# Small square baler capacity



## JMT (Aug 10, 2013)

Would like to hear opinions on the capacity of late model small square balers.

We do round bales and square bales behind a 9+ft mower conditioner. We round bale all 1st cutting and square bale later cuttings. Most square bales are alfalfa orchard grass mix.

We are looking to buy a rake to take three windrows of hay when round bailing. Would be raking about 27' to 29' of hay into one row.

Will a late model small square baler (14 x 18") handle that much hay in good yielding 2nd cut alfalfa/orchard grass? Our current square baler is 40+ years old and I don't think it would handle that much hay.

Thanks for your thoughts.


----------



## IH 1586 (Oct 16, 2014)

I raked 18' into one this year most of the time and it was on the heavy side for the baler. I run a 315 NH. I don't believe the newer models handle much more hay than the NH 315,316.That is not to say the baler won't take, just didn't seem to make as nice bales. If your yield is good I would think 11' would be about max. My yields 1st approx. 100/bales /acre

2nd approx. 70-90/bales/acre

Hope this helps


----------



## Tx Jim (Jun 30, 2014)

Ditto what IH 1586 stated. IMHO if you're trying to bale in the 50+ sq bale to acre hay 27' swath will be way too much for a small sq baler. The thicker the hay the more ragged the bales will look. If you purchased a rake similar to my H&S Hi-cap then you could just narrow the width of raking to fit baler capacity simply by moving a hyd control lever on the tractor. In '07 when we received a lot more rain than normal I had to rake a single 9' flat cut swath with my H&S just so my rd baler could handle the 8 rd bales(4X5.5) per acre hay.


----------



## sethd11 (Jan 1, 2012)

Frankly it depends on your yield/ton/acre. I can rake some monster 100 bale/acre windrows and bale them with the 5070 hay liner and not blink an eye. We used to have a 315 and it couldn't make half as nice a bale nor take as heavy a windrow as the hayliner. I would say if your lookig for a newer baler it would be between the 5070 hayliner or a Massey 1840. Lot of guys on this forum love both these balers.. 
P.s. I was raking 20-30 feet together making some huge windrows playing with capacity.


----------



## IH 1586 (Oct 16, 2014)

Tx Jim said:


> Ditto what IH 1586 stated. IMHO if you're trying to bale in the 50+ sq bale to acre hay 27' swath will be way too much for a small sq baler. The thicker the hay the more ragged the bales will look. If you purchased a rake similar to my H&S Hi-cap then you could just narrow the width of raking to fit baler capacity simply by moving a hyd control lever on the tractor. In '07 when we received a lot more rain than normal I had to rake a single 9' flat cut swath with my H&S just so my rd baler could handle the 8 rd bales(4X5.5) per acre hay.


Sounds like one of my fields I had. 5 acres and took off 40 + 4x5 round bales. Have yet to get any of my fields back to those yields again. Someday.


----------



## slowzuki (Mar 8, 2011)

During a year of rain that we did first cut in August, we have had some low well fertilized spots yield such that that 20 ft raked, bales came out of the baler with some double stacked, the rest butt-to-butt.

That was using a MF 224 baler. It didn't blink. My JD's square balers don't like that much hay going in the auger. A centreline baler can't drive over that size windrow without a roller up front to compress it, it balls up and causes feed problems.


----------



## Teslan (Aug 20, 2011)

I think you could. My cousin rakes 2 15 foot windrows of 2nd and 3rd cutting grass hay together and is able to get through them with his 14x18 NH and Case baler. He just goes slow. Can't do it 1st cutting though. I never tried it when I was doing small squares even with our 16x18 balers. But that was due to not having a rake to be able to do that. In hindsight we sure wasted a lot of time not doing that. Especially on 3rd cutting.


----------



## PackMan2170 (Oct 6, 2014)

I rake 30' of heavy (2-2.5 ton) alfalfa together in front of my Hesston 4650 (16x18) and it will get 'er done. Grass mix tends to get a little bit more difficult, given that grass is lighter and "fluffier" and the windrows tend to get bigger, but as long as the ol' 4020 will clear it, the 4650 will eat it. It can be an exercise in patience, given a low ground speed, but I guess you are really doing it at the same amount of time per ton.

FYI, in my experience, offset balers usually have SLIGHTLY more capacity than Hesston inlines (and may be a good solution if you are worried about clearing the windrow), but I will never go back to one after using an inline and enjoying the convenience they offer.


----------



## Rhinoman (Dec 7, 2014)

Hey guys,
I average 2-2.5 ton alfalfa grass mix per acre and pull 28ft into one windrow and can bale it pretty quick with my 1839 MF 14x18. On average i make 14 flakes per bale and weigh between 70-80 2 string bales. I am baling pretty close to 300 bales a hr. On wheat hay I did pull 28ft swath together I wish I wouldn't have done it cause I was baling .5 mph average 12 flakes per bale. That was 4-4.5 ton acre yield, but the little baler never missed a tie. I have made a little over 6000 bales since I bought it new and haven't missed a tie, the best baler on the market in my opinion. I started out with JD 224 WS it was a great baler but it would not handle that much hay and the windrows had to be tight do to the small pickup.


----------



## PackMan2170 (Oct 6, 2014)

Howdy fellow Nuevo Mexican Rhinoman! I guess you probably get a handicap placard being from NM too!

I can't believe you got through your wheat hay at all double raked! I don't even double rake it in front of the big baler!

Good luck to ya. Whereabouts are you in the "Land of Enchantment"?


----------



## Rhinoman (Dec 7, 2014)

Hello Packman2170,
I am just northwest and about 3 hrs away from Las Crues in a little place called Buckhorn. I am a very small farmer 30 irrigated acres but can get from 5-7 cutting a year. You know how hard it is to expand with the price of the water rights in NM. Anyway my wheat hay really didn't seem like a lot until I started raking and I thought well I sure hope the little baler can handle it. You should have seen the amount bales I had per windrow it was a little ridiculous and a little slow with the bale wagon.


----------



## PackMan2170 (Oct 6, 2014)

Yeah sure, I know where Buckhorn is. Been through there a lot of times going to Glenwood or Luna or Reserve.

Only raked like two or three pairs of windrows of wheat together one time and decided it was probably a bad idea.

Well, hope things are going well for ya up there. Sounds like your enjoying your new baler. Hope to see ya on the trail.


----------



## JMT (Aug 10, 2013)

Sounds like the right baler would handle 27' to 29' of my hay in a windrow. Next question is will a Hoelscher accumulator keep up with that baler?

Also, does a Hoelsher accumulator pair good with an inline baler?


----------



## German Farmer (Apr 14, 2014)

Good question, JMT. I am interested to know, also. We run a Massey 124. We have rebuilt it several times and it is an awesome machine. We always take about upgrading, but the dang little thing just runs like a Swiss watch, and honestly round bales are easier so we tend to be on the lazy side.

We were debating a new Massey in-line and worried about pulling our Steffen's behind it.


----------



## R Ball (Feb 26, 2013)

I have a 565 and it bales fine in a heavy cut but the flicks of hay are intertwined. We also was in low range 1-2 gear on a Ford 3910. In my opinion it was over loaded. We upgraded to a NH 5070 hayliner 
And it handles it much better and quicker.
Still have the 565 NH for sale. It's like new with maybe 6000 squares. We upgraded because of the accumulator we bought. Now instead of round baling almost everything we square bale for the revenue increase.
We baled about 6000 squares this year.


----------



## slowzuki (Mar 8, 2011)

Lots of videos of offset accumulators behind centreline balers.



German Farmer said:


> Good question, JMT. I am interested to know, also. We run a Massey 124. We have rebuilt it several times and it is an awesome machine. We always take about upgrading, but the dang little thing just runs like a Swiss watch, and honestly round bales are easier so we tend to be on the lazy side.
> 
> We were debating a new Massey in-line and worried about pulling our Steffen's behind it.


----------



## Josh in WNY (Sep 7, 2010)

JMT, I've grow a timothy hay and I have had times where I rolled four swaths of 2nd cut into one windrow (from a nine foot mower) and it still was too light for my 336 and I've had times where I doubled the windrows in 2nd cut and it was just right, I think it all comes down to the yield on the field. If you can find a rake that will let you adjust how much you are putting in based on the conditions, you'll be in good shape. That being said, I have yet to see a piece of farm equipment that was ideal for all conditions. 

As far as the accumulator, I won't be any help there, but the other guys are already chiming in.


----------



## hay wilson in TX (Jan 28, 2009)

Most of the commenters probably travel over the ground at a set speed.

I have baled 4 T/A with a nh 315 and have baled a slim field with the same baler.

One timeI used the creeper gear and I have also raked in road gear at 600 RPMs.

Idealy for a 36" long bale I want 15 Strokes per bale. higher strokes per minute than the book recomends.

I have a mark on the Tac for 93 stroks per bale. For heavy windrows you travel at the lowest gear you have.

To get a good solid bale on a thin windrow I keep going up in gears till I can get a bale at least every 18 strokes

Idealy a hay baling tractor has a Hydro dransmission and you can bump up the ground speed or pull it back to keep the hay running at 15 strokes per bale.

With my gear shift tractor I go up a gear when the bales are down less than 11 strokes per bale and go down a gear at 18 strokes per bale. Now when I was running in Road Gear the baler was baling at 24 strokes per bale and the flaes bounced when the hit the ground and usually ended up standing on end.

Most of you are in the Humid east and it would be better if your hay was laying out flat until the day you bale. Do not try that unless you have a good dew. I rake at first light the day BEFORE I expect to bale.

Not trying to be picky but the person on the tractor is supposed to be an operator not a driver.

My early model NH 411 disk bine has been modified to trop an 8' wide swath on the ground.

I do not even own a V rake now.

Some neighbors think I bale at too fast a speed. Other neighbors have burned up a slip clutch trying to bale my hay, trying to bale in thrid gear.

I like baling in a creeper gear. I can get off the tractor, walk back And chck bale weights and bale lengths and walk back to the traveling tractor.

Hint if the hay is too much to bale go up in RPMs and drop back another gear. .

On the 4T/A hay I had to stop baling half way through the field and haul that hay to the barn. By then the leaves were shatterting to much. Finished balng the next day. The hay I baled the next day tested better than the first day.


----------



## hay wilson in TX (Jan 28, 2009)

While baling I watch the windrow, count the strokes per bale, watch when the bale falls off the bale chute. Peak at the bale moixture.

The key to good baling is the windrow. A good windrow will make better bales.


----------



## Thumbtack (Jun 18, 2012)

Welcome fellow New Mexican, Rhinoman to Hay talk. Was just in your neck of the woods in October. You guys have had some nice moisture this year. I know the Buckhorn area pretty well.


----------



## R Ball (Feb 26, 2013)

One thing I forgot to mention about the bc 5070 hayliner. When baling with the Kuhns accumulator we 
Cannot have any pressure on the hydraulic tensioner on the baler or the bales are way to heavy and busting the string. Once we figured that out no problem. 
Does anyone else run a kuhns behind a hayliner? If so what's your experience with this?


----------



## R Ball (Feb 26, 2013)

One thing I forgot to mention about the bc 5070 hayliner. When baling with the Kuhns accumulator we 
Cannot have any pressure on the hydraulic tensioner on the baler or the bales are way to heavy and busting the string. Once we figured that out no problem. 
Does anyone else run a kuhns behind a hayliner? If so what's your experience with this?


----------



## sethd11 (Jan 1, 2012)

I will be next year so I'll find out R ball. Getting an 18 bale Kuhn's. I'm actually pretty excited.


----------



## R Ball (Feb 26, 2013)

You will wonder how you did without it, great machine.


----------



## Teslan (Aug 20, 2011)

R Ball said:


> One thing I forgot to mention about the bc 5070 hayliner. When baling with the Kuhns accumulator we
> Cannot have any pressure on the hydraulic tensioner on the baler or the bales are way to heavy and busting the string. Once we figured that out no problem.
> Does anyone else run a kuhns behind a hayliner? If so what's your experience with this?


So really you don't even need the hydraulic tensioner to even work?


----------



## R Ball (Feb 26, 2013)

That's right. Would not even need it unless we bale without the accumulator. 
For bale tension I am still sold on a air bag over anything, used two years on our 565 and it was flawless.


----------



## JMT (Aug 10, 2013)

After looking at our book, hooking on our Hoelscher accumulator to an inline baler would be easy. But it would be offset quite a bit from the tractor and inline baler. Looks like it would make it difficult for road transport and barn storage.

Anybody have any experience with an accumulator behind an inline baler?


----------



## OhioHay (Jun 4, 2008)

We run kuhns behind our inlines. Works well. Very maneuverable in field or down the road.


----------



## Vol (Jul 5, 2009)

JMT said:


> After looking at our book, hooking on our Hoelscher accumulator to an inline baler would be easy. But it would be offset quite a bit from the tractor and inline baler. Looks like it would make it difficult for road transport and barn storage.
> 
> Anybody have any experience with an accumulator behind an inline baler?


Kuhns accumulators and inlines are a perfect fit.

Regards, Mike


----------



## JMT (Aug 10, 2013)

Kuhn track centered directly behind the baler right? My Hoelscher would be offset to the right, just not sure by how much. I think it would be enough to cause problems.


----------



## OhioHay (Jun 4, 2008)

Yes, the kuhns tracks directly behind the baler. That's one of the reasons we went with it when we switched from kicker to accumulator.


----------



## beggar (Aug 22, 2014)

I had a NH311 hayliner and it fed the bale chamber with fingers. In heavy windrows it would put out irregular bales if you crowded it. I now have a H4050 with auger fed and don't have that problem anymore. However it doesn't pick up the hay as clean. Maybe because of the small diameter of the pickup reel.


----------



## slowzuki (Mar 8, 2011)

Re bale tension and kuhns - we have the same type of chute on our bale baskets and run no tension on the baler too.


----------



## Lostin55 (Sep 21, 2013)

hay wilson in TX said:


> Most of the commenters probably travel over the ground at a set speed.
> 
> I have baled 4 T/A with a nh 315 and have baled a slim field with the same baler.
> 
> ...


I agree with almost everything you said. Right up until you mentioned getting off a running tractor with the pto running, walking back to check the baler and returning to the tractor.
In my mind, that is foolish. Most of us have done something similar, of course, but you are asking for a wreck. Is it really worth it?
As for the rest of your post, I thought everyone baled that way. Learn something new every day. I was taught pretty much everything you said about rpm and groundspeed from an early age.


----------

