# What pickup truck to buy



## FarmerCline

Need some opinions on what pickup truck to buy. It's not for me but is for my dad. He currently had a Toyota Tundra which was stolen off the carport last week by a bunch of druggies and was totaled. For vehicles he is a Toyota person but he looked at the new Tundras and wasn't thrilled with some changes they made so he is open to looking at other options now. I have been after him for a while that the next truck he buys should be a little bigger so he could actually pull a trailer and help me haul hay.

A couple things I should mention.....he absolutely will not buy a used vehicle so we are talking new.....but not one of these loaded up $70,000 trucks. Also getting him to buy a GMC/Chevrolet isn't going to happen so we talking either Ford or Dodge.

I was thinking along the lines of a single rear wheel 1 ton truck but he is leaning more towards a 3/4 ton. I was thinking the only difference is heavier leaf springs in the 1 ton and the rest of the truck is the same? If that is the case I dont see a down side to buying the 1 ton? For myself if I was buying I would get a dual rear wheel 1 ton cab and chassis but he doesn't need something like that and needs to stick with a single rear wheel.

Any thoughts between the Ford vs Dodge? Neither him or I are brand loyal to either so we don't prefer one over the other. I'm not interested in a brand war. I just wanted to see if there were any actual advantages to one over the other. Regardless of which brand it will be a diesel.....I'm not going to let him buy another gas burner if he is stepping up to a bigger truck.

Hayden


----------



## paoutdoorsman

If you're open to any brand, I would go test drive the Ford, Dodge, and Chevy/GMC as much as you can. The truck market is changing quickly, and most of us probably cannot attest to any real usage of the 2018 models. He'll likely find one that he prefers driving after spending some seat time in each. Sounds like a fun search. Good luck! Pics once he decides!


----------



## FarmerCline

paoutdoorsman said:


> If you're open to any brand, I would go test drive the Ford, Dodge, and Chevy/GMC as much as you can. The truck market is changing quickly, and most of us probably cannot attest to any real usage of the 2018 models. He'll likely find one that he prefers driving after spending some seat time in each. Sounds like a fun search. Good luck! Pics once he decides!


 He is open to either a Dodge or Ford. Will not consider a GMC/Chevrolet.....grandad is a die hard GM person and honestly over the years has had a lot of vehicles with drivetrain/mechanical problems (cars not trucks) so that pretty much rules out a GM product for my dad. And yes I did explain to him that neither the diesel motor or the transmission in a truck was made by GM but it's still not going to happen. We are going to look at trucks on the lot later this week. Just thought I would see if anyone had any input on here first. Especially on the 1 ton vs 3/4 ton.


----------



## CowboyRam

That Duramax Allison transmission is one hell of a combination. Dad has a 2006 GMC with 250,000 miles. It has been the best truck he has ever owned, but it is time to replace it. To many miles.


----------



## Teslan

I’m enjoying my Nissan Titan I bought in September. I too wasn’t blown away by the Tundra, which is why I am not driving one now. I didn’t try a GM as I’m kinda done with them based on my dads recent experiences. The Ford was very nice but seats bother my back. It’s a thing with me. Otherwise I might be driving one also. The Ram was ver comfortable. But I didn’t trust the dealership if I would have problems. The 100k five year warranty offered on the Titan tipped the scales. It gets better mileage then my Tacoma did. The Titan XD with a diesel Cummins might impress your dad.


----------



## FarmerCline

CowboyRam said:


> That Duramax Allison transmission is one hell of a combination. Dad has a 2006 GMC with 250,000 miles. It has been the best truck he has ever owned, but it is time to replace it. To many miles.


 I'm not knocking the Duramax and Allison.....although I do wonder about the other components after some of the quality problems my Grandparents have had with their GM vehicles but maybe the trucks are different. Kind of the same concern though with the Dodge as well.....can't beat the Cummins but I do wonder about the rest. Regardless he won't have a GM vehicle if for no other reason that my grandad is always telling him to buy a GM.


----------



## FarmerCline

Teslan said:


> I'm enjoying my Nissan Titan I bought in September. I too wasn't blown away by the Tundra, which is why I am not driving one now. I didn't try a GM as I'm kinda done with them based on my dads recent experiences. The Ford was very nice but seats bother my back. It's a thing with me. Otherwise I might be driving one also. The Ram was ver comfortable. But I didn't trust the dealership if I would have problems. The 100k five year warranty offered on the Titan tipped the scales. It gets better mileage then my Tacoma did. The Titan XD with a diesel Cummins might impress your dad.


 I mentioned to him about Nissan having a diesel truck and he was open to looking at it. From what I saw online though they called it a 5/8 ton so it not quite a 3/4 ton and I was really hoping he would consider a 1 ton. If he decides he wants to stay with a smaller truck the Nissan could be an option. I'm kind of partial to a Cummins engine so I liked that fact. It looks like it is not a 6.7 though like is the the Dodge......what I saw online said it was a v8 Cummins? What kind of fuel mileage do you get?


----------



## Teslan

FarmerCline said:


> I mentioned to him about Nissan having a diesel truck and he was open to looking at it. From what I saw online though they called it a 5/8 ton so it not quite a 3/4 ton and I was really hoping he would consider a 1 ton. If he decides he wants to stay with a smaller truck the Nissan could be an option. I'm kind of partial to a Cummins engine so I liked that fact. It looks like it is not a 6.7 though like is the the Dodge......what I saw online said it was a v8 Cummins? What kind of fuel mileage do you get?


I don't have the diesel. I didn't need one that powerful. I have just a gas V-8. It is averaging about 17 mpg. The XD is supposed to be between a 1/2 ton and 3/4 ton.


----------



## 8350HiTech

If he's only doing occasional towing, I don't think I'd be so quick to rule out a gas.


----------



## FarmerCline

8350HiTech said:


> If he's only doing occasional towing, I don't think I'd be so quick to rule out a gas.


 The only towing he would do is if he would haul hay for me. He uses a truck mostly to haul stuff in the bed for his buisness. I pretty much sold him on a diesel though. It would get just as good and probably better fuel mileage than his Tundra did. After having a couple gas burning trucks myself I'm not a fan. My current daily driver burns just as much fuel as a diesel ton truck would.


----------



## vhaby

If your dad wants to step up to a larger truck, have him consider the Dodge RAM 1500 EcoDiesel. It has a Fiat diesel engine coupled with an 8-speed transmission. This diesel engine is almost as quiet running as any gas engine and the acceleration can launch you onto any Interstate highway without worrying about getting run over. Towing capacity is around 9,000 lb. Fuel economy on town trips is in the range of 23-24 mpg, and on the highway it is rated at 28 mpg depending on the speed and whether the driver has a lead foot. I have gotten up to 32.5 mpg with ours on a farm to market road while trying to hold the speed at 60 mph. The suspension is light, but can easily haul 3/4 ton. I have hauled a ton of feed, but it sets the back end down. Very comfortable and quiet ride. I don't work for Dodge, but certainly enjoy this pickup.


----------



## 8350HiTech

FarmerCline said:


> The only towing he would do is if he would haul hay for me. He uses a truck mostly to haul stuff in the bed for his buisness. I pretty much sold him on a diesel though. It would get just as good and probably better fuel mileage than his Tundra did. After having a couple gas burning trucks myself I'm not a fan. My current daily driver burns just as much fuel as a diesel ton truck would.


*burns the same fuel at less buy in cost.


----------



## FarmerCline

vhaby said:


> If your dad wants to step up to a larger truck, have him consider the Dodge RAM 1500 EcoDiesel. It has a Fiat diesel engine coupled with an 8-speed transmission. This diesel engine is almost as quiet running as any gas engine and the acceleration can launch you onto any Interstate highway without worrying about getting run over. Towing capacity is around 9,000 lb. Fuel economy on town trips is in the range of 23-24 mpg, and on the highway it is rated at 28 mpg depending on the speed and whether the driver has a lead foot. I have gotten up to 32.5 mpg with ours on a farm to market road while trying to hold the speed at 60 mph. The suspension is light, but can easily haul 3/4 ton. I have hauled a ton of feed, but it sets the back end down. Very comfortable and quiet ride. I don't work for Dodge, but certainly enjoy this pickup.


 If he decides he wants to stick with a 1/2 ton truck I will tell him to consider it. Those sure are some impressive fuel mileage numbers. I think Ford might also make a small diesel for the F150.


----------



## FarmerCline

8350HiTech said:


> *burns the same fuel at less buy in cost.


 But a 1 ton diesel is much more capable than a 1/2 ton gas burner burning the same amount of fuel. Wasnt really looking to debate gas vs diesel. To each his own but personally I wouldn't have a gas burner for doing anything but running around town in.


----------



## endrow

If I needed a 1-ton truck that's what I would buy because there's no way anything less would do. But if I did a lot of driving each day and a half ton truck would be enough capacity I would much rather drive a half ton truck they always seem to ride a little bit better and drive a little nicer. Everyone's needs are different


----------



## Teslan

FarmerCline said:


> But a 1 ton diesel is much more capable than a 1/2 ton gas burner burning the same amount of fuel. Wasnt really looking to debate gas vs diesel. To each his own but personally I wouldn't have a gas burner for doing anything but running around town in.


Not to stoke the fires of the diesel/gas debate that you didn't want to have. I have a customer that last year bought a Gas 2500 Ram. The Powerwagon. Previously he had an older diesel Ram 2500. I would guess about a 2004. He climbs serious grades to get to his house in the mountains. He doesn't haul huge loads because of it. He says the gas 2500 get's better mpg then his older 2500 diesel and pulls up the hill better. Plus you don't have the expensive maintenance things to do with gas that you have with a new diesel pickup. One thing your dad isn't going to like if he cares about it much is how fast every other truck declines in value next to his Tundra. Tundras are the best with holding their value of a full sized pickup. I did the research earlier this year looking at new/used values. You can't find a used Tundra in this area with low miles much more then $2k less then just buying new. Many times they are asking more then a new one, which I don't get. I'm hoping my Nissan does ok, but the last generation didn't do to well. If he cares about seat comfort like I do here is my list in the 1/2 ton range (that shouldn't really be different in any other range). 1. Ram. 2. Nissan. 3 Toyota 4. Chevy (I'm assuming as they have never bothered me) 5. Ford (But I'm weird and in the minority). But now that I've driven nearly 5k miles I will say my Nissan seat is amazing. I usually get back aches in anything after an hour or two. Not so with the Nissan. I guess that's what you get when you have NASA design your seat. As for reliability. After talking to some oil and gas people (they treat their trucks terrible). GM is the preferred followed by Ram then Ford. Oil and Gas companies don't usually buy Toyota or Nissan in their fleet sales. I'll let you know in about 50k miles about Nissan.

I prefer a half ton as I don't deliver hay or haul much. About a month ago I sold our C6500 Topkick as I only delivered hay once a year at most. The rest of the time the truck sat unless buying seeds or something. Replaced that truck with a 16 foot car trailer and if I had to I'm sure the Titan could pull it and 8 bales of 3x3 bales easily. I sell a to a lot of customers pulling 8 bales with much less truck then the Titan.


----------



## FarmerCline

endrow said:


> If I needed a 1-ton truck that's what I would buy because there's no way anything less would do. But if I did a lot of driving each day and a half ton truck would be enough capacity I would much rather drive a half ton truck they always seem to ride a little bit better and drive a little nicer. Everyone's needs are different


 For what he does he doesn't need a 1 ton truck. I'm the one that needs the 1 ton truck.....I just mentioned to him that since he wasn't thrilled with the new Tundras that it might be worth just looking at a heavier truck and he could then help me haul hay. I'm just about the point to where next year I'm going to have to hire someone to help as I can't get it done myself. My point was for similar money he could buy a bigger truck that would get just as good or better fuel mileage as his current truck and be able to do a lot more with it.

We are going to look at trucks and umtimatley it is going to be his decision if he likes them and wants to go bigger not. If he decides he wants to stay with a 1/2 ton that is fine and it's his decision. He did admit that while not very often he does overload his 1/2 ton Tundra when getting stuff for the business so something like a 3/4 ton wouldn't be a bad idea. Then my point was that I thought the only difference in a 3/4 and 1 ton was more leaf springs and the actual truck was no bigger? The price difference is only about 1k so I was thinking for that you might as well buy a 1 ton.


----------



## FarmerCline

Teslan said:


> Not to stoke the fires of the diesel/gas debate that you didn't want to have. I have a customer that last year bought a Gas 2500 Ram. The Powerwagon. Previously he had an older diesel Ram 2500. I would guess about a 2004. He climbs serious grades to get to his house in the mountains. He doesn't haul huge loads because of it. He says the gas 2500 get's better mpg then his older 2500 diesel and pulls up the hill better. Plus you don't have the expensive maintenance things to do with gas that you have with a new diesel pickup. One thing your dad isn't going to like if he cares about it much is how fast every other truck declines in value next to his Tundra. Tundras are the best with holding their value of a full sized pickup. I did the research earlier this year looking at new/used values. You can't find a used Tundra in this area with low miles much more then $2k less then just buying new. Many times they are asking more then a new one, which I don't get. I'm hoping my Nissan does ok, but the last generation didn't do to well. If he cares about seat comfort like I do here is my list in the 1/2 ton range (that shouldn't really be different in any other range). 1. Ram. 2. Nissan. 3 Toyota 4. Chevy (I'm assuming as they have never bothered me) 5. Ford (But I'm weird and in the minority). But now that I've driven nearly 5k miles I will say my Nissan seat is amazing. I usually get back aches in anything after an hour or two. Not so with the Nissan. I guess that's what you get when you have NASA design your seat. As for reliability. After talking to some oil and gas people (they treat their trucks terrible). GM is the preferred followed by Ram then Ford. Oil and Gas companies don't usually buy Toyota or Nissan in their fleet sales. I'll let you know in about 50k miles about Nissan.
> 
> I prefer a half ton as I don't deliver hay or haul much. About a month ago I sold our C6500 Topkick as I only delivered hay once a year at most. The rest of the time the truck sat unless buying seeds or something. Replaced that truck with a 16 foot car trailer and if I had to I'm sure the Titan could pull it and 8 bales of 3x3 bales easily. I sell a to a lot of customers pulling 8 bales with much less truck then the Titan.


 Resale is not important to him as he usually keeps a vehicle until it's not worth having or gets stolen is this case. So in this case it is very important that he likes what he buys and longevity is very important. His Tundra had nearly 300,000 miles and he never did anything to it other that routine maintenance. Im not a Toyota guy but it is hard to argue with that kind reliability and that is why he was set on another Tundra if he would have liked the changes. The down side is that Tundra got terrible fuel mileage. I joked that it took two people to drive it......one to steer and one to keep gas in the tank. I do think the new one have improved that.

I don't want it to sound like I'm trying to get him to buy a truck that he doesn't want or need.....I'm just trying to get him to look at the other options to see if he likes them but at the end of the day it is his choice and not mine. My whole point is that both of us drive vehicles that get the same or worse fuel mileage that a diesel 1 ton but are no where near as capable so why not have a diesel 1 ton then? I would love to but I can't afford to upgrade to anything else right now.....my daily driver only cost $2,500 so I make do with the terrible mileage.


----------



## Teslan

Well December is a good time for deals on the 2017s if he isn't looking for special features or colors. I should have waited until now as the incentives are higher then they were in Sept.


----------



## BWfarms

He's going to get tax shock, I'll guarantee you that. I always buy new vehicles in November and December.

Have a Ram 6.7 Cummins and that's the big reason I have a Ram. Now here's a beautiful tidbit with the HD Rams, a 3/4 is pretty much the same as the 1 ton when configured with SRW. Check out Ilderton in High Point, ended up there because they will sell you one at a good price especially if they have a few extra year end models. Gas Ram, I'll turn my back on it and buy a GM. Checked out Ford but bang for buck was with the Ram.


----------



## Lewis Ranch

Ford is the only way to go between the dodge and ford in today's diesel trucks. Dodge has never solved the issues with their front ends in the pickup trucks.


----------



## CowboyRam

Lewis Ranch said:


> Ford is the only way to go between the dodge and ford in today's diesel trucks. Dodge has never solved the issues with their front ends in the pickup trucks.


My uncle has owned several Dodge's and had problems with the front ends on everyone he had owned, but he always bought Dodge; mainly because they are cheaper. Last year he bought another new Dodge, but this time he bought a gasser this time. He has not been very happy with that truck.


----------



## FarmerCline

BWfarms said:


> He's going to get tax shock, I'll guarantee you that. I always buy new vehicles in November and December.
> Have a Ram 6.7 Cummins and that's the big reason I have a Ram. Now here's a beautiful tidbit with the HD Rams, a 3/4 is pretty much the same as the 1 ton when configured with SRW. Check out Ilderton in High Point, ended up there because they will sell you one at a good price especially if they have a few extra year end models. Gas Ram, I'll turn my back on it and buy a GM. Checked out Ford but bang for buck was with the Ram.


 Yeah, he already had a sticker shock on the new Tundra he looked at.....approaching 50k. That's when I told him if he was going to spend that kind of money he could get a 1 ton diesel for that and get more bang for his buck and have a job hauling hay for me next summer. Personally I would be buying slightly used and let someone take the depreciation but he wants new. As bad as I need a truck I cant afford even a used one right now. It's amazing how well diesel trucks hold their value.


----------



## FarmerCline

What is everyone's thoughts on the aluminum body on the new Fords? Good, bad, or not a big deal? I just found out they were aluminum as I don't really keep up with new trucks since they are out of my price range.


----------



## skyrydr2

I just came from a Tundra and went to a Chevrolet. I will never ever buy another Toyota truck again! The gm truck gets twice the mileage and tows way WAY better than the Toymotor did!
My buddy has a brand new aluminium Ford and already cracked the pickup bed floor from tossing in some fire wood. But it tows really good.
Next door nieghbor had a dodge 3/4 ton midnight edition, 6.4 hemi..2 mile to the gallon monster.. it had more miles pn the back of a tow truck than on its own! I told him he should have gotten a diesel!
Dodge still has front end issues for sure and transmission issues behind the diesels on the 25-3500 series the 4500 and bigger have allisons.
Too bad he won't consider GM they make a really nice truck now and that Duramax/Allison combo is just plain killer! Good on fuel and can really tow!


----------



## Teslan

FarmerCline said:


> Yeah, he already had a sticker shock on the new Tundra he looked at.....approaching 50k. That's when I told him if he was going to spend that kind of money he could get a 1 ton diesel for that and get more bang for his buck and have a job hauling hay for me next summer. Personally I would be buying slightly used and let someone take the depreciation but he wants new. As bad as I need a truck I cant afford even a used one right now. It's amazing how well diesel trucks hold their value.


. Was he looking at a Tundra Limited for $50k or just looking at the sticker? To avoid such sticker shock when going to the dealer you should visit the dealers website before hand. Look at the new inventory. Most dealers will show "their" sales price. Which should be considerably lower then sticker. I found most 1/2s with similar options ended up around $40k down from a sticker price of around $50k. Except GM trucks. They seemed to be about $5000 higher then anyone else. That's on the GM dealer websites. That is what they do around here anyways. I didnt really pay attention to what dealers were doing with the larger trucks.


----------



## FarmerCline

Teslan said:


> . Was he looking at a Tundra Limited for $50k or just looking at the sticker? To avoid such sticker shock when going to the dealer you should visit the dealers website before hand. Look at the new inventory. Most dealers will show "their" sales price. Which should be considerably lower then sticker. I found most 1/2s with similar options ended up around $40k down from a sticker price of around $50k. Except GM trucks. They seemed to be about $5000 higher then anyone else. That's on the GM dealer websites. That is what they do around here anyways. I didnt really pay attention to what dealers were doing with the larger trucks.


 He is not much of an online website person.....hence the reason I'm doing most of the research for him. The dealer price without any negotiating was I think around 46-47k. I don't think it was a limited since it had cloth seats and not leather.....he just said it was equipped middle of the road. The reason he decided against another Tundra was to get the 6.5' bed like he currently has the back seat was smaller.....more like a cab and a half. To get the full cab like he has now it would mean a smaller 5' bed and he didn't want to compromise what he already had.


----------



## Teslan

FarmerCline said:


> He is not much of an online website person.....hence the reason I'm doing most of the research for him. The dealer price without any negotiating was I think around 46-47k. I don't think it was a limited since it had cloth seats and not leather.....he just said it was equipped middle of the road. The reason he decided against another Tundra was to get the 6.5' bed like he currently has the back seat was smaller.....more like a cab and a half. To get the full cab like he has now it would mean a smaller 5' bed and he didn't want to compromise what he already had.


They would go down to 41k or maybe less for what he saw. It's typical for all the 1/2 tons. I suppose if he starts dealing he will be surprised with how fast and how much they lower the price. Since he won't be looking at them online and just walking on the lot. Tell him not to be. It's just how it is. But where Toyota is 46k 47k they will knock it down to $41k or so. Ford, Ram, Nissan will MSRP them for $48k or $49k. In fact my sticker for my Nissan was $49k and I got it for around $40k without really fighting for it. They offered me considerably more for my Tacoma trade then I had ever imagined so that deflated my price fighting/arguing plans. So possibIy they came off the price of the new one for the trade. think you will find if he decides he really only wants a half ton that most of the trucks that are on the lots with crew cabs have the short bed. 5 1/2 feet. At least that's how it was when I was looking. I know Nissan has a longer bed with a crew cab as I walked by them. I'm think Ram also does. They probably all do, but far more common is the smaller bed. So he might be happier with a 3/4 ton or 1 ton. I'm assuming the dealers do somewhat the same with the bigger trucks, but maybe not since they don't usually have as many on the lot that they need to move as fast. I was looking online this morning at the local Ford Dealer and anything like an F350 with the "dealer" price was about $55k. And most of their models were the extra fancy Lariat or King Ranch pushing $70k. I think they just had one in inventory for under $60k. I wish your dad good luck and hopefully you will have help hauling hay.


----------



## FarmerCline

Well we went today to look at trucks. Stopped at the Ford dealer first but they didn't have what he was looking for......either long beds or duallys and most were loaded up 70k dollar trucks. He only wants a 6.5' bed and not a 8'. We went by Dodge and test drove both a 2500 and 3500 similar to what he would want. He decided for sure that he might as well get a 3500 since it only cost an additional 1k more......that was kind of my feeling all along. He actually really liked the truck.....said he really liked the diesel and that it rode every bit as good as his Tundra. I have to say I was impressed with how smooth it rode as well. I actually think he would have bought one on the spot if I had not have insisted that he wait until he drives a Ford first.

I located a Ford online this evening about an hour away that is pretty close to what he would want so we are going to look and drive it in the morning. Personally I'm leaning pretty heavily towards a Ford.....I sure hope it handles and rides as nice as the Dodge or he might not go like it. Price is very comparable between the two which was a surprise......comparing pretty equally equipped trucks the Ford is only about 1k higher.


----------



## somedevildawg

You may not remember the old advertising slogan but it fits....."have you driven a Ford lately" it would be a shame to not check out the Fords. Tell him they'll be here in the long run, not so sure about some of the others....


----------



## Teslan

FarmerCline said:


> Well we went today to look at trucks. Stopped at the Ford dealer first but they didn't have what he was looking for......either long beds or duallys and most were loaded up 70k dollar trucks. He only wants a 6.5' bed and not a 8'. We went by Dodge and test drove both a 2500 and 3500 similar to what he would want. He decided for sure that he might as well get a 3500 since it only cost an additional 1k more......that was kind of my feeling all along. He actually really liked the truck.....said he really liked the diesel and that it rode every bit as good as his Tundra. I have to say I was impressed with how smooth it rode as well. I actually think he would have bought one on the spot if I had not have insisted that he wait until he drives a Ford first.
> I located a Ford online this evening about an hour away that is pretty close to what he would want so we are going to look and drive it in the morning. Personally I'm leaning pretty heavily towards a Ford.....I sure hope it handles and rides as nice as the Dodge or he might not go like it. Price is very comparable between the two which was a surprise......comparing pretty equally equipped trucks the Ford is only about 1k higher.


Maybe call that Ford dealer to make sure that truck is really there before driving an hour. Sometimes they sold it say today but won't take it off their website until tomorrow. Or if they are a dealer with multiple locations they will just list all their vehicles at all locations even if you think you are looking at one location.


----------



## Teslan

somedevildawg said:


> You may not remember the old advertising slogan but it fits....."have you driven a Ford lately" it would be a shame to not check out the Fords. Tell him they'll be here in the long run, not so sure about some of the others....


thats true. I kept thinking when I test drove Rams. They are owned by Fiat. since Fiat has owned NH I think their equipment is t as good. So what are they doing to Ram. Cutting corners somewhere I'm sure.


----------



## FarmerCline

Teslan said:


> Maybe call that Ford dealer to make sure that truck is really there before driving an hour. Sometimes they sold it say today but won't take it off their website until tomorrow. Or if they are a dealer with multiple locations they will just list all their vehicles at all locations even if you think you are looking at one location.


 Yep, I already did that. The salesman I talked to is holding the keys until we get there tomorrow. It is a leftover 2017 and has more options than what he really wanted to pay for but they said they had some pretty good discounts on it. They also have a new 2018 that is supposed to come in any day that is just about exactly what he wanted. But with the discounts the 2017 might end up not being that much more and would get more for the money. Biggest thing at this point is to let him drive one see if he likes it as good or better than the Dodge.


----------



## FarmerCline

Teslan said:


> thats true. I kept thinking when I test drove Rams. They are owned by Fiat. since Fiat has owned NH I think their equipment is t as good. So what are they doing to Ram. Cutting corners somewhere I'm sure.


 Yeah, I was just thinking about that today. Im not a fan of Fiat.....largely due to what NH has become. I really like a Cummins engine though and I think that is the best thing the Dodge has going for it.


----------



## skyrydr2

Fiat saved Dodge from death there is no douts! Dalmier destroyed anything good for dodge back when they took the reins.
Ram is a decent truck and can haul a good load. I think Ford is better. GM trucks in thier class are the best driving rigs, but they dont have a 4500 or 5500 class rigs anymore.
My buddy has a towing company and runs every brand of tow truck and the one with the least amount of trouble is the GMC it has a lot more power than the others doing the same job and is much better on fuel. The Dodge has had transmission issues but they seem to have that fixed with a tuner. It is not as powerful as the gm or ford and rides rough. The Ford has had emmisions issues that are disturbing because it is always the same troubles egr and def.
Only issues with gmc were from hauling to heavy a load, front end felt light... its a 3500 all the others are 4500 dodge and 550 ford..and the gmc does what they do power wise with ease just needs heavier suspension.


----------



## Tx Jim

skyrydr2 said:


> My buddy has a brand new aluminium Ford and already cracked the pickup bed floor from tossing in some fire wood. But it tows really good.
> Next door nieghbor had a dodge 3/4 ton midnight edition, 6.4 hemi..2 mile to the gallon monster.. it had more miles pn the back of a tow truck than on its own! I told him he should have gotten a diesel!


On another tractor discussion forum there's a thread about 6.4L,6 speed auto Ram 3/4 T pickup getting ""23.7 mpg"" at 68 mph. I'd like to witness that feat!


----------



## endrow

I'm not brand sensitive but I go down to New Holland Livestock Auction in a Monday morning and sometimes sit in line while I huge flow of stock trailers moves about your big trucks your 450s and your 5500 definitely do the job they're supposed to. The guys thst amaze me are the single rear wheel Chevy Duramax Diesel 2500. In that particular class no one will touch him and hauling capacity


----------



## swmnhay

Have you looked at the work trucks or commercial grade.I saved alot compared to others on the lot.Stll have air,auto,power window and locks,factory running boards and backup camera.doesnt have carpet.has vinyl seats that look like leather.


----------



## Teslan

swmnhay said:


> Have you looked at the work trucks or commercial grade.I saved alot compared to others on the lot.Stll have air,auto,power window and locks,factory running boards and backup camera.doesnt have carpet.has vinyl seats that look like leather.


Vinyl is good. My Nissan actually has some Vinyl. It does look like leather. It sure doesn't feel like the 70s and 80s vinyl either. And if it's true what an upholstery guy told me the vinyl will last longer then cloth or leather.


----------



## swmnhay

Teslan said:


> Vinyl is good. My Nissan actually has some Vinyl. It does look like leather. It sure doesn't feel like the 70s and 80s vinyl either. And if it's true what an upholstery guy told me the vinyl will last longer then cloth or leather.


had a couple guys look at it and comment.Jeeze you got leather seats,must be nice!Ummm no it's Vinyl.I did not buy it because it looked like leather,I bought it because it was cheaper!


----------



## Teslan

FarmerCline said:


> Yep, I already did that. The salesman I talked to is holding the keys until we get there tomorrow. It is a leftover 2017 and has more options than what he really wanted to pay for but they said they had some pretty good discounts on it. They also have a new 2018 that is supposed to come in any day that is just about exactly what he wanted. But with the discounts the 2017 might end up not being that much more and would get more for the money. Biggest thing at this point is to let him drive one see if he likes it as good or better than the Dodge.


I really liked the F150 with a 3.5 V-6 when I test drove it. That engine and acceleration was simply amazing to me. So much more powerful then the 4.0 V-6 in my Tacoma. Though a bunch more technology. I actually liked the on/off engine feature when you are stopped in traffic or whatever. I think the 2018s of all Ford trucks have that now. The pickup drove pretty small also. If I had bought one I would have put a rubber bed mat to protect the supposed weakness of the floor of the bed. And I wouldn't have dropped rocks in it either like the commercials show. I liked it enough despite my fears about me not liking the seats that much to ask the salesman to e-mail or call me with his best price. He said he would in about 30 minutes (to this day 2 months later he never called). Then when I got back in my Tacoma I realized how uncomfortable I had been in the Ford seats. Maybe I had just needed to do some adjusting. But no other pickup I tried did I feel I needed to do any adjusting. Except in a used Tundra that had 15k miles on it. But that was an odd test drive because I didn't like that Tundra, but had liked a brand new one with no miles 2 days before. The used Tundra was at another Ford dealer so I got a quote on a F150 from them. I was about to revisit the Fords when I decided to try Nissan. Hopefully you and your dad will really like the Fords. Don't take my dislike of their seats to seriously. It's just me. Always have had a problem with Ford seats. Millions of other people have no problem.

Previously to buying my Toyota Tacoma since I was 16 I had been a General Motors guy. Through thick and thin. First car was a 1988 Camaro and though they were known as not being very reliable mine sure was. Drove it 100k miles with very few problems. Then 3 Chevys after that. The S-10 was the worst. All kinds of problems. Then came a Silverado 1/2 ton. Headgasket leaked and an injector went out at some point. Those were all used vehicles though when I got them. Traded that for a brand new 2004 Chevy HD2500 gas. No problems with it except strangely the alternator went out after 30k miles. And had lots of rattles by the time I traded it with just 50k miles. But I got tired of it's stiff ride and in general largeness for parking lots and at the time I was taking lots of pictures of houses in town to do valuations on them for banks. It was so big for that. We had bought a Lexus SUV and it had been so reliable that I thought maybe a Tacoma would be good. Bought it and never had one problem over 110k miles. Though I suspect it was going to have problems soon. I'm not one to keep a car much over 100k miles. I like change. In the meantime my parents owned a Buick and a GMC Sierra 1500 2wd. Problems after problems with them. My dad still has the GMC and despite only having 30k miles (he doesn't drive much). It generally is expected to have something go wrong every 6 months. And my cousin has an older model Chevy Colorado that simply fell apart in nearly every aspect at 75k miles. I know I shouldn't judge GM on the older model Colorados. As well as a couple GM mechanics telling me that they have been surprised GM is even letting the recent models out of the factory with their problems. Though mechanics see the bad all the time. So that has lead to me dismissing GM products for the time being. Besides just not liking the looks of the Silverado or Sierra. Though if I won the lottery that I never play I would probably splurge on a new Camaro or a Corvette. Sorry for the rambling.


----------



## CowboyRam

Dad had a 2004 Chevy he bought new, and within the first two months the transmission when out, They replaced it with a rebuilt trany, and he then never had any more problems. The only problem with that truck was it just did not have enough power for pulling a trailer. He 2006 GMC Duramax has been a great truck that now needs to be retired; over 250,000 mile on it, it is just starting to use a little bit of oil now. Dad bought a 2013 Ford F150 with that Ecoboost engine; for a little engine it pulls pretty good. I don't think I would want to overwork it, but it does work in a pinch.


----------



## somedevildawg

Well......did you drive one of them 6.7 powerstrokes?


----------



## Teslan

somedevildawg said:


> Well......did you drive one of them 6.7 powerstrokes?


they are probably still stuck in the finance guys office trying to escape the extended warranty pitch after his dad bought one.


----------



## FarmerCline

swmnhay said:


> Have you looked at the work trucks or commercial grade.I saved alot compared to others on the lot.Stll have air,auto,power window and locks,factory running boards and backup camera.doesnt have carpet.has vinyl seats that look like leather.


 Yes I looked into the commercial trucks for him but was hard to find one like what he was wanting. Most of those had the 8' bed which I would have preferred but he only wanted the 6.5'. Also both him and I do not like vinyl seats at all.....just personal preference.....he likes cloth seats.


----------



## FarmerCline

Teslan said:


> I really liked the F150 with a 3.5 V-6 when I test drove it. That engine and acceleration was simply amazing to me. So much more powerful then the 4.0 V-6 in my Tacoma. Though a bunch more technology. I actually liked the on/off engine feature when you are stopped in traffic or whatever. I think the 2018s of all Ford trucks have that now. The pickup drove pretty small also. If I had bought one I would have put a rubber bed mat to protect the supposed weakness of the floor of the bed. And I wouldn't have dropped rocks in it either like the commercials show. I liked it enough despite my fears about me not liking the seats that much to ask the salesman to e-mail or call me with his best price. He said he would in about 30 minutes (to this day 2 months later he never called). Then when I got back in my Tacoma I realized how uncomfortable I had been in the Ford seats. Maybe I had just needed to do some adjusting. But no other pickup I tried did I feel I needed to do any adjusting. Except in a used Tundra that had 15k miles on it. But that was an odd test drive because I didn't like that Tundra, but had liked a brand new one with no miles 2 days before. The used Tundra was at another Ford dealer so I got a quote on a F150 from them. I was about to revisit the Fords when I decided to try Nissan. Hopefully you and your dad will really like the Fords. Don't take my dislike of their seats to seriously. It's just me. Always have had a problem with Ford seats. Millions of other people have no problem.
> 
> Previously to buying my Toyota Tacoma since I was 16 I had been a General Motors guy. Through thick and thin. First car was a 1988 Camaro and though they were known as not being very reliable mine sure was. Drove it 100k miles with very few problems. Then 3 Chevys after that. The S-10 was the worst. All kinds of problems. Then came a Silverado 1/2 ton. Headgasket leaked and an injector went out at some point. Those were all used vehicles though when I got them. Traded that for a brand new 2004 Chevy HD2500 gas. No problems with it except strangely the alternator went out after 30k miles. And had lots of rattles by the time I traded it with just 50k miles. But I got tired of it's stiff ride and in general largeness for parking lots and at the time I was taking lots of pictures of houses in town to do valuations on them for banks. It was so big for that. We had bought a Lexus SUV and it had been so reliable that I thought maybe a Tacoma would be good. Bought it and never had one problem over 110k miles. Though I suspect it was going to have problems soon. I'm not one to keep a car much over 100k miles. I like change. In the meantime my parents owned a Buick and a GMC Sierra 1500 2wd. Problems after problems with them. My dad still has the GMC and despite only having 30k miles (he doesn't drive much). It generally is expected to have something go wrong every 6 months. And my cousin has an older model Chevy Colorado that simply fell apart in nearly every aspect at 75k miles. I know I shouldn't judge GM on the older model Colorados. As well as a couple GM mechanics telling me that they have been surprised GM is even letting the recent models out of the factory with their problems. Though mechanics see the bad all the time. So that has lead to me dismissing GM products for the time being. Besides just not liking the looks of the Silverado or Sierra. Though if I won the lottery that I never play I would probably splurge on a new Camaro or a Corvette. Sorry for the rambling.


 I won't go into all the details but like you my Grandparents have had a lot of issue with their GM vehicles over the past 20 years. A couple years ago the SUV they bought was drinking oil like crazy and developed a knock after 30k miles. They replaced it with another just like it and it has had some issues as well.....I jokingly call it the clunker. Their experience is what turned my dad fully against a GM product. While they were always having problems my dads Tundra went 280k miles without a single issue and didn't any oil to this day. Honestly all their problems have kind of turned me off of GM also so that is why I really didn't push hard for my dad to look at one even though I feel the Duramax motor and Allison transmission would probably be trouble free. And yes my current daily driver is a GMC vehicle.


----------



## FarmerCline

somedevildawg said:


> Well......did you drive one of them 6.7 powerstrokes?


 Sure did and we are bringing it home tomorrow as you already know.


----------



## FarmerCline

Well dawg already knows the story but figured I would give everyone else an update. We went this morning to the Ford dealer over an hour away up in the mountains to look and test drive the one they had. I had a feeling I may like the Ford better but I kept an open mind. Without ever being in a Ford my dad was leaning Dodge after driving it yesterday but kept an open mind as well. After driving the Ford we both agreed we liked it better than Dodge without a doubt.....wasn't a difficult decision. It drove and handled pretty much the same but the interior was more comfortable than the Dodge.....the seats were nicer and felt more comfortable and more leg room as well.

Both interior and exterior of the Ford just seemed to be a little nicer made. Granted this particular truck that was on the lot had more options and upgrades than he was really looking for. But we also looked at and sat in a truck without the extra options that would be closer to what he wanted but was in the wrong color and it was also nicer than the comparably equipped Dodge. They did have a new 2018 that was equipped how he wanted in a good color that was supposed to be coming in any day.

While the list price on a comparably equipped Ford and Dodge were very similar I found out why I have been told that Dodge is a good bit less expensive than the Ford. Dodge had more incentives and came way down off the list price but Ford did not. Still yet he liked the Ford enough that this wasn't really a deciding factor. I should say though that many things that are an option on the Dodge are standard on a Ford so that makes up for some of the price difference.

However rather than to wait for the 2018 that was equipped like he wanted they offered some good discounts on the 2017 we drove which had more options. It ended up being about 2k higher than the 2018 would have been but for the value it was a better buy and I think he kind of liked some of the upgrades anyway. Wasnt really planning on buying the one today so we are going back to finish the deal tomorrow and drive it home.


----------



## Teslan

FarmerCline said:


> Well dawg already knows the story but figured I would give everyone else an update. We went this morning to the Ford dealer over an hour away up in the mountains to look and test drive the one they had. I had a feeling I may like the Ford better but I kept an open mind. Without ever being in a Ford my dad was leaning Dodge after driving it yesterday but kept an open mind as well. After driving the Ford we both agreed we liked it better than Dodge without a doubt.....wasn't a difficult decision. It drove and handled pretty much the same but the interior was more comfortable than the Dodge.....the seats were nicer and felt more comfortable and more leg room as well.


Told you I was weird about seats. I couldn't disagree more. I thought Ram seats were the best. I thought the nicest interior also. Leg room I have no idea. All full sized trucks are fine for me. But if it's what he likes and you like then it's all good. I'm pretty sure it will be a better truck then a Ram. Is it a F250 or F350? Or larger? Does this have that sensor system for trailers also? That seemed interesting to me. I don't trailer much so not a selling point, but a neat feature anyways.


----------



## FarmerCline

Teslan said:


> Told you I was weird about seats. I couldn't disagree more. I thought Ram seats were the best. I thought the nicest interior also. Leg room I have no idea. All full sized trucks are fine for me. But if it's what he likes and you like then it's all good. I'm pretty sure it will be a better truck then a Ram. Is it a F250 or F350? Or larger?


It is a F350 single rear wheel 6.5' bed. I really wished he would have gotten the 8' bed but it was his choice.

Well everyone has their own likes and dislikes.....that is why there is different brands. I had no intentions of bashing the Dodge as Im sure it is a good truck.....we just liked the Ford better. Maybe saying the whole interior was better on the Ford might have been a misstatement......it was really just the seats, more leg room in the back seat, and the fact that the Dodge had a hump in the floorboard (like a wheel well) on the passenger side that kept me from stretching my legs straight out.....I think the hump was from the bell housing as it was on the left side of the passenger floorboard. Otherwise that I couldn't complain about the interior of the Dodge. I should also say we sat in a higher optioned Dodge that had bucket seats and I thought they were very nice. The bench seat in the Dodge just seemed cheap and uncomfortable compared to the one in the Ford.


----------



## Teslan

FarmerCline said:


> It is a F350 single rear wheel 6.5' bed. I really wished he would have gotten the 8' bed but it was his choice.
> 
> Well everyone has their own likes and dislikes.....that is why there is different brands. I had no intentions of bashing the Dodge as Im sure it is a good truck.....we just liked the Ford better. Maybe saying the whole interior was better on the Ford might have been a misstatement......it was really just the seats, more leg room in the back seat, and the fact that the Dodge had a hump in the floorboard (like a wheel well) on the passenger side that kept me from stretching my legs straight out.....I think the hump was from the bell housing as it was on the left side of the passenger floorboard. Otherwise that I couldn't complain about the interior of the Dodge. I should also say we sat in a higher optioned Dodge that had bucket seats and I thought they were very nice. The bench seat in the Dodge just seemed cheap and uncomfortable compared to the one in the Ford.


Oh so this has a front bench seat? I didn't sit in those I just sat in front bucket seats. I like a console in the middle up front in all vehicles. You are right about the back seat if they are similar to the 1/2 tons. I didn't really like the rear seats of the Ram. And since I have two boys that will ride in the back in coming years that was something to consider.


----------



## FarmerCline

Teslan said:


> Oh so this has a front bench seat? I didn't sit in those I just sat in front bucket seats. I like a console in the middle up front in all vehicles. You are right about the back seat if they are similar to the 1/2 tons. I didn't really like the rear seats of the Ram. And since I have two boys that will ride in the back in coming years that was something to consider.


 In Dodge we were looking at the tradesman and SLT......we were told to get the bucket seats you had to step up to the Big Horn package which was considerably more money. There wasn't any equipped this way in the 100 mile radius I searched anyway.

In Ford we were looking at XL and XLT and bucket seats were an option in the XLT but all of the ones they had were bench seats. Kind of strange since except for not having bucket seats the one he bought is equipped the same as a Lariat. I don't like bench seats either but the one in the Ford really doesn't feel like a bench seat at all.....the Dodge sure did. If it wasn't for the middle seat that folds down into kind of a console you would think it was bucket seats.


----------



## paoutdoorsman

How bout some pics of the new truck Hayden?


----------



## Vol

I told Ms. Claus what truck I wanted for Christmas and she said that's fine....until she found out how much. And then she started questioning my sanity.....accused me of trying to recapture my youth....and then wanted to know what I thought my grandson would think about such. I said that Mason would say, "romp on it Papa!"

Regards, Mike


----------



## FarmerCline

paoutdoorsman said:


> How bout some pics of the new truck Hayden?


 Here ya go. So far he absolutely loves the truck. It is getting great fuel mileage as well....way better than that gas burning Tundra he had.


----------



## paoutdoorsman

Sharp looking truck!


----------



## Teslan

FarmerCline said:


> Here ya go. So far he absolutely loves the truck. It is getting great fuel mileage as well....way better than that gas burning Tundra he had.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> image.jpeg
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> image.jpeg
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> image.jpeg
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> image.jpeg


Looks like it was a good purchase. Only time will tell if it has the reliability of the Tundra.


----------



## slowzuki

I’ve got an old f350 superduty srw, and a 2012 ram 3500 6.7 dually. I really just prefer most things about superduties to the dodge. The newer f150 based bodies are even better for interior space than the SD, I think your dad will be happy.


----------



## mlappin

Have never owned anything but Dodge pickups, never had one yet with the notorious death wobble. But&#8230;I usually take em apart and reassemble with an aftermarket upgraded steering box and all Moog parts the first time I have to do any front end work.

I ain't buying a new one thats for sure, I really don't have enough use for a new 3/4 or 1 ton truck, have a fleet of heavy trucks if I have heavy work. Seriously thinking of a gently used half ton with a gas this time around as even used diesel pickups seemed like they've gone up 50% since the last one I bought. Can get a hell of a lot nicer half ton for less than a pretty ragged out Cummins. Only looking to use it to pull the stove trailer and the install trailer, both are under 5000lbs, moist likely under 4000lbs.


----------



## Vol

It does take a lot to justify a new diesel.

Regards, Mike


----------



## swmnhay

Vol said:


> It does take a lot to justify a new diesel.
> 
> Regards, Mike


It's sure different then when I bought first diesel pickup in 98.Diesel was .30 less then gas.No pollution crap either.IIRC $3500 more for diesel than a gas back then.

Now with ultr low sulfer diesel I get to pay .30 more then gas.And turn around and spend $20 acre to put sulfer on my fields.


----------



## IHCman

mlappin said:


> Have never owned anything but Dodge pickups, never had one yet with the notorious death wobble. But&#8230;I usually take em apart and reassemble with an aftermarket upgraded steering box and all Moog parts the first time I have to do any front end work.
> 
> I ain't buying a new one thats for sure, I really don't have enough use for a new 3/4 or 1 ton truck, have a fleet of heavy trucks if I have heavy work. Seriously thinking of a gently used half ton with a gas this time around as even used diesel pickups seemed like they've gone up 50% since the last one I bought. Can get a hell of a lot nicer half ton for less than a pretty ragged out Cummins. Only looking to use it to pull the stove trailer and the install trailer, both are under 5000lbs, moist likely under 4000lbs.


What steering box do you recommend? my 01 is a little squirrelly and that's about the last thing left to change.


----------



## FarmerCline

Well I'm not really sure how you actually justify buying a new vehicle......I guess it just comes down to what you want to drive and how much you want to spend. For my dad he was going to buy a new vehicle regardless of what it was.....that is just his choice and since he keeps a vehicle for a very long time and doesn't trade I guess it's not so bad.

Did he have to have a ton truck for what he does.....no a half ton would have been adequate enough for most of what he does. For what a new half ton truck was going to cost the additional cost of a bigger truck was more than justifiable for the added capability to help me haul hay with no real downside for him.

As far as justifying buying a diesel vs gas in my opinion if your already spending the kind of money that a new truck is the extra 8-9k for the diesel is well worth it. Sure diesel fuel might be a little higher than regular gas but you get better fuel mileage with a diesel so that offsets that......not to mention the other advantages of a diesel.


----------



## mlappin

IHCman said:


> What steering box do you recommend? my 01 is a little squirrelly and that's about the last thing left to change.


I'll have to dig way back and see if I can find the receipt for the last one. Kind of a proportioning steering box, just turn the wheel a tiny amount and you don't have full pressure from the pump, turn it more or quick and you get full pressure. I also add the steering box stabilizer that has a bearing that runs on the pitman shaft and goes from frame rail to frame rail.

I believe this was the box I installed:

https://www.genosgarage.com/category/steering-box

And this is the stabilizer:

https://www.genosgarage.com/product/bd-1032004/steering-box-stabilizer


----------



## Dan_GA

Coming into the post a little late, and too lazy to read all the other pages of posts, so if I repeat something, take it with a grain of salt.

No way would I even look at a Ford new. Too many issues with their past diesels, and way overpriced on the new lot.

I have owned 4 Chevy's ('03 2500, '11 2500, '15 2500, '07 3500) with the DMAX/Allison, and they can't be beaten. Well over 1 million trouble free miles. If I were going to buy a new one, it'd likely be a Dodge Laramie if I could get it with a 6 speed manual. Dodge auto is shit. My cousin has had her's replaced twice, and traded it on a DMax after the second. Her husband's 1 ton is on its 3rd transmission and it has just a little over 100k on it.

My 2015 fully loaded Dmax crew cab 4x4 was $55k out the door with some awesome rebates. Timing is key, as with any purchase. Wait for rebates.

SRW 1-tons have very little benefit. The 3/4 ton and the 1 ton dually are the same trucks. Only difference is an additional leaf in the spring pack that adds very little capacity, and even then it's only in the bed/pin weight. The extra towing capacity comes in on the DRW with the weight being added due to the extra 2 tires in the back.


----------



## somedevildawg

Dan_GA said:


> Coming into the post a little late, and too lazy to read all the other pages of posts, so if I repeat something, take it with a grain of salt.
> 
> No way would I even look at a Ford new. Too many issues with their past diesels, and way overpriced on the new lot.
> 
> I have owned 4 Chevy's ('03 2500, '11 2500, '15 2500, '07 3500) with the DMAX/Allison, and they can't be beaten. Well over 1 million trouble free miles. If I were going to buy a new one, it'd likely be a Dodge Laramie if I could get it with a 6 speed manual. Dodge auto is shit. My cousin has had her's replaced twice, and traded it on a DMax after the second. Her husband's 1 ton is on its 3rd transmission and it has just a little over 100k on it.
> 
> My 2015 fully loaded Dmax crew cab 4x4 was $55k out the door with some awesome rebates. Timing is key, as with any purchase. Wait for rebates.
> 
> SRW 1-tons have very little benefit. The 3/4 ton and the 1 ton dually are the same trucks. Only difference is an additional leaf in the spring pack that adds very little capacity, and even then it's only in the bed/pin weight. The extra towing capacity comes in on the DRW with the weight being added due to the extra 2 tires in the back.


55k is a good price for a 3500 diesel....
But, you couldn't give me a Chevrolet.....well, I take that back....you could give me one but I wouldn't be caught driving it, I'd trade it for a Ford and make the salesman sign an affidavit saying it was another dude that traded it in.......no more government motors for me, but then that's well documented thru this forum.....good luck with your trucks, if it wasn't for you and me (and every other tax paying American) they probably wouldn't be making any trucks at all....

Here's the deal with rebates.....if they's a rebate on something, it's because it's not moving (not popular) or its at the end of the year....when buying new, and at the end of the year, the best deal can usually be had but you are buying essentially a used truck at a new truck price because when you drive it off the lot, the depreciation will be much faster, because it's at the end of the year model. If they happen to change body styles the depreciation will happen much faster.....

I've bought about 4 new cars and 30 used cars/trucks in my life, but I've sold 100's.....it always amazes me how some folks will go in and "lay down", don't do it.....go in ready and swinging for your best deal.


----------



## Teslan

somedevildawg said:


> Here's the deal with rebates.....if they's a rebate on something, it's because it's not moving (not popular) or its at the end of the year....when buying new, and at the end of the year, the best deal can usually be had but you are buying essentially a used truck at a new truck price because when you drive it off the lot, the depreciation will be much faster, because it's at the end of the year model. If they happen to change body styles the depreciation will happen much faster.....


When I was truck shopping the sales guy at a Ford dealer pitched how great all the rebates are. He said you get a $50k truck for $40k. I countered and said no I think I would be getting a $40k truck for $40k. Because that is about what every dealer is selling the same thing for give or take $1000. He laughed and said yeah that's right. Just trying to make it sound better. I just hate the rebate thing. Just lower the darn price. Then you don't have to pay sales tax.

I also agree with the body style changes. In my truck shopping (I didn't look at GM). I was getting excited about a Tundra. I liked the Rams also. As I said earlier the Ford was good also. But what worried me about the Tundra and the Ram is that there would be a style change coming for 2019. Did a little searchy searchy on ol google and what do you know. Ram is redesigning for 2019. There are rumors about Tundra changing (It needs it), but Toyota is much better at keeping secrets then Ram. And what did I see recently. A new designed Chevy Silverado for 2019 (actually looks pretty awesome as I disliked the previous looks). The day those redesigns come out the current new trucks on the lot are worth less even before they are sold. Then even less after the person buys them. Unless the update sucks. And one can say that when the diesels switched to DEF they probably didn't just start selling more of those to people that wanted them because of the DEF.

Ford seems to be ever changing with slow change over time. Like this year with all their new engines, but no body changes or interior changes. One of the reasons I chose the Nissan Titan was because it was new last year. So the style probably won't change for 10 years.

Though I've noticed the companies aren't being as dramatic in their changes anymore. Not at all like the way Dodge radically changed styles in the 90s I think? Or Ford also changed quite radically.


----------



## gerkendave

Something to consider in a daily driver in my mind is ride quality. If your dad wants something to drive every day that if slightly heavier but rides nice the 3/4 dodges are now sporting coils in the rear where as the 1 tons still use leafs. I've got a 2010 ram 2500 ( still leaf spring rear) with the 6.7 Cummins and 6 speed and love it, the cab is night and day over previous generations for build quality and comfort. But I also don't drive it every day, I kept my old half ton as a daily beater for that purpose. If I had to drive my "heavy" truck daily with as few times as I actually pull I'd strongly look at a new 2500 ram with the 6.4 hemi. Lots of guys getting the same or better empty mileage with them as I get with my diesel.


----------



## FarmerCline

gerkendave said:


> Something to consider in a daily driver in my mind is ride quality. If your dad wants something to drive every day that if slightly heavier but rides nice the 3/4 dodges are now sporting coils in the rear where as the 1 tons still use leafs. I've got a 2010 ram 2500 ( still leaf spring rear) with the 6.7 Cummins and 6 speed and love it, the cab is night and day over previous generations for build quality and comfort. But I also don't drive it every day, I kept my old half ton as a daily beater for that purpose. If I had to drive my "heavy" truck daily with as few times as I actually pull I'd strongly look at a new 2500 ram with the 6.4 hemi. Lots of guys getting the same or better empty mileage with them as I get with my diesel.


 So far he is loving the F-350 he bought. Honestly I don't know how many people complain about the ride of a 1 ton truck.....at least a single rear wheel.....maybe the older trucks were worse.....haven't drove one so I don't know. It might be a little stiffer going over bumps than a half ton but nothing to really complain about whatsoever. He actually thinks it rides better than his Tundra did......I won't go quite that far but it does ride nice. We test drove both 3/4 and 1 ton trucks and saying that the 3/4 rode noticeably better would have been splitting hairs. We did not test drive one with the coil suspension though so we were comparing leaf spring to leaf spring.


----------

