# What is everybody fertilizer program for Bermuda with healthy soil



## Ranger518 (Aug 6, 2016)

I have been playing around the last few years with my fertilizer program on my midland 99 field that I square bale I’m trying to get the best possible yields of corse. But while I am weighting on my soil test to come in if they ever do now that they are shut down do to cov-19 I have been wondering if I have been wasting my money on using to much fertilizer or if I am staying on track. Everybody around me including my fertilizer dealer thinks I am crazy for putting on the amount I do which has be 450lb a acre of 22-11-22 at green up and after every cut so I usually do this 3-4 times a year. My soil ph is pretty good around 6.8 every year and I am always in the medium or optimal levels of p&k. So my question is am I crazy and putting out way to much or does this seam ok? I’m in row crop country so the people that say I’m using to much no really nothing about hay much less quality hay they just recommended me to put out a little 19-19-19 every year which is what I have always done until I joined this forum and started getting better info. Thanks.


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## Ranger518 (Aug 6, 2016)

Here is my soil test results from April of last year 2019


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## Vol (Jul 5, 2009)

Triple 19 is a good value here price wise. You could use your own formula one year and Triple 19 the next and see how that rotation works out.

Regards, Mike


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## Troy Farmer (Jul 31, 2011)

I have seen a yield curve somewhere where there is a diminishing return at some point with N. In my local area I have cow calf operations and most make their own hay. They fertilize once a year when they fertilize their pastures and usually get a couple of cuttings in a year. That is not a hay production operation. These same folks would flip out to know how I fertilize my bermuda fields.

The difference is I'm producing a crop that yields usually 4 cuttings (harvests). If your row crop neighbors planted 4 times a year I'm sure they would fertilize each planting.

The blend I use is 20-5-20 at 300 to 400 lbs/ acre at green up and after every cutting. Bermuda loves N, K and a nice pH. If you don't feed it the stand will fail.


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## Ranger518 (Aug 6, 2016)

Troy Farmer said:


> I have seen a yield curve somewhere where there is a diminishing return at some point with N. In my local area I have cow calf operations and most make their own hay. They fertilize once a year when they fertilize their pastures and usually get a couple of cuttings in a year. That is not a hay production operation. These same folks would flip out to know how I fertilize my bermuda fields.
> 
> The difference is I'm producing a crop that yields usually 4 cuttings (harvests). If your row crop neighbors planted 4 times a year I'm sure they would fertilize each planting.
> 
> The blend I use is 20-5-20 at 300 to 400 lbs/ acre at green up and after every cutting. Bermuda loves N, K and a nice pH. If you don't feed it the stand will fail.


Good point. Well at least I am not the only one so far putting on lots of fertilizer as it looks like we are spreading pretty close to the same blend and amount.


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## robert23239 (May 10, 2009)

All grass loves K , a lot of cows guys around dont spread any on the pasture but have a lot less cows per acre.


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## scout (Jan 14, 2015)

I use the triple 19 or a triple 15 in the fall (I don't know if the fall or green-up is the better time to apply; I'm trying to help the root system during the winter). After each cutting, I currently have been using 33-0-0-12(S) at 250#; our pH is close to 8 so the sulfur helps, and I like the AMS/urea blend. Another good one for each cutting is a 26-10-10 (something like that) and more than likely will use it this year to get some more potash out there; probably will use 300# of this one. I like the 22-11-22 blend you're using, also. We have common Bermuda, Jiggs, and Tifton 85 (mostly Jiggs).


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## JB1023 (Feb 22, 2011)

Here in south central Texas our gumbo blackland seems to really be lacking nitrogen and has a ph of 6.8. This is what my soil test have shown and local co-op manager have said also. I just put out a few loads of 30-10-10 @ 350lbs/acre. Was very lucky and received 4 inches of rain over 3 days. I have also used 35-7-7 and 26-13-13 all around the 300-400lbs/acre rate. There are times I put out liquid and it is 21-7-3. This rate is what those Aggies tell me to use on the soil test I get. So I do what they tell me. This is coastal, jiggs and Tifton 85 used for square baling. Right or wrong on some winter grass Italian ryegrass and clover I will sprinkle some 46-0-0.


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## scout (Jan 14, 2015)

Those Aggies are alright. Don't listen to the people who wear (burnt) orange.


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## somedevildawg (Jun 20, 2011)

In the spring I spread 100-100 N,K or as close as I can get depending on what the co-op has available and what soil tests look like...usually urea this time of year, after June it's gonna change. Depending on days between cuttings, I may decrease or increase on the next cutting. Depending on how my pocketbook is doing I may just spread 80 units of ammonium nitrate....
My target is 350u of N pa/ 300u of K pa....sometimes I get there sometimes I exceed....just have to play the game 

Hybrid Bermuda grass...


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## vhaby (Dec 30, 2009)

I used to agree with Troy Farmer on the N-P2O5-K2O blend and rate for fertilization of our Coastal/common bermudagrass hay meadow. However, a few years back, scientists in GA have come up with a 4-1-5 ratio of N-P2O5-K2O for fertilization of hybrid bermudagrass, so that is what I now use. The amount in pounds per acre comes to 80-20-100 applied for the first cutting after the volunteer ryegrass and other winter grasses near maturity and the nighttime air temperatures consistently remain above 60 oF. My soil tests in the high range for phosphorus, so the 20 lb of P2O5 is a maintenance level. I agree with GA's potash rate being higher than the N rate because potash, as K2O, has only about 83% K, so 100 lb of K2O contains only 83 lb of K. With this knowledge, I'm applying an N-P2O5-K ratio of 4-1-4.

Nearly every Extension Service scientist/specialist will tell you, based on earlier research data, that K is the cure-all to prevent hybrid bermudagrass stand decline. However, they, and the scientists who did the earlier research to evaluate potash rates to prevent bermudagrass stand decline, forgot that what is called potash and is represented as K2O in the fertilizer blend is actually potassium chloride (KCl). Previous research scientists seem to have forgotten that potash also contains chloride in addition to potassium and they never evaluated the effect of the chloride ion on bermudagrass stand decline. One of the last research studies that I conducted before retirement was to evaluate the effect of chloride on increasing bermudagrass yield, and chloride, in addition to potassium, increased hybrid bermudagrass yield. The study was not run sufficiently long to prove the effect of chloride on preventing stand decline, but there have been numerous studies on cereal crops to show the effect of chloride on disease reduction and increasing yield. Usually, bermudagrass stand decline is caused by a disease called Helminthosporium (if I'm spelling it correctly). With this said, perhaps it makes little difference because when we apply potash, we are also applying chloride.

Regards,

Haby


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## HAYcorey (Jul 22, 2018)

VHaby, would you mind talking about timing of first application and temperature a bit? Noticed you wait til nighttime temps are consistently.

Thanks,

Kerry


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## vhaby (Dec 30, 2009)

Kerry,

As you know, hybrid bermudagrasses are warm-season forages. These grasses begin growth as the soil and air temperatures begin to warm in spring, but their growth is slow until night-time temperatures consistently remain above 60 oF. Soil temperature is also important and a rule of thumb is that soil temperature at 4 inches deep should be in the range of 60 to 65 oF before fertilizer application. Spring day time temperatures can rise to 80 or so and the bermudagrass wants to start rapid growth, but this growth is shut down when cooler temperatures occur again. If fertilizer is applied before bermudagrass begins active growth, other early season grasses such as volunteer ryegrass and also weeds may take up fertilizer nutrients intended for bermudagrass. This reduces the efficiency of applied fertilizers for bermudagrass production.

Below is a news release from Dr. Vanessa Corriher-Olsen, AgriLife Extension Forage Specialist in Texas, that discusses fertilization of hybrid bermudagrasses. You may find it helpful to understanding fertilizer use by hybrid bermudagrasses.

https://www.wacotrib.com/hay-producers-should-hold-fertilizer-application-until-temperatures-rise/article_de3fac44-59c9-5e6c-96df-6892bf271145.html

In this article, a clarification is needed wherein it states that bermudagrass hay removes 42 pounds of potash per ton. This should have been 42 pounds of potassium per ton. When plant samples, (hay samples) are analyzed for nutrient content, potassium, not potash, is reported.

Stay Safe,

Haby

P.S. Happy Easter. Think of what Easter means to us and enjoy the day even though our celebration is curtailed by not being able to attend church services bc of social distancing required to stop C-19.


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## vhaby (Dec 30, 2009)

In reply #11 above, I failed to mention that my fertilizer program for bermudagrass hay includes magnesium and sulfur in addition to N, P, and K. If I use urea as the nitrogen source, I use a combination of urea and ammonium sulfate that provides a 42% nitrogen analysis. If I use ammonium nitrate as the N source, I add K-Mag that also provides magnesium and sulfur.

Haby


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## HAYcorey (Jul 22, 2018)

Makes sense to me. Thanks for the reply. I've been waiting till last sign of frost which is normally after Easter. Got this advice from some sage farmer buddies. Thanks for explaining the science behind it!!

Happy Easter to you. It's for sure some strange times were in now. I'm afraid we and our kids are going to feel the impacts for a long long time.


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## Ranger518 (Aug 6, 2016)

vhaby said:


> I used to agree with Troy Farmer on the N-P2O5-K2O blend and rate for fertilization of our Coastal/common bermudagrass hay meadow. However, a few years back, scientists in GA have come up with a 4-1-5 ratio of N-P2O5-K2O for fertilization of hybrid bermudagrass, so that is what I now use. The amount in pounds per acre comes to 80-20-100 applied for the first cutting after the volunteer ryegrass and other winter grasses near maturity and the nighttime air temperatures consistently remain above 60 oF. My soil tests in the high range for phosphorus, so the 20 lb of P2O5 is a maintenance level. I agree with GA's potash rate being higher than the N rate because potash, as K2O, has only about 83% K, so 100 lb of K2O contains only 83 lb of K. With this knowledge, I'm applying an N-P2O5-K ratio of 4-1-4.
> 
> Nearly every Extension Service scientist/specialist will tell you, based on earlier research data, that K is the cure-all to prevent hybrid bermudagrass stand decline. However, they, and the scientists who did the earlier research to evaluate potash rates to prevent bermudagrass stand decline, forgot that what is called potash and is represented as K2O in the fertilizer blend is actually potassium chloride (KCl). Previous research scientists seem to have forgotten that potash also contains chloride in addition to potassium and they never evaluated the effect of the chloride ion on bermudagrass stand decline. One of the last research studies that I conducted before retirement was to evaluate the effect of chloride on increasing bermudagrass yield, and chloride, in addition to potassium, increased hybrid bermudagrass yield. The study was not run sufficiently long to prove the effect of chloride on preventing stand decline, but there have been numerous studies on cereal crops to show the effect of chloride on disease reduction and increasing yield. Usually, bermudagrass stand decline is caused by a disease called Helminthosporium (if I'm spelling it correctly). With this said, perhaps it makes little difference because when we apply potash, we are also applying chloride.
> 
> ...


After first cutting do you change your blend or stay with your 80-20-100? Also I am assuming that is actual amounts (units) not fertilizer weights?


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## somedevildawg (Jun 20, 2011)

I apply usually 4 times per year so mine is spread out a bit....the first one is the killer. After that the fields are staggered. It’s a tough nut to crack when applying every field in the same week....it’s a large number so I usually have to do a lot of checkbook watching during that application. I just ordered my NPK for first application. I believe it was 80-20-40-10 and that was right at $60 an acre...to bump up the K to 100 units was $88. Iirc. It may have been a bump to 80u of K, can’t recall....I know it was gonna cause a bump in my checkbook so I decided to wait until it’s spread out a bit....real world applications don’t you know, unfortunatly the pocketbook usually rules the day.


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## Troy Farmer (Jul 31, 2011)

vhaby said:


> In reply #11 above, I failed to mention that my fertilizer program for bermudagrass hay includes magnesium and sulfur in addition to N, P, and K. If I use urea as the nitrogen source, I use a combination of urea and ammonium sulfate that provides a 42% nitrogen analysis. If I use ammonium nitrate as the N source, I add K-Mag that also provides magnesium and sulfur.
> 
> Haby


I also have ammonium sulfate added to my blend. My fert guy only uses urea with granular.


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## Troy Farmer (Jul 31, 2011)

somedevildawg said:


> I apply usually 4 times per year so mine is spread out a bit....the first one is the killer. After that the fields are staggered. It's a tough nut to crack when applying every field in the same week....it's a large number so I usually have to do a lot of checkbook watching during that application. I just ordered my NPK for first application. I believe it was 80-20-40-10 and that was right at $60 an acre...to bump up the K to 100 units was $88. Iirc. It may have been a bump to 80u of K, can't recall....I know it was gonna cause a bump in my checkbook so I decided to wait until it's spread out a bit....real world applications don't you know, unfortunatly the pocketbook usually rules the day.


You are so right Dawg! The pocketbook rules here too.


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## vhaby (Dec 30, 2009)

I may not use the same blend of N-P2O5-K2O plus S and Mg after the first cutting. I'll use the same blend ratio, but the rate per acre depends on how much more hay that I need to complete filling my 50 x 100 hay barn. Normally, I'll lower the rate per acre, because of the fear of stem maggot or army worm invasion after the first cutting. I usually don't plan on more than two cuttings. The 80-20-100 is pounds of N-P2O5-K2O per acre. And yes, it gets expensive to apply this much fertilizer, but if I want to produce quality hay, I have to "bite the bullet" so to speak. Normally, I have $60 per rb invested in fertilizer and including the cost of hired baling, At this cost, I don't attempt to sell any hay because there are too many producers selling rbs for much less, and I don't want to let the plant nutrients in the hay leave this ranch.


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## Ranger518 (Aug 6, 2016)

Well I got my soil test back and have pretty much the same results as last year other then I have moved up a few points into the optimum levels of P and K when last year I was in the Medium levels but just barley. So I guess with the results and what y’all recordation are I am just going to stay with the same rate and mix as of now but I think I am also going to try and use a little ammonium sulfate and urea as my nitrogen source this year and see what happens as I used a little ammonium sulfate few years ago and it seamed to have a little better yields then just urea. We will see I guess.


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