# Granular or Liquid fertilizer on Alfalfa



## crhay (Jun 19, 2010)

Hi guys just joined, wanted to get some input on what you guys think about Granular or Liquid fertilizer on Alfalfa? Normally I will try to in the spring (if weather permits and fields are dry enough) put on Granular pretty heavy. Now i've been talking with some guys that say after you get first cutting off to go ahead and hit it again. I know some of them use both Granular and Liquid. Well i wanted to try it this year, so i put Liquid on a about 8 days after i baled, (once it had some growth, but not too much to leave tire tracks) I used a atv and 275gal sprayer so it hopefully wouldn't damage the plant (wasn't as much wieght as tractor and sprayer). So far i'm not too happy with the outcome. It grew fast the first two weeks, then kinda stoped. I didn't get the growth i was wanting, and it has some high and low spots. Like maybe some of the plants didn't have much leaf growth when i sprayed it. On top of that, There is a yellow color to it, now more than likely it because of all the darn rain we have been having. But the neighbors doesn't look near as yellow. I guess its kinda hard to tell if it help or not with the abnormal weather. Buts what is your guy's thoughts?? Thanks Chris


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## vhaby (Dec 30, 2009)

Where are you located?
What is the soil series name where the alfalfa is growing?
Are soils acid or alkaline?
What plant nutrients did you apply for first spring growth? Second spring growth? 
How much of each nutrient each time?
Do you soil test and follow the recommendations?


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## rjmoses (Apr 4, 2010)

crhay said:


> On top of that, There is a yellow color to it, now more than likely it because of all the darn rain we have been having. But the neighbors doesn't look near as yellow. I guess its kinda hard to tell if it help or not with the abnormal weather. Buts what is your guy's thoughts?? Thanks Chris


Two possibilities for the yellow color: Insects or micro-nutrient deficiency.

I have been reading a number of reports that sulphur in the soil was not a problem when we had plenty of air pollution and acid rain. But since we cleaned up, more and more fields are showing sulphur deficiencies. I have taken to adding 30-40#/acre/year of suplhur to my fertilizer.

I am going to experiment spraying sulphur as an anti-fungal/anti-insect spray at the rate of 10#/acre in 30 gallons of water, should we ever get some dry weather. My thinking is that it will be effective as an insecticide if I can upset the PH balance for several days in a row. But it will have to stay on the plant!

A number of the peach growers in this area have gone back to using sulphur instead of fungicides because of cost and effectiveness. They're getting better results with it than the high-priced chemicals.

Ralph


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## mlappin (Jun 25, 2009)

We've heard the same for corn. One year we tried using something like 18-34-0-6s, problem with that was the added sulfer would settle out. We've started added a micronutrient premix to the starter liquid right before we plant the sand and have noticed a yield increase, haven't noticed a bit of difference on the clay yet.


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## crhay (Jun 19, 2010)

Out soil veries alot, we dont have nice flat field, just rolling hills. This is the first year on the field. we bought it from a farmer who only ran row crop on it, and most the top soil is at the bottoms. (for whoever asked) From what i can remember Last year soil ph was around 5.1-5.5, For P205 i needed to apply somewhere around the 230, and 275 for K20. We put on more than enough, we haven't done test yet this year to see where we're at.
One this is for sure this rain is killin us here, i cant eventhink about mowing the alfalfa and theres alot of blooms. just not real tall and yellow. My Timothy are all laid flat, and starting to rott at the bottoms. Not even sure how the disk mower is going to cut it. What a bummer. If weather works out i think i'm going to try Granular next time, that is if the ground is soild enough. My main question for this topic, is will Liguid fertilizer have the same effect on alfalfa as Granular after cuttings. It seem that every plant would need to have plenty of leaves in order to soak in the liquid.-Chris


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## rjmoses (Apr 4, 2010)

I was told by our local FS dealer some time ago to not even bother trying to get my maintenance levels close until the PH was right -- 6.5. Alfalfa and grasses like orchard grass and timothy needs about 300# potash/70# DAP per year. Maintenance level is 300/75 each.

Your soil test should show both maintenance and buildup needed. If the buildup is high, you might need to do it over several years. Also, incorporation vs top-dressing makes a big difference. Potash only migrates about 1/8th to 1/4 inch per year into the soil when top dressed.

If you're going to spend the $$$$, I think I would get that PH right first. It takes about two years for the lime to go to work. Longer if top dressed.

Ralph


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## sedurbin (May 30, 2009)

> f you're going to spend the $$$$, I think I would get that PH right first. It takes about two years for the lime to go to work. Longer if top dressed.


Anyone had any experience with pelletized lime, it is supposed to work faster.


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## Rodney R (Jun 11, 2008)

Once upon a time a guy told me "If you have a dollor to spend on lime or fertilizer, choose the lime" Alfalfa likes a pH of 6.5. 6 is OK, but 5.1 to 5.5 is terrible. What happens at lower pH is that the nutrients in the soil are not able to be absorbed by the plant roots - their bond to the soil is more than the pulling power of the roots - you have to put out a LOT more fertilizer to have the plants be able to absorb it.

With a low pH the granular vs liquid is sorta a moot point - neither one will work well. Once the pH is good, you only need to apply a granular after your 1st cutting. Alfalfa makes it's own N, and the 1st cutting is normally stemmy anyway, so we never apply until that's been removed.

I think that foliar fertilizers do have their place in a low fertility situation, but you can not apply too much, as in dry conditions it will 'burn' the alfalfa plants. If it is as wet as you say that has helped you - I think we apply around 7 gal/acre of 5-15-15 I think that in our situation it doesn't pay for itself, but apparently the salesman was good, cause my dad keeps buying it.

What it sounds like ought to be done - apply 2 ton of lime/acre, and apply the granular fertilizer like you have been doing, cause even in low pH, plants still need fertilizer. We have one field that we rent that was planted to alfalfa when the fall before we aquired it. the pH is low (similar to yours). We have fertilized like all the other fields, and given it some lime. The guys who we rent from also planted a few other field that same year, and have given theirs very little fertilizer, and no lime. Those fields have like 2 stalks of alfalfa in them, and ours looks nice.... 10 years later.

Rodney


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## hayray (Feb 23, 2009)

The biggest issue with liquid fertilizer is being able to get enough rate on per acre. If you need 200 lbs. of K2O how do you do that with a liquid that is putting on maybe a 1 lb. rate per acre?


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## crhay (Jun 19, 2010)

I guess i should of said that the soil test was taken last spring before i planted it. I put more than enough lime (both granular and liquid lime) than what it needed. I didn't get a cutting last year because of the poor weather. so this is really the first year for it. You did give me some awsers i was looking for, like being able to put enough on with liquid. or will it burn it if its too dry and hot out. or what is preffered after 1st cutting, liquid or Granular. This is kinda my expermental field, trying to raise nice alfalfa in poor ground with poor top soil. It looks like it kinda came out of the yellow look. i think it is fungus or something from all the rain. The ground has dried up, and forecast looks good, so i may try to mow tommrow. -Chris


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## vhaby (Dec 30, 2009)

Many of my questions in the 6/20/10 reply have been answered in the replies that followed. Here are a few additional thoughts:
- Was the limestone applied a rather coarse material, such as effective calcium carbonate equivalence 60%, or 60 percent effective, and was the lime applied to the soil surface and not incorporated into the soil? You did mention applying liquid lime, which is only about 50% lime, the rest is the water and clay used to suspend the lime- expensive.
- With a pH below 5.5, surface-applied not incorporated limestone is not going to have a great deal of effect at changing soil pH below the surface where a higher pH is needed for the Rhizobia to fix nitrogen for the alfalfa, at least in the short term.
- Excessively wet soil conditions will inhibit Rhizobia activity due to lack of oxygen.
- Liming a low pH soil to decrease the acidity for alfalfa, or for clover, especially if the soil is low in organic matter, ties up what little boron might be available, so additional boron should be applied- up to 3.5 lb B/acre for alfalfa (1 lb/ac for clover).
- Application of sufficient liquid fertilizer to fertilize the soil for alfalfa, especially after waiting for a week to ten days to allow sufficient leaf growth for the alfalfa to absorb the nutrients certainly will burn the vegetation. If you were intending to foliar apply the fertilizer, a much lower rate should have been used.
- What is the soil pH below the depth that you sampled for the soil test. If the pH in the subsoil is as low as it was in the surface, or lower, aluminum will be toxic to alfalfa root growth, so the plants will not be able to uptake sufficient water for production once it quits raining.


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