# Fertilizer Question



## VA Haymaker (Jul 1, 2014)

When you folks are talking about putting down 30 or 50 or 60 lbs of Nitrogen for Timothy or OG and then another 30 lbs after the first cut, are you speaking of lbs per acre or lbs per expected yield in tons? 30 lbs per acre vs 30 lbs per ton where 2 tons per acre yield is expected is a huge difference.

lbs per acre or lbs per ton of yield?

Thanks,

Bill


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## BWfarms (Aug 3, 2015)

Per acre.


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## FarmerCline (Oct 12, 2011)

Actual units of N per acre.....not pounds of nitrogen fertilizer. I use around 70 units of N per acre applied this time of year for first cutting grasses like orchard and Timothy. For example......using a 34-0-0 fertilize that would be about 200 pounds of actual fertilize per acre which would equal 68 units of N per acre.


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## BWfarms (Aug 3, 2015)

FarmerCline said:


> Actual units of N per acre.....not pounds of nitrogen fertilizer. I use around 70 units of N per acre applied this time of year for first cutting grasses like orchard and Timothy. For example......using a 34-0-0 fertilize that would be about 200 pounds of actual fertilize per acre which would equal 68 units of N per acre.


The 'unit' is still pounds.


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## FarmerCline (Oct 12, 2011)

BWfarms said:


> The 'unit' is still pounds.


 Yep, I realize that but sometimes people can get pounds of actual N per acre and pounds of a N fertilizer per acre confused so that is why I usually refer to pounds of actual N as units per acre......at least that is the way it was explained to me.


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## Hayman1 (Jul 6, 2013)

FarmerCline said:


> Yep, I realize that but sometimes people can get pounds of actual N per acre and pounds of a N fertilizer per acre confused so that is why I usually refer to pounds of actual N as units per acre......at least that is the way it was explained to me.


Hayden, I use the same wording with the fertilizer guys. Avoids heartburn.


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## endrow (Dec 15, 2011)

I agree there are unit pounds and product pounds and density pounds.. I need to know them to set the fertilizer spreader right


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## vhaby (Dec 30, 2009)

BWfarms said:


> The 'unit' is still pounds.


When I studied fertilizer technology, a unit was 20 lb. Unit should never be used when talking about fertilizer. It is too confusing. One can talk about applying 300 lb of ammonium nitrate (34-0-0). And one can say that 300 lb of ammonium nitrate is 102 lb of actual nitrogen. To most of us, unit is a meaningless term in fertilizer technology.


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## rjmoses (Apr 4, 2010)

I go strictly by actual lbs/acre, e.g., urea is 46% nitrogen, so, for every 100 lbs/acre of urea, I am actually applying 46 lbs/acre of nitrogen.

Density becomes a little more involved when spreading because lighter weight material will not throw as far as heavier weight material. I leave that up to my supplier because different equipment may have different throw distances, especially when I'm mixing urea, potash, DAP and sulphur.

Hope this helps.

Ralph


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## reede (May 17, 2010)

I've never cared for the term units, because it is a unitless unit. Of course, figuring fertilizer and the form that it goes out in gets confusing, because the recommendation will call for, say, 50 lbs of K2O, but you put out KCl, or some other form that has a percentage of K, not K2O.


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## BWfarms (Aug 3, 2015)

A unit in fertilizer is not 20 pounds of actual (fill in nutrient you are using). The correct answer is a unit is 1 pound of the actual nutrient.

I wasn't disputing FarmerCline's post, I wanted Leeave96 to know when someone says unit that it meant pounds. I do my figures in actual pounds and never say units. Guys that say units are neither wrong or right at the fertilizer place. No Heartburn there because the salesman probably knows what you meant.

It's really all in preference. I say soda, the Midwest says pop. Tuh-may-Toe / Too-mah-Toe it's generally understood.


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## swmnhay (Jun 13, 2008)

Never heard to term unit as 20 lbs when talking fertilizer.So I googled it.Cut and pasted this from the article.http://archive.lib.msu.edu/tic/holen/article/1975jun2.pdf



> "Salesmen often wish to add sophistication to conversions by using the term units instead of pounds. The term unit is used in fertilizer discussions to mean 20 pounds. In a ton of 18-46-0 there are 18 units of N (nitrogen) and 46 units of ]?2^5 (Phosphorus). Since a unit is 20 pounds, multiply units by 20 and we have pounds per ton. In a ton of 18-46-0 there are 360 pounds of N and 920 pounds of (phosphorus). When we mean pounds per acre we should say pounds per acre. When we discuss price per pound, remember there is a vast difference between price per pound and price per unit. The difference is a factor of _20. Table 3 and 4 are helpful to the understanding of fertilizer analysis and price per pound of plant food."


Seems like its just another way to come up with actual nutrients in a ton of product.Pretty useless other wise.


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## r82230 (Mar 1, 2016)

Swmn, it almost looks like it was transcribed from 'rock & chisel' times. You must have dug deep to find a piece that appears to be typed, with Times Roman font.  I'm impressed.

Have to agree, never hear of this usage and being useless.

Larry


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## somedevildawg (Jun 20, 2011)

"unit" is commonly used down here for the reason cline mentioned.....it's a term probably started by the salesmen as a way to eliminate confusion. To those not common with the term it probably is more confusing...although with a bit of thought it should become obvious. I'll have to disagree with The Doc on this one.....one should use whatever terminology is familiar given ones locale to eliminate confusion. Interestingly enough, the driver will usually meet me at the gate and we discuss how many pounds of actual NPK we are applying per acre and we never use the term "units"
But when I order fertilize I order "units" pa

Unit is not meaningless...it's quite simple Unit = actual NPK pa


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## vhaby (Dec 30, 2009)

somedevildawg said:


> "unit" is commonly used down here for the reason cline mentioned.....Interestingly enough, the driver will usually meet me at the gate and we discuss how many pounds of actual NPK we are applying per acre and we never use the term "units"


Dawg, now you are confusing me...


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## somedevildawg (Jun 20, 2011)

Lol....ill explain a bit more concise

When I call my local co-op to order fertilize for a field the call goes something like this...

"Charlie, this is Todd....down at my 319 lower river field I need 100 units of N and 30 units of K spread on the 37 acre field and 50 units of N spread on the 10 acre field"
He will come back with "liquid or dry?"
I'll come back with whatever is applicable, in this example I'll say "granular"
He will come back with "10-4, we have blend of 100 units of N and 30 units of K being spread on the 37 acre field at the 319 lower river fields. And we have 50 units of N being spread at the 10 acre lower river field" all granular, is that correct?"
I'll come back with "10-4, ASAP please"
He'll come back with "OK, we'll add a bit of sulfur right"
me..."10-4"
him, "ok, the driver will call you when he is enroute. Thanks for your business, let me know of any problems"

Driver shows up and we go over the actual pounds of material being spread and how he is to spread it, (we put out so much that it is generally spread in crossing passes at half rate) the blend ratio and "actual N" being spread per acre.....we never discuss "units" with the driver/speader operator. He probably wouldn't know what the hell I was talking about . Once I know the numbers jive, and they always do, I write them a check and watch him spread the gold....when he's through I make sure the truck is empty and pray for rain


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## Hayman1 (Jul 6, 2013)

Yep, sounds just like here Dawg


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## vhaby (Dec 30, 2009)

Well written! I can almost hear the conversation...


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