# Hay guard perservative



## dscottmartin

The advertised hay guard on this site.
Does anyone here have any experience with it?
They claim on rate of 2lbs/ton up to 25% moisture.


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## expensive hobby

im goin to try it this year thought 2 lbs wasnt much but sales guy says its been around for many years and it is what it is,quoted 12 cents abale so im going to be liberal on app. like always gotta find out hard way


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## smyers

used it last year on 3-3 squares and was very happy will use it this year again


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## white gables farm

does it kep hay green and does it tend to heat and discolor hay


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## chief-fan

Is that a liquid base or granular product? Since it is lb./ton I would say it is granular. I am going to use granular for the first time this year. Going with Slia-Prime, a micorb base product. 3 lb per ton up to 20%. Don't plan to bale anything over 20% moisture Cost is about the same at $.10 bale for small squares applied at 3 lb/ton. Good luck with your product.


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## GeneRector

Howdy! I have heard of this being used; however, how is it applied and with what equipment? Thanks! Always, Gene


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## jfleace

Hay Guard is a liquid product. Dohrmann Enterprises makes a nice applicator that you can use to apply it. Dohrmann Enterprises, Inc.


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## white gables farm

doe sthe hat heat after and discolor? does the hay stay greener.


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## jfleace

Testing has shown that the hay stays up to 22 degrees cooler after baling and stays green.


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## mlappin

Several questions here.

I have the automatic applicator from harvest tec and have always used propionic acid. So far if enough is applied I've always had good results. However even buffered it is still somewhat corrosive and to be perfectly honest, it stinks.

I know from previous discussions on this site that the propionic works like a fumigant and that having it cover all the hay in the bale is not as critical. I bale some rather large rows at times, the front axle on my baling tractor is always nice and shiny as a matter of fact. Would I have to slow down to get better coverage with the hayguard? If I'm baling that tough of hay to need to treat it, then that usually means the weather has not been co-operative and its gonna get worse, so going slower is not a option.

I've seen a rate of 2lbs per ton is recommended up to 25% moisture with the hayguard and I take it that it will not work with anything over 25%?

Whats the cost of Hayguard versus propionic?

Is Hayguard stable in freezing temps or do I need to use it all up before winter hits?

Has anybody on this site used both and ended up preferring one over the other?


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## ISF

I'll try to answer a few questions here regarding Hay Guard. It has no odor like the propionic acid products. Works great for all types of hay. It is a liquid product and can be applied through any applicator including the Harvest Tec systems. We just need to flush the system and make some minor adjustments to the monitor of the Harvest Tech applicator.

The new, improved Hay Guard formulation is based on a product that has been used for hay production for over 10 years called Silo Guard. I have attached a couple of testimonials from folks that have used that product. Hay Guard has an improved formula to reduce tip plugging, and is designed specifically for dry hay production. It's a true HAY product.

This product will freeze, so it should be drained and stored above 32 degrees in the winter. Applicator manufacturers recommend running RV antifreeze through the system to protect the pumps in freezing weather. The shelf life on this product is 3 years in a sealed container.

One unique characteristic of Hay Guard is that it actually turns into a gas and searches for oxygen. It then "eats" up the oxygen in the bales. This stops mold and yeast activity so the bales will stay cooler and you'll see less browning. We typically see softer, greener hay as suggested by the testimonials that I've attached.

I hope this answered most of the questions. If not, drop me an email at [email protected] and I'd be glad to answer any specific questions you might have.

If you need an inexpensive applicator, check out this link: Dohrmann Enterprises, Inc.


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## mlappin

Two things ISF, Haygueard is still good for 25% and below correct? Does the system have to be reflushed before propionic can be used?

Originally I was thinking of using the hayguard for most of the hay unless I knew I was going to have anything over 25%, then I was going to drain the hayguard and use acid.

How long does it actually take to go from propionic to Hayguard and back again far as setup and flushing?


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## ISF

Our label states up to 25% moisture. Yes the system would need to be flushed to go back to prop. The flushing process takes about an hour.


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## slick

I've been feeding two horses since june 2010 with timothy treated with hay gaurd, and thier hooves are growing out wierd. It's like they are missing the high gloss outer enamal coating. ?????? I'm not going to use this hay next year. (If it's been treated)

I am adding to slick's post as a moderator.....this is slick's one and only post and has not been back to haytalk since making this ridiculous statement. I am leaving this post "unhidden" so that the following responses can be better understood by seeing/reading this beforehand.

Mike, haytalk moderator.


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## expensive hobby

good one slick


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## rjmoses

Slick:

Horses' hooves grow about 1/8th-1/4 inch per month, depending on the time of year, more during the summer, less in the winter. This means that your horses hooves would have grown approximately 1/2 to at best 1 1/4 inches since June. Since they grow from the top down (the coronet band) and that part is normally "unpolished", I would suspect something else.

Often, that polished comes from your farrier rasping the hoof wall, or from the horse moving through a tall, course grass that buffs the hoof wall. Have you changed farriers or pastures? Have you changed other elements in their diet over the last 18 months?

Ralph


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## mlappin

Forgive my ignorance here as we've never had a problem with it here, but couldn't endophyte infected fescue cause the problems with the hoofs? It's probably something else, but as I've never dealt with it, for some reason the endophyte thing came to mind.


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## rjmoses

There appears to be a lot of opinions about endophyte-infected fescue, and I am going to add my own thoughts to the confusion:

It's my understanding that endophyte infected fescue primarily affects a mare in her last 90 days of pregnancy. It can reportedly increase the risk of laminitis. The fungus lives mostly in the seed head, so early cuttings for hay have the highest risk. A 2nd/3rd cutting would appear to have lower risk.

Further, planting endophyte-free fescue usually only lasts 1-2 years. If there is infected fescue nearby, the fungus will travel and infect the new field. Some reports are that it travels only by infected seeds, while others I have read seem to indicate that it can be spread by airborne.

Check these links:

http://www.uky.edu/Ag/AnimalSciences/pubs/id144.pdf
Cornell University Department of Animal Science
Pasture Seed|Tall Fescue Grass Seed For Pasture - Endophyte Friendly Tall Fescue Pasture Grass|Fescue.com
BayerEquineConnection.com - Feeding: Fescue in the Horse's Diet

Ralph


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## haystax

Used some Silo-Guard on some orchard mix a couple weeks ago just to get it out of the field, application was with a electric pump and sprayer nozzles through a 1390 Freeman inline 3-string baler. Fed to weaned calves one week after baling. Hay was starting to mold but was mostly going to "tobacco". Moisture was below 25%, hay had been rained on but then tedded and still had a little "green" in some places. Overall, we weren't too impressed with the Silo Guard.

Ran out of SG so drained some Cropsaver from the Harvestec on the big baler, used it to finish up and there is no mold and little discoloration to the hay baled with the Cropsaver. It was around the same moisture level, and basically the same conditions. It is storing well and the stacks aren't trying to melt like the other hay so we haven't fed it yet.

On alfalfa through the Hesston 4790 with Cropsaver and the automatic Harvest Tec system we have had great results with baling hay above normal moisture levels in order to beat a storm or clean up rained on hay and get it out of the field. We normally do not rely on the product but use it as insurance. So far it has fed great to our cows and our dairy customer has had no complaints.


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## JoshA

We purchased a Gazeeka moisture meter and preservative system this year through Greg (the person posting earlier in the thread under "ISF") for use on my big square baler (Hesston 7434 3x4 baler). I used it all year, and ran Hay-Guard / Silo-Guard on nearly all my dry hay. Honestly? I love it.

The hay will still heat, NOTHING will prevent that from happening. The difference is that Silo-Guard/Hay-Guard will keep it from getting AS HOT and for as LONG. Check the bales or feed it out right away, yes it will have heat.

I am not claiming the preservative will work for all people. But from my experience, the only reason it wont work is because you dont know the true moisture of the bale. ISF sells a moisture meter which I use on my baler, and ISF recommends Hay-Guard to 22%, with the ability to push it to 25%. Hay testing 25% with a moisture probe or a Harvesttech system will heat. It is simply not accurate enough.

We had a very positive experience with Greg @ ISF and Silo-Guard thus far, I will give a full report on my experiences with the product as we get further into the winter as we feed out more of our hay stacks.

-Josh


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## Aurora_Ranch

What is the cost of they Hay Guard vs. CropSaver or Thirty Plus for 50 & 275 gallon container. I am building a applicator right now after losing about 1,000 small squares to mold. Moisture was a little high but the hay smells good just very dusty like smoke when you shake flakes out. This will not happen again, I can't stand losing hay.


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## hay wilson in TX

dscottmartin, 
I can sympothise with you. Here not far from Temple 25 years ago I installed a applicator on my baler. Used it for 5 years and was reasonably satisfied with it.
The best and least costly was one of the buffered acid products. Any of them. 
Key to the use is an on the go moisture tester. If the pickup for the tester is on the knife side than 25% moisture is reasonable. 
My on the go moisture tester pickup is on the side oppisite the knives and 22% moisture is more realistic.

Will the hay color on you? Yes, but not always.

When I learned the significants of the humidity, down next to the hay, I was able to stop using the preservitive.

With fully cured hay I can start baling when the humidity is 70% and the hay will bale between 18% & 20% moisture. The moisture will humt up to 22% with a wet slug but that has not been a bother.

When the air next to the hay is at 65% humidity the hay will bale at 16% moisture to 18% moisture and safe for just about any baling.

Usually somewhere between 50% & 55% humidity the hay will start to shatter and you will loose both quality and yield.

In the FarmTek catalog is a nice meter that will give you the humidity, down next to the windrow.

To speed drying lay the hay out behind the mower as wide as possible, and finish by 2 or 3 PM so you will have plenty of time for the hay to cure down below 48% moisture by sunset. 
Leave the hay out flat all of the second day. Rake the hay with the first light the morning of the third day. Plan to bale the hay the morning of the fourth day. For Central Texas Conditions.

A key to avoid mold for us is to bale when the humidity is no higher than 70%.
Only cut as much hay as you can bale between being too damp and too dry. Here that is 2 maybe 3 hours.

Do not worry about the pretty green color. The animals can not see green, but they do slect by smell, and taste. The person buying does not taste the hay nor smell the hay but he can see green colors.

In a hay judging contest color is never considered.

There is an East Texas Farm & Ranch Club that you might be interested in. Check with Jim Guthrie at [email protected]


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## Aurora_Ranch

Sorry I am just getting back on the forum, the Hay Guard product is great in my opinion. We got ahold of Greg with ISF and he sent us out 3 5 gallon containers right at the end of our hay season to try out. After sizing the sprayer tips and getting everything mounted it worked great and application was simple. Just to see how well it did I left 22 square bales out in the pasture through the winter, rain snow warm and cold and when I went back I was suprised to say the least. The bales where not molded however the did bleach from setting out and when I rolled them over I expected to see black nasty hay but it was still somewhat green and no mold or fungus.

Needless to say, I will be using the Hay Guard product on every bale we run through the baler. Big thanks to Greg also for sending out the sample so we could do a hands on test and verify the results. We are in contact now with a distributor of the product and about to purchase for this hay season. If you are in the Texas, Oaklahoma, Louisiana or Arkansas area I can give you the distributor contact info below.

Hay Guard Distributor Contact
Rod
Cell# 918-542-7688


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## DSLinc1017

What applicator do y'all recommend for a small square baler (NH 565). I've gotten quotes from Dohrmann and harvest tec. The harvest tec's are twice s much for their recommendation, the electronic version. Is there really that much difference? Does the harvest tec regulate the flow much better, saving product? No offense to ISF! Sorry if this is a bit off the thread.


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## Aurora_Ranch

I would go with Dohrmann, they are very knowledgeable and very friendly and helpful. Dohrmann set me up with the filter, pump and spray tips for the Hay Guard chemical and it was easy and simple. No electronics to break. I looked at the Harvest Tec unit also but a little to pricey. I like my equipment as low tech as possible that way trouble shooting is simple if needed. It took me all of maybe 20 minutes to set mine up on my NH Baler. I pretty much set it and forget it due to the simple application rate of the Hay Guard.


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## DSLinc1017

Thanks much Aurora, this helps.

Hay on!


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## Tomas982

I recently bought a New Holland 630 baler with a Dohrmann applicator on. Does anyone know how the control unit is supposed to work? It has an on/off switch and a knob with the numbers 0-10 on it. It doesn't matter where I turn the knob, it makes no difference on the pump. I tried Dohrmanns' website, but did not find an answer. Thanks for any help.


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## DSLinc1017

Tomas982 said:


> I recently bought a New Holland 630 baler with a Dohrmann applicator on. Does anyone know how the control unit is supposed to work? It has an on/off switch and a knob with the numbers 0-10 on it. It doesn't matter where I turn the knob, it makes no difference on the pump. I tried Dohrmanns' website, but did not find an answer. Thanks for any help.


I found the best way to get answers about Dohrmann products is to give them a call, they are very receptive to end users. They quickly answered all my questions and even gave me a list of dealers in my area to purchase from. Or you can purchase direct.


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## Tomas982

OK, thanks, I'll give that a try, dealer not real helpful so far, they say they don't know how they work either.


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## DSLinc1017

I spoke to one dealer who told me to go toTractor supply and build one from scratch.


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## mlappin

DSLinc1017 said:


> What applicator do y'all recommend for a small square baler (NH 565). I've gotten quotes from Dohrmann and harvest tec. The harvest tec's are twice s much for their recommendation, the electronic version. Is there really that much difference? Does the harvest tec regulate the flow much better, saving product? No offense to ISF! Sorry if this is a bit off the thread.


My two cents here, I absolutely love my automatic Harvest Tec unit and won't bale hay without it. But I have have a round baler and the sensor pads are mounted directly above the bottom roller so it can react quicker to changing moistures in the hay. I just looked it up on their site and I see their still using the star wheels for square balers.

The few I've seen the wheels are mounted farther back on the bale chamber so you could possibly get half a bale made or more before the wet hay reaches the sensor and the rate is increased. Now if it was possible to mount the start wheels as close as possible to the end of the plunger stroke so the reaction time is much quicker then this would work much better.

Far as Hayguard versus propionic versus silo king etc. All of these products do work, but only if you apply enough and know the true moisture of the hay. Just guessing at the moisture or weight might and most likely will lead to disappointing results. I've went as far as to install a scale kit on my round baler so the exact weight is known at all times, also is very handy for tracking actual yield of a field so proper fertilizer applications can be made.


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## DSLinc1017

Thanks Mlappin,
I still haven't decided on an applicator, as the applicator seems to depend on what type of product your using. That's right, still on the fence on product! Hay guard seems to be less complicated as far as amount of moisture. Where proponic seems to heavily depend on moisture content. That would bring back around on what applicator! 
Regardless, I'm bailing tomorrow, old fashion, no product!! With that said, I'm being chased by rain, so... Here I am again, wishing I wasn't ansuring this tread.


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