# Who Does NOT Condition Their Hay???



## VA Haymaker (Jul 1, 2014)

Me and my boys are going to make a run at baling some hay over the upcoming Labor Day Weekend and we've got a sickle bar mower, rake and baler in place. The only piece we don't have is a tedder. I'm on the look out for one, but what I've seen thus far isn't very good for the asking price - probably be better off buying a new one.

So it is very likely we will attempt to cut/rake/bale without a tedder. I know it's almost taboo not to condition hay these days, but back in the day I don't know that anyone around my neck of the woods conditioned hay other than giving it a second roll with a hay rake.

Question is - anyone NOT conditioning their hay? What is your cut to bale time line? Cut, let it lay for 2 or 3 days or more, rake and bale - pray it doesn't rain?

BTW - this hay making exercise is to give our equipment a test run to see what we've got and to clear the field for a burn down, reseeding, fertilizer and lime. If we didn't bale, we'd either bush hog or give the hay away for someone to cut. So since we are going to cut it anyway, now is a good time to give our equipment (and my boys) a trial run!

Thanks!
Bill


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## 8350HiTech (Jul 26, 2013)

Come on up to PA. I'll sell you a tedder! 

What are you cutting? Is it the first time it's been cut this year?


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## VA Haymaker (Jul 1, 2014)

8350HiTech said:


> Come on up to PA. I'll sell you a tedder!
> What are you cutting? Is it the first time it's been cut this year?


Second cut. First cut was just mowing it down with a bush hog at Memorial Day weekend. We are going to totally recondition the fields, reseed, etc. There are around 10-12 acres and the plan is to keep the fields from growing-up and since they haven't been hayed in about 10 years and haven't been limed or fertilized in probably 30 years, we are starting from scratch. I figure if we are going to mow the fields in the first place, it would be good for my teenage boys to get some experience making some square bales and who knows, make a few dollars for some college expenses in a few years. I'm footing the bill for the equipment, the boys are providing sweat equity and of course Dad will be in the tractor'a seat...

Can't say we'll make any money doing this, but I think it will be a fun/good experience for the family.

BTW - the hay presently is thin from neglect. There is orchard grass, a bit it timothy and fescue and to my surprise a fair amount of red clover. Of course there is a goodly amount of weeds and native grasses too. But - I guess this mixture will bale and test our equipment as good as a 100% stand of orchard grass or timothy.

Thanks,
Bill


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## Trotwood2955 (Sep 4, 2012)

I've never not made hay without a conditioner, so can't speak to that but can still hopefully give you something to compare with since location-wise should be fairly close to you. We run a discbine and also a tedder. In first cut hay, in ideal weather (sunny, breezy, lower humidity) we still pretty much figure on needing a full 3 day window - including using the discbine and tedding at least once. And usually like to mow the evening before to get more like a 3.5 day window. For second cutting, usually still want at least 3 full days for grass hay, and usually we will ted once unless it is really thin, then we may skip the tedding.

Weather of course is always a big factor on how many days, but as you can tell we usually figure on 3+. So in your case with no conditioner and no tedder I would think you would be looking at 4+ minimum. Depends a lot too on the hay - if it's really green vs. really mature/ripe, if it's high volume vs. thin, grass vs. legume (you mention some red clover, which can really slow down drying time).

Raking it a couple times can help it dry (we usually call it "half raking"). BUT, you still can't start raking too soon. I've seen some people "half rake" hay that was still way too wet to rake, and once its raked up I don't care how many times you flip it, it will be hard to get it dried down consistently and fast, especially if you are using a side deliver/bar-type rake. Now if you wait a couple days after mowing to start raking, then that should be ok - typically.

One other point, not to state the obvious, but just because you plan on making hay over Labor Day don't get too set on that - who knows what the weather will be like that far in advance. I know how it is to get something "planned out" and then you try to force things to work even if conditions aren't ideal, and it usually doesn't turn out the best! So don't rush something - it usually leads to broke equipment or tough hay.

Good luck!


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## NewBerlinBaler (May 30, 2011)

My hay fields are atop a ridge. There's only about 3 inches of top soil, then it's shale. If it rains in the morning, it's dusty by late afternoon. We call it "well drained soil" as everything dries fast.

I use a trailed disk mower that does not have a conditioner. The mower's discharge chute set up for maximum swath width. I don't own a tedder. We are growing orchard grass. Two days after cutting, the crop's moisture content is always down in the 10% - 15% range.

If it rains after I've cut - has happened more than once, two days later the moisture content is back down below 15% and ready to bale.

In my operation, conditioning & tedding are simply unnecessary.

Gary


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## Circle MC Farms LLC (Jul 22, 2011)

Obviously being in Texas my conditions are a little different than yours, but we have days here that are 95+ degrees and <35% humidity and I can cut large stemmed crops without conditioning and bale at about 44-48 hours on the ground. However, the guys with the thick sorguhm sudan have to wait 5-7 days. If thin hay or small stemmed and cut in the morning sometimes can be dry enough by that evening. Your conditions will be different and there are some good recommendations from people in your general area, but my advice would be that you won't have a really good feel for it until you've baled a couple rounds of hay.


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## Dill (Nov 5, 2010)

People did it for years with just a sickle bar and rake without a conditioner or tedder. Heck it was mowed by hand with a sickle for eons. However its a lot easier to do with a conditioner and a tedder. If it wasn't no one would have bought that terrible plugging tow behind roll conditioners.


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## Tim/South (Dec 12, 2011)

My grandfather thought a tedder was a waste of time and money. He would let hay lay out until the top was almost bleached then rake it.


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## slowzuki (Mar 8, 2011)

You can do it here in the most ideal weather especially with thin crops of grass hay. Any legumes like field vetch or alfalfa etc good luck even with 4-5 days of dry weather.


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## VA Haymaker (Jul 1, 2014)

Thanks everyone for the replies! Very interesting to hear folk's experiences who don't or haven't tedded or conditioned their hay.

I think at the end of the day, given our potential for late evening thunder storms, high humidity and a day job, we will need to make due with as narrow of a window as possible and a tedder and probably a haybine of some sort will make that much easier.

Unless a tedder falls into our lap over the next few weeks, we'll be making hay with a tedder for this round.

Fingers crossed!

Thanks,
Bill


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## aawhite (Jan 16, 2012)

With the clover, I would think a conditioner would shave a day or two off your baling window. Clover is a bear to dry down. If all grass, conditioner wouldn't save you much time. That was our experience in SE Iowa, very humid and hot.


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## 8350HiTech (Jul 26, 2013)

aawhite said:


> With the clover, I would think a conditioner would shave a day or two off your baling window. Clover is a bear to dry down. If all grass, conditioner wouldn't save you much time. That was our experience in SE Iowa, very humid and hot.


I agree with that more strongly for spring cutting than summer around here. There's plenty of clover in the fields right now but it isn't nearly as sappy as it is in the spring. Here, the worst thing to deal with this time of year would be those random broadleaf weeds that hold moisture all year long as if it were May.


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## shortrow (Feb 21, 2012)

NewBerlinBaler said:


> My hay fields are atop a ridge. There's only about 3 inches of top soil, then it's shale. If it rains in the morning, it's dusty by late afternoon. We call it "well drained soil" as everything dries fast.
> 
> I use a trailed disk mower that does not have a conditioner. The mower's discharge chute set up for maximum swath width. I don't own a tedder. We are growing orchard grass. Two days after cutting, the crop's moisture content is always down in the 10% - 15% range.
> 
> ...


I'm envious.


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## Tim/South (Dec 12, 2011)

I have 30 acres on the ground. Went to run the tedder over it today and decided it was not worth the effort. The hay is not thick and is drying well.

makes me wish I had a kicker wheel on the rake. We normally ted everything which makes the windrow easier for the baler to pick up.


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## mlappin (Jun 25, 2009)

I mowed hay wednesday, tedded yesterday morning, tedded again this morning, just got done raking, gonna head down with the baler shortly. Was cloudy and overcast from the time I had 80% of the hay mowed and rest of the day, never broke 70 Wednesday. Was sunny Thursday with a high of 72, about upper 70's today. Not only did we have a very heavy dew last night, tractor tires were still wet when I finished tedding at 11:30. It will most likely all go from 16-18% when I bale, but without my aftermarket rolls it wouldn't have went with stock conditioning rolls, without some kind of conditioning I wouldn't have even bothered to mow it with only a poor three day window.


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## vhaby (Dec 30, 2009)

Mowed alfalfa Tuesday, no cutter/conditioning, raked and baled Friday. Best alfalfa hay this season. Hay has a nice green color and quite leafy. Previously always teddered.


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## Vol (Jul 5, 2009)

vhaby said:


> Mowed alfalfa Tuesday, no cutter/conditioning, raked and baled Friday. Best alfalfa hay this season. Hay has a nice green color and quite leafy. Previously always teddered.


Must be bone dry in your part of the country.

Regards, Mike


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## siscofarms (Nov 23, 2010)

If your talking a true just a sickle mower you will not have any problems with the curing part . I use one , a int. 1300 9ft . on most all my grass hay . The advantage you will find is that the hay lays where its cut meaning that besides the swath board giving you 6 inches for every round you are laying the hay down in a wide swath . there is no piling of the hay as conditioners , and even most disc mowers will do . If you got sharp blades , good guards , everything adjusted right , and its dry , the one advantage to the disc mower is you can cut when its wetter , you'll be good and a little help from the weather man and you'll not be needing those tedders and conditioners .


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## jturbo10 (Feb 28, 2011)

East Texas: Usually mow Bermuda one day, let cure one day, bale third day depending on weather, including cloud conditions, wind and humidity. No need here for tedding although some people with round balers do ted in front of a v-rake towing a baler. This week I mowed on Thurs, raked, baled, and put almost 800 bales in the barn before 8:30 pm with NH Stackliner. Moisture tester was running about 10-12 percent. Lot difference in the fall when we have cooler temps, less wind, and more humidity. My best advice is to talk to your neighbors who are haying for a living and/or talk to your county ag agent and hay wholesalers. Every state and county is unique and we have to adjust our haying operations to the environment.


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## jturbo10 (Feb 28, 2011)

I use a Kuhn 9 1/2 ft disc mower and it basically lays my Bermuda where it was cut and it definitely helps in the curing process. The Alicia Bermuda is not very stemmy so it dries evenly and quickly. I lay the heaviest hay down first so it has the longest time to cure and usually rake and bale using visual evaluation to determine which will be ready first.


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