# Nissan Cummins



## bluefarmer (Oct 10, 2010)

ww.autoblog.com/2015/01/12/2016-nissan-titan-xd-detroit.

Did not know this!


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## Dan_GA (Dec 29, 2015)

Kind of cool to see them starting to offer more diesels. To me, if you have a need for only a half ton truck's capacity it's a good deal because you get the benefits of a diesel engine. Dodge, Ram, whatever they are going by this week... they have a diesel half ton and it won't be long before Ford and Chevy do as well. I wouldn't call this truck the "every duty truck" but for the guy that can get by with a half-ton at a max weight of 12,300 it will fit the bill.


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## timberjackrob (Feb 16, 2015)

I really don't see the benefit of a diesel in a half ton truck.


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## Dan_GA (Dec 29, 2015)

timberjackrob said:


> I really don't see the benefit of a diesel in a half ton truck.


Better fuel economy, longer engine life, more power, better towing.


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## slowzuki (Mar 8, 2011)

Maybe better fuel economy, debatable longer engine life, not likely more power than the monster V-8's and turbo 6's, maybe better towing but all the trucks have far more power than they need for towing, the size of a 1/2 ton truck is the limit.



Dan_GA said:


> Better fuel economy, longer engine life, more power, better towing.


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## Grateful11 (Apr 5, 2009)

timberjackrob said:


> I really don't see the benefit of a diesel in a half ton truck.


Me either mainly because of all the emissions controls listed below. Plus there's a DEF tank too.

We'll stick with 381hp 401 ft.lbs. of torque gas averages 16.2mpg. That's a 10K mile average with some towing.

Quote from Nissan:

NEAR-ZERO EMISSIONS

Proven air handling and emissions control technology draws upon Cummins extensive emissions technology expertise. Cummins M2™ Two-Stage Turbocharger, cooled Exhaust Gas Recirculation (EGR) and Cummins Emission Solutions Aftertreatment System, featuring a Diesel Particulate Filter (DPF) and Selective Catalytic Reduction (SCR), result in near-zero oxides of nitrogen (NOx) and particulate matter (PM) emissions while delivering better performance and fuel economy.


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## Wcbr1025 (May 1, 2015)

I cannot see the benefit of a 1/2 ton or 3/4 ton diesel truck really. These new gas motors have proven to last and last. A diesel will be $10000 more when you buy it, fuel costs 20-30 cents more a gallon here, and look at the cost of service over the life of the truck. I've got a 6.0 gas that has pulled anything I asked it to. If I had it to do over again I would have bought something like an International 4900 for the farm and had a 1/2 ton for my daily driver.


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## JD3430 (Jan 1, 2012)

Most of you missing bigger benefits of diesels than the ones listed.
1.More torque 
and 
2. more torque at lower rpm.
You can have all the horsepower you want. Me? I'll take torque 24-7 over HP, unless my 1/2 ton is used for racing. 
I'd rather have a diesel engine that makes 300/700 than a gas engine that makes 400/500.
And it also makes most of that 700 ft lb at under 2000rpm, instead of 500ft lb at 5000 rpm.
That's also one reason why diesels last so long-lower revs and more power with lower revs.

It's a reason many of us older guys preferred the Ford gas in line 300 six over the 302 V8. It had more torque down low and it lasted longer because it revved lower.

The government has made owning a diesel less attractive.
If gas engines are so freakin amazing, why don't the put them in farm tractors for the last 50 years?
If gas this "the answer" to today's diesels, then why are more 1/2 tons being offered than diesels? 
Why are tractors, even small ones, still mostly offered with no gas engine option?

Flame suit zipped. Bring it on. I'm a diesel head!!!


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## JD3430 (Jan 1, 2012)

Wcbr1025 said:


> I cannot see the benefit of a 1/2 ton or 3/4 ton diesel truck really. *These new gas motors have proven to last and last. A diesel will be $10000 more when you buy it,* fuel costs 20-30 cents more a gallon here, and look at the cost of service over the life of the truck. I've got a 6.0 gas that has pulled anything I asked it to. If I had it to do over again I would have bought something like an International 4900 for the farm and had a 1/2 ton for my daily driver.


What makes them "last and last"? Is there some new technology? Wouldn't the same technology if there was some, also go into the Diesel engine?

I was just window shopping diesel trucks. I've yet to see one that was a $10,000 upgrade, but maybe it has with a brand I haven't seen. It was $8,500 with most I saw. 
In some states, diesel fuel is cheaper than unleaded. 
Some Diesel engines come with a longer warranty than gas counterparts. Isn't that worth something?

Your 6L gas is a good puller, but a diesel offering will pull stronger from a dead stop better and that will become even more noticeable the heavier the load gets, and with dramatically increasing fuel economy. And while a 6L is a fine puller, it will rev higher to get the load moving compared to a duramax. The duramax will last longer because of lower revs. It has to. 
It just gets down to duty cycle and wear. A diesel doesn't have to send the piston up and down and turn the crank as many turns. The valves don't open/close as much. It has to last longer as long as maintenance is equal and both engines are built without defects.


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## Grateful11 (Apr 5, 2009)

Even at $8500 that's enough to buy fuel to run our truck for about 70,000 miles or about 8-10 years for us.

How much torque does a 1/2ton PU need? The first new truck I ever bought was an '86 Chevy K10 5.0L V8 the engine made 165 hp @ 4,400 rpms and 240 lb·ft @ 2,000 rpms. I never had any trouble towing whatever we put behind it.

If I were buying a 1 ton or higher there would be no thinking about it, it would be diesel all the way but I don't see us ever needing a tow rig that big.

Diesel hasn't been cheaper in NC in at least 15 years that I can remember. On the last run down of fuel prices before this latest one diesel was $0.75-1.00 higher.

Our truck has a lifetime powertrain warranty as long as the oil is changed every 5K miles and do routine maintenance.


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## JD3430 (Jan 1, 2012)

Grateful11 said:


> Even at $8500 that's enough to buy fuel to run our truck for about 70,000 miles or about 8-10 years for us.


Ok, but are we taking into account the higher fuel economy of a diesel? This new ram diesel is advertising like 30mpg. That cuts deeply into a gasser having cheaper fuel. The way I see it, a diesel "pencils out at about 100k, just when a diesel is broken in and a gasser.....well, we all know how the value of a gas powered vehicle drops like a rock at 100k miles.



> How much torque does a 1/2ton PU need? The first new truck I ever bought was an '86 Chevy K10 5.0L V8 the engine made 165 hp @ 4,400 rpms and 240 lb·ft @ 2,000 rpms. I never had any trouble towing whatever we put behind it.


Yeah and that truck probably had a GVWR of 6,000lbs. 1/2 tons today are up over 9,000 and approaching 10,000 lbs with towing capacities that would make a 1 TON from 15 years ago embarrassed. So if the 1/2 tons of today are 50% more truck than the relics of the 80's & 90's., it makes perfect sense to take the HP/TQ up at least 50%, too.



> If I were buying a 1 ton or higher there would be no thinking about it, it would be diesel all the way but I don't see us ever needing a tow rig that big.


Well, maybe. But a lot of people don't feel that way. We've got 2 diesel 1/2 tons now that would embarrass a lot of gas engines and it looks like Ford & GM & Toyota may follow.



> Diesel hasn't been cheaper in NC in at least 15 years that I can remember. On the last run down of fuel prices before this latest one diesel was $0.75-1.00 higher.


But remember, it's not that way in every state, and as has been proved, the diesel gets noticeably better MPG. Diesel in my state .35 more/g, which is 15% more than gas, but my 550 gets 30% better MPg than a big block gas 550.



> Our truck has a lifetime powertrain warranty as long as the oil is changed every 5K miles and do routine maintenance.


You bought that warranty.


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## Wcbr1025 (May 1, 2015)

Different strokes for different folks I reckon.
Just can't justify a diesel unless I was pulling everyday all day. IMHO all of the newer trucks can pull alot more than they can safely stop.


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## Wcbr1025 (May 1, 2015)

I think what has helped the gas motors longevity the most was fuel injection.


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## Grateful11 (Apr 5, 2009)

JD3430 said:


> Ok, but are we taking into account the higher fuel economy of a diesel? This new ram diesel is advertising like 30mpg. That cuts deeply into a gasser having cheaper fuel. The way I see it, a diesel "pencils out at about 100k, just when a diesel is broken in and a gasser.....well, we all know how the value of a gas powered vehicle drops like a rock at 100k miles.
> 
> Yeah and that truck probably had a GVWR of 6,000lbs. 1/2 tons today are up over 9,000 and approaching 10,000 lbs with towing capacities that would make a 1 TON from 15 years ago embarrassed. So if the 1/2 tons of today are 50% more truck than the relics of the 80's & 90's., it makes perfect sense to take the HP/TQ up at least 50%, too.
> 
> ...


 "This new ram diesel is advertising like 30mpg"

My wife drove one of the RAM EcoDiesels before she decided on the Tundra and she said there's no need in me even driving the thing that it was ok once it was up to speed but other than that it's sick.

"well, we all know how the value of a gas powered vehicle drops like a rock at 100k miles."

From what I've seen pretty much all trucks lose a ton of value once they hit 100K.

"1/2 tons today are up over 9,000 and approaching 10,000 lbs"

That sounds a bit high. Our truck has GVWR of 7200 lbs. Can't argue with on the huge differences of todays trucks vs. 80's model but still towed fine.

"Well, maybe. But a lot of people don't feel that way."

I'm not sure it would embarrass our Tundra. It tows better than any truck I've ever towed with, not saying it's the best towing truck out there, just my personal experience.

"But remember, it's not that way in every state"

Doesn't matter what diesel cost in other states to me because I'm not driving out of state to buy fuel. I just know that it's been higher here for a good 15 years and right now is almost 15% higher than 87 octane gas.

"You bought that warranty."

Maybe and maybe not. Seeing as how we got a Tundra Double Cab with 4x4, TRD off road package, 5.7L V8, towing package, 4.30 final drives, 10.5" ring gear, Navigation, 18" alloys with Michelin all-terrains, sprayed in bedliner, etc. for $36K and some change. We looked at Ford, Dodge, and Chevy, they could not even come close to that price with that equipment, they were in the $45-50K range. This dealer provides a lifetime powertrain warranty on every new vehicle they sell. We know one of the salespeople. One a good Fri, Sat. and Sun. they'll sell over 100 vehicles. The reason he says they offer the lifetime powertrain warranty is because they know from past experience that the majority of their buyers will not keep a vehicle long enough to ever need that warranty, he says it's a good sales tool. For the minority that do keep their vehicles for extended periods they can handle the repairs. Besides it's a Toyota, it has about the best track record out there as far as engine failures. They're in the top 10 in sales in the nation. We were in there the other day for one of the free oil changes and he had a customer from TN, Charlotte is a long ways from TN. He said the guy tried to deal locally and just couldn't make the deal. Personally I'd never drive that far to buy a new vehicle. I guess we probably paid for those 5 free oil changes and tire rotations too.


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## JD3430 (Jan 1, 2012)

Diesels keep a LOT of value after 100k. We're in the process of buying one now and it's very common to see a 5-8 yr old diesel with 125k miles sell for $19,000. I can get same truck in gas for $12,000. 
You get the extra you paid for a diesel back when you sell.

Everyone, including myself, likes to justify their purchase decisions. 
The point I'm trying to make is today's F-150, Ram 1500, etc are probably equal to 90's 1 tons in terms of power, brakes, tow cap, payload. Therefore, they are offering diesels for those who want to use them at their limits.

The biggest common denominator I see with pickups, even greater than the divide between "ford v. Chevy" is the divide between the opinion on diesel v. Gas. 
No brainier for me. My tractors are diesel, heavy trucks are diesel, hell even my lawn tractor is diesel. I just prefer them.
My wife and I are looking forward to a diesel in a Tahoe or expedition someday.


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## Wcbr1025 (May 1, 2015)

Most folks around here don't use a truck for what a truck is made for anyways!


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## JD3430 (Jan 1, 2012)

Wcbr1025 said:


> Most folks around here don't use a truck for what a truck is made for anyways!


Isn't that a fact! Lady down the street from me has a balls to the wall diesel pickup that's never towed anything!!


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## Teslan (Aug 20, 2011)

From what I see online in dealer inventory for the Rams there really isn't a huge premium for the cost of the diesel engine. It's all in the feature packages. And I haven't even tried to buy one. The reason why values plummet after 100k is because it's much harder for a buyer to get a loan on a vehicle with over 100k miles. And with the price of late model vehicles the values has to drop quite a bit before the average buyer has enough cash to buy one. Then if they have that kinda cash typically they will get a less used one or new one with a loan. I would agree that the heavy duty diesels keep their value better after 100k miles though. Except Fords from the mid 2000s. Those drop like rocks.


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## JD3430 (Jan 1, 2012)

Teslan said:


> From what I see online in dealer inventory for the Rams there really isn't a huge premium for the cost of the diesel engine. It's all in the feature packages. And I haven't even tried to buy one. The reason why values plummet after 100k is because it's much harder for a buyer to get a loan on a vehicle with over 100k miles. And with the price of late model vehicles the values has to drop quite a bit before the average buyer has enough cash to buy one. Then if they have that kinda cash typically they will get a less used one or new one with a loan. I would agree that the heavy duty diesels keep their value better after 100k miles though. Except Fords from the mid 2000s. Those drop like rocks.


I wouldn't buy one, but those do present a decent opportunity if you know how to fix the head stud, erg cooler, etc. you can pick up a Ford "6 leaker" cheap. 
Once the fixes are done, it's a decent truck, but I don't know if it'll pass emissions inspections in some states like CA.


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## Grateful11 (Apr 5, 2009)

JD3430 said:


> Diesels keep a LOT of value after 100k. We're in the process of buying one now and it's very common to see a 5-8 yr old diesel with 125k miles sell for $19,000. I can get same truck in gas for $12,000.
> You get the extra you paid for a diesel back when you sell.
> Everyone, including myself, likes to justify their purchase decisions.


Everyone I know that owns a diesel truck, brother, BIL, 3 nephews, and several friends have all paid about $7-8K more for the diesel option over gas. How is one getting paid back $7K more after 100K miles anything extra at all when you paid $7K extra up front? It's a wash as I call it.

I'm not trying to justify our purchase, I'm merely saying that not everyone fits the same shoe. We done the math and paying $55-60K for a diesel vs. $36K for a gasser wouldn't ever pan out for us. What we bought is working out for us, what you bought is working out for you.


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## Grateful11 (Apr 5, 2009)

JD3430 said:


> Isn't that a fact! Lady down the street from me has a balls to the wall diesel pickup that's never towed anything!!


That's the dang truth. I can usually tell by the hitch hole. If I see a 5 year old truck and it still has the factory paint in the hole they haven't towed much at all if anything. I'd say that's what about 80% of all PU's around are like that.


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## Teslan (Aug 20, 2011)

Grateful11 said:


> Everyone I know that owns a diesel truck, brother, BIL, 3 nephews, and several friends have all paid about $7-8K more for the diesel option over gas. How is one getting paid back $7K more after 100K miles anything extra at all when you paid $7K extra up front? It's a wash as I call it.
> 
> I'm not trying to justify our purchase, I'm merely saying that not everyone fits the same shoe. We done the math and paying $55-60K for a diesel vs. $36K for a gasser wouldn't ever pan out for us. What we bought is working out for us, what you bought is working out for you.


I agree. I try and sell or trade before 100k miles. Which is about 6-7 years for me. I'll be getting close with my Tacoma at the end of the year. We'll see what I do this fall. If I feel rich or not. If I go over 100k with it I'll keep it until 200k. Though man it's hard to shell out over $30k for anything. And you are right that most full sized if you get 4x4, 4 doors is over $40k. Crazy! If you factor in the extra costs in a half ton for the diesel engine. Plus the extra for service, DEF. Then factor in the cost of diesel vs MPG savings it really is a wash. But maybe with more diesels being put into trucks the extra cost for the engine will come down.


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## mlappin (Jun 25, 2009)

I won't buy a new one, don't want all the bells and whistles, also don't like losing money soon as I drive it off the dealers lot.

Plenty of solid 3/4 or 1 ton pickups out there yet with the trusty ole 5.9 cummins.


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## Hugh (Sep 23, 2013)

Waiting (in the near future) for Toyota to announce the availability of the new Caterpillar 6.4 liter light truck engine with 900 lb ft torque and 450 hp in the coming one ton Tundra. A new technology is expected to produce a fuel economy of 41 mpg. Is this for real?? No, I'm just B.S. ing...


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## barnrope (Mar 22, 2010)

I've had about all I care to put up with on my 6.0000000. It almost makes me want to go buy a gasser Chevy.

I enjoy driving my 83' 6.9liter F250 about as well as anything these days. Bobtailing, it gets about24 mpg.


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## JD3430 (Jan 1, 2012)

Grateful11 said:


> Everyone I know that owns a diesel truck, brother, BIL, 3 nephews, and several friends have all paid about $7-8K more for the diesel option over gas. How is one getting paid back $7K more after 100K miles anything extra at all when you paid $7K extra up front? It's a wash as I call it.


What do you call it after 100-200k miles? I'd call it money SAVINGS. Remember, the diesel is going to get 25-50% better fuel economy over the 100,000 miles (depending on towing and other factors). Then at resale, when a gasser is basically worthless with 150-200k on it, a diesel is worth 5-10k more. So now at 150-200,000 miles, even with 8 k extra up front, I've saved thousands on fuel compared to a gasser. Next, when I go to sell my 150-200k diesel and I get 5-10k more in resale. So now I'm way ahead of a gasser. Plus, through all those years of ownership, I get the extra torque for towing those heavy loads and spend much less time looking for gas stations. More enjoyable towing experience. 
I keep vehicles way beyond 100k miles. Why would one trade a gasser sooner? 'fraid motors gonna grenade at 100,000 miles? I thought they were proven to "last and last"????


> I'm not trying to justify our purchase, I'm merely saying that not everyone fits the same shoe. We done the math and paying $55-60K for a diesel vs. $36K for a gasser wouldn't ever pan out for us. What we bought is working out for us, what you bought is working out for you.


Wait...so now you're saying a diesel is $24,000 more than the same truck with a gas engine? 
I don't think so..it's more like $8-9,000. Let's keep it real.


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## deadmoose (Oct 30, 2011)

JD, Not apples to apples. Diesel is the only way to go for you. Gas for some others...

If diesel or gas was the best in all applications, they would all be one or the other.

For example, here, a truck will be a rust bucket long before the engine goes. Assuming mechanically taken care of and driven year round.


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## Grateful11 (Apr 5, 2009)

JD where can I get a new diesel that has a set of balls for $44K ? I didn't say all diesels are $24K more than a gasser, what I said is we paid $36K for a truck that's going to do everything we need it to do and when we were shopping around a diesel with a set of Kahunas, that means eco-diesel not in the picture, was $55-60K. If I went to buy a decently equipped Chevy gasser truck it would probably cost about $45-50K, a diesel Chevy is going to run about $55K and up.


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## luke strawwalker (Jul 31, 2014)

Plus don't forget that usually all the diesels on the lot, being a higher-priced vehicle, are outfitted with the "cowboy cadillac" high end feature prices that drives the prices up, even if only a soccer mom ends up buying the thing... The gassers, being cheaper to start with, can be had more easily in cheaper packages without as many bells and whistles for 'work truck' or the nicer packages for the folks that want them with all the bells and whistles...

Me personally, the only "must haves" I want is cruise control and air conditioning... electric windows and power mirrors are nice, but not "must haves", but of course most vehicles now come with electric mirrors and power windows now anyway... The rest of that crap they can keep....

Later! OL J R


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## Hugh (Sep 23, 2013)

I want this pick-up.


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## JD3430 (Jan 1, 2012)

luke strawwalker said:


> Plus don't forget that usually all the diesels on the lot, being a higher-priced vehicle, are outfitted with the "cowboy cadillac" high end feature prices that drives the prices up, even if only a soccer mom ends up buying the thing... The gassers, being cheaper to start with, can be had more easily in cheaper packages without as many bells and whistles for 'work truck' or the nicer packages for the folks that want them with all the bells and whistles...
> 
> Me personally, the only "must haves" I want is cruise control and air conditioning... electric windows and power mirrors are nice, but not "must haves", but of course most vehicles now come with electric mirrors and power windows now anyway... The rest of that crap they can keep....
> 
> Later! OL J R


Up or over my way, there's lots of diesel chassis that are stripped. Crank winders and plastique seats,


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## Teslan (Aug 20, 2011)

JD3430 said:


> What do you call it after 100-200k miles? I'd call it money SAVINGS. Remember, the diesel is going to get 25-50% better fuel economy over the 100,000 miles (depending on towing and other factors). Then at resale, when a gasser is basically worthless with 150-200k on it, a diesel is worth 5-10k more. So now at 150-200,000 miles, even with 8 k extra up front, I've saved thousands on fuel compared to a gasser. Next, when I go to sell my 150-200k diesel and I get 5-10k more in resale. So now I'm way ahead of a gasser. Plus, through all those years of ownership, I get the extra torque for towing those heavy loads and spend much less time looking for gas stations. More enjoyable towing experience.
> I keep vehicles way beyond 100k miles. Why would one trade a gasser sooner? 'fraid motors gonna grenade at 100,000 miles? I thought they were proven to "last and last"????
> Wait...so now you're saying a diesel is $24,000 more than the same truck with a gas engine?
> I don't think so..it's more like $8-9,000. Let's keep it real.


Are we talking about the two different kinds of diesel trucks? The heavier duty ones 2500s and up with a diesel are better at holding value sure. The 1/2 tons like the Ram or smaller like the Colorado we don't know yet as they haven't been around long enough. Though I'm pretty sure in countries that allow small diesels in every truck and suv hold their value much better then the gas counter parts. But then they also don't cost that much extra also over gas.


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## Teslan (Aug 20, 2011)

Since this thread was started talking about the Nissan Titan diesel I was curious on the price of them. So I visited my local Nissan dealer website. It seems they have 12 in stock. None under $54,000. Some over $60,000. Now I visited the local Ram dealer site and chevy. Similar price for a 2500 diesel. Slightly more for a 3500. So to me it seems Nissan might be pricing themselves out of the market. Unless they come down significantly from the sticker price.


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## Hugh (Sep 23, 2013)

I think it depends. I drive our pick-up about 8,000 miles per year, and tow maybe 500 miles. V8 gas Tundra, auto, radio, air, about 35K new, no frills. We drive a Toyota Prius for everything else, and get 55 mpg. I see women going to the store in F350 "King Ranch" Fords. Also a lot of diesel rigs around here with leather, a lot of extra plastic badges, big chrome brush guards, etc, $60,000. I have never seen an "unloaded" diesel truck. I assume they are available. If I were towing huge loads or a big tractor all the time I guess I would special order a basic diesel rig. A friend has an older Dodge/Cummings with 300,000 miles. The engine goes that long but everything else is ready for the junk yard. The seats are falling apart, the body is falling off.

I would rather have a 35K gas truck for 150,000 miles and then get another new one. Why have an engine that will last for 500,000 miles when everything else is total junk at 200,000?


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## JD3430 (Jan 1, 2012)

Well, it don't take me but a second to show a "unloaded", "no frills" diesel 550. It's mine. 
No "King Ranch" here. No "plastic badges" and not much chrome, either. 
Vinyl bench seat and manual locking hubs and a Hillbilly flatbed.
I've seen hundreds of diesel trucks with 250-350 k on them that are still on original motor/trans. 
You guys must not treat your trucks very well if they're junk at 200k!! Lol


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## FarmerCline (Oct 12, 2011)

Grateful11 said:


> JD where can I get a new diesel that has a set of balls for $44K ? I didn't say all diesels are $24K more than a gasser, what I said is we paid $36K for a truck that's going to do everything we need it to do and when we were shopping around a diesel with a set of Kahunas, that means eco-diesel not in the picture, was $55-60K. If I went to buy a decently equipped Chevy gasser truck it would probably cost about $45-50K, a diesel Chevy is going to run about $55K and up.


 Not trying to start a argument or anything but you can buy a new diesel truck in the mid 40 thousand dollar range. When I was looking into buying a truck last fall I was quoted 46k for a new Dodge 3500 cab and chassis, crew cab, 4wd, Cummins diesel. It wasn't tricked out with every bell and whistle though. I also priced the same truck with a Hemi 6.4 gas motor and it was about 38k.....I almost bought that truck since It was going to cost me less than the diesel but at the end of the day I didn't.....very good decision I made. I don't have anything against a gas motor but for hauling I feel a diesel is well worth the extra cost.


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## somedevildawg (Jun 20, 2011)

Hugh said:


> I think it depends. I drive our pick-up about 8,000 miles per year, and tow maybe 500 miles. V8 gas Tundra, auto, radio, air, about 35K new, no frills. We drive a Toyota Prius for everything else, and get 55 mpg. I see women going to the store in F350 "King Ranch" Fords. Also a lot of diesel rigs around here with leather, a lot of extra plastic badges, big chrome brush guards, etc, $60,000. I have never seen an "unloaded" diesel truck. I assume they are available. If I were towing huge loads or a big tractor all the time I guess I would special order a basic diesel rig. A friend has an older Dodge/Cummings with 300,000 miles. The engine goes that long but everything else is ready for the junk yard. The seats are falling apart, the body is falling off.
> I would rather have a 35K gas truck for 150,000 miles and then get another new one. Why have an engine that will last for 500,000 miles when everything else is total junk at 200,000?


You did say that was a dodge didn't you? I'm sorry, just can't help it......


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## JD3430 (Jan 1, 2012)

Teslan said:


> Since this thread was started talking about the Nissan Titan diesel I was curious on the price of them. So I visited my local Nissan dealer website. It seems they have 12 in stock. None under $54,000. Some over $60,000. Now I visited the local Ram dealer site and chevy. Similar price for a 2500 diesel. Slightly more for a 3500. So to me it seems Nissan might be pricing themselves out of the market. Unless they come down significantly from the sticker price.


And the last sentence is the most important one there. 
When something new like a Nissan Cummins comes out or the Ecoboost diesel, they're overpriced for all the guys who MUST have one. 
The prices will drop precipitously if sales get slow. 
The bottom line is, diesel trucks have never been more popular. It seems like there's an auto manufacturer coming out with a new one every year here in the US. When I first went out on my own in the late 80's, diesel pickups were almost a novelty. Now it seems like they own 1/3 of the market and growing (1/2-1 ton, not just 1/2 ton). 
Even with the setback created by the VW scandal, demand for diesel suv's and light trucks is CRAZY high. Go to a truck dealer lot, and you're lucky if there's 3 on the lot and the dealers don't budge much on the price. 
Look at all the Sprinter and MB diesel vans you're seeing out there. You rarely see a UPS or FEDEX truck without a Diesel engine. Their bean counters are "bottom line" people. They know Diesel engines pencil out.
Once the "European influence" diesels, like MWM, FIAT, Mercedes finally start to get more mainstreamed into the US light trucks, the gas engine will be about as popular here as it is in Europe.
If you ever go to Europe, you'll see ~50% of their vehicles, even BMW & MB sports sedans, have twin turbo high efficiency Diesel engines. Almost every truck is diesel. I stayed with a farm family in the UK in the late 90's and they had a diesel Land Rover pickup that was really sweet. They make so much more sense. 
The fact that diesel fuel in the US costs more in most states (not all) and the EPA regs is probably the only thing holding Diesel engines back from becoming more the norm than the exception. Once manufacturers come up with the technology to make them clean and reliable, diesels will take over.


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## Teslan (Aug 20, 2011)

JD3430 said:


> And the last sentence is the most important one there.
> When something new like a Nissan Cummins comes out or the Ecoboost diesel, they're overpriced for all the guys who MUST have one.
> The prices will drop precipitously if sales get slow.
> The bottom line is, diesel trucks have never been more popular. It seems like there's an auto manufacturer coming out with a new one every year here in the US. When I first went out on my own in the late 80's, diesel pickups were almost a novelty. Now it seems like they own 1/3 of the market and growing (1/2-1 ton, not just 1/2 ton).
> ...


Every truck and SUV in Panama also is diesel and the mileage is crazy high on them. Higher then they would be here because of less emission regulations. I was thoroughly impressed with my sister-in-laws Mitsubishi Montero with a diesel. I looked into one here and felt it was lousy with a gas engine. Though my brother in law did just buy a 3500 Ram. He probably had to pay a premium there to get it. I'm not sure how he is going to drive around on those little roads and streets easily with it there.


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## Teslan (Aug 20, 2011)

I was just curious on what the asking price is on a GMC Canyon diesel. So I looked it up on the local GMC dealer website. They have 3. All above $40k! And that is listed after their "incentives" Though the gas version is listed for about $38k. Even the Toyota Tacoma is listed for $38k. I guess they figure people will pay a premium for a smaller sized truck. Strangely I don't really have sticker shock. As you all know when you look at prices for farm equipment they seem super high as well. LIke $31K for a nice double rotary rake. A rake! $175k for a 175hp tractor. $145k for a self propelled swather. I have no idea how much a PT disc mower is, but I'm sure they are seemingly high in price.


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## azmike (Jan 4, 2015)

I have a 2013 4x4 Nissan Frontier, a '95 Nissan PU utility truck. I also run a 350 Ford and have had 1 ton Dodges. I don't feel that Nissan is in the same class as the American work trucks, I don't care what engine or trans combo they build in. At $60K plus--I wouldn't go there...


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## JD3430 (Jan 1, 2012)

Teslan said:


> I was just curious on what the asking price is on a GMC Canyon diesel. So I looked it up on the local GMC dealer website. They have 3. All above $40k! And that is listed after their "incentives" Though the gas version is listed for about $38k. Even the Toyota Tacoma is listed for $38k. I guess they figure people will pay a premium for a smaller sized truck. Strangely I don't really have sticker shock. As you all know when you look at prices for farm equipment they seem super high as well. LIke $31K for a nice double rotary rake. A rake! $175k for a 175hp tractor. $145k for a self propelled swather. I have no idea how much a PT disc mower is, but I'm sure they are seemingly high in price.


PT discbines are cheap. $25K+ will get you a New Holland.

The Canyon diesel is kind of cool. At only 181/369, the baby duramax isnt a track star, but it tows 7700 lbs and delivers the torque down low.

It's GM finally listening to the customer. I just hope the 6.6 Duramax finds its way into the Tahoe someday. I'd be all over that bad boy..


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## deadmoose (Oct 30, 2011)

JD3430 said:


> You rarely see a UPS or FEDEX truck without a Diesel engine. Their bean counters are "bottom line" people. They know Diesel engines pencil out.


Ask your delivery guy about that. He is gonna disagree. Yes. The vehicles 10+ years old are gonna be diesel. Find a new one that is. Ain't gonna happen. They are some "green" alt fuel/ hybrid or gassers.


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## JD3430 (Jan 1, 2012)

Not in my area....
We don't have emissions inspections in PA. That may be the reason. You can run an old school Mack truck with the fuel screw cranked and black smoke belching and its legal.
Not considerate or kind, but it is legal.


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## haybaler101 (Nov 30, 2008)

JD3430 said:


> PT discbines are cheap. $25K+ will get you a New Holland.
> 
> The Canyon diesel is kind of cool. At only 181/369, the baby duramax isnt a track star, but it tows 7700 lbs and delivers the torque down low.
> It's GM finally listening to the customer. I just hope the 6.6 Duramax finds its way into the Tahoe someday. I'd be all over that bad boy..


I would love to have a 6.6 duramax in our suburban. It has the 5.3L gets 16 mpg and starts hurting for power at 80 mph. My HD 2500 gets 20+ mpg, runs 80 like it does 40 and at 115 mph was still accelerating, I just decided it will go way too fast.


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## JD3430 (Jan 1, 2012)

The '07+ and newer duramaxes are probably the best engine I've ever "driven". I know you cant drive an engine, but in an HD, its an amazing experience compared to other trucks.

It blends the smoothness of big block V-8 gas with the low end torque of a traditional diesel. Until you've driven one, you cant really explain it.

Dont get me wrong, I like "gettin my grunt on" with old school in line 6 diesels that snort & shake, but at the end of a long day, that smooth duramax in a smooth riding HD is a real nice driving experience.

I miss my '07 3500 duramax a lot. Wish I could have kept it.


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## haybaler101 (Nov 30, 2008)

JD3430 said:


> The '07+ and newer duramaxes are probably the best engine I've ever "driven". I know you cant drive an engine, but in an HD, its an amazing experience compared to other trucks.
> It blends the smoothness of big block V-8 gas with the low end torque of a traditional diesel. Until you've driven one, you cant really explain it.
> 
> Dont get me wrong, I like "gettin my grunt on" with old school in line 6 diesels that snort & shake, but at the end of a long day, that smooth duramax in a smooth riding HD is a real nice driving experience.
> ...


Mine is an '08 and has 217,000 on it. Been deleted and 4 stage tuner since 170,000. I would like to find another '08-10 that grandpa bought to pull his camper and is still stock and under 100,000 miles.


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## JD3430 (Jan 1, 2012)

I looked for 6 months for a clean, used '07.5 NBS 3500hd SRW dmax/ally reg cab 
Wanted to use it as a plow truck. Found exactly ONE in 6 months of intense looking. It was too heavily modified for me. Passed on it. 
I just shook hands Tuesday on a 2008 F-350 reg cab 6.4L plow truck. Stole it. But now I'll have another 6.4L living "rent free" in my head to go with my '08 F-550. 
Won't know if it's mine till Friday or Monday.


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## pede58 (Oct 27, 2015)

When dodge entered this market with IMO the best diesel, it had a body swap option in that when it rusted out you could replace. I like the motor not the truck but if I could buy anything I want it would be a ford frame and driveline, Cummins motor with an Allison, and a chevy body. I'm not sure how much they think it pollutes, but what's sad is you can buy a VW diesel car in Europe that gets over 80mpg.


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## luke strawwalker (Jul 31, 2014)

pede58 said:


> When dodge entered this market with IMO the best diesel, it had a body swap option in that when it rusted out you could replace. I like the motor not the truck but if I could buy anything I want it would be a ford frame and driveline, Cummins motor with an Allison, and a chevy body. I'm not sure how much they think it pollutes, but what's sad is you can buy a VW diesel car in Europe that gets over 80mpg.


Like everything you said but the Chevy body. LOL 

OL J R


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