out a bale with only a short piece of wrap(about 10 ft long) but give no error code. I just turn tractor around utilizing frt tractor tire to unroll the bale then re-bale the bale then continue baling. Also ever once in a while wrap will get caught on my "farmer engineered metal starter roll" that I've added extra 14'' rods on each side to help stop Coastal from running up frt of baler when grass gets a little too dry. These extra rods also help starting core in large windrows.

If you think larger tires don't pack soil that is fine BUT I think larger footprint tires still pack soil but because of size of tires spread compaction to lower amount of compaction per sq inch of soil. In wet yrs in the past I've been baling and my 2WD tractor sinks to drawbar & gets stuck. IMHO no matter what size tires my equipment has in these conditions I'm either going to get stuck or create some serious ruts :lol:


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## swmnhay (Jun 13, 2008)

If JD balers have less iron in them shouldn't they be cheaper?Maybe that high priced green paint holds them together?

I guess I'd sooner have a heavy built baler then a baler the sides wear threw with 25 -30k bales here of cornstalks.

To say a extra 1000 lbs is causing compaction is really grasping at straws to bad mouth another brand.I bet the PSI is very little difference.Even more far fetched a claim is a tractor will take more fuel pulling 1000 more lbs.Maybe you need a better tractor that don't suck so much fuel if a extra 1000 lbs pulls it down.

I did own a JD baler once it was light built for sure.I didn't know how bad a baler it was until I traded for a Vermeer.


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## Tx Jim (Jun 30, 2014)

OK BUT not every rd hay baler is utilized to bale corn stalks. My 467 has baled fewer than 1000 corn stalk bales and that was created because of the drought we were experiencing at the time.. What's the average number of bales of stalk baling for Vermeer baler before it's traded off? I think your 1000# difference in comparable Yellow(605N CS special weighs 8600# with 1650# drawbar weight with """150 tractor HP requirement""") or green balers(569 SS 6620# no tongue wt posted) is incorrect.

I'll compare my JD '91 4255 for fuel consumption comparison against your tractor if you so choose but I happen to own one of JD's older better 6 cyl engine fuel consumption per hr tractors

Green paint covered equipment has been higher priced BUT I think that is on a path of CHANGING.


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## E220 (Feb 10, 2016)

@tx Jim. I admire brand loyalty. If something works for your system why change? Just don't stop looking around for something better(504pro?.

But I'm curious what you mean by your last sentence. Have you seen Deere dropping some prices? If so, can you speculate why?


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## mlappin (Jun 25, 2009)

Hehe, Ford vs Chevy vs Dodge.

Just depends what color you like and what you have for dealers in the area, a bad dealer can make the best piece of equipment seem like an overpriced POS.

I've thought about Vermeer before, they have a lot of things about em that I really like, but have one dealer for them in the area while I have three New Holland dealers in the area that are as close or closer than the Vermeer dealer.


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## swmnhay (Jun 13, 2008)

Tx Jim said:


> OK BUT not every rd hay baler is utilized to bale corn stalks. My 467 has baled fewer than 1000 corn stalk bales and that was created because of the drought we were experiencing at the time.. What's the average number of bales of stalk baling for Vermeer baler before it's traded off? I think your 1000# difference in comparable Yellow(605N CS special weighs 8600# with 1650# drawbar weight with """150 tractor HP requirement""") or green balers(569 SS 6620# no tongue wt posted) is incorrect.
> 
> I'll compare my JD '91 4255 for fuel consumption comparison against your tractor if you so choose but I happen to own one of JD's older better 6 cyl engine fuel consumption per hr tractors
> 
> Green paint covered equipment has been higher priced BUT I think that is on a path of CHANGING.


OK i looked at a 504 wieght compared to the 469 my mistake reading fine print on Ipad this morning.So 2000 lbs more iron in the Vermeer to me is a good thing.It's built heavier plain and simple just like most everything Vermeer builds.

I have no idea what the average trade in time is on vermeer balers,everyone is definitly different about when they trade.All is I know I have had 3 guys tell me time to get rid of the JD because the sides are getting holes in them.Never heard that from a Vermeer guy.

Cornstalks are definitly harder on balers and is what most guys use rd balers for HERE.It's definitly a test on balers and the weaker points will show up sooner in any brand.In this area i would say 80% of the rd bales made are cornstalks.Cornstalks from good corn is also alot tougher baleing then drought corn

You said YOUR tractor would take less fuel pulling a lighter JD baler then the heavier Vermeer baler.I don't think any tractor what ever brand would make much difference pulling 2000 lbs more wieght around the field.

A 605N CS special could be run with a 100 hp tractor buy not at capacity.Not really sure why they have 150hp recomended for the 605N CS special and 100 hp for the 605N when the main difference is just the hydraulic driven power feeder.Just run by a orbit motor and doubt it takes 10 hp to operate.

Definitly want 150hp if you want to push the baler to capacity.




__ https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=1078052845617238


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## Tx Jim (Jun 30, 2014)

E220 said:


> @tx Jim. I admire brand loyalty. If something works for your system why change? Just don't stop looking around for something better(504pro? .
> 
> But I'm curious what you mean by your last sentence. Have you seen Deere dropping some prices? If so, can you speculate why?


1st I'm in the twilight of my baling career not so much from my age but due to my permanent nerve damage. Also I know how a JD rd baler ticks & how to repair them. In the last few yrs having to depend on someone else to operate my hay equipment isn't "my cup of tea". Therefore the prospects of my buying another new rd baler is slim to not happening. 504 pro would not fit my customers as they desire a 66'' tall bale. I see Vermeer advertises a 504 pro can make a 2400# bale. I wonder what weight 15% moisture grass bale they will make? I think JD tractor & equipment reliability isn't what it was in yrs gone by. Therefore I think JD is going to loose some of it's market share. Add into the mix the amount of foreign owned/manufactured hay equip(Krone,Mchale,Kuhn,etc equip) being introduced every yr. A lot of readers think I bleed green blood but in reality I own 1 each of JD,Kubota,Ford tractors & JD,Krone,H&S,Vermeer hay equip.


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## Tx Jim (Jun 30, 2014)

swmnhay said:


> OK i looked at a 504 wieght compared to the 469 my mistake reading fine print on Ipad this morning.So 2000 lbs more iron in the Vermeer to me is a good thing.It's built heavier plain and simple just like most everything Vermeer builds.
> 
> I have no idea what the average trade in time is on vermeer balers,everyone is definitly different about when they trade.All is I know I have had 3 guys tell me time to get rid of the JD because the sides are getting holes in them.Never heard that from a Vermeer guy.
> 
> ...


You need to practice on your reading comprehension as I stated or implied my 4255 will more than likely ""use less fuel"" than your tractor. In other thread weight I posted was for a 605N CS not 504 pro. Sorry I refuse to participate in Facebook.


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## Tightwad (May 29, 2016)

Tx Jim said:


> I'll compare my JD '91 4255 for fuel consumption comparison against your tractor if you so choose but I happen to own one of JD's older better 6 cyl engine fuel consumption per hr tractors


Out of sheer curiosity on my part, how many gallons per hour are you using with your 4255 pulling your roller? My 7710 Ford uses 2-2.5 gal/hr pulling the old L baler, and my NH 8260 is using around 4 gal/hr pulling a 604M. It handles the baler fine, but I was surprised at how much fuel it uses compared to my other tractors, which are all turbo 4 cyls.

Thanks.


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## Gearclash (Nov 25, 2010)

Tightwad said:


> Out of sheer curiosity on my part, how many gallons per hour are you using with your 4255 pulling your roller? My 7710 Ford uses 2-2.5 gal/hr pulling the old L baler, and my NH 8260 is using around 4 gal/hr pulling a 604M. It handles the baler fine, but I was surprised at how much fuel it uses compared to my other tractors, which are all turbo 4 cyls.
> 
> Thanks.


I'm not Jim, but your comment about the fuel consumption of the 8260 catches my eye. I wonder if that has the same engine as my TM120? Cowboy math put the fuel use on the TM120 at 4.4 gph on a New Holland 5x6 baler. I was not impressed as I always figured my MX135 used about 3.5 gph pulling the same baler. Also, the MX has power to spare and the TM runs short.


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## Tx Jim (Jun 30, 2014)

Tightwad said:


> Out of sheer curiosity on my part, how many gallons per hour are you using with your 4255 pulling your roller? My 7710 Ford uses 2-2.5 gal/hr pulling the old L baler, and my NH 8260 is using around 4 gal/hr pulling a 604M. It handles the baler fine, but I was surprised at how much fuel it uses compared to my other tractors, which are all turbo 4 cyls.
> 
> Thanks.


Last time I checked my 4255 pulling my JD 467 rd baler @ 6 MPH making 66'' tall bales in 3+ bale per acre hay taking in 27' windrow it was using 3.1 or 3.2 gallons per hr. 6 MPH is my speed limit due to rough ground as I bale very few cultivated acres. The reason I don't remember exact GPH is I think due to "Oldtimers".


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## barnrope (Mar 22, 2010)

Ive baled roughly 36,000 bales in the last 5 years. Never had to worry about Vermeer teeth......


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## Tightwad (May 29, 2016)

Gearclash said:


> I'm not Jim, but your comment about the fuel consumption of the 8260 catches my eye. I wonder if that has the same engine as my TM120? Cowboy math put the fuel use on the TM120 at 4.4 gph on a New Holland 5x6 baler. I was not impressed as I always figured my MX135 used about 3.5 gph pulling the same baler. Also, the MX has power to spare and the TM runs short.


From looking at tractordata, your TM120 and my 8260 share the same 7.5 L Genisis engine. Yours has a turbo and is factory rated at 95hp at the PTO, where mine is non turbo and rated at 100hp, go figure. Your MX135 has the 5.9 Cummins engine with a turbo, rated at 115 PTO HP. Assuming similar transmissions and such, it appears to be just a matter of a higher tuned engine running more efficiently in the case of your MX135.


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## Tightwad (May 29, 2016)

Tx Jim said:


> Last time I checked my 4255 pulling my JD 467 rd baler @ 6 MPH making 66'' tall bales in 3+ bale per acre hay taking in 27' windrow it was using 3.1 or 3.2 gallons per hr. 6 MPH is my speed limit due to rough ground as I bale very few cultivated acres. The reason I don't remember exact GPH is I think due to "Oldtimers".


Thank you.

That's a pretty equal comparison, as I'm running a similar baler and run 5-6mph depending upon conditions.

I've pulled a 604M with a 7710 on flat ground, but wouldn't want to touch it on hilly terrain and didn't bother to check fuel consumption.


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## erikknutson (Aug 28, 2016)

There is an easy way to put those rollers in, on the right side(opposite of the main drive side) there is a tee at the bottom of the cylinder for the tensioner. Unscrew that and run a hose to the tractor from there, this lifts the tensioner up to the holes on the sided for removing the bolts from the ends of the rollers. That tee was put there specifically for this.


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## Tx Jim (Jun 30, 2014)

erikknutson said:


> There is an easy way to put those rollers in, on the right side(opposite of the main drive side) there is a tee at the bottom of the cylinder for the tensioner. Unscrew that and run a hose to the tractor from there, this lifts the tensioner up to the holes on the sided for removing the bolts from the ends of the rollers. That tee was put there specifically for this.


Why can one not raise tension arm to correct location for removing tension roller with hyd's hoses attached to tractor similar to when baling hay? I can change tension roller &/or brgs on my JD rd baler without any hyd hose modifications.

I'm just asking & not trying to start a COLOR WAR.

Thanks,Jim


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## swmnhay (Jun 13, 2008)

Tx Jim said:


> Why can one not raise tension arm to correct location for removing tension roller with hyd's hoses attached to tractor similar to when baling hay? I can change tension roller &/or brgs on my JD rd baler without any hyd hose modifications.
> 
> I'm just asking & not trying to start a COLOR WAR.
> Thanks,Jim


the tractor hydraulics have nothing to do with the tension arms.It has its own closed system not connected to the tractor hydraulics.

It hasn't been a issue for me as I've never had any of those bearings out but looking at it after E220 described how to do it,it doesn't look to be that bad of a fix.


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## Tx Jim (Jun 30, 2014)

swmnhay

Thank you for your explanation.

Jim


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## E220 (Feb 10, 2016)

erikknutson said:


> There is an easy way to put those rollers in, on the right side(opposite of the main drive side) there is a tee at the bottom of the cylinder for the tensioner. Unscrew that and run a hose to the tractor from there, this lifts the tensioner up to the holes on the sided for removing the bolts from the ends of the rollers. That tee was put there specifically for this.


The tee was put there to charge the system. While it works to push the cylinder up, make sure that you put a stop in the cylinders to hold it there. If you do it this way, after you are finished, double check your charge because you could overcharge it this way.


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## Hand&Hand Farms (Feb 5, 2011)

It's pretty easy to do. Do it like other said. While at it replace all the bearings in tension rollers, be done with that for a while. I've had to replace the same drive roller bearings twice in same day but I was pushing it beyond limits.

I like our Vermeer because 90% of my parts come from local NAPA store or on line. Only 2 bearing sizes on the baler which can be got anywhere. Simple, easy and tough machines for me


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