# pto divider 2 run 2 balers 1 tractor



## tarrquinn (Jul 5, 2014)

grettings from aus, ive been reading this site 4 a while and i find your guys postings very informative

Im just in early stage of converting my dairy farm to alfalfa farming and oh do i have alot of questions 

where i live is high rain fall high humidity (sub tropical) so moisture is going to be my biggest hurddle (like all hay farmers i imagine)

Im about to start purchasing hay gear and would like 2 know what is recomended by the experts

i have 1 way too big tractor ,40acres of hay nearing cutting aiming at 120 acres under irrigation and getting about 8 ton acre from 9 cuts per yr oh and a few stones lol (only me doing job supplying small bales to horse people)

I saw somewhere on web about being able 2 run 2 balers with 1 tractor but cant find again ?

asked my new holland dealer ... his response was duugh never herd of it

i then said was looking at bale wagon to pick up bales.. he said so old school, cant get parts , dont make them anymore,accumulator and grab is best way... and quickest... responses please if u still reading lol

over here if i can find old nh wagon (tow) looking at about 16 k for the flat stack ..our $ is same as yours

with my odd rocks what is best mower condit to suffer least damage ?

and last question with the rake how far can i move windrows 4 baling without droping all the leaf ? if i get say 10 foot mc do i try and pair it up with a 10 foot rake or can i safely use 30 foot rotary rake to windrow and keep leaf

well 2 those who got through my essay ty look forward to some wisdom


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## slowzuki (Mar 8, 2011)

There are at least 4 commercial built double or triple hitches in north america and a few more home builts.

RE bale wagon, how far to storage from fields? Here I go too far to use a bale wagon. Accumulator works well with long road distance.

RE rocks, big embedded or small loose on surface? I have big embedded rocks and my discbine can slide over many. Haybine is even better for that style. Loose small rocks get fired / shattered from discbine. Rubber conditioner rollers like them even less.


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## tarrquinn (Jul 5, 2014)

storage in middle of farm so only 1000 yards in all directions

rocks mainly embeded but do make there way out now and then , would a sickle style mower b better option than disc ?


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## astropilot (Jun 3, 2008)

Rake wise we find the least amount of shatter with our rotary rake. Consider a tedder too, it will help dry down time. We also run a steffens 15 bale accumulator and love it. One other thing to think about are wagons, 20ft works well ,but with a 15 bale grab, 24ft would work better. 3 ricks each on 24ft. Finally we really like our Krone Mowers conditioner heavily built.


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## tarrquinn (Jul 5, 2014)

That's good to know thanks ,so you can use tedder on alfalfa, had been told would loose to much leaf, at what stage are you using it at ?


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## astropilot (Jun 3, 2008)

We ted the alfalfa when it (Alfalfa) is still damp with dew. This will prevent the leaves from shattering. The tedding will get the hay up off the ground and allow air to pass through it better.


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## deadmoose (Oct 30, 2011)

tarrquinn said:


> That's good to know thanks ,so you can use tedder on alfalfa, had been told would loose to much leaf, at what stage are you using it at ?


Others are much more experienced than I. I ted either right after mowing (12' mower 3.5-4' with drow) or within a day. I didn't want to wait for fear of shatter but my schedule this past week had me cutting in evening. Cut some one night, brother helped ted next night as I cut more. I did not notice difference in leaf loss.

Today I had some hay (alfalfa clover grass) that was washed last night. I tedded this am, then raked and had to wait to dry a bit to bale. I think tedder saved more hay than it shattered. Neighboring field with prewashed grass hay was still sitting as I finished baling.

I can guarantee you if that hay was tedded it would have been dry enough to bale yesterday. As it stands I would guess it gets raked tomorrow and will have at least some mold and not much color.

Also if it was tedded today it could be baled now.

I didn't know what a tedder was when I started making hay a few years ago. This site taught me about them. Now I just need to save up for a bigger one.


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## Teslan (Aug 20, 2011)

It really depends on your climate if you need to ted alfalfa or not. I don't ted anything. Is it low humidity where you are or pretty humid?


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## tarrquinn (Jul 5, 2014)

A low humidity day here is 36 % middle of winter (as in now) would normally sit 70-90 % range 9 months a year

Used to make grass hay in New Zealand and would always ted that but the alfalfa caper is new to me and I'm trying to do it in an aera that everyone tells me it can't be done .. but I can't see y not


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## deadmoose (Oct 30, 2011)

So you are familiar with a tedder? You could benefit from one now as well.


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## tarrquinn (Jul 5, 2014)

yes ,had always intended on getting one after reading on here people were using after cutting to spread swath but my 'helpful' new holland dealer said no the leaf would shatter so had gone off idea
If dew can make leaf stay on i got hours of tedding lol
What about when windrowing is it worth buying a bigger rotary rake and bring in 4 to 1 or is that 2 much moving when dry
i'll probably buy a 10 ft mc as they seem most common but im still not using my tractor to its potential ..... 155hp mayb need to downsize but i do like it lol.
As for baler will prob get used nh575 or case 545 is there much difference between balers ..


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## somedevildawg (Jun 20, 2011)

Welcome to haytalk Tarrquinn, I have learned not to listen to salesmen when it comes to farm equoiment, for the most part they don't have a clue except what they've heard.....that's of little value.

I think you are on the right page with the rotary rake.....it really is perfect for the legume, minimum leaf shatter and very nice fluffy windrows, that being said, if you went with a double you can easily combine windrows to get the perfect size for your baler and yield...
There is a good bit of difference between balers, the knotter is the same on some but the manner of getting the hay into the machine is usually different. Inline balers (Massey, challenger, Hesston maybe others down under) are completely different than the others. Good luck and welcome to haytalk....


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## tarrquinn (Jul 5, 2014)

Thanks for the welcome and advice dawg

Whats the general feeling with the growers out there on best gear to do alfalfa ...or is it a bit of john deere versus the rest lol

If you were in my shoes what machinery would you purchase .. high humidity year round, wet season jan - april [summer] 50 inch rainfall (70 % wet season) 80 acres of solidset irrigation at 27 yard spacings ,15 acres water winch ,& 30 acres dryland one 155hp tractor with loader and a semi friendly bank manager :wub: lol oh and a few rocks doh

Am i better to spend more on used baler or used mower conditioner or should i just get mower with out conditioner as i read haywilson advocates in other posts ive read


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## Nitram (Apr 2, 2011)

Re non conditioner is because of the blister Beatle which is poision to horses. High humidity best crack them stems unless you have those blister beetles. Imo


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## tarrquinn (Jul 5, 2014)

Ah is that y , I had seen in eary haywilson other posts that he said the plant transpired beter out the leaves with out stem being crushed .I didn't realise it was also to do with beatles.Which thankfully I don't think exist in australia .The only poisions thing im haveing trouble with is common thornapple weed which has exploded in one block, been here 15 years and havnt seen it here untill i planted alfalfa grrr ,sprayed it with mcpb but it did bugger all 2 it


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## NDVA HAYMAN (Nov 24, 2009)

To answer your question about pulling 2 balers, look at Marcrest Mfg. in Canada. They make a nice looking double hitch. Don't know anyone with it but looks neat. They are the makers of Bale Baron. Welcome aboard! Mike


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## 8350HiTech (Jul 26, 2013)

If your big tractor is modern enough to be relatively fuel efficient, I think I'd stick with it for familiarity. I'm running a tractor almost that big (140ish) and it's not terrible, partly because it has both 540E and 1000E pto speeds. If it's a big ol' fuel hog, maybe a new home is in order. But big tractors to ride smooth


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## somedevildawg (Jun 20, 2011)

tarrquinn said:


> Thanks for the welcome and advice dawg
> Whats the general feeling with the growers out there on best gear to do alfalfa ...or is it a bit of john deere versus the rest lol
> If you were in my shoes what machinery would you purchase .. high humidity year round, wet season jan - april [summer] 50 inch rainfall (70 % wet season) 80 acres of solidset irrigation at 27 yard spacings ,15 acres water winch ,& 30 acres dryland one 155hp tractor with loader and a semi friendly bank manager :wub: lol oh and a few rocks doh
> Am i better to spend more on used baler or used mower conditioner or should i just get mower with out conditioner as i read haywilson advocates in other posts ive read


Tarrquinn, I might be one of those that say you could have some trouble with alfalfa in your locale....
For years our extension office has been trying to get us in the south to plant alfalfa, we also have high humidity, not quite as high as yours however.....we don't have problems growing the varieties adapted (bulldog) for our climate, and if put up as silage not a problem.....however, when putting up dry, especially in small squares, we have a hard time....with our humidity, no one has been able to really make a go of it, the bales have good feed value but they're ugly as hell.....hard, very hard to do it, buyers will turn their nose up at it.....

We do have success with a crop called perineal peanut, don't know if you've heard of it? It's well suited for well drained sandy soils we have here, doesn't take to well to cold, will winter kill during long cold winters. Has to be sprigged, may take a couple o years to establish a good stand, but very palatable to horses (all livestock) and crude protein is 13-21 % . I have no idea if its even grown there but for those that have established stands, they have a captive market, horsey folks just love it....

You may have been advised correctly by your locals, don't try to reinvent the wheel, someone else has probably already tried to, more than once....

Good luck with whatever you decide


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## tarrquinn (Jul 5, 2014)

Hi dawg

Yes we do have pinto peanut around in tiny amounts on a couple of dairy farms, not mine though and the horse people don't seem to chase it they just want alfalfa or grassy alfalfa I know I'm gonna have big problems in wet season so will just big bale silage.

Im hoping the dews wont bleach the alfalfa 2 much any tips on how i can reduce it

Got my first bit cut yesterday by contractor as i havnt got machinery yet ... costly he did a poor job, 2 much of a rush ( a lot of the crop has gone down while I was waiting 4 it too flower stems are really fine) and his mower was leaving heaps uncut, I worked out it was his curtain which was torn being the problem so got him to cut that off then went will but ill have 2 graze the cows in there once hay out 2 even up field but lost prob 1/3 rd of crop doh, then he hit 1 rock and left so got 6 acres out of 20 cut lol

will my stems thicken up after first cut , crop grew really quick and was high enough to cut at 7 weeks ,i waited till 12 still hardly a flower so cutting and hoping next will stay up and will let flower then

really good $ at mo though prime alfalfa $20 for small sqaure and another 5 months before we will start to get reliable rain so they say,i was budgeting on 12 for july


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## somedevildawg (Jun 20, 2011)

Are you saying you cut at 12 weeks? Wow.....

Did your contractor leave just because he hit a rock? All the more reason to have your own equipment! 
Of course that means you'll be out in the field scouting for large rocks trying to eliminate those....you said he was costly, not sure I woulda paid him a dime to cut 6 out of 20 acres....how the hell does that work, if I contract to cut 20 acres, I expect to pay and have 20 acres cut and not butchered. Sounds kinda like roofers (or any other contractor) who come in and get all the long runs (gravy) and leave the vallies, caps and the chimney for someone else.....I can't play on that field!

Not sure about those alfalfa stems.....

"I was budgeting 12 for July" what does that mean?


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## tarrquinn (Jul 5, 2014)

yes 12 weeks, a touch early only a few flowers but they say here 12- 14 weeks,how long for your first cut there, to be honest i probably had more alf 4 weeks ago b4 it started going down was 2feet highafter 6 weeks , stuff cut today probably only 12 inch unless stand them up ,then a spindly 20 inch.
just waiting on a loan to come through to set up machinery thought it would be well through by now grrr
Yup 1 rock and he pulled out in 6 acres ,he said it was first blade he had broken in 3 years contracting ...really doh
fields have had silage taken off them for 13 years but the odd rock still pop up
So now trying to find old drum mower to go through and do first cut over the lot then get moco but may get a haybine now after seeing how stressed contractor was with 1 Rock instead of disc moco
the 12 budget was $ a bale what i thought id get


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## somedevildawg (Jun 20, 2011)

Ok, I follow you on the budget.....

Having never grown alfalfa, I really don't know exactly but I believe they cut for silage at 6 weeks. I'd have to check on that, I have a friend that grows 30 acres for his dairy operation, the ones that tried to grow it to sell in packages have gone to PP or put the fields into row crops or Bermuda grass production.

Thankfully we don't have to deal with many rocks, lots of guys on this forum deal with em tho, there's been plenty of discussion on here about them....and gophers, neither of which we have....the two kind of go hand in hand it seems...


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## Rodney R (Jun 11, 2008)

For folks that feed cows they want alfalfa cut every 28 days after the 1st cutting, but if you're going after the horse market it will dry better for you if you let it get those pretty flowers. It will also give you many more tons/acre. If the plant is cut in the bud stage it contains a LOT of water, so even though it looks like a lot of material out in the field, till it is dry you have lost a LOT of it to evaporation. For us, we can make dry alfalfa in 3 days, but if it doesn't have flowers we can easily add another day, and we'll lose a lot of color. So you want to cut it when it gets flowers for horses. Remember, old hay is better than rained on hay, so the weather is a big factor.

Rodney


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## slowzuki (Mar 8, 2011)

I break alot of blades on my disc mower. Then I get mad. These are 2 of the 15 this size in just 1 acre this year, I have taken at least 25 this size out of this same acre in the last 10 years. Overall we take out about 40-50 per year on the roughest 30 acres we have.

Bottom pic is a couple of years ago, certainly not the largest but about the biggest our little compact Kubota can move with the loader. After that the big MF has to move them or they get the top jackhammered off.


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## tarrquinn (Jul 5, 2014)

with the rocks mine seem to be about the 8 inch size , so my main concern if i go disc mower is i hit rock and it keeps moving forward with me, is there a better moco brand out there with more share pins than the others when it comes to hitting rocks and doing minimal damage

Those big rocks look hard work slowzuki but maybe not as bac breaking picking up the smaller ones day after day lol, I could trade u


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## slowzuki (Mar 8, 2011)

Want the immovable ones too? lol. We have lots of the smaller ones too, they get pried out and tossed in the bucket. It is a slow process. At least the 8" ones can be plowed up.


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## tarrquinn (Jul 5, 2014)

so the disc mower handles ok bar the blades or bigger probs happen with stones going through machine, what flavour is yours


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