# New holland bar rake teeth/tines rubber vs steel



## Ranger518 (Aug 6, 2016)

I have recently bought a new holland 258 rake and it has about half rubber tines and half steel tines I was wondering what ones worked better for taking heavy crop of bermuda. I would like to make them all the same type. Just don't know if it is better to get the rubber ons or metal. Thanks


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## 8350HiTech (Jul 26, 2013)

The steel are cheaper so someone probably starting replacing rubber with steel as they wore out. Rubber are nice but unless you buy good ones from NH, don’t even bother.


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## Ranger518 (Aug 6, 2016)

8350HiTech said:


> The steel are cheaper so someone probably starting replacing rubber with steel as they wore out. Rubber are nice but unless you buy good ones from NH, don't even bother.


I don't mind replacing them all with rubber or steel as the cost is going to be about the same do to I will need to buy the keepers and bolts for the steel tines I replace. I just want to get what will work the best for my use.


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## Josh in WNY (Sep 7, 2010)

We have an old NH 55 rake with steel tines as a backup rake (used to be our only rake) and two NH 258s with rubber teeth. The only thing that is keeping us from totally converting both of the 258s to steel tines is the cost. We haven't been able to find any rubber teeth (even from NH) that last. The steel ones may get worn or bent, but they stick around and keep moving hay. We are typically replacing 20-30 rubber tines a year... and we don't mow too close to the ground and the rake height is checked every time we pull in the field. We did look at slowly converting over, but for some reason, the steel tines and the rubber tines wouldn't always match up on the bar. Might end up switching a bar at a time to spread the cost out.

Other than them not lasting, the big problem we've had with the rubber tines is getting them installed. It seems line the holes are just a little bit off and you can't get the bolt started through. My dad came up with a trick of taking the cuttoff tool and putting an angled cut on the end of the bolt. This lets the bolt get started in the hole on the tine and then you use the threads to pull the bolt in.

In case it didn't show, I am a little bit bitter about the rubber tines, so that may cloud my judgement a smidge.


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## Ranger518 (Aug 6, 2016)

All I have read and heard about rubber tines is that they are always breaking and that they are hard to line up and install but the new holland brand fit a little better and last a little longer but are 3 times the price so what is the point to them do they rake any better? So I am leaning towards steel tines just wondering if they work as good or are they better for heavy crops 2.5 ton a acre. Steel sure are cheeper when you do break or bend one and need to replace. But I want to get what works the best.


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## Josh in WNY (Sep 7, 2010)

Ranger518 said:


> All I have read and heard about rubber tines is that they are always breaking and that they are hard to line up and install but the new holland brand fit a little better and last a little longer but are 3 times the price so what is the point to them do they rake any better? So I am leaning towards steel tines just wondering if they work as good or are they better for heavy crops 2.5 ton a acre. Steel sure are cheeper when you do break or bend one and need to replace. But I want to get what works the best.


I am raking timothy/grass hay and have seen some very heavy/thick crops with that (probably not to the bermuda level that you are talking about, though) I think that the steel tines hold up better for what I do and that the same trend would be present in your crops.


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## Ranger518 (Aug 6, 2016)

So how many steel times and how many rubber times is the 258 take spec say 100 or 155 but does not say what tine type?


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## 8350HiTech (Jul 26, 2013)

Ranger518 said:


> So how many steel times and how many rubber times is the 258 take spec say 100 or 155 but does not say what tine type?


Shouldn't matter type. It's a matter of whether you fill all three holes or just two.


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## Ranger518 (Aug 6, 2016)

8350HiTech said:


> Shouldn't matter type. It's a matter of whether you fill all three holes or just two.


Ok thanks. I guess the more tines the better job it does. Now just got to decide what the better tine type is sounds like steel but every rake I see has rubber tines just has me wondering why.


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## 8350HiTech (Jul 26, 2013)

Ranger518 said:


> Ok thanks. I guess the more tines the better job it does. Now just got to decide what the better tine type is sounds like steel but every rake I see has rubber tines just has me wondering why.


Realistically three is just more to break unless you're raking an extremely short, fine crop.


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## Ranger518 (Aug 6, 2016)

8350HiTech said:


> Realistically three is just more to break unless you're raking an extremely short, fine crop.


Got it. Yea I should only need the 100 then.


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## Gearclash (Nov 25, 2010)

3 is more driving force and less deflection which = longer tine life, unless you use your rake like a harrow. We have had Vermeer bar rakes for years, those rubber tubes have held up very well. I would not want to go to steel on them.

My experience with baler tines has me sceptical of aftermarket tines, rubber and steel, unless proven to be good.


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## mike10 (May 29, 2011)

One thing to consider if you intend to fill all three holes with tines. From the factory the left two holes have tines, though there have been screwups over the years and some got out with tines in the right and left hole but not the center. This will lead to tine failures of the right tine. If you go with steel tines, there is a special tine that goes into the right hole. It is a reverse tine, called that because the mounting is different from the regular tines. Even with the reverse tines, you can still have issues of the right tine crossing over the stripper bar. NH recommends, and so do I, to go with rubber tines if you want to fill all three holes.

One other suggestion, do not buy cheap tines.


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## Ranger518 (Aug 6, 2016)

mike10 said:


> One thing to consider if you intend to fill all three holes with tines. From the factory the left two holes have tines, though there have been screwups over the years and some got out with tines in the right and left hole but not the center. This will lead to tine failures of the right tine. If you go with steel tines, there is a special tine that goes into the right hole. It is a reverse tine, called that because the mounting is different from the regular tines. Even with the reverse tines, you can still have issues of the right tine crossing over the stripper bar. NH recommends, and so do I, to go with rubber tines if you want to fill all three holes.
> 
> One other suggestion, do not buy cheap tines.


So if I was just going with 100 tines what type would you suggest. go with rubber or metal I just want what would work best for me which is flat ground no rocks and usually heavy hay and will only be used when I square bale which is most of the time. Thanks.


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## mike10 (May 29, 2011)

Steel, just be sure to put them in the left and center holes. Left is determined by standing behind the machine facing the tractor.


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## Ranger518 (Aug 6, 2016)

mike10 said:


> Steel, just be sure to put them in the left and center holes. Left is determined by standing behind the machine facing the tractor.


Good deal i am guessing that is left and center from standing behind the rake?

Like this was taken from front of rake.


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## Ranger518 (Aug 6, 2016)

Like this? Better pic


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## mike10 (May 29, 2011)

Yes


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## Ranger518 (Aug 6, 2016)

mike10 said:


> Yes


Thank you very much.


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## luke strawwalker (Jul 31, 2014)

Josh in WNY said:


> We have an old NH 55 rake with steel tines as a backup rake (used to be our only rake) and two NH 258s with rubber teeth. The only thing that is keeping us from totally converting both of the 258s to steel tines is the cost. We haven't been able to find any rubber teeth (even from NH) that last. The steel ones may get worn or bent, but they stick around and keep moving hay. We are typically replacing 20-30 rubber tines a year... and we don't mow too close to the ground and the rake height is checked every time we pull in the field. We did look at slowly converting over, but for some reason, the steel tines and the rubber tines wouldn't always match up on the bar. Might end up switching a bar at a time to spread the cost out.
> 
> Other than them not lasting, the big problem we've had with the rubber tines is getting them installed. It seems line the holes are just a little bit off and you can't get the bolt started through. My dad came up with a trick of taking the cuttoff tool and putting an angled cut on the end of the bolt. This lets the bolt get started in the hole on the tine and then you use the threads to pull the bolt in.
> 
> In case it didn't show, I am a little bit bitter about the rubber tines, so that may cloud my judgement a smidge.


Yeah I bought a NH rake at auction years ago and it had rubber tines... a few were shot so I bought some replacements from TSC... DON'T WASTE YOUR MONEY! They're TOTAL junk. I too carefully check my rake height and MAKE SURE it's not "plowing" like I've seen a LOT of guys do, and the rubber teeth STILL don't hold up. I had some ORIGINAL NH teeth on there that were still holding OK, despite being weather checked and VERY old, but the steel ends up rusting and separating the rubber from the tine base and then they chuck the tine. I tried NH replacements but they're awful proud of those things and they don't hold up as well as the originals did. When I found out I could get 3 steel tines and the clips for the cost of ONE rubber tine from NH, I started switching it over...

I still have a few ORIGINAL rubber tines on the rake, but they seem to be holding up MUCH better, for the most part. I think the steel tines actually help protect them... Rakes, no matter HOW carefully set, WILL contact the ground once in awhile, due to small rises or dips in the soil, small varmint holes or ant hills or whatever causing a wheel to drop a bit or a high spot in front of the basket... and that's what will eat the rubber tines... IF they have a steel tine beside them, though, I think the steel tine "takes the hit" and protects the rubber tine...

I wouldn't recommend the rubber tines AT ALL... too expensive for the good ones and the cheap ones are absolutely worthless... even the new steel tines (at least the cheap ones) aren't as good as they used to be... in the old days, a steel tine would usually break before it bent the wire past it's "spring limits", but it was rare to lose a tine (maybe a couple per season on a 30 year old rake!) The TSC steel ones, if you hit something just right, will bend around and make one heck of a noise.... and I can bend them back into shape with the loop end of a crescent wrench...

I just run all steel tines. I wouldn't even CONSIDER rubber tines. I hear Vermeer puts ONLY rubber tines on their baler pickups, so I wouldn't even buy a Vermeer baler because of that-- even though I hear people RAVE about "how good the tines are"...

Later! OL J R


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## luke strawwalker (Jul 31, 2014)

Ranger518 said:


> All I have read and heard about rubber tines is that they are always breaking and that they are hard to line up and install but the new holland brand fit a little better and last a little longer but are 3 times the price so what is the point to them do they rake any better? So I am leaning towards steel tines just wondering if they work as good or are they better for heavy crops 2.5 ton a acre. Steel sure are cheeper when you do break or bend one and need to replace. But I want to get what works the best.


Rubber tines were *originally* used for "bean rakes"... hay rakes used to roll up beans or peas for combining, where shatter was a big issue. The thought was that the rubber, being smooth, gave less opportunity to shatter beans and leaves compared to the wire loop "springs" of steel teeth, and were therefore "gentler".

They sort of made their way onto a lot of different rakes. BUT, they're not "all that" as you've found out, and thus steel teeth never disappeared. Lets face it, if they WERE "that great" then steel teeth would have gone the way of the dodo bird...

For bermuda, steel teeth do just fine. The rubber teeth will do just as good a job; one won't do a better job than the other... SO then it comes down to COST and LONGEVITY or RELIABILITY... the steel teeth will hold up better and last longer and cost 1/3 the amount of rubber teeth, so IMHO it's a no-brainer which one to choose...

Later! OL J R


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## luke strawwalker (Jul 31, 2014)

Ranger518 said:


> Ok thanks. I guess the more tines the better job it does. Now just got to decide what the better tine type is sounds like steel but every rake I see has rubber tines just has me wondering why.


The three tines is again, a "Bean rake"... more teeth to move the product and thus less shatter. For hay, the two teeth is enough, and one hole is skipped...

That's why you see some rakes with 2 teeth side by side... the ones with 3 teeth side by side were sold as "bean rakes"... for hay it doesn't matter... 2 will do the job just fine.

I think rubber teeth versus steel teeth is sort of a regional thing, too... and some manufacturers were just in love with the things. Vermeer being one of them. NH offered both. I think the rubber teeth probably hold up better "up north" where they don't fry and surnburn in our southern scorching sun...

Later! OL J R


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## Ranger518 (Aug 6, 2016)

Good deal thanks looks like OEM new holland steel times it is.


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