# Ecodiesels



## mlappin (Jun 25, 2009)

I know at last one of our members own a EcoDiesel, anyone else? My old cummins has about had it, motor will run forever of course and the transmission is actually solid, phantom electrical gremlins are driving me nuts and someday if I keep it gonna need a new brake booster $$$ then of course plan on dropping another $1500 into the front end one of these days.

Seriously looking at the Ram 1500's, for what I'm mainly gonna use it for the wife's Jeep Liberty can handle in a pinch, if I have heavy stuff I have a fleet of straight trucks to pick from so no real need for a 3/4 or 1 ton. That and the half tons ride better, my back would appreciate that right away.


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## Bonfire (Oct 21, 2012)

Aren't the 21 models to be 3rd generation?


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## Gearclash (Nov 25, 2010)

The older ones were rather notorious for rotating mass failures. Personally I wouldn't even begin to think about a half ton diesel. Fuel savings are gonna get wiped out by up front cost and upkeep down the road. Ask what replacing the injectors and hi pressure pump cost . . .


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## Vol (Jul 5, 2009)

Gearclash said:


> The older ones were rather notorious for rotating mass failures. Personally I wouldn't even begin to think about a half ton diesel. Fuel savings are gonna get wiped out by up front cost and upkeep down the road. Ask what replacing the injectors and hi pressure pump cost . . .


Depends. In the 1500 Chevy the diesel is only $2500 more than the 5.3 gasser and will put you in the thirties on the long haul and 23 in the city. Wont take long to pay for that oiler at that price and economy.....and be able to tow the boat and the medium load trailers like a champ.

I read where the Dodge costs $5K more than the 5.7 Hemi gasser.

Regards, Mike


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## mlappin (Jun 25, 2009)

Bonfire said:


> Aren't the 21 models to be 3rd generation?


HAHA, don't care, well out of my price range. A 2020 is running $72,200. I just can't bring myself to pay more for a pickup thats gonna rot out eventually than dad paid for the west 52 acres.

I did find a 2018 with less than 12,000 miles, was a buy back though, in other words a lemon.


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## JD3430 (Jan 1, 2012)

I don't have experience with any of them, but it seems like the....ahem.....Ford 1/2 is more liked. 
Id rather have the RAM, my 5500 is pretty nice, it I heard the Italian diesel isn't the best.

Why not a used 3/4 ton RAM with the real Cummins in it?


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## mlappin (Jun 25, 2009)

JD3430 said:


> I don't have experience with any of them, but it seems like the....ahem.....Ford 1/2 is more liked.
> Id rather have the RAM, my 5500 is pretty nice, it I heard the Italian diesel isn't the best.
> 
> Why not a used 3/4 ton RAM with the real Cummins in it?


Tired of rebuilding the front ends constantly and the ride sucks compared to a half ton.

Everything I plan on doing with a 1/2 ton the wife's Jeep Liberty can do in a pinch. Main use will be for the boilers, I've used the Liberty both on the stove trailer and my install trailer when there just wasn't room to get a full size extended cab pickup with a 8 foot bed into the area.


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## mlappin (Jun 25, 2009)

Gearclash said:


> The older ones were rather notorious for rotating mass failures. Personally I wouldn't even begin to think about a half ton diesel. Fuel savings are gonna get wiped out by up front cost and upkeep down the road. Ask what replacing the injectors and hi pressure pump cost . . .


I read about that, was an error in the assembly or torqueing of the crank deck plate, that's been rectified.

I've put almost 200,000 miles on my 5.9 with no injector or pump issues. Big secret to that is don't buy fuel on the road. We keep B5 road diesel on the farm thats filtered out of the tank then all of our Dodge Cummins have another filter/water separator we added between the fuel tank and charge pump, have also installed fuel pressure sensors on em, fuel pressure gets below 5PSI to the injector pump and bad things are gonna happen. Banks and Edge have sensors available for the eco diesel. Reason I say road fuel is an issue is my Dad and a cousin were delivering trailers years back, Dad had a 3/4 ton and 1 ton Ram both with 5.9's and the cousin had a Chevy, all were comparable in years and mileage, all three had issues with pumps and injectors, Dad stopped delivering trailers and his issues stopped. They were out to Maine, California and into Canada often.

With the boilers I'd be close enough to home I'd never have to refill on the road and when we vacation we get on a plane and go somewhere, have no desire whatsoever to drive across the country.

I've looked hard at the gassers as well, but it would be like the wife's Liberty, even a small trailer behind it and you can watch the gas gauge drop.


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## Gearclash (Nov 25, 2010)

"I've looked hard at the gassers as well, but it would be like the wife's Liberty, even a small trailer behind it and you can watch the gas gauge drop."

We are on our third "truck" gas engine now, a 5.3 in a '15 Suburban. I am impressed with it. A month ago we took it to Chicago with a 3500 GAWR trailer behind. Picked up a load of concrete forms and accessories that weighed around 3500 lbs net. I was really please how well the Suburban and the 5.3 handled the load. It can't hold a candle to my '99 Cummins obviously but it is head and shoulders better than the '06 Hemi Mega Cab and '06 Nissan Armada with a 5.6 that preceded the Chevy. Both the mileage and the usable power were plenty acceptable. It made the 5.6 Nissan look silly, and I've pulled some with it as well. The only thing I don't like about the 5.3 is the AFM. That needs to get disabled.


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## mlappin (Jun 25, 2009)

Strange thing I'm noticing is when milage and models are near identical not a lot of difference in price between a Hemi and a Ecodiesel in the used market.


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## JD3430 (Jan 1, 2012)

mlappin said:


> Tired of rebuilding the front ends constantly and the ride sucks compared to a half ton.
> 
> Everything I plan on doing with a 1/2 ton the wife's Jeep Liberty can do in a pinch. Main use will be for the boilers, I've used the Liberty both on the stove trailer and my install trailer when there just wasn't room to get a full size extended cab pickup with a 8 foot bed into the area.


Then maybe the F150 diesel is a candidate for you. They've been around long enough that there's plenty of clean used available.

Or

Maybe the newer RAM front ends have improved components? I hope so. I just bought a 5500 and I don't want to be fixing anything for at least 5 years.


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## JD3430 (Jan 1, 2012)

Gearclash said:


> "I've looked hard at the gassers as well, but it would be like the wife's Liberty, even a small trailer behind it and you can watch the gas gauge drop."
> 
> We are on our third "truck" gas engine now, a 5.3 in a '15 Suburban. I am impressed with it. A month ago we took it to Chicago with a 3500 GAWR trailer behind. Picked up a load of concrete forms and accessories that weighed around 3500 lbs net. I was really please how well the Suburban and the 5.3 handled the load. It can't hold a candle to my '99 Cummins obviously but it is head and shoulders better than the '06 Hemi Mega Cab and '06 Nissan Armada with a 5.6 that preceded the Chevy. Both the mileage and the usable power were plenty acceptable. It made the 5.6 Nissan look silly, and I've pulled some with it as well. The only thing I don't like about the 5.3 is the AFM. That needs to get disabled.


I have a 5.3 in a Tahoe with 210,000 miles and it's still runs great. Really impressed with that little motor


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## mlappin (Jun 25, 2009)

JD3430 said:


> Then maybe the F150 diesel is a candidate for you. They've been around long enough that there's plenty of clean used available.
> 
> Or
> 
> Maybe the newer RAM front ends have improved components? I hope so. I just bought a 5500 and I don't want to be fixing anything for at least 5 years.


Word of advice, unless something has changed since I last went thru mine a few years ago nothing but Moog when possible in the solid front axles on the Rams, seem to outlast other brands of parts including OEM. But even the Moog doesn't seem to last nearly as long as they should, I just laugh to myself when I see guys with 10ft V plows on 3/4 and 1 ton Rams, they are gonna get real good replacing ball joints and wheel bearings.


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## mlappin (Jun 25, 2009)

JD3430 said:


> Then maybe the F150 diesel is a candidate for you. They've been around long enough that there's plenty of clean used available.
> 
> Or
> 
> Maybe the newer RAM front ends have improved components? I hope so. I just bought a 5500 and I don't want to be fixing anything for at least 5 years.


I'm a Dodge guy, have had a few of the other big three over the years, prefer my pentastars. I will admit that last 3/4 ton chevy got the holy snot beat out of it the years I had it, but it was for plowing snow and cutting wood, wasn't about to drive it 75 miles to install a boiler.


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## skyrydr2 (Oct 25, 2015)

The new chevy diesel 1/2 ton is a powerhouse compaired to the other 1/2 ton diesels! And a crewcab LT4wd is selling for 48k here. It is so quiet it will blow your mind too! The ram is a turd off the line and is noisy in comparison. Ford isn't even going to make anymore 1/2ton diesels because the sales sucked so bad.. 
A friend has a new chev and he has gotten 40.4 mpg on a trip through NY. That ain't bad in any book!


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## JD3430 (Jan 1, 2012)

skyrydr2 said:


> The new chevy diesel 1/2 ton is a powerhouse compaired to the other 1/2 ton diesels! And a crewcab LT4wd is selling for 48k here. It is so quiet it will blow your mind too! The ram is a turd off the line and is noisy in comparison. Ford isn't even going to make anymore 1/2ton diesels because the sales sucked so bad..
> A friend has a new chev and he has gotten 40.4 mpg on a trip through NY. That ain't bad in any book!


Read good reviews on GM, too. Looks like the timing chain/belt is on the back of the motor and you have to remove transmission to replace it!

The Ford diesel is also used in the Land Rover Discovery.


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## JOR Farm (Aug 27, 2019)

I have one that hasn't been brought up. My little truck is a 2017 GMC canyon with the dmax and allison it gets mid 30's running around and still manages to get 18 hauling hay. The trailer it pulls is an old 40 foot cotton trailer hauls 23 4x5 round bales


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## Tx Jim (Jun 30, 2014)

I'll bet trying to stop a 40' wagon with 23 rd bales on it towed by a small pickup will make one's pucker string tighten significantly!!


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## r82230 (Mar 1, 2016)

Tx Jim said:


> I'll bet trying to stop a 40' wagon with 23 rd bales on it towed by a small pickup will make one's pucker string tighten significantly!!


Would even be worse if no brakes on wagon. 

At just 700# each, you're looking at over 16,000 (8 tons) of hay. My full sized 1 ton, weighs a little more than half that and I wouldn't be comfortable. It's not the ability to pull the load, but ABILITY stop the load that matters the most to me.

Larry


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## JOR Farm (Aug 27, 2019)

Maybe I should have clarified low range, exhaust brake on, never breaking 20mph loaded. The farthest field is only about 5 miles from the barns never had any trouble stopping yet.


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## JD3430 (Jan 1, 2012)

r82230 said:


> Would even be worse if no brakes on wagon.
> 
> At just 700# each, you're looking at over 16,000 (8 tons) of hay. My full sized 1 ton, weighs a little more than half that and I wouldn't be comfortable. It's not the ability to pull the load, but ABILITY stop the load that matters the most to me.
> 
> Larry


Yep, I dont try to go fast with hay. 300 HP would be plenty....though I have more.
Would rather have exhaust brake and Alison/Aisin with downshifting and 4.30/4.88 than a HO engine. 
Just picked up a 35' 38,000lb gooseneck trailer with deck on the neck and I'm more of a 45-50mph guy that wants to stop real nice & easy.


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## Tx Jim (Jun 30, 2014)

JOR Farm said:


> Maybe I should have clarified low range, exhaust brake on, never breaking 20mph loaded. The farthest field is only about 5 miles from the barns never had any trouble stopping yet.


No offense intended but it still sounds as if the tail is wagging the dog to me. It will only take one time having trouble stopping on public road for things to go down hill FAST.


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## somedevildawg (Jun 20, 2011)

That’s why he said “yet” Jim, and I’m bettin in southeast Alabama it’s as “flat as a fliddle” so it ain’t got no downhills to worry about gettin him downhill in a hurry!


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## Tx Jim (Jun 30, 2014)

By "down hill" I wasn't referring to the terrain I was referring to "poop hitting the fan" in a hurry!!!!


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## JD3430 (Jan 1, 2012)

JOR Farm said:


> I have one that hasn't been brought up. My little truck is a 2017 GMC canyon with the dmax and allison it gets mid 30's running around and still manages to get 18 hauling hay. The trailer it pulls is an old 40 foot cotton trailer hauls 23 4x5 round bales


 Never knew the smaller truck got the Allison


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## r82230 (Mar 1, 2016)

I had just 4 RB on my RB hauler (has no brakes) that I was pulling behind a 1/2 pickup. The RB weighed in at around 5,000#, the hauler at 2150#. I was coming back from weighting at the local elevator. From the stop sign to my driveway is about 200', so I wasn't going very fast (I'd say less than 10 MPH). Black top road, flat and wet from morning dew. Lockup the brakes and slid by my driveway, had to back-up pull into said driveway. Never pull that RB hauler with that pickup again. :huh:

RB hauler can hold 8 bales on bottom, 3 or 6 six on top (depending upon your stacking/tying on).

YMMV

Larry


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## JOR Farm (Aug 27, 2019)

No offense taken Jim but it really handles it fine there's no hill around more than 50 feet are so and to stop at the stop sign just tap the brakes and it goes from 20 to a crawl in prolly 100 feet that's just the exhaust and transmission I have another cotton trailer that get pulled with a1996 dodge 3500 automatic and Cummins and I find myself stomping the brakes a lot harder with it but we do run a lot faster with it


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## somedevildawg (Jun 20, 2011)

r82230 said:


> I had just 4 RB on my RB hauler (has no brakes) that I was pulling behind a 1/2 pickup. The RB weighed in at around 5,000#, the hauler at 2150#. I was coming back from weighting at the local elevator. From the stop sign to my driveway is about 200', so I wasn't going very fast (I'd say less than 10 MPH). Black top road, flat and wet from morning dew. Lockup the brakes and slid by my driveway, had to back-up pull into said driveway. Never pull that RB hauler with that pickup again. :huh:
> 
> RB hauler can hold 8 bales on bottom, 3 or 6 six on top (depending upon your stacking/tying on).
> 
> ...


Probably one of them "off-brand" trucks


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## r82230 (Mar 1, 2016)

somedevildawg said:


> Probably one of them "off-brand" trucks


Ya, a red one.

Knowing what I know today, surely wouldn't have wanted a black one (would be on it's knees most of the time and/or throwing objects ), should of had a white or even a silver one perhaps.  :lol: 

Larry


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## mlappin (Jun 25, 2009)

So get to doing some research and when did Ram goto sealed transmissions? Whoever made that decision really deserves to get their sack caught in a roto rooter.


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## JD3430 (Jan 1, 2012)

mlappin said:


> So get to doing some research and when did Ram goto sealed transmissions? Whoever made that decision really deserves to get their sack caught in a roto rooter.


Hahaha 

Doesn't RAM offer a 3/4 ton with an air ride suspension for a few years now? 
That way you get the real Cummins, an Aisin transmission and a softer suspension. Maybe a used one?


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## mlappin (Jun 25, 2009)

Bought a Bighorn with the 5.7 Hemi, its a runner, not quite as much fun as the Cummins 5.9 but the Hemi is stock&#8230;

Taillights are getting replaced with the brightest LED ones I can find, Added the brake LED light strip under the tailgate, changed the third brake light to LED. Somebody ever rear ends me again they had best hope they knock me out as I'm coming out of this truck swinging.


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## skyrydr2 (Oct 25, 2015)

I see this is an old thread but I just wanted to add that my father got a 2021 chevy 1/2 ton with the 3.0 diesel , put a gooseneck knob in the box and hauls 200 bales on the tilt deck goose effortless. And boys, it ain't no slouch! That is definately the little engine that does! Gets wicked good milage too! He absolutely loves it.


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## mlappin (Jun 25, 2009)

So…broke down in July and found an 2020 Ecodiesel lease return, extended warranty being dealer certified. The hemi did fine for awhile but looked at the speedo awhile back and thought this can’t be right, put almost 40,000 miles on it in less than 2 years. So okay, boilers paid for the hemi, might as well let em pay for another. 

Even put a picture of a trailer behind the Hemi and hello single digits for mileage, Ecodiesel averages 15-18 mpg with any of my trailers behind it. Hemi had 3:21 rears when hauling my Ditch Witch trencher around might shift down as low as 4th on a big hill, eco diesel went down to 6th on the same hills. extra grunt from that itty bitty turbocharger and the 3;92 rears help tremendously. Did a few estimates in the flatter part of the state to the southwest of me, 139 mile round trip and averaged 31.8 mpg with the cruise at 62. Did another trip to Indianapolis for the wife's yearly follow up at St. Vincents. Met an owner in the parking lot to deliver a warrantied replacement door. From Indy up 69 to Fort Wayne doing 80mph a good way of it, then down the bunny trail for 35 miles to do a service call then home. Then 80mph knocked it down a bit but got 27.8 mpg on that trip.


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## paoutdoorsman (Apr 23, 2016)

Hey Marty! Good to see you! I've personally experienced the single-digit mpg when towing anything with a Hemi on numerous occasions. Those are some pretty good numbers from the Ecodiesel.


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## mlappin (Jun 25, 2009)

paoutdoorsman said:


> Hey Marty! Good to see you! I've personally experienced the single-digit mpg when towing anything with a Hemi on numerous occasions. Those are some pretty good numbers from the Ecodiesel.


Been busy, been a guy short all fall. Extra driving I had to do is killing what was the good knee. Probably be the first time ever I’ll have to have an aspiration on the left as well as the right. Took 32ml off the right one last time.

Gonna pick the last 45 acres tomorrow, then like clock work after it got cold and had some real snow the phone started ringing and the boilers I have coming in next week are mostly sold already.


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