# Haying 2017



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

I am starting this thread as a general thread for all of my posts regarding this season. I thought it would be better than having a lot of small threads.

Here is a video of my fields.


----------



## Shetland Sheepdog (Mar 31, 2011)

Let me be the 1st to join in, if I may? I'll throw in some news, from a small operation in southern NH, on occasion. I do 3-4000 small squares a season, mostly sold to horse owners. Still waiting for a weather window here, but my grasses are all headed out!


----------



## somedevildawg (Jun 20, 2011)

That sickle did a good job IMO.....
A couple of things struck me in the vid....
1) The use of the word "yard" for fields, I would call that fields others may call them other things....just never heard em called "yards" but apparantly that's because they use to be part of the yard....
2) walking through the field with camera in hand and little regard for Mr NoShoulder is very foreign to me....my camera would have shown my feet in every frame 
Overall, I think the sickle did a fine job


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

I use my phone to take all my pictures and video. I'm not sure if that has anything to do with it.


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

The wife and I went out and tested the baler. She's tying beautiful knots!


----------



## Ranger518 (Aug 6, 2016)

I like your idea and videos should be fun.


----------



## 8350HiTech (Jul 26, 2013)

MyDaughtersPony said:


> The wife and I went out and tested the baler. She's tying beautiful knots!


But how's the baler working?


----------



## endrow (Dec 15, 2011)

8350HiTech said:


> But how's the baler working?


LOL


----------



## glasswrongsize (Sep 15, 2015)

I would say that the M should cut decent in 3rd...4th might be too fast.

Also, (follow me on this one) the PTO rpms of the tractor is tied directly to the throttle. The speed of the tractor (in a specific gear) is also tied directly to the throttle. That means that for every foot of forward movement in a specific gear, the sickle would go backy-forthy the same number of times in that foot whether you are 1/2 throttle or full throttle. You can keep climbing gears (I like 3rd for my sickle) and adjust the throttle down a little. You are in too high of gear when it doesn't cut clean.

I haven't responded to too many of your questions and learning curve, but let me say not to let the "big-dogs" run you under the porch on here. I don't know you from Adam, but, just from looking at you, you could be in the age group to be setting on your duff, playing video games, frying your brain cells with whatever...instead, you are trying to be part of the land....I commend you. With little or no farming background, you could be in a lot worse shape without your drive and desire.

Mark.


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

I look younger than I am. I guess I'm still young but I am 31 which seems old to me.


----------



## glasswrongsize (Sep 15, 2015)

MyDaughtersPony said:


> I look younger than I am. I guess I'm still young but I am 31 which seems old to me.


Nope...that's young!!

Around here, some ain't weened yet at 31...but they're the ones asking mommy for to bring home the latest video game on her way home from work.

Mark


----------



## luke strawwalker (Jul 31, 2014)

Looking good... KUTGW!

I'd pop the old M in second and see what happens... You really don't know til you try. You'll want to keep your RPM's up though, to maximize your strokes per minute. Those old pitman-type mowers had fewer strokes per minute, which means they can't take as much ground speed as pitmanless type (wobble box usually) mowers... but we used to cut in second or third on our old Golden Jubilee with a Ford 501 7 foot pitman-type sickle machine, so it's POSSIBLE... just have to match the ground speed to the conditions-- thicker grass, slow down. Pop it in a higher gear, if it's leaving a ragged cut or plugs the sickle, slow down. The machine will tell you what it can handle...

Later! OL J R : )


----------



## r82230 (Mar 1, 2016)

IDR, the PTO speed on our old Farmall H, but do remember a mark (put there by my dad I believe) by the notch on the throttle that we ran the JD 14t baler at, seem it was about half throttle plus a little. I would suggest you get a way to determine what your PTO speed is (540 is standard). I would run your mower, a little slower than 540 PTO. I also agree with Glass, at least cut in second gear, first gear (IMHO) is way to slow.

Google some pictures of Orchard grass, along with Quack grass (naïve Michigan ground cover, I used to call it), Timothy and Brome grass. These grasses are fairly common here in Michigan, then you will have a better idea of what you are baling for hay. All these grasses, can make good feed (OR bad with enough liquid sunshine).

Looks like you are cutting MUCH better with the new parts (hopefully with a smile on your face even). BUT I would stay away from cutting where there is junk or small trees. Why mess up a great repair job!!! Leave bush hog jobs to bush hogs.

Larry


----------



## Grateful11 (Apr 5, 2009)

I guess you missed this thread 

http://www.haytalk.com/forums/topic/62265-2017-haying-photos-and-videos/


----------



## Troy Farmer (Jul 31, 2011)

You remind me of me. I started out the same way (kinda) . I had a John Deere B a #5 sickle mower and 14 T baler. Make good hay and you will have more customers than you can shake a stick at.


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

I am in the process of uploading another video. It was an interesting day... I started to early and dealt with dew... And traveling to slow in 1st gear... I made it through. Things got easier as the day went on. I'm guessing because things started to dry out a little.

I am embarrassed to say it took me all day to cut 5 acres. I did have a few break downs. Lost a guard... And a knife. I am worried about the guard making its way into my baler... That would be a killer.... I put on an old guard and went to the store and bought more knifes and rivits. Got it going again and finished. Just before ending I broke something..
Not sure what but it has to do with the positioning of the bar. It doesn't hold a 90 degree angle. The bar is trailing to far rearward. I need to focus on raking and bailing and worry about the sickle after this cutting is finished.


----------



## stack em up (Mar 7, 2013)

I'd bet you didn't break anything, just tripped what's called the "breakaway" it's meant to trip if the bar hits an obstruction. Simply put the mower down and back up slowly, it should reset.


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

I was going to say I didn't see anything missing or broken. That makes sense. Thanks.


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

Just a video of me cutting.

I felt more comfortable cutting in 1st full throttle.... the grass was thick and I felt like I needed full power on the bar. Maybe next cutting when the grass isn't so tall I'll be able to try 2nd gear.


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

I lost a guard and knife in the field.... should I be worried about baling them up?!?!!? That would kill my baler... I have no idea how I'd even find them before I started to bale.


----------



## somedevildawg (Jun 20, 2011)

I doubt the pickup will pick them up....more likely a tire


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

If I need pan evap of say .63 and I actually get .87 what does that mean? The grass is thick/tall and could very well need 4 days to dry. I'm more less just curious to the answer.


----------



## r82230 (Mar 1, 2016)

Use pan evaporation as a guide ONLY. You have other variables involved, including ground moisture. The charts you are reading are guesstimates not actual numbers (remember they are from a forecast). As far as the .87 pan evaporation, you could have bone dry hay on top and too damp to keep on the bottom, if you rake to soon, as an example.

Just check your hay, I can have variances from field to field. If you don't have one, put a moisture tester on your 'wish list'. I have to admit I lived without a moisture tester for years, but then again I had a Grandfather and Dad, that had been testing hay by hand for years for mentors. I know we baled a lot of hay way too far on the dry side (losing leaves/quality), also by that method.

Time for me to escape the office, looks like 3-4 days of sunshine. Going to take a chance on my tedder being repaired around noon today.

Larry


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

I'm playing the game of schedules. My wife has Wednesday and Friday off... And the days she works I watch the kids in the morning before I go to work. So I can bale Wednesday or Friday... The hay was cut yesterday. Hopefully it we works out.


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

I am in the process of uploading another video. I was able to get the baler up and running. I didn't count but I think I baled 50-60 without missing a knot. I managed ground speed much better and was making nice solid bales. If I was on a light windrow even if I sped up sometimes I'd make a banana bale. Overall I was really happy with how things went.


----------



## Teslan (Aug 20, 2011)

MyDaughtersPony said:


> I lost a guard and knife in the field.... should I be worried about baling them up?!?!!? That would kill my baler... I have no idea how I'd even find them before I started to bale.


nope. Don't worry or think about it


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)




----------



## somedevildawg (Jun 20, 2011)

Did you say you found the rake teeth? Those will get a tire or ruin a sickle mowers day....make sure to find em or they will surely find you sooner or later .....if they's a Tedder tine in the field, it'll be sooner rather than later....
The baler seems to have performed well, good job!


----------



## glasswrongsize (Sep 15, 2015)

I agree with Dawg, I would find the guard and knife if I could (or rake teeth). The guard shouldn't be too difficult to find...the mower should have started leaving an uncut (or poorly cut) strip as soon as it was gone. I would start looking there.

Mark


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

I lost a guard and sickle knife. I was just commenting that I am missing tines from my rake. They are not in the field. Good idea checking the uncut strips for the guard and knife. I'll take the kids out tomorrow and see if they can prove useful


----------



## luke strawwalker (Jul 31, 2014)

MyDaughtersPony said:


> I lost a guard and knife in the field.... should I be worried about baling them up?!?!!? That would kill my baler... I have no idea how I'd even find them before I started to bale.


Not likely if you rake it correctly... don't run your rake too low; the heavy stuff usually stays on the ground or rolls out of the hay. Make sure your baler pickup isn't running too low either.

Don't worry about the guard or sickle section (knife is the assembly, "section" is the individual riveted-on blade). About the only way to find them is when you have to pull them out of a tire LOL

I've lost a lot of rake teeth and baler tines and other stuff in the fields over the years... the worst thing I had to deal with was the 4 inch steel pipe collars that the oilfield crew threw out in the slush pit back in the 80's when they drilled gas wells on the place... after they were done and the dozers pushed all the dirt back out on the fields, we were catching those things with cultivators and plows and stuff for YEARS... there's STILL some of them out there I see from time to time!

One time one dead-centered the middle buster point while I was plowing, on the outside row of the 4 row middlebuster... I was plowing deep and really had them down in the ground, and when that thing caught on the tip of the point and suddenly it was like the plow point was trying to push a solid steel ring through the soil, it just swung the entire tractor and plow around in a circle to that side... had to beat the thing off the plow point with a hammer...

Later! OL J R 

Later! OL J R


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

I just counted. I got 100 bales off the small yard fields. Pretty happy about that.


----------



## r82230 (Mar 1, 2016)

I will suggest this:

Weigh a few bales to get an idea of your total tonnage you got per acre. (There is probably an app for figuring out how many acres you cut/baled.) The rationale behind knowing your tonnage removed, is that you have 'removed' some nutrients also. If you don't replace these nutrients, your yields most likely will decline in coming years.

IDK, the nutrients removed per ton for OG, hopefully someone (much more knowledgeable than me) will chime in. But for alfalfa, I use the estimate of 8-10# Phos and 40-50# Potash, needs to be replaced for each ton of hay I remove. With OG, Nitrogen will be an important nutrient.

If you do not replace the nutrients that you remove by taking the hay crop off, some refer to this practice as 'mining the soil'. Not a wise practice IF you plan on continuing to farm this ground (IMHO).

I personally, keep yield records year to year off my fields (along with soil testing).

Larry


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

Thanks for the insight Larry. I plan on keeping records this year. I can use Google Earth to get field measurements. The bales that I made Wednesday were fairly heavy. I'll get them on a scale to get a more accurate idea. I'll need to figure out when and how to fertilize.


----------



## r82230 (Mar 1, 2016)

MyDaughtersPony said:


> . I'll need to figure out when and how to fertilize.


I fertilize after taking 1st cutting off, you might be able to get your local co-op to spread for you. The fertizer spreaders might be a little too much for a Farmall M, IMHO.

Larry

PS I know somewhere you have a post on setting your register on your sickle bar, try this piece, it might help.


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

What is a estimate in how much that costs? Say for 5 acres. I just want a vague idea.


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

That PDF is very helpful! Thanks


----------



## bool (Mar 14, 2016)

That helpful pdf is a page out of the manual. That's why you need the manual.

What with machinery, parts, fertiliser, manuals, seed, twine, time and all the other expenses, sometimes a person could wonder why they bother to make hay rather than buying it. But where's the satisfaction in buying it.

Roger


----------



## rajela (Feb 15, 2014)

MyDaughtersPony said:


> What is a estimate in how much that costs? Say for 5 acres. I just want a vague idea.


Estimate on what? The fertilizer?


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

I'm not arguing against the fact I need any manual... I'm on a budget... Clearly you don't understand. I'll get the manuals when I can. If you don't want to answer my questions in the mean time then don't.


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

rajela said:


> Estimate on what? The fertilizer?


Yeah


----------



## 8350HiTech (Jul 26, 2013)

MyDaughtersPony said:


> I'm not arguing against the fact I need any manual... I'm on a budget... Clearly you don't understand. I'll get the manuals when I can. If you don't want to answer my questions in the mean time then don't.


I think every member here understands budgets quite well. The point is the manual might cost - what - $10? Sell two bales of hay if you've already tapped out the couch cushions.


----------



## VA Haymaker (Jul 1, 2014)

MyDaughtersPony said:


> Just a video of me cutting.
> 
> I felt more comfortable cutting in 1st full throttle.... the grass was thick and I felt like I needed full power on the bar. Maybe next cutting when the grass isn't so tall I'll be able to try 2nd gear.


I have found with my sickle mower that if you pickup the speed a little, it helps the grass fall back and away from the sickle mower.

From 2016...


----------



## VA Haymaker (Jul 1, 2014)

MyDaughtersPony said:


> I'm not arguing against the fact I need any manual... I'm on a budget... Clearly you don't understand. I'll get the manuals when I can. If you don't want to answer my questions in the mean time then don't.


Visible anger is the next step in haying. You're well down the dark path to hay. Be prepared, everything up until now has been warm-up. Wait until your first encounter with a goofy horse owner..... ????????


----------



## Lewis Ranch (Jul 15, 2013)

bool said:


> That helpful pdf is a page out of the manual. That's why you need the manual.
> 
> What with machinery, parts, fertiliser, manuals, seed, twine, time and all the other expenses, sometimes a person could wonder why they bother to make hay rather than buying it. But where's the satisfaction in buying it.
> 
> Roger


This is the second or third time I've seen you make remarks about this guy not buying a manual. For damn sake don't comment if it's that big of a deal to you. People of all shapes forms and sizes come to this site for help and we don't need a smartass trying to run them off. There plenty of nice folks willing to lend a helping hand. Some folks started with nothing (myself included) and used to have to worry about buying fuel to make it through tomorrow, I'm pretty positive he'll buy a manual first time he has a spare 20 bucks.


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

leeave96 said:


> I have found with my sickle mower that if you pickup the speed a little, it helps the grass fall back and away from the sickle mower.
> 
> From 2016...


I will definitely try to go faster next time around the field. I just need to find the right mix of ground speed and throttle power. I'll have to be in 2nd gear because in the video I was full throttle in 1st gear. I'll have to try some different things until I find the right combo. I was just happy I was able to cut the fields myself for the first time!


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

8350HiTech said:


> I think every member here understands budgets quite well. The point is the manual might cost - what - $10? Sell two bales of hay if you've already tapped out the couch cushions.


I don't own my equipment. I owe my father money. I owe my mother money. I owe my father in law land rental money. I have fuel and supplies/parts expense. I can keep going.... All the hay I'm selling is just to keep the dream alive. I don't think I really have to justify my financial decisions on a hay related message board. I am not demanding anyone give me answers to my questions. I enjoy this message board I don't want it to turn into something negative.


----------



## 32-0-0 (May 30, 2017)

MyDaughtersPony said:


> I don't own my equipment. I owe my father money. I owe my mother money. I owe my father in law land rental money. I have fuel and supplies/parts expense. I can keep going.... All the hay I'm selling is just to keep the dream alive. I don't think I really have to justify my financial decisions on a hay related message board. I am not demanding anyone give me answers to my questions. I enjoy this message board I don't want it to turn into something negative.


MDP,
Don't let jerks like him get to you...doesnt sound like he has ever had to pinch pennies to make ends meet, so what good is his opinion on this subject? Blow it off and ignore him.


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

These are the measurements of my fields.

Back field - 3.5 acres

Side field - 1.5 acres

Left yard - .6 acres

Right yard - .77 acres

Total - 6.37 acres

(off the left and right yard I got 100 bales from 1.37 acres) The bales were conservatively 50 lbs. each. 100 bales x 50 lbs = 5,000 lbs of hay

I am raking and baling the back and side field tomorrow. I'll be back with video and some figures.


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

Really!!! We were not supposed to get rain tonight! I hope it scatters around me.


----------



## r82230 (Mar 1, 2016)

MyDaughtersPony said:


> (off the left and right yard I got 100 bales from 1.37 acres) The bales were conservatively 50 lbs. each. 100 bales x 50 lbs = 5,000 lbs of hay


5000 / 2000 = 2.5 tons of hay

2.5 / 1.37 = 1.82 tons of hay per acre

Now if someone more knowledgeable about OG, can tell you how much nutrients you need to replace, you will have rough idea of how much fertilizer to purchase/spread.

Does someone have a rough guide on what is removed per ton with OG hay?

With that being said, and knowing your finances maybe tight this year (start up costs, etc.), an option could be to cut back on what ever gets recommended to be applied OR skip applying any fertilizer this year (mine your soil). You would not be the first to skip fertilizing one year IMHO.

Larry


----------



## rajela (Feb 15, 2014)

Soil Test.....


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

Yeah I'll have to soil test and see what I can do from there.


----------



## somedevildawg (Jun 20, 2011)

rajela said:


> Soil Test.....


Best money you can spend....buy this before the owners manual


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

I'll keep this short because I'm shot... The ole supper 66 baled 300 bales excellent before it decided to shear the fly wheel bolt, break a chain, and demolish the wadboad assembly at the hands of the plunger. Needless to say I fell short of filling my order of 375 but the guy understood. I'll be getting him the remaining balance at next cut assuming my baler is going.

Now I need to find out if I can find this part and hope it's not a trillion dollars...


----------



## 32-0-0 (May 30, 2017)

MyDaughtersPony said:


> I'll keep this short because I'm shot... The ole supper 66 baled 300 bales excellent before it decided to shear the fly wheel bolt, break a chain, and demolish the wadboad assembly at the hands of the plunger. Needless to say I fell short of filling my order of 375 but the guy understood. I'll be getting him the remaining balance at next cut assuming my baler is going.
> 
> Now I need to find out if I can find this part and hope it's not a trillion dollars...


Try www.tractorpartsasap.com or call 1-877-530-4430. It's an outfit called All State Ag Parts...they sell used parts and ship them to you. I'm not sure of the size of the part you need, so shipping may or may not be an issue (meaning will shipping cost be too much). My dad bought some parts from them and is happy with service and parts received. As long as you're not in a super hurry for the part, then they are another source of parts. Good luck and hang in there...be persistent.


----------



## RockyHill (Apr 24, 2013)

Bummer!

Jeff remembers a family member having that problem. This has been some years back and they had enough "remains" that they just got some wood and made one -- worked for them. Jeff wasn't familiar with that baler enough to give you any specifics but thinks it is do-able.

All State Ag has helped us out in the past, a good resource for parts.

Shelia


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

Thanks for the help. I'll definitely check them out. I need more than the wooden part. It seems like it hit further back on the unit. I'll post some pictures later.


----------



## RockyHill (Apr 24, 2013)

Here are a few places around here that you might try calling if you don't come up with anything.

http://www.powdermillsfarmequip.com/default.asp

http://www.dranefarmequipment.com/

http://www.sweettractors.com/

Shelia


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

I had a neighbor come and round bale what I wasn't able to finish. He started after I had left to work but my wife said they were medium sized rounds 9.5 of them. I owe him $11 per. I guess it could be worse. Now I just need to figure out a way to move them off the field lol.


----------



## skyrydr2 (Oct 25, 2015)

For baler and cutter parts I have had very good luck with Fry's Machinery in Penn. 5705463968


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

Baling day was a little hectic and bales were moving around faster than I could accurately track. Based on our best estimate our yeild was 79 bales per acre. 514 bales on 6.5 acres = 79 if anything those figures are on the conservative side.

I am getting a soil test done in the next couple weeks. I talked to a neighbor with a pig farm and he said he could spread a light application of pig manure after my 3rd and last cutting in late August or early September. That should help the field out a little.


----------



## Shetland Sheepdog (Mar 31, 2011)

Go for it! The neighbors will LOVE you!


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

Clip of baling before we broke down. I'm trying to figure out the sequence of failure. Chain slipped on sproket? Caused collision? Broke chain link and sheared flywheel shear bolt?


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

A few pictures.


----------



## skyrydr2 (Oct 25, 2015)

OUCH! Dang you done crunched that bit didn't you! 
Lucky for me my day went a bit better than yours, as I only lost a shear bolt that was old and had the nut fall off last fall. We saw the nut on the frame ans put ir back on, should have just changed it.. that is nothing compaired to your boo boo.
Check all your chains and spockets now.. those kind of crashes hurt..


----------



## KNFarm (Jul 7, 2011)

I had pretty much the same thing happen 10 - 12 years ago on mine and at the time all of the parts were still available from NH. Looking at their online parts book it looks like you may still be in luck. It ran me about $250 and I was back up and going in a few days.

http://partstore.agriculture.newholland.com/us/parts-search.html#epc::mr51411ar174034bi328256-13


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

KNFarm said:


> I had pretty much the same thing happen 10 - 12 years ago on mine and at the time all of the parts were still available from NH. Looking at their online parts book it looks like you may still be in luck. It ran me about $250 and I was back up and going in a few days.
> 
> http://partstore.agriculture.newholland.com/us/parts-search.html#epc::mr51411ar174034bi328256-13


You had or have a 66? Did you have up replace the entire wad board plunger? If it's only $250 that won't be too bad.


----------



## KNFarm (Jul 7, 2011)

Yes, I have a PTO drive 66, much rougher looking than yours but still does a nice job. I did have to replace the entire wad board as well as the two front finger sections that are #21 & #22 in the diagram. On mine, the plunger took out #21 & #22 and snapped the wad board into 3 pieces but #13 was still usable. On yours #13 appears to have taken most of the hit.


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

Please check this thread frequently in the next week's. I'm sure I may need some advice!


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

On my NH 256 rake I checked the gear box oil. It says to use S.A.E No. 140 gear oil (which I bought today at the dealership). However, when I took the fill plug off I saw something that looked thick like grease. I am not familiar with 140 gear oil is it supposed to be thick? I didn't add any new oil because the gear box was full of that grease looking stuff. Any advice?


----------



## luke strawwalker (Jul 31, 2014)

MyDaughtersPony said:


> On my NH 256 rake I checked the gear box oil. It says to use S.A.E No. 140 gear oil (which I bought today at the dealership). However, when I took the fill plug off I saw something that looked thick like grease. I am not familiar with 140 gear oil is it supposed to be thick? I didn't add any new oil because the gear box was full of that grease looking stuff. Any advice?


Yeah it's typical for guys to just put grease in there... the seals just don't seem to want to hold oil-- it just leaks out and makes a mess.

Corn head grease is a good "happy medium"... it's more flowable than regular tube-type grease, but way thicker than oil and will stay put in those gearboxes.

Later and good luck! OL J R


----------



## 8350HiTech (Jul 26, 2013)

luke strawwalker said:


> Yeah it's typical for guys to just put grease in there... the seals just don't seem to want to hold oil-- it just leaks out and makes a mess.
> 
> Corn head grease is a good "happy medium"... it's more flowable than regular tube-type grease, but way thicker than oil and will stay put in those gearboxes.
> 
> Later and good luck! OL J R


Yeah, typically labeled EP or 00 grease.


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

Alright I'll just leave it alone since it's full of grease. I just wanted to make sure it was good to go. Thanks.


----------



## Ranger518 (Aug 6, 2016)

Yea 00 grease is some good stuff eapecially when you have a olde piece of equipment with a leaky seal but it is hard for me to find anymore I did find 2 bottles this year at tractor supply that I picked up.


----------



## BWfarms (Aug 3, 2015)

I'm really surprised a parts man at a dealership sold oil for a 256 and not tell you to plug it with grease. He must be a by the book man lol.


----------



## 8350HiTech (Jul 26, 2013)

Ranger518 said:


> Yea 00 grease is some good stuff eapecially when you have a olde piece of equipment with a leaky seal but it is hard for me to find anymore I did find 2 bottles this year at tractor supply that I picked up.


Definitely not on every store shelf but my NH dealer always has it.


----------



## luke strawwalker (Jul 31, 2014)

BWfarms said:


> I'm really surprised a parts man at a dealership sold oil for a 256 and not tell you to plug it with grease. He must be a by the book man lol.


More likely doesn't have a clue...

Later! OL J R


----------



## luke strawwalker (Jul 31, 2014)

Deere dealer usually has corn head grease out the wazoo...

We also used a very thin grease for the picker bars on cotton pickers... got that stuff by the five gallon bucket!

Later! OL J R


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

I was brush hogging this morning. We have a small piece of land that was really over grown. I thought I'd knock it down with a brush hog. I'm​ wondering if it will give me trouble cutting with the sickle come next cutting. For example plugging up the cutter bar. Or will the grass clippings dry up and break down enough that it won't matter?


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

Soil sample was sent in yesterday. Hopefully get the results in a week. I'll post the form and welcome any advice.


----------



## Idaho Hay (Oct 14, 2016)

MyDaughtersPony said:


> I was brush hogging this morning. We have a small piece of land that was really over grown. I thought I'd knock it down with a brush hog. I'm wondering if it will give me trouble cutting with the sickle come next cutting. For example plugging up the cutter bar. Or will the grass clippings dry up and break down enough that it won't matter?


I've not done exactly what you're doing here, but my experience/gut tells me that you will likely have plug ups. I have a field that on one end of it is my mother-in-law's lawn where she'd blow grass lawn clippings out into the field. And back when I had a sickle machine it would plug up every time I cut through that. Sickles don't like fine mats of anything.


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

On my baler I'm guessing it's the or a gear box. I don't have my manual in front of me to verify. Anyways it has a plug on the top. I opened it and I didn't see much of any fluid inside.... Mine is motor driven but I don't know if that matters.... I'm guessing this isn't a good thing.


----------



## Idaho Hay (Oct 14, 2016)

MyDaughtersPony said:


> On my baler I'm guessing it's the or a gear box. I don't have my manual in front of me to verify. Anyways it has a plug on the top. I opened it and I didn't see much of any fluid inside.... Mine is motor driven but I don't know if that matters.... I'm guessing this isn't a good thing.


The gear box isn't supposed to be full of oil. Look around on the side of the gear box and see if you can find another plug, which would be the fill to plug. That's how full the gear box should be.

Most every gear box should have three different plugs: one on the bottom (drain plug), one about half way up the side (fill to plug), and one on top (filler plug and in many cases it's also a vent/breather)


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

Thanks


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

I found it in the manual... I'll check it out out tomorrow. It most definitely should be drained and filled.


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

That oil came out of the gear box. We got the wad board assembly out. We think we need the long wad board and another part called a helper. I'll call the dealership on Monday for availability and prices. We also noticed some of the idler pulleys were worn. I'm checking prices on those as well. I took some pictures.


----------



## bool (Mar 14, 2016)

It looks like you might be able to straigthen most of the metal parts. There might be enough of the wooden parts left to use as a pattern to cut new pieces.

Does that chain drive the knotters? If so, it must be timed properly and I imagine the manual explains how to do that. It would be good to determine how worn it is. The holes in the links where they join become oval after a while. If you remove it and lay it down and see how far you can bend it sideways, and take a photo of a 3 foot length or so and post it, we could see how much it can be bent and suggest whether we think it needs to be replaced.

Roger


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

I took the picture of the chains to show the pulleys. I also asked for chain prices and availability. I'm not going to try and straighten the metal. I'm getting a new part for $145. I'm not sure how much the wooden helper board costs but I'm getting a price. The helper board is pretty splintered. I did not post a picture of it. It seems pretty straight forward what we have to do. I am feeling more optimistic.


----------



## r82230 (Mar 1, 2016)

Some where I have seen a chart that shows different types of chain, along with measurements. You lay the chain down pull it straight and measure X amount of pitches. If the length exceeds X measurement (or is close to meeting it) chain is worn and you should replace. I just need more time to think of where I seen that chart at (I'm thinking one of my equipment manuals).

Larry


----------



## The saint (Oct 4, 2015)

MyDaughtersPony said:


> I lost a guard and sickle knife. I was just commenting that I am missing tines from my rake. They are not in the field. Good idea checking the uncut strips for the guard and knife. I'll take the kids out tomorrow and see if they can prove useful


.

I remember ridding the ATV along the swaths with a borrowed detector looking for a lost guard before. Just an idea


----------



## luke strawwalker (Jul 31, 2014)

MyDaughtersPony said:


> I took the picture of the chains to show the pulleys. I also asked for chain prices and availability. I'm not going to try and straighten the metal. I'm getting a new part for $145. I'm not sure how much the wooden helper board costs but I'm getting a price. The helper board is pretty splintered. I did not post a picture of it. It seems pretty straight forward what we have to do. I am feeling more optimistic.


Trace a pattern of it onto heavy cardboard and then if you ever happen to break another one, you can always cut one out of good lumber and bolt it in.

Your chain idlers don't look too bad to me... so long as they're not completely floppy on the pins, (pins wore out or holes egged out in the idlers) I think they're okay... they'll get some grooves where the chain runs on them... besides, the dealer will positively SCREW you on things like idlers that you can get something similar from TSC or just about any ag supply as a generic part.

What I'd be more concerned about is the chains themselves... Find the master link and take them off... clean them up of all the caked-on dirt and crud by washing in varsol or diesel (or gas if you're careful) with a good stiff brush (good brass or stiff plastic brush). Lay them out flat on a board, and squeeze all the links together one by one, measure the length of the chain. Then grab each end (or have someone else grab one end while you hold the other if it's too long) and pull it as far as it'll go, and measure it again. The difference in length is the wear in the chain. Leave the chain flat on the board and grab about three feet of it and try and twist it sideways like someone else said, and measure how much slack and wear is in the chain.

Get back to us with photos...  BTW the dealer is also probably the worst place to buy chain-- unless he has good AMERICAN made chain, not the cheap Chinese junk that MOST of the dealers seem to stock... JD is usually better about this than most others... If you have to settle for cheap Chinese junk chain, you can get it a whole lot cheaper at any of the generic farm stores like TSC and the like, or better yet order chain from Shoup Parts... (If you don't have their catalog, look them up online and get a free one...)

Later! OL J R 

PS. BTW *IF* the chains are good, spray them heavily with a good quality chain lube and reinstall them, be sure it gets to the pins and down between the side plates of EVERY LINK... You CAN use oil, but it's messy and attracts dirt and grit and chaff which will wear the chain out faster, and chaff holds moisture and can rust the chains. Lube your chains when they're warm after you finish baling for the day (assuming your baling for a few hours-- less than that, every other time).


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

I definitely have to address the chains before next cutting. Thanks for information.


----------



## Dieselfume (Jul 20, 2014)

Very poor hay year. 2nd year of drought, averaging .4 tons per acre.

Problem is even as poor as the hay tonnage is, it's still much cheaper than can be bought, so we don't have much choice but to go after it.

If not for our vermeer equipment (the trail mower mostly) we would not be fast enough to cover the ground we are currently covering each day to get the hay put up before it burns up.

So far about 800 acres down, and 600 left to go on our place, then headed to the neighbors to cut 450 acres of voulenteer wheat that might make decent cow hay.

Will take more pictures as the weeks go on, have a new video camera coming so hopefully the cell phone videos don't put you off too much!













The pic of the grass is hay I didn't think would make it a couple weeks ago, but we got lucky and got 8 tenths of rain and I think it might actually be worth cutting now. It's not real thick, but has some height and might make 1/2 ton/acre. At least it's green!


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

That's a lot of property!


----------



## luke strawwalker (Jul 31, 2014)

Dieselfume said:


> Very poor hay year. 2nd year of drought, averaging .4 tons per acre.
> 
> Problem is even as poor as the hay tonnage is, it's still much cheaper than can be bought, so we don't have much choice but to go after it.
> 
> ...


Amazing what a little rain will do...

Later and good luck! OL J R


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

I don't know how to interpret this report. Any help would be great!


----------



## 8350HiTech (Jul 26, 2013)

Their recommendations are the interpretation.

Basically, you're a little low on ph and potassium. The rest of the recommended application is based on what you're removing with each crop.


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

So I apply lime? it says 0 ton / A ?


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

I gather my pH is .3 above recommendation. My phosphorus is way to high.... my Potassium is below opimum and magnesium is also above optimum.

How do I lower my P and Mg and raise my K? I know lime lowers pH so I assume I need to apply lime, but it sa.ys 0 ton/A which I don't understand.


----------



## 8350HiTech (Jul 26, 2013)

They're recommending 5.5 on ph. Maybe that is considered best for orchard grass in your area. It would typically be considered a little low. They know more about your soil type so I'm sure there's a reason. You don't need to actively lower the high level nutrients. They'll be lowered as you harvest hay. You raise what you need to by applying the pounds of fertilizer that are suggested. Now you may have a bit of an issue if you do take the hog manure you've mentioned but, while it may be wasteful or even irresponsible, you can apply it anyway so long as you aren't subject to a nutrient management plan from the manure exporter.


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

No he's actually a family friend who lives around the corner.

I don't think I want the maneur if my phosphorus is already high...


----------



## swmnhay (Jun 13, 2008)

MyDaughtersPony said:


> I gather my pH is .3 above recommendation. My phosphorus is way to high.... my Potassium is below opimum and magnesium is also above optimum.
> 
> How do I lower my P and Mg and raise my K? I know lime lowers pH so I assume I need to apply lime, but it sa.ys 0 ton/A which I don't understand.


Lime raises PH

5.8 PH is on the low side.I shoot for 7 but am in rotation with corn & beans.5.8 may be fine for orchardgrass but wouldn't be for alfalfa.

K is easy to raise just apply Potash 0-0-60

Don't worry about P & MG being on high side.

0-ton is just what it says.they are recomending nothing


----------



## Ranger518 (Aug 6, 2016)

I would say if you were on a budget and wanted to get by as cheep as possable I would apply 50lb of urea and 50lb of potash after each cutting this year and test it again this winter and see where you are at. But over all your ground looks pretty good have you been fertlizering it in the past few years? I like my PH to be at least 6.5 but that is in my area on Bermuda grass not sure what orchard grass likes but they say 5.5 so you should be ok for now.


----------



## r82230 (Mar 1, 2016)

MyDaughtersPony said:


> No he's actually a family friend who lives around the corner.
> 
> I don't think I want the maneur if my phosphorus is already high...


Did he give you a rough idea of the analysis of the pig manure by any chance? It still might fit in as part of the fertilizer program. I agree with SWMN, some lime might be in your future.

Larry


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

I don't believe he has his maneur analyzed. He said he doesn't test his hay fields because he over fertilizes with maneur. He said he'd be afraid to see his phosphorus levels.


----------



## 8350HiTech (Jul 26, 2013)

MyDaughtersPony said:


> I don't believe he has his maneur analyzed. He said he doesn't test his hay fields because he over fertilizes with maneur. He said he'd be afraid to see his phosphorus levels.


People like that are exactly why we need regulations.

For your land, you can still responsibly accept manure but you will want to base the amount on phosphorous removal instead of nitrogen need.


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

So I shouldn't have him apply manuer unless I know the analysis of the manuer? He said it'd cost me $120 for him to hit all 6 acres. Pretty much just fuel.

I want to be responsible but thats much more pocket book friendly than what it'd cost to buy fertilizer and rent spreader.


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

It's just a balancing act for me... Small field size... Small pocket book... I keep hay for our animals and sell the rest. I don't want the field to decline but I probably can't afford to do exactly what it needs. I need to find a middle ground that is possible.


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

Maybe do one application of urea this year and then hit it with potash next year. Split the cost up a little... I'm guessing this would still help but no be ideal.


----------



## rajela (Feb 15, 2014)

Get the manure and then retest next spring.


----------



## 8350HiTech (Jul 26, 2013)

MyDaughtersPony said:


> So I shouldn't have him apply manuer unless I know the analysis of the manuer? He said it'd cost me $120 for him to hit all 6 acres. Pretty much just fuel.
> 
> I want to be responsible but thats much more pocket book friendly than what it'd cost to buy fertilizer and rent spreader.


Hog manure analysis is a crap shoot (intended) unless it's agitated very well before spreading. Try to find an average online or from your extension office (the manure is different depending on the size of the hogs he has so you need to know what his operation involves) and then apply according to that average. Apply an amount that carries the amount of phosphorus you'll remove each year with hay that you sell off of your property. This will likely leave you a little short on nitrogen. At that point you can choose to add a little urea or choose not to. Soil rest again in two or thee years.


----------



## VA Haymaker (Jul 1, 2014)

Sorry wrong haying 2017....


----------



## Dilligaffarms (Feb 11, 2017)

First post here. Love this site. Im in same boat old equipment no money newbee. Anyhow check sloan express for chain and bearings, two day ship to our area half price of tsc $11 flat shipping. Ive been stalking this site for awhile and learn every time im here.


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

I would be lost without this site. I've asked a lot of beginner questions. I started on this site last year.


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

leeave96 said:


> Sorry wrong haying 2017....


All good


----------



## Dilligaffarms (Feb 11, 2017)

Been stalking since my mother bought me a gift of an old ford 536 moco and a jd336 two yrs ago, So i could bale my field for the horses. I have to say i love cutting hay not sure why. All in all its a no pay part time job. Someday ill win the lotto and just farm till its gone lol


----------



## luke strawwalker (Jul 31, 2014)

MyDaughtersPony said:


> So I apply lime? it says 0 ton / A ?


That 5.8 pH is pretty acidic... the more acidic the soil, the more nutrients tend to get tied up and not available to the plant. BUT, they're recommending a 5.5 pH, which is weird, as that's even MORE acidic than you currently are, which is why they're recommending NO lime! Now that don't sound particularly right to me, but we don't grow orchardgrass, so who am I to judge...

They're saying to hit it with some nitrogen and a pretty good amount of potash... probably get what you need as dry fertilizer; if your local co-op has a spreader you can take them your results and they should be able to blend it up and load it in a spreader for you, and then you can just tow it home with the pickup (or them deliver it) and then hook the spreader to your tractor and get after it...

Later! OL J R


----------



## luke strawwalker (Jul 31, 2014)

MyDaughtersPony said:


> I gather my pH is .3 above recommendation. My phosphorus is way to high.... my Potassium is below opimum and magnesium is also above optimum.
> 
> How do I lower my P and Mg and raise my K? I know lime lowers pH so I assume I need to apply lime, but it sa.ys 0 ton/A which I don't understand.


Lime RAISES pH, not lowers it. 7.0 is neutral, below 7 is acidic, above 7 is basic (alkaline). Lime makes acid soil more basic (alkaline). Our pH typically runs about 7.2 here and we never have had to apply lime. The "ideal" pH is typically described as about 6.5-6.8 from what I've read and heard. 5.8 is pretty acidic, and 5.5 is even more so. Course, some crops like acidic soil. You can raise pH with lime, but there's not really a good way to LOWER pH (make soil more acidic). Applying sulfur slowly helps make soil more acidic, but nothing like lime does to raise pH.

As the soil becomes more acidic, more and more nutrients are tied up and become unavailable to the plant. At the same time, some metals can become more available, sometimes to toxic levels.

You don't need to "lower" your phosphorus... in fact, a high phosphorus level is a GOOD thing, because phosphorus is one of the most expensive nutrients to apply, and it's not particularly mobile in the soil (needs to be worked in to the soil, as it doesn't move much with water (leaching) into the soil-- if applied ton the soil surface it pretty much stays on the surface). Potash doesn't move a lot either IIRC but it moves more and easier than phosphorus. Nitrogen is highly mobile in the soil.

Basically, they're calling for 60 units of nitrogen and 235 units of potassium (potash). That's a lot of potash... For whatever reason, they're saying that your pH is about where it needs to be for orchardgrass... at least that's the recommendations...

Talk to your local co-op or fertilizer dealer, show them your recommendations, and go from there...

Best of luck! OL J R


----------



## luke strawwalker (Jul 31, 2014)

MyDaughtersPony said:


> So I shouldn't have him apply manuer unless I know the analysis of the manuer? He said it'd cost me $120 for him to hit all 6 acres. Pretty much just fuel.
> 
> I want to be responsible but thats much more pocket book friendly than what it'd cost to buy fertilizer and rent spreader.


Well, it'd be better for him to apply the manure to your ground than onto his where it's already overapplied...

I think that you'll still need some N spread on top, but that's cheaper than K is... course from your analysis recommendations looks like they're REALLY recommending you lay on the K, so that's where most of your expense is going to be... 60 pounds of N is *fairly* cheap (by comparison).

Why not get the manure analyzed? Should be able to send it in for testing and they'll tell you exactly what's in it...

The rest is just multiplication and subtraction... 

Later! OL J R


----------



## luke strawwalker (Jul 31, 2014)

MyDaughtersPony said:


> It's just a balancing act for me... Small field size... Small pocket book... I keep hay for our animals and sell the rest. I don't want the field to decline but I probably can't afford to do exactly what it needs. I need to find a middle ground that is possible.


Well, you don't have to do EVERYTHING in one year, or one go...

Split it up and so long as you're putting out more potassium than your taking off in hay, your numbers will rise.

Manure will have some nitrogen, so that's a cheap source. It'll add plenty of phosphorus on your land too, and I'm not sure about the potassium. Why it'd be good to get an analysis and you'd know what you're putting out.

If spreader rental is going to be too high, check at any local farm auctions and try to pick up a 3 point spinner spreader... they can be had pretty cheap (make sure it's in working order) and then you can buy bulk or bagged dry fertilizer and spin it on yourself with the tractor and PTO spreader... Just make sure you wash the thing out well and then wash it with diesel and spray oil on it so it doesn't rust all to pieces!

I don't think you can afford to put out ALL that K in one year... and if you did, I think you'd really need to disk it in to get the most benefit... so long as you're putting out more than you're using, you're golden!

Later! OL J R


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

I am trying to adjust the register.


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

I am trying to adjust the register. All my pictures are upside down... I'll be back...


----------



## Shetland Sheepdog (Mar 31, 2011)

Are you aware that part K is threaded into part I?

You adjust register by turning Part I as many revolutions as needed, either onto or off from part K.

Sort of like threading a nut onto a bolt.

Its kind of involved, but should not have to be done more than once, unless the pitman stick is replaced with one of a slightly different length.

HTH, Dave


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

In picture 5 I loosened bolt "F"

In picture 6 I removed bolt "G"

Then I tapped the tilting clamp "H" back a little

I am confused on what exactly is the shoe hinge and how exactly I turn it. I see from the post above by sheepdog that apparently it's threaded... how do I rotate the entire thing?!


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

Is the turn just a small turn or are we talking full turns?

I feel like "I" is attached to the bar... if I need to spin that onto or off of K I need to spin a lot of stuff...

Also there is a chain and whatnot connected to it... how do I spin the entire thing with that attached? I must not be understanding something because it does't make sense to me.


----------



## Shetland Sheepdog (Mar 31, 2011)

Part I is the shoe hinge.

Yes, you will need to turn the shoe hinge a full turn, so the bottom of the cutter bar is still toward the ground.

Depending on how far out of register it is, you may need to take more than 1 full turn.

I don't know what the thread pitch is, but not enough to keep you from getting close to perfect register with multiples of full revolutions.

Visualize part K as a huge bolt, and part I as a huge nut! As you crank the nut onto the bolt, or off the bolt, that will change the distance from the pitman crank, to the cutter bar/fingers, while the length of the pitman rod does not change, so the distance from pitman crank to knife/sections does not change. Thusly you change the knife register.


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

Ok I understand now. So that eye bolt with the chain must be removed before I can fully turn the shoe hinge? Seems sort of difficult to turn the shoe hinge with the entire cutter bar attached... I think I'll have to remove the grass board before I start turning to make it a little easier.


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

Is it easier to do on or off the tractor?


----------



## TJ Hendren (May 12, 2017)

MyDaughtersPony said:


> Just a video of me cutting.
> 
> I felt more comfortable cutting in 1st full throttle.... the grass was thick and I felt like I needed full power on the bar. Maybe next cutting when the grass isn't so tall I'll be able to try 2nd gear.


Man-Oh-Man, Thanks for posting this, talk about bringing back memories. The only difference is the tractor was a Farmall H and the mower had a rudimentary hydraulic lift on the bar when I cut my teeth at 8 years old mowing hay for the first time 52 years ago. The excitement was indescribable at dad turning me loose in the hay field. Of course he would have been put in jail for child endangerment these days.


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

My 2 year old son is already climbing up and sitting on the M... If he sticks with it I could see him mowing some hay at a young age... Just need to do it when mom's not around lol.


----------



## Ranger518 (Aug 6, 2016)

MyDaughtersPony said:


> My 2 year old son is already climbing up and sitting on the M... If he sticks with it I could see him mowing some hay at a young age... Just need to do it when mom's not around lol.


Yea its great my 2 1/2 year old loves to ride along and work out side and in the shop with me.


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

Just a few non hay related pictures of my place.


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

Any creative ways to move round bales? I'm pretty much down to tow strap and dragging on the round side to where they need to be. They are wrapped in twine 6-10 wraps. They are pretty soild so I hope they can hold up to the dragging. From the field to where they need to is all on grass and probably 4-500 yards. I only have to move 9. Any ideas would be great or wish me luck dragging!


----------



## 8350HiTech (Jul 26, 2013)

MyDaughtersPony said:


> Any creative ways to move round bales? I'm pretty much down to tow strap and dragging on the round side to where they need to be. They are wrapped in twine 6-10 wraps. They are pretty soild so I hope they can hold up to the dragging. From the field to where they need to is all on grass and probably 4-500 yards. I only have to move 9. Any ideas would be great or wish me luck dragging!


Assuming you don't have access to even a 3pt spear (and don't want to make one), maybe push/pull them onto a makeshift sled that you can pull with a chain. Maybe some old posts or used lumber would make something. A heavy piece of plywood would probably be good as long as you add another board to attach the chain to. With bales with only that much twine, you definitely want to find a way that doesn't just involve dragging them far unless you can get the twine off of the ground.


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

I'll see if I have a plywood sheet laying around. I know I have spare wood. I don't have a chain but I think a tow strap will work. Hopefully I can position the bale on the plywood... They are pretty heavy and have been settling on the field for a few weeks... Might need to tug them free first and then hook up to the board.


----------



## Tim/South (Dec 12, 2011)

Do you have some old chain link fence? I bet you could skid the rolls on that.


----------



## Shetland Sheepdog (Mar 31, 2011)

Discarded car or truck hood came to mind as well!


----------



## Vol (Jul 5, 2009)

Roll the bale on a tarp and then tie up a corner of the tarp with a good rope and pull it.

Regards, Mike


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

I just took the kids for a ride around the fields. I am noticing a lot more clover now than in first cutting. Unless I just didn't notice if because it was taller and more mature. I am wondering if I will have trouble getting the stems to dry because I only cut with a sickle bar.

The clover is in about 50% of the field mixed in with the OG. I would prefer to cut with my sickle and save the money but if I should have it conditioned to make good hay I will.... Either I have the neighbor cut/condition or I try to rent a conditioner and run it over the field after I cut. I am selling 225 bales to horse customers.

I am in the process of uploading a video if that would help with any advice.


----------



## 8350HiTech (Jul 26, 2013)

It could depend some one your weather forecast and your yield. Say it's going to be a decent yield and you have to pay $20/acre to have it mowed. Would you trade 4 or five bales per acre for having it dry a few days earlier? Probably.

Your decision is yours based on all of your costs or potential costs, but the simple point is clover is difficult to dry sometimes even when conditioned.


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

It's 5 acres so assuming he's $20/acre it'd cost me $100 or 25 square bales at $4 each. I am selling 25 to my boss and then 200 to a couple young girls who bought from me last year.

I've been working hard on my sickle and investing money... I'd hate to not use it. At the same time I need good hay.


----------



## 8350HiTech (Jul 26, 2013)

MyDaughtersPony said:


> ... I need good hay.


Bingo. Proceed accordingly.


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

As you mentioned previous the best option is not always possible for me... I'm just looking for advice from someone with more experience. As always weather plays a large factor into drying the crop...


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)




----------



## swmnhay (Jun 13, 2008)

Some horse folk claim red clover causes slobbers??in horses.Heard it here on HT so must be true!I feed my horse some grass hay that has Red clover in it and it doesn;t bother it.

Red clover stems are pretty rubbery and the conditioner won't do alot to them,not like they do to alf.You prly won't gain a whole lot by conditioning it.Tedder would be a better option.


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

Alright thanks for the advice. I need to get a Tedder also. Maybe I can rent one.

It's mixed in with the grass. Maybe it's not quite enough of the clover to be an issue. It was like this last year also. I had no complaints.


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

I guess I could cut Saturday and bale by Wednesday if the weather holds. Otherwise I'll be waiting another week it looks like.


----------



## Ranger518 (Aug 6, 2016)

Wow I wish it was that cool here. Did you get your baler repaired?


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

No... I need help finding these super rare parts! I can get them new but the wad board is $130 and the wad board helper is $390!

I am looking for used but no one has a salvage S66 apparently. Even so the wooden wad board is probably shot... I'll settle for a new wad board and a used helper unit. I'm still hunting though.... I have a week or 2 to find what I need or I'll have to cut and rake and have the neighbor bale for $1 per square 

Any information on places to call would really help! Thanks


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

Part numbers 29628 and 29629 I believe.


----------



## Ranger518 (Aug 6, 2016)

Just sent you a pm I may of found a guy with the parts you need.


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

I got in touch with the eBay guy and he had yet to take the parts off his baler. He got back to me today and had it off and sent me pictures. It's exactly what I need. It's in used shape obviously but should work just fine. I store my baler inside so the condition wont get a ton worse by weather.

He only wants $50 + shipping I understand it's used but brand new it was $130 for long wad board and $390 for the metal wad board helper............

He's weighing it and getting a shipping total for me. I'll be paying and he'll be shipping it out tomorrow. I was starting to get worried my baling was done for the season. As long as we can get these parts installed and get it going again I'll be able to cut the next weather window and have a functional baler again.


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

Also managed to adjust the register on the sickle. It is a pain to do... Definitely a 2 man job. The manual definitely left out a couple steps.

We actually bent the socket that the sickle ball goes into... When we were spinning it the metal part got stuck and we didn't realize it... Then had to reposition it to make a full revolution.

Once we finished and were putting it all back together we realized that a nut that had to go on had less thread on the bolt because we turned the shoe off or away from the main shaft. I'll probably just have to buy a longer square neck bolt to the nut has more thread.


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

Quick sickle bar update.


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

Hopefully Monday is the start of a good weather window! Would like to start 2nd cutting soon.


----------



## somedevildawg (Jun 20, 2011)

I've learned to not pay too much attention to those extended forecasts......they change at the drop of a hat. I don't make a move until I see definitive changes taking place......


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

I understand there are many variables but... can anyone give me a general answer. If I cut OG mixed with red clover on Monday and the weather is good until Saturday could it be to dry? I cut with a sickle and don't ted. I'm assuming the top layer will be sun bleached and underneath will still look good.


----------



## 8350HiTech (Jul 26, 2013)

It could be. It could still be wet on the bottom too. Like you said, variables.


----------



## Ranger518 (Aug 6, 2016)

You could always rake it twice which will help it dry a little better. Not ideal but will work.


----------



## VA Haymaker (Jul 1, 2014)

MyDaughtersPony said:


> I understand there are many variables but... can anyone give me a general answer. If I cut OG mixed with red clover on Monday and the weather is good until Saturday could it be to dry? I cut with a sickle and don't ted. I'm assuming the top layer will be sun bleached and underneath will still look good.


I assume this is first cut hay? Clover is tough to dry. I had the stuff In our fields when we started to reclaim them. Where it was heavy, I got some dust. When using a sickle bar on mixed grass, weeds and clover - I let it lay out flat with the sickle mower for probably 4 days and then raked and baled on the fifth. Some of your hay is going to be bleached and the underside somewhat light green, hopefully between the rake and baler, you'll be OK. You can rake sooner to preserve some color, say the 4th day and use he heal of the rake to turn the windrow over on the fifth day and bale.

Absent a conditioner and a baler mounted moisture meter, dusty, bleached hay is a crap shoot. IMHO - better to live with some over dry hay than mild dust. When you get further along with your haying, I'd recommend a sprayer and eliminate the clover. I found my sprayer, 50 gal with 20ft boom for $50.

Good luck,
Bill


----------



## stack em up (Mar 7, 2013)

leeave96 said:


> When you get further along with your haying, I'd recommend a sprayer and eliminate the clover. I found my sprayer, 50 gal with 20ft boom for $50.
> Good luck,
> Bill


This seems counterintuitive to me, kind of a cut off your nose to spite your face kind of deal. Why eliminate the forage that would increase the RFV, in turn increasing dollar value of the hay, just to make it easy for the right now, versus the long term? And red clover isn't a long term perennial anyway, so in a couple years it's not even gonna be there. I say take advantage of it whilst ya got it.


----------



## 8350HiTech (Jul 26, 2013)

stack em up said:


> This seems counterintuitive to me, kind of a cut off your nose to spite your face kind of deal. Why eliminate the forage that would increase the RFV, in turn increasing dollar value of the hay, just to make it easy for the right now, versus the long term? And red clover isn't a long term perennial anyway, so in a couple years it's not even gonna be there. I say take advantage of it whilst ya got it.


Because it's a hassle to dry and more buyers than not don't want it. Selling small bales is about what customers want, forage value be damned.


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

Used wad board was warped....


----------



## VA Haymaker (Jul 1, 2014)

stack em up said:


> This seems counterintuitive to me, kind of a cut off your nose to spite your face kind of deal. Why eliminate the forage that would increase the RFV, in turn increasing dollar value of the hay, just to make it easy for the right now, versus the long term? And red clover isn't a long term perennial anyway, so in a couple years it's not even gonna be there. I say take advantage of it whilst ya got it.


Because the higher $$$'s is in square bales of hay for horses. Horse owners are programmed to object to clover, regardless of condition and clover's difficult dry down can and does yield either dusty hay or hay that has set out to dry so long it's bleached. Neither of these conditions are appealing to my horse customers.

YMMV


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

We sanded it down enough to get it back in the baler. Ran out of time... Back at it tomorrow...


----------



## stack em up (Mar 7, 2013)

8350HiTech said:


> Because it's a hassle to dry and more buyers than not don't want it. Selling small bales is about what customers want, forage value be damned.


And to me, that is the stupidest thing about horse hay buyers. I swear most don't have a damn thought in their head.


----------



## Coondle (Aug 28, 2013)

stack em up said:


> And to me, that is the stupidest thing about horse hay buyers. I swear most don't have a damn thought in their head.


Most it seems to me have plenty of room in their head to store a stray thought if one comes along.

The latest Facebook driven hay fashion is "low-sugar' hay which the hoss people then complain their critters do not eat.

MDP great to see you sourced some parts.

Reading of your S66 brought memories back of when I first started custom haying with a mid mounted Bamford (British) sickle mower. An Allis Chalmers tricycle WD tractor, an IH GL side delivery basket rake and a NH S66.

IH made a full range of farm equipment and many parts were common across the range. e.g. the caster wheel on the back of your mower fitted the rake (which had 2) too. Seeder wheels (GL132) fitted their combine harvester (GL200) and the tradition continued for several decades The 6-2 seeder wheels fitted the 711 combine harvester in the 1970's. Square link drive chains were on the hay rake, seeder, combine harvester and many bearings were generic across the range.

Still have the last 2 items on the scrap heap and would give you the remains of the S66 but freight would kill

Take a pattern from the wadboard so you an fabricate another if ever needed. The timber parts on old hay gear are easy to manufacture if you can source suitable timber and you should have plenty around where you are.


----------



## somedevildawg (Jun 20, 2011)

Coondle said:


> Most it seems to me have plenty of room in their head to store a stray thought if one comes along.
> 
> The latest Facebook driven hay fashion is "low-sugar' hay which the hoss people then complain their critters do not eat.
> 
> ...


Believe me Kevin, we've seen it on this very forum.....


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

Well it's at the end of the 8 day so it could change 100 times between now and then... But starting Friday I see some clear potentially dry weather. I'm hoping to cut on Friday and bale on Tuesday... Here's to hoping!!


----------



## JD3430 (Jan 1, 2012)

Just finished my 700th 4x5 RB in first cutting. It was a pretty frustrating first cutting. Lots of downtime, repairs and rain. Torrential downpours last night when I got home. Probably got 2-3" rain in 4 hours.


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

Cutting second cut tomorrow. Wish me luck.


----------



## Vol (Jul 5, 2009)

MyDaughtersPony said:


> Cutting second cut tomorrow. Wish me luck.


Good luck.

Regards, Mike


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

The M wont shift into 1st gear. It does shift into 2, 3, 4 and, 5th gear. It seems that neutral is reverse.

How do I fix this? I need to finish cutting tomorrow. I was told I had to take the floor cover off and adjust a clip?

Any help would be appreciated. Thanks.


----------



## haybaler101 (Nov 30, 2008)

Your gear shift lever lost the first/reverse shifting rail and you are stuck in reverse. Remove pins in bottom of shifter and pull it out. Take a pry bar and align all three rails so the slots line up in neutral position and re install shift lever. A five minute repair with experience and be gentle with the old girl when you are shifting gears, she is only 70 years old!


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

Thanks. I'll be more gentle.


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

I'll be back with an updated after church.


----------



## mlappin (Jun 25, 2009)

haybaler101 said:


> Your gear shift lever lost the first/reverse shifting rail and you are stuck in reverse. Remove pins in bottom of shifter and pull it out. Take a pry bar and align all three rails so the slots line up in neutral position and re install shift lever. A five minute repair with experience and be gentle with the old girl when you are shifting gears, she is only 70 years old!


Have an Oliver 88 diesel that does something similar sometimes except it pops out of one range into the other then your stuck with R1, 1, 2, and 5th, again with experience takes five minutes to pop the two bolts out that hold the shifter and put it back into the correct range. I've inspected the shift rails, and have changed the gear shift lever, still does it once in awhile, just one of those things I guess.


----------



## rankrank1 (Mar 30, 2009)

MyDaughtersPony said:


> Thanks. I'll be more gentle.


It may not be a matter of being gentle. Those type farmall shifters from the h and m were notorious for 2 big problems. When one or both of the following happens it creates a situation where one of the shift rails does not get moved and it pops out. (You have received good advice on the remedy in previous post about how to remove the shifter and line up all the rails again with a big screwdriver or pry bar)

Problem #1 is the shifter gets sloppy on top at the big pin at the base of the shifter. A temporary repair can me made there using the smooth shank portion of a grade 8 bolt to remove the slop in place of the worn pin, but there is also a "sloppy shifter fix kit" on ebay that is supposedly an even better fix for this problem although I have never needed one of those.

Problem #2 is even more common and the tip of the shifter gets worn. Building the shifter tip back up with weld (or braze if no welder is handy) and then grinding back to desired shape is the nearly free and easy fix here. There are dimensions of what that tip should measure pictured on Yesterday Tractor Forum with a search over there.


----------



## rankrank1 (Mar 30, 2009)

PS If you still cutting with that sickle in 1st gear that is too slow a ground speed on an m. Grass needs to fall behind the bar as you cut not in front of bar.

I feel you should be 2nd gear wide open throttle in the tight areas of a small field and lots of 3rd gear wide open throttle in the bigger open areas of a field. I have both an h and an m and am very familiar with the travel speeds of each gear assuming you have the run mill common tranny optioned farmall m.

If you still need first gear to cut then you are not adjusted correctly on that sicklemower (glad to see you finally fixed register. That adjustment alone will be huge in performance and should have been done long ago), bar angle, and bar lead need to be adjusted next.


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

I'll run the speed test again but in 1st gear full throttle I was going 3 MPH.... I had 100 ft marked out with barrels. A fellow poster told me how many seconds it takes to go 100 ft = MPH. I don't remember how many seconds it took me to go 100 ft in 2nd gear but I remember it was pretty quick. I'm heading out to try and get it fixed so I can finish cutting.

I'm dead in the water without this tractor running... not a good feeling.

Thanks everyone for the great advice!


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

I dont see 2 bolts under the shifter.


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

I dont see anything under it that would connect to the shifter.


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

How do I get the pin out? Hammer and screw driver as a punch?


----------



## VA Haymaker (Jul 1, 2014)

MyDaughtersPony said:


> I'll run the speed test again but in 1st gear full throttle I was going 3 MPH.... I had 100 ft marked out with barrels. A fellow poster told me how many seconds it takes to go 100 ft = MPH. I don't remember how many seconds it took me to go 100 ft in 2nd gear but I remember it was pretty quick. I'm heading out to try and get it fixed so I can finish cutting.
> 
> I'm dead in the water without this tractor running... not a good feeling.
> 
> Thanks everyone for the great advice!


Tractordata shows the M at 2.6 mph in 1st gear and 3.5 mph in 2nd gear.

I posted this link several times 



 and was doing 5.3 or 3.6 (depending on the gear), but my sickle can cut thick dry hay at 5.0ish mph all day long. I say that to reinforce the prior point that was made. You definitely want to be going fast enough for the hay to be falling backwards off the cutterbar as shown in my video. It's hard to clog a sickle IMHO when the grass is moving across it so fast that the bar has moved on before the cut hay can cause trouble.

If you're sickle is in register, 540 PTO speed, knifes are sharp, down on the ledgers and the ledger edges are in good shape too, and the grass is dry, you can really cut a lot of hay with a sickle bar mower.

Good luck,
Bill


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

Is that the pin? I chipped the paint off. It seems like soft metal that I'm denting...


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

Better picture. The pin seems soft.


----------



## haybaler101 (Nov 30, 2008)

That is it. I think it has freeze out plugs on both sides. Remove those to get to the pin. It has been a while since I have had to do one, my dad is a pro, he can pop when back in in a matter of seconds.


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

What is a freeze out plug? I only know very basics as I'm learning. Do I just hit with a hammer and screwdriver? I dont want to make this worse... I understand you've given basic instructions but I need baby steps.


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

The freeze plug is just indenting.


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

Does the shifter need to be in a specific position for the pin to come out?


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

We got the shifter off. Trying to figure out what needs to be ppositioned where.


----------



## haybaler101 (Nov 30, 2008)

Ok look down into the transmission and you will see 3 shifting rails. The left and middle ones should be in the center neutral position (the slot where the end of the shifter goes will be straight down in the middle). The right rail should be slid back if you are stuck in reverse. Take a long screwdriver and move it forward. All three rails should have the slots lined up in the neutral position now. Put the shifter back in in the neutral position and put the pin back in. You will probably need to set the brakes and depress the clutch to relieve any pressure on the transmission before you can move the rails.


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

Got it going! And I was able to finish.cutting. Thanks everyone!


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

Everything you said was spot on!


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

Next issue I have... We were trying to replace a couple chain pulleys that were worn. We took them off to take into tsc. Anyways didn't find a good match and somehow managed lose them.

Any idea on measurements? My dad could make new ones or any idea on a universal pulley I can buy.


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

A video of me cutting. I took it myself...not easy to do.

I wish it wasn't so blurry.... my phone isn't taking good videos these days.


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

Another video after finishing cutting.


----------



## RockyHill (Apr 24, 2013)

Jeff & I really enjoyed the last video!

from Jeff: can you put a hydraulic cylinder on to raise the mower?


----------



## 8350HiTech (Jul 26, 2013)

MyDaughtersPony said:


> Next issue I have... We were trying to replace a couple chain pulleys that were worn. We took them off to take into tsc. Anyways didn't find a good match and somehow managed lose them.
> 
> Any idea on measurements? My dad could make new ones or any idea on a universal pulley I can buy.


You're probably going to need to be more specific what you're looking for. However, pretty much any farm/industrial store that has a weld-a-sprocket display should be able to match up what you need. Once you figure out what you need...


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

RockyHill said:


> Jeff & I really enjoyed the last video!
> 
> from Jeff: can you put a hydraulic cylinder on to raise the mower?


I'm not exactly sure. It would be very nice if I could. I'll look into it.


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

8350HiTech said:


> You're probably going to need to be more specific what you're looking for. However, pretty much any farm/industrial store that has a weld-a-sprocket display should be able to match up what you need. Once you figure out what you need...


There was one pulley that we couldn't manage to remove. It's the exact same size. We are going to take measurements and have my dad and uncle make new ones.

Also plan on loosening the bale tension and shortening the bale length a little. I really need this baler to complete the job.


----------



## rankrank1 (Mar 30, 2009)

Nice video....but that was painfully slow travel speed in 1st gear. Should be in 2nd minimum and 3rd when it feels more comfortable to you.

Do not understand your displeasure with the manual lift mechanism. Drop it once when you enter the field and raise it only once when you exit the field. Even an old man can handle that amount of manual lever duty of a grand total of twice. Now you have to mow the proper mowing pattern to do this and learn the art of the 90 turn while cutting but that is even easier with a NF tractor. The proper mowing pattern is outlined in every old sickle bar manual I have ever seen.


----------



## somedevildawg (Jun 20, 2011)

Perhaps he knows of someone that grabbed the bar to lift and is now missing a finger or two


----------



## rankrank1 (Mar 30, 2009)

somedevildawg said:


> Perhaps he knows of someone that grabbed the bar to lift and is now missing a finger or two


If you watch the videos the manual lift mechanism is operated from the tractor seat, It would be impossible to get ones fingers cut operating that manual lever as it is no where near the sickle sections.

Your point is only valid when picking up the bar by the bar itself and then it applies and is a very good thing to remember.


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

I clog up a lot!!! So I'm constantly raising the bar going in reverse to clear the grass off the bar then forward to uncut grass and drop on the run to start cutting again.

I did try 2nd gear and felt comfortable... But I kept clogging. Something has to be out of adjustment. It was clogging a lot near the shoe and near the grass board. And yes I was keeping the shoe on the clear path made from the grass board.

I had periods where I was moving great and others where I was stop and go because of clogging up. It's weird that it works great sometimes and other times not so much.


----------



## somedevildawg (Jun 20, 2011)

I'm purity sure the fella i knew that was missing them missed the videos too....

Is it clogging ahead of the bar or building up behind the bar?


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

Not behind. It clogs or builds up and bunches in front of the bar.


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

Just another video of me cutting. Please excuse the kids in the background lol


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

A short clip of me raking. Self filmed while driving lol


----------



## Coondle (Aug 28, 2013)

Clogging a sickle bar at the ends (shoe and the swath board end) in my experience can be due to one or more of several factors.

They are: hold-downs, ledger plates, knife back and the knife guards generally.

Note all knife guards should be aligned to along the back and with each other to form a straight flat bar.

The ends of the knife bar seem particularly susceptible to lack of adjustment of the hold-downs, blunt knives or compromised ledgers.

I seem to recall you have addressed the register of the knife. i.e. the point of the knife lies exactly on the centre of the guards (also known as fingers) at the each end of the stroke.

Now the pitman arm end (shoe end).

The motion of the pitman arm puts extra stress on the knife in that area. Most mower manufacturers try to address this issue by providing additional bearing area on the end of the knife. Check to make sure there is not too much wear in the enlarged slide components. Wear allow the knife to lift up above the register on the first set of knife guards.

The swath board end of the bar is difficult to keep the knifes in contact with the ledger because the knife bar is easily bent up away from the ledger..

Check the ledger on the guard on both ends of the mower bar.

The ledger is the stationery cutting plate on the guard.

To cut grass, the moving knife passes over the ledger and shears the grass stalk. Somewhat like bypass pruners. Much attention is paid to the sharpness of the knife but little to the ledger. Both have to be sharp to cut grass effectively.

At one time the ledger plate was replaceable. There were 2 countersunk rivets securing the plate to the guard. Many guards are now cast as one piece and the ledger plate is not replaceable.

Examine the ledger plate closely and if rounded or worn down replace the plate or if not a separate item, replace the guard.

To ensure there is an effective cutting action there are hold-down clips that are designed to keep the knife sections held down onto the ledger plates. If the hold-down clips are not holding the knife sections onto the ledger plates then the grass will not be severed cleanly, and there'll be a build up of torn grass fibres under the knife section leading to clogging.

Hold-downs perform their function in two parts. The rear of the knife section should overhang to the rear of the knife back and lie under the first part of the hold-down clip. The hold-down then curves up and over the knife back clearing the rivets or bolts fixing the knife sections to the knife back. The front of the hold-down has a flat bearing surface which should engage the knife sections and hold them down onto the ledgers.

Another component to pay attention to is the knife back itself. The knife back runs in a channel formed in the knife guards. Modern knife guards have a bearing surface to engage the rear of the knife back but if either the knife back or the bearing surface on the guard is too worn the knife can not be held steady enough to effectively cut the grass. Older mowers had a replaceable wear surface that bolted on with guard bolts to hold the rear of knife back and fitted under the hold-downs.

The swath board end of the knife is easily bent up away from the ledger hence the adjustments mentioned are critical to ensure an effective cut.


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

Thank you for all that great information. I did purchase a new cutter bar with new knifes and all new guards. Not that it matters much but I also got a new grass board.

Register is adjusted as good as possible. I will inspect the unit for the above adjustments before next cutting.

I will mention the knifed are smooth edge and very sharp and the serrated edges of the guards and in great condition.

I think I have been cutting to early while the dew is still set. I'm assuming that wet grass clumps and clogs the guards and blocks the knifes. I noticed that when I cut later in the day it usually goes better. I am using a IH 27V sickle.


----------



## Coondle (Aug 28, 2013)

Moisture can affect the cutting and flow of grass through a mower. High moisture levels allow for fine fibres to remain uncut and the very fine residue of cutting to build up a mass of squashy green matter which will not flow.

I have found that smooth knife sections require regular sharpening, whereas serrated ones have a much longer service life. I have tried both top serrated and under serrated, fine serrations and coarse, but rather like the fine under serrated knife sections.

Notwithstanding having new components check the clearance on the end knives/ledgers.


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

Baling


----------



## RockyHill (Apr 24, 2013)

from your video "no baler breakdowns"

Wasn't that a good feeling? Glad you had a good day baling!

Shelia


----------



## Ranger518 (Aug 6, 2016)

Good deal looks like you got bailer back together and working good.


----------



## VA Haymaker (Jul 1, 2014)

MyDaughtersPony said:


> Baling


Lookin' good!


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

Guys... It was a battle but my pregnant wife stuck by my side and together including the kids got it done!

We left some broken bales on the field maybe 10-12. I ran out of time due to working on the baler prior to starting. Once we got it going it ran great!

We were having issues with the new used wad board... The fingers kept grazing the needles. I was scared shitless to run it... If they hit and destroyed we would have been toast!!! I got it adjusted but they are close in proximity even when properly adjusted!!! Anyways because of the late start and slow speeds (didn't want to to over work the baler and break something) I ran out of time to re bale the busted bales. We got rain today... Hopefully I can dry it out and feed to our goats.

Thanks everyone for all the support!!


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

My knotter was working... And the stopped tripping. I took some pictures. I see a small spring that looks stretched out... The one I'm referring to is in the first picture. Hopefully that's all it is..


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

On the right side of the spring the last coil seems to be stretched out... I think...


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

I cleaned out the grime and greased up the knotter and sure enough I got it to trip. The knotter engaged and the needles came up. However, while manually cycling I bound up...... I stopped to check where. I found nothing so kept turning.... Then I realized what I did. I have pictures below. Now I need to figure out how to reposition the part that pushes on the clutch pawl. It's not in the right position... Sigh. I need to get that push bar part behind or under the pawl... I forced it into the wrong position. How do I get it back in the right position? I'm assuming the correct position is in my previous pictures above.


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

Crap it looks like my pictures are upside down....


----------



## mike10 (May 29, 2011)

It has been a long long time since I worked on a 66 baler so I cannot remember exactly how everything is set up. When that type of damage happens on balers made after the 66 it is caused by a broken spring on the trip lever. * NOT* the spring shown on the clutch pawl in the photos. I know the 66 is somewhat different but on the later balers the trip lever spring pulls the trip lever forward to release the clutch pawl. That also explains why the knotter did not trip since there was nothing to pull the bent angle down to release the clutch pawl.

Straighten the bent angle back into the right orientation and look for a missing spring.


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

If you are looking at the parts diagram I took 67 off completely. I need to bend it back straight and put it back on... I didn't take any pictures but I think I have all my springs... What exactly does the clutch pawl do inside the clutch? That bent part clicks up and down but I don't know what the pawl does?

I know the knotter drive chain powers the clutch but my knowledge of the clutch ends there. I hope if I straighten that part and reinstall I'm good to go. Anything else other than missing springs I should look for knotter wise?

Thanks again for all your help.


----------



## mike10 (May 29, 2011)

Is there an arm attached to 67. I would think a spring should be attached somewhere to 67 and would that spring be 61.

When the metering wheel moves the trip arm up there should be a spring pulling the trip arm forward when the set bale length is achieved. This spring should pull 67 down to release the clutch pawl. The small spring pulls the clutch pawl forward causing the roller on the other end of the clutch pawl to run against the hub 69. Bolted to the hub where the pawl roller is now contacting is what is called the latch, 70. The latch now drives the pawl and knotter assy through a rotation. During the rotation the trip arm moves rearward to start the next bale. When the trip arm moves rearward 67 pivots upward so the clutch pawl can contact it and pull the pawl roller away from the latch stopping the knotter rotation.


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

I am going to have to read that about 10 times really slow while looking at a parts diagram and the bailer to fully understand that. After work today I will go out and take a video and post on youtube and post a link in this thread. Hopefully I can show you everything in motion to refresh youur memory on the ole 66!


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

I am in the process of uploading my video. I'm confused because a spring I see on my baler I don't see on the parts diagram. I feel like my knotter support brace according to the diagram name is different. I was hoping to get the proper spring but there may not be a proper spring.... I might have to just get a slightly shorter spring than the one I have currently...


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)




----------



## mike10 (May 29, 2011)

The clutch pawl needs to contact the angle that was bent so it can de-clutch the knotter drive.

I have two pdf files attached. One is a bad photo from the operators manual that shows the trip arm. You will see there is no spring attached to the trip arm long link. The spring is not hurting anything but you will probably not find it listed in the parts book.

You need to see if there is binding in the long link going forward from the metering wheel that would cause the long link to raise above the roller. Something is pushing the long link up so the roller can escape. You need to make the wife happy and have her turn the flywheel so you can see can watch what is happening. It may be the roller on the short link may be forcing the long link up.

The spring on the short link the roller is attached to needs to be attached to the link without the wire. The added spring and the wire to the short spring may have been added to keep from having the problem you have.

The other pdf file shows a later baler and how the angle that was bent should be positioned in relation to the clutch pawl. I am not sure how the short link with the roller is held to the shaft of the piece which was bent. If it is just clamped, then loosen the clamp bolt and rotate the angle up so the clutch pawl contact the angle by ¼". When the knotter is tripped the angle should drop down and the pawl should clear the angle by ¼".

Since there is no other adjustment for the bent angle, disregard the other information about the placement of the needles.

You need to replace the small spring. Part number 18.

View attachment 66.pdf


View attachment 565.pdf


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

Thank you so much for your knowledge and willingness to share! I will work on it this weekend and report with an update.


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

Mike should I not worry about that small spring on the clutch paw? I thought in the parts diagram that part #18 was that small spring on the paw. It sounds like you are saying part #18 is the one in my video that has the wire on it. If I should replace the paw spring I don't even see it on the diagram.


----------



## mike10 (May 29, 2011)

You do need to replace the pawl spring. 18 is the spring for the pawl, not the one with the wire. I think the one with the wire may be part number 16. I am attaching a couple of photos of the parts that I found in stock. One photo shows the pawl and hub.assy. The pawl is pulled back as it would be when the knotter is de-clutched. When the knotter is tripped the pawl is pulled forward by the spring and the roller on the pawl will now rotate againt the outer hub until the latch in the outer hub contacts the roller and the knotter starts turning. After a revolution the pawl will come around and contact the angle and the roller will disengage from the latch stopping the knotter rotation.. The other photo shows about where the angle should contact the pawl. The short link is only clamped to the shaft with the angle. Loosen clamp bolt and rotate the angle up until it contacts the pawl link in the photo.


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

Amazing. That information is very helpful. I am going to get those 2 springs and mess with adjusting it tomorrow after my daughter's horse show. I'll be back with more questions or a story of triumph! Thanks again!


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

Hey Mike if you watched my video I show a big black spring. I think it's attached to the knotter frame or something like that. In the parts diagram I believe that is part #16 in my opinion. If I don't need a new medium sized "wired up" spring on my unit then I guess I wont get one. At this point I can't even find it on the parts diagram to figure out a part number. Anyways that's my guess on part #16


----------



## mike10 (May 29, 2011)

16 is the spring which is wired. The other spring is listed with the twine fingers. That part number is 143224. The purpose of the 143224 is to return the twine fingers to the home position.


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

I have a couple more videos I'm posting. I think we fixed the paw and short trip arm positioning. Now the long trip arm keeps pulling up and away from thr short trip arm roller and it keeps falling off the notch. Once we figure that out I think we are golden. I'm wondering if I put a stronger spring where that long gray one is to give more downward tension.


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)




----------



## mike10 (May 29, 2011)

Watch at the 20 second mark. There must be some kind of stop to keep the short link from rotating back.


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)




----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

Thanks for the video. It happens so fast and I can't see the long trip arm... If you have a chance to watch my 2 new clips I explain what I'm dealing with.


----------



## mike10 (May 29, 2011)

Place your mouse at the 20 second mark and click to replay from there. You will see the long trip arm raise away from the roller. Something is holding the arm the roller is on from rotating back. Look closely at the frame to see if you can tell if something has broken off.


----------



## mike10 (May 29, 2011)

You can slow the speed down by clicking on the settings icon at the bottom of the clip and choosing a slower setting.


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

This is a video I found on YouTube... It sort of looks like the long bar does not ride on that nob like mine is... When the long trip arms rides up on that nob it lifts it up to high and the short trip arm falls off the roller like I show in my clip... How did this get so far off position?? And other than bending how can I adjust??!!


----------



## mike10 (May 29, 2011)

Go back to the video I linked to and slow the speed down. You will see the link lift when the knob on the cam comes around. The video you just linked to I had seen and was about to go to bed when I realized the guy tripped the knotter with his finger. It hit me then that there was no way you could trip your knotter with you finger the way the spring was hooked to the short link. It is hard to see in the video you linked to, but it appears the spring is attached somewhere else then yours is. Also in the video you linked to, the long trip arm does rise.


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

Here is an old picture of my baler. It seems like the curved part of the long trip arm is inside of the unit with that knob on it. I think I might have to bend and force it back down...


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

Picture


----------



## mike10 (May 29, 2011)

The link is still up against the cam gear.

The videos while showing the link moving does not tell the complete story.

Think of it this way.

As hay is pushed back into the chamber the metering wheel starts turning as hay contacts the spikes of the wheel.

As the metering wheel rotates the long link moves forward and contacts the roller on the shot link.

As the metering wheel continues to turn the long link moves forward.

Once the long link is in contact with the roller the long link pushes the short link forward as the metering wheel continues to turn with each charge of hay.

As the short link moves forward the angle on the outside, where the pawl is in contact with the angle, starts moving down.

Finally the last charge of hay has turned the metering wheel enough that the long link has pushed the short link far enough that the angle on the outside has rotated low enough that the pawl is released and the knotter starts rotating.

I am sure you know all that, but think about this.

There is no more hay being pushed into the chamber while the knotter is rotating.

With no more hay entering the chamber the metering wheel is not turning.

Since the long link is attached to the metering wheel the long link is stiil pushed forward against the roller of the short link and the angle is still in the down position.

The question now is, How do you get the angle to move up to catch the pawl so the knotter stop rotating?

That is the job of the lobe on the cam gear. When the lobe contacts the long link, the long link is raised releasing the short link and the spring pulls the short link back which raises the angle so the pawl can contact the angle and release the drive latch stopping the knotting cycle.

We need to determine what was used to stop the short link from rotating so far back. Perhaps the stiff wire was enough but I do not think so. There has to be some kind of mechanical stop.


----------



## mike10 (May 29, 2011)

OK, look at the very end of the tube where the shaft with the angle goes through. does it look like there was a weld there? Looking at the photos it appears there may have been one. Also, in one of the photos it appears there is a wear spot on the angle where it has been contacting a plate.

I am attaching a photo of the parts diagram and if you look at the end of the tube on item 65 there is some kind of plate and I believe this is the stop for the angle. There needs to be some kind of mechanical stop for the angle and this makes the most sense.


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

I know I am looking at the correct spot on the diagram but I'm not seeing it. I need to go out and look at it.

This stop is to stop spring 60 from pulling down to far which raises the paw stop up to far.


----------



## mike10 (May 29, 2011)

That is what would happen. The plate would limit the upward travel of the pawl stop by contacting the pawl stop. This would prevent the spring from pulling the stop farther and the roller falling behind the trip link.


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

I am attaching pictures. I think I figured it out. Please advise.


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

I think I bent that up when I crunched the paw stop... When I bound up and kept turning the flywheel...


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

I'm thinking I need bend that back down and it will stop the paw stop so the roller is held in place so when the long trip arm separates the roller is held in place and does not fall down.


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

If I am correct I now know why they extended the spring with wire. That spring is very strong and pulls down hard. So with all that force the stop is hit hard. I'm pretty sure I bent it up during my incident... It has a good crease in it and now when the spring forces the paw stop up and it hits that stop it just pushes the stop up because it's to weak to stop it.


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

Either I replace spring or add extension with wire. I need to get that stop bent in correct angle and weld on it a bit to firm it up. I really hope I am correct.


----------



## mike10 (May 29, 2011)

You have found the problem. The spring may not be the right one. A new spring measures 3 1/2" overall length and the coil wire is .094. The spring in the photos appear to be heavier and shorter.


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

I need that spring and a paw clutch spring and a little Welding to firm that stop up.


----------



## mike10 (May 29, 2011)

Let me know how it works out.


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

Will do! Thanks again for all the help!


----------



## rankrank1 (Mar 30, 2009)

You might want to make a road trip to SE Ohio for a free parts NH 66 machine. The few bucks in gas spent would be money well spent (copy and past link).

http://forums.yesterdaystractors.com/viewtopic.php?t=1326054


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

I don't have a way to transport a baler from Ohio. That would be amazing to have a parts machine.


----------



## rankrank1 (Mar 30, 2009)

Well it could be a parts machine at a minimum use, the biggest plus is all the PTO parts are there if you ever get the D17 going and decide PTO operated in lieu of engine operated, or if it ends up being in better shape than you think it could even be put into service as a back-up machine.

You not gonna beat that price so might even justify renting a trailer, Gas to fetch it is rather minimum.


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

So I've been unknowingly over greasing my knotter. If you've seen my recent pictures they do not look pretty. I've spent some time this weekend cleaning it up and it looks a lot better. However, there is more I want to remove but can't reach... How bad would it be to spray it with the hose? If that's not advised what are my other options?


----------



## bool (Mar 14, 2016)

Pour some gasoline into an open-topped tin can and use a small old paint brush.

With your number of bales a couple of pumps of the grease gun once a year is probably enough on the knotter grease nipples. The parts that turn constantly will need more than that. The manual ought to explain that.

Roger


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

Manuals are great but don't always explain everything. I don't recall my manual saying exactly how many pumps. It says grease after every use. Thanks for the cleaning tip. Haven't heard from you in a while. Hope you are doing well.


----------



## mike10 (May 29, 2011)

Every 1000 bales is what I found for lubrication intervals. I would not be worried about grease on the knotter


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

Ok Mike. It just looks bad and is annoying me. I might top out at 1,000 squares in a season. I've been way over greasing the knotter.


----------



## Coondle (Aug 28, 2013)

MyDaughtersPony said:


> Ok Mike. It just looks bad and is annoying me. I might top out at 1,000 squares in a season. I've been way over greasing the knotter.


Grease on the outside of the knotter may be aesthetically unpleasant but you cannot have too much grease in the knotter bearing surfaces. On a baler the one place that can be overgrazed is the bearing/bush carrying the drive shaft in the over-run rachet on the flywheel. Too much grease there can lubricate the clutch which defeats the grip of the clutch.

Bearing failures can be guaranteed if you keep too much grease is the can you bought the grease in.


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

Good to know. Thanks.


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

My wife just picked up the 2 springs we needed from the dealership today. She sent me a picture and the short strip arm spring is similar length to the one currently on but a good amount thinner coil diameter. I'll be putting them on after work today. I'll be back with an update.


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

The new springs are installed and the stopper piece that I bent and cracked off is welded back on. Here are some pictures.


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

3rd cutting was cut yesterday and I'll be baling on Saturday afternoon. Wish me luck!


----------



## Ranger518 (Aug 6, 2016)

Good luck!


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

Thanks to Larry my 3rd cutting went smoother than ever. I learned more in one short afternoon about how to run my equipment than I could have taught myself in a lifetime! We had 0 breakdowns, used less fuel, and used way less time! Time to clean up the equipment and start dreaming about 1st cutting 2018!


----------



## VA Haymaker (Jul 1, 2014)

I lied....

Apparently our 2017 hay season was not over. Given the string of sunny days, I took the opportunity. Some of my recent posts were in regards to some extent for this cut and a prelude to what I might try/expect for next year.

Things I did:

Cut at 3 inch stubble height. Grass is already coming back, will over seed and in a few weeks add some nitrogen, as well as other fertilizer per our soil tests. The plan is to first cut at 5 inches to help the grass recover and survive the hot summer, cut closer in late summer/fall and overseed.

Bought a bale of 9600 plastic twine with 210 knot strength. Probably the first time from the initial fill-up the bale chamber to the last bale that we had ZERO missed knots or twine breakage. Amazing the difference. My JD348 was really cranking out some nice square bales. Didn't care for the twine diameter from a handling standpoint. Now I've got a decision to make for 2018.

First time using our hay preservative applicator. Even with plenty of sun, the heavy dews and shorter daylight days make for higher moisture in the bales. Further, we did NOT Ted this hay, but laid it out flat as possible from the haybine. Last second cutting I felt we left a goodly amount of hay in the field - grass blades that fell into the stubble to the ground. Our yield reflected no tedding (hey - nothing new. No tedders were used with sickle mowers for decades). The hay stayed on top of the stubble and the rake did a nice job of picking it up and mixing the green with the dry/sun exposed top. The preservative was the key in making useable hay. Buffered propionic acid. Moisture levels with the preservative were 20-25%. Agtronix BH-2 onboard meter. I got to believe the readings were a bit higher due to the acid and bale density. I'll be checking the hay for heating, dust/mold to see how this preservative works. As far as customers that object to buffered propionic acid, not really concerned. It's a legit/harmless product and if they can't understand, not my problem - kinda like inline bales with cut side on the string or sisal vs plastic twine. None of these, including acid, effect the quality of the hay IMHO.

YMMV - Bill


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

I only see 2 holes to adjust the tips. Also I measured the bales I made and they were about 38"


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

.... Pictures are upside down.... Sorry


----------



## Coondle (Aug 28, 2013)

MyDaughtersPony said:


> .... Pictures are upside down.... Sorry


Pictures look good for me, but the writing is still upside down


----------



## mike10 (May 29, 2011)

In a perfect world where all bale slices were 3' or 4" or 6", etc (evenly divisable into 36") you would end up with 36" bales. But hay windrows are never perfect. Your baler is set to make 36" bales but what happens when instead of 6, 6" slices you endup with 5, 6" slices and the 6th slice is 4". Now you have a 34" bale and the knotter metering arm is not tripped since the baler is set for 36" . Unless the next slice is 2" you are going to end up with a longer bale as in the case of the bale you measured.


----------



## Tx Jim (Jun 30, 2014)

mike10 said:


> In a perfect world where all bale slices were 3' or 4" or 6", etc (evenly divisable into 36") you would end up with 36" bales. But hay windrows are never perfect. Your baler is set to make 36" bales but what happens when instead of 6, 6" slices you endup with 5, 6" slices and the 6th slice is 4". Now you have a 34" bale and the knotter metering arm is not tripped since the baler is set for 36" . Unless the next slice is 2" you are going to end up with a longer bale as in the case of the bale you measured.


Ditto. That's a very good explanation


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

Great information. Thanks.


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

It is not a super. I've been using a super manual. I have noticed some different things in pictures but overall it seems pretty similar. I've added some pictures of the wind guard and twine guide. I don't know if they are good enough pictures for positioning to be correctly evaluated.


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

I think you were spot on Larry. I checked the grooved side of the needles at the weld spots and the side that kept falling out the groove is not groovey... The opposite needle still has its groove.


----------



## MyDaughtersPony (Jun 12, 2016)

The pictures of the wind guard are not exactly accurate. I have it lifted up in transport mode. So it does not look like it does while baling.


----------

