# Best way to rake to speed up production



## W Bench Farms (May 19, 2016)

I am running into an issue raking this year, and not sure of the best way to fix it. Put up hay on 100-125 acres a year, mostly rented ground, and some of it is pretty rough. About 800 round bales, and 1000-1500 small squares. Most of these fields are 5-10 acres, and oddly shaped, lots of hills. I work full time, so speeding things up is pretty important. Is usually just me, but dad will mow or rake for me when he can. Usually I mow 5+ acres at a time, what I can get back up in an evening. I'll then go in and rake the night/day before baling, and bale the next day. I have been using 2 roll a bar rakes on a double hitch, so that does speed things up some. If dad rakes, he usually only will use one rake, and double up windrows. This year we are really late finishing up 1st cutting because of the wet spring, and a lot of this hay is pretty big. We round bale with a Krone KR 125. What I have been running into is if I set up my double hitch to rake double rows, it will plug up at least one rake, and if I just single windrow, I have to run the baler tractor faster than I would like on the rougher ground and hills. Double windrows make baling faster, but if the windrows get too big, the baler doesn't like them and will spill some hay off the sides. Not a big problem other than it will leave hay on the field, and I don't like that. I saw some folks baling yesterday, the same big first cutting that we are dealing with, baling huge 25' windrows. I would have my baler plugged in the first 3'. I know a rotary rake would solve a lot of problems, but trying to work with what I have until the right deal comes along. Mower is a 7'10" Frontier, so about 15 feet of hay or so seems to work pretty good. To me, an 8 or 9' rake takes too long. Raked about 7-8 acres last night on a rough hillside with 2 rakes in about 1 1/2 hours. Any suggestions for making good windrows in big hay, and keeping things moving along?


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## Gearclash (Nov 25, 2010)

I would consider a 10 wheel high capacity wheel rake. There not common but they would work perfect on two of your mower passes. At 15 or 16 feet width a 10 wheel high capacity rake would be at it optimal wing angle for raking heavy crop, and in light crop it would rake 3 mower widths. Something I learned about high capacity wheel rakes, if you travel slower with them in heavy crop they can push the windrow a little tighter together and make what could have been too wide a windrow for the baler work better. A wheel rake would work good on rough ground too.


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## rjmoses (Apr 4, 2010)

For small patches, 5 acres or so, my 8 wheel rake behind my JD 4710 compact or NH TS110 works pretty good. Smaller tractor and smaller rake works better in these fields.

Ralph


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## W Bench Farms (May 19, 2016)

Have considered a wheel rake, and had one several years ago that I did not like. The main reason was that with my disc mower, it lays hay out flat, with only about 10-12" between the swaths. A wheel rake has to have a kicker wheel, or the hay down the center will not get turned over. The rake I used didn't have a kicker, so I ended up having to make another pass to get everything turned over, which defeated my purpose of a bigger rake. I have talked to several folks I know with wheel rakes, and they have said that they pulled the kicker wheel off, or ordered their rakes without one. Too much hassle. How do folks here like or use kicker wheels?


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## Jerry/MT (Dec 14, 2017)

I use a 10 wheel V-rake (Bush Hog BSR 10) without a kicker and I have no problems with it. I can rake a 20 ft swath which is a little over 3 three passes of our 6 1/4 ft drum mower. Dry down is not usually a problem here because of the conditioning of the drum mower and low humidity but overly dry hay is. I have to bale in the morning or evening to keep the moisture above 10%. If you're cutting small fields I would think a single roll -a--bar would be better from a maneuverability stand point especially in odd shaped fields.

Our fields are rough and we have to mow around rock outcrops which makes it somewhat difficult to rake nice straight windrows. Our NH 688 baler loves big windrows and gobbles them up. I've not been able to plug it but I have to bale at low ground speeds because the fields are rough. I have to go really slow with high pto speed to bale small squares and I learned a hard lesson this year since this was the first year I made small squares.

If the windrows are so big that you are plugging your round baler there's seems to be only two things you can do; either go slower or get a higher capacity round baler that will swallow those big windrows.


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## krone.1 (Jul 28, 2013)

Have you considered a tandem inline side delivery rotary rake? very versatile and they make a sweet windrow. How rough are your fields? If rutted and holes etc, it may not be a good choice. but if just rolling and unlevel you should be ok.


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## W Bench Farms (May 19, 2016)

I have looked at the tandem rotary rakes, and really like them. A couple neighbors have them, and I like the way they rake and clean up a field. If I can find the right deal on one, that is the way I would like to go. At the moment, I can't justify the price tag.


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## mlappin (Jun 25, 2009)

I have issues to no end when baling hay behind a rolabar rake, course I also know half the time the person raking has no business being anywhere near a hayfield.

I finished my first cutting after the 4th of July, raked it all with a 25' V wheel rake, have the center kicker wheels so everything gets moved. Nice thing about mine if your hay is tedded you can narrow it up, doesn't have to be all the way out to use.


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## W Bench Farms (May 19, 2016)

mlappin said:


> I have issues to no end when baling hay behind a rolabar rake, course I also know half the time the person raking has no business being anywhere near a hayfield.
> 
> I finished my first cutting after the 4th of July, raked it all with a 25' V wheel rake, have the center kicker wheels so everything gets moved. Nice thing about mine if your hay is tedded you can narrow it up, doesn't have to be all the way out to use.


What brand/model rake are you using?


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## Beav (Feb 14, 2016)

I have 2 rotary rakes a 3200 Kuhn 9' and a 4221 Kuhn 13' I have used the 4221 90% of the time this year rake at 10 to 12 MPH with either rake. I have a NH 7060 round baler and a 5070 hayliner SS baler the 4221 work well for both balers so I am thinking about trading the 3200 for an other 4221.I would think the 4221 would work well for you I have 250 acres of small fields also but I rarely double windrow because it slows drying too much. I don't like wheel rakes because I am too impatient to adjust them correctly just MO


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## rjmoses (Apr 4, 2010)

Re-reading your original post, here's the key (IMO): Match your equipment to your field size. crop and time frame. Mower to tedder to rake to baler to field size.

I have a 8 wheel rake for small, irregular fields, a 12+3 wheel rake for long, straight fields. Tedder covers two mower windrows; rakes are set (12+3 configured as a Y rake) to produce twin Twinkie rolls for round baling into a Super Sweep pickup.

All too many people get into a rush to buy a "priced right" piece of equipment rather a "needs" right equipment.

Doing 100+ acres at 5 acres per field would take different equipment than doing 100+ at 20 acres each.

Like shoes, one size does not fit all.

Ralph


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## Tx Jim (Jun 30, 2014)

I utilize the same H&S Hi-cap 14 wheel rake to rake all shape/sizes of fields from 2 acres to 50+ acres. Nice thing about a bi-fold rake is one can rake three 9' swaths down to one 9' depending on hay production per acre simply by moving hyd control lever. I also utilize same rake for both rd & sq bales.


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## mlappin (Jun 25, 2009)

W Bench Farms said:


> What brand/model rake are you using?


New Holland HT154


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## W Bench Farms (May 19, 2016)

I rolled up about 7.5 acres last night, made 57 - 500-600 lb 4x4 bales in about 3 1/2 hours. Here's what I observed from a few changes that I made. I single raked this field with 2 - 8' rollabar rakes. Took about 1 1/2 hours to rake. This field is on a hillside, and has some rough spots. I baled at about 4-5 mph (3rd gear hi). I could make a bale from start to tied in 2.25-2.5 minutes. The last field I baled 46 bales in 3 hours, and the windrows were doubled. I ran in 1st or 2nd gear, around 3 mph. I had to cover more ground at a higher speed last night, which I usually don't like to as I think it can be harder on equipment. It was easier to start a bale, and never plugged the pickup once. This was mowed with a 7'10" disc mower, and raked with 8' rakes, so it was matched up pretty good. It was not tedded. We mowed Tuesday evening, raked Wednesday evening, and baled Thursday evening. I think single windrowing it helped dry the bottom Thursday, because it was more than ready to bale last night.

One thing that I was wanting to see if I could change was how much hay I was leaving on the field. I was thinking that a smaller windrow would let my rakes do a better job, and be better for the baler to pickup. It did help some, but still left some on the field, so it's looking like a rake issue and not a baler issue. Would like to go rotary, but don't think I can swing it. Thinking of trying a hi capacity wheel rake, from the feedback you all have given. I'm just not a fan of the standard wheel rakes, and I definitely need a kicker wheel or a way to turn the middle of the windrow. Has anyone had any experience with the one way wheel rakes, like an H&S TR7-S or TR9-S? Wasn't sure if there was an advantage on being able to rake one direction, or if a v is easier on smaller fields.

I added a couple pictures of the windrows from last night.

Thanks for all of the input.


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## mlappin (Jun 25, 2009)

I've used my 25' v-rake in fields as small as 2 acres.

I have one rough field, used to be the guys cow pasture, rake slower, bale slower of course. Have no tilled alfalfa back in twice now, way too rolling and erosion prone to risk working it. Have fixed a few gullies in it after a huge rain event a few years ago.

Raked fifty acres in three fields the other day in smooth fields, a tad less than 2 hours to rake. All three fields are next to one another with two of them sharing the south endrows.

Last of my first cutting I got 84 800lb bales off 14 acres. From start of a bale to latching the tailgate after ejection was making a bale every 52 seconds in the heaviest spots around a minute even in the rest.


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## W Bench Farms (May 19, 2016)

I have been looking at v rakes this week, and found several that may work. Looked at a nearly new Vermeer VR1022 at an auction yesterday. I think I would really rather have a hi capacity rake. It brought $5200. Told myself I would go $4000 on it since it wasn't exactly what I think I want. I found 2 Sitrex Mk-12 and an Mx-10. I think all have kicker wheels. One 12 wheel is within 25 miles of one of our farms for $6950. The other 12 wheel was $6500 and the 10 $6250. Both close to where we run a semi weekly. I'm thinking the 10 wheel would fit better, but would the best option be to go with a 12 wheel for more speed in later cuttings for almost the same money? Don't want to go too big for the baler and fields, but want to speed up my raking. Took about 3 hours to rake 8.5 acres the other day.


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## KYhaymaker (Jun 7, 2018)

I couldnt be happier with my 10 wheel Kuhn with kicker. My situation is similiar to yours as I do a few smaller pieces in addition to the main fields and it is nearly as easy as my NH256 and certainly faster.

In really tall thick hay, especially if it is a little casey, every once in a while the kicker can ball up. This hasnt been much of a problem for me, and I have a feeling that people that regilarly experience this dont have the rake set up right. The way kuhn sets up the hydraulics is smart, you can control kicker up or down from the seat just like the wings.

I think a ten wheel kuhn with kicker would be perfect for what you are looking to do. They set up higher than some other brands so you can drive over a windrow if needs be. They are horizontal in the up position so you can store them in lower sheds...some v rakes stick up pretty high when you fold them up. They have pretty decent size tires so holes/dips arent as much of an issue. Overall, well thought out. For your mower I would get the ten wheel.


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## rjmoses (Apr 4, 2010)

All you all triggered an interesting thought.

My Ag-Maxx 12+3 rake Y/V rake has the support bar outside the wheels. My Hesston 8 wheel V rake has the support bars on the inside of the wheels.

The Ag-Maxx never clogs up; the Hesston will clog up in heavy crop.

My thinking is that clogging often has to do with where the support bars are: inside or outside the wheels.

Ralph

Coffee just kicked in!


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## Tx Jim (Jun 30, 2014)

Ralph

I'll 2nd what you stated about wheel rakes with rake wheels next to hay are very difficult to plug up IE I've never found anything my H&S Hi--cap 14 wheel rake won't rake & there's no plugging.


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## Vol (Jul 5, 2009)

This is a very interesting speed rake and I have looked at them pretty seriously. I have not been able to talk with a actual owner/operator, so I have been reluctant to buy one. This is their latest design....note the wheels in FRONT of the wings(best design) and also note that the HYDRAULIC center(kicker) wheels are not on the rear of the frame, but are located on the tongue to help prevent balling up. Also, the front wheels on the 10 wheel rake, and the front two wheels on the 12 wheel rake can be placed in a clearance position to allow much narrow raking in "big" hay like heavy first cuttings.

Regards, Mike

https://www.ogdenmetalworks.com/rcr-812-hay-runner


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## Tx Jim (Jun 30, 2014)

That Ogden rake looks like a very well built/designed rake. 2 things I like better about my H&S Hi-cap rake is I can alter windrow width independent of raking width by turning a crank & I can rake any width between 7'-28' simply by moving hyd control lever. Several yrs back when we had an over abundance of rain I had to rake one 9' swath that was making 8 rd bales per acre. Bales were 4X5.5 in size


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## Vol (Jul 5, 2009)

Tx Jim said:


> That Ogden rake looks like a very well built/designed rake. 2 things I like better about my H&S Hi-cap rake is I can alter windrow width independent of raking width by turning a crank & I can rake any width between 7'-28' simply by moving hyd control lever. Several yrs back when we had an over abundance of rain I had to rake one 9' swath that was making 8 rd bales per acre. Bales were 4X5.5 in size


According to Ogdens Operator Manual you can also adjust windrow width independent of raking width. This information is listed under the "Wing Adjustment" heading.

https://cdn.websites.hibu.com/df1bb15f22ef46a8b9259b7a096f59f0/files/uploaded/RCR2018Manual2.pdf

Regards, Mike


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## rjmoses (Apr 4, 2010)

Vol said:


> https://www.ogdenmetalworks.com/rcr-812-hay-runner


I'm curious--the rear wheels seem a little close to rake wheels. It looks like they might run over the inside of the windrow or maybe cause clogging. What is the distance between the rear wheels and the rake wheels? I'd want to try before buying.

Ralph


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## hillside hay (Feb 4, 2013)

It's a nice looking rake for sure. I sure am enjoying not spending 1000+ a year on rotary maintenance. Did you ever find a price point on them? I'm just being lazy and not calling a dealer at the moment


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## Vol (Jul 5, 2009)

hillside hay said:


> It's a nice looking rake for sure. I sure am enjoying not spending 1000+ a year on rotary maintenance. Did you ever find a price point on them? I'm just being lazy and not calling a dealer at the moment


I think they are asking a little over 8K when outfitted with 10 wheels, hydraulic double kicker wheels, and dual running wheels, and the plastic rake wheel inserts(wind guards).....they come red or green.

Regards, Mike


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## Tx Jim (Jun 30, 2014)

Vol said:


> According to Ogdens Operator Manual you can also adjust windrow width independent of raking width. This information is listed under the "Wing Adjustment" heading.
> 
> https://cdn.websites.hibu.com/df1bb15f22ef46a8b9259b7a096f59f0/files/uploaded/RCR2018Manual2.pdf
> 
> Regards, Mike


Yes both raking & windrow width can be adjusted on the Ogden rake BUT not near as easily & quickly as on my H&S. Raking width can't bee adjusted near as narrow on Ogden compared to H&S


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## Tx Jim (Jun 30, 2014)

rjmoses said:


> I'm curious--the rear wheels seem a little close to rake wheels. It looks like they might run over the inside of the windrow or maybe cause clogging. What is the distance between the rear wheels and the rake wheels? I'd want to try before buying.
> 
> Ralph


Ditto I agree for heavy hay tires look too close to rake wheels


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## MistyRidgeFarm (Jun 30, 2012)

I have the ten wheel Ogden Hayrunner and it has improved my small operation immensely. In heavy crop, you can flip up the front rakes in seconds. You can also easily lock out one side to flip or move a windrow. I had a Frontier 1010 and it plugged constantly. The high capacity design of the Ogden has reduced them to near zero, and then only because my son tries to make sharp turns in heavy crop. I use a tedder so I don't need the center wheels. The field rakes clean with no issues. Mine ran me $7K and so far the best upgrade for performance and time compared to other equipment. Some of my fields are pretty rough and in two seasons, zero problems with the Hayrunner. The pickup on the JD 328 and the NH BR740 are almost the same, so I don't have to adjust windrow width. I do wish the rake width had cranks instead of turn buckles but I also never have to adjust them (maybe on extra light third cutting).


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## Vol (Jul 5, 2009)

MistyRidgeFarm said:


> I have the ten wheel Ogden Hayrunner and it has improved my small operation immensely. In heavy crop, you can flip up the front rakes in seconds. You can also easily lock out one side to flip or move a windrow. I had a Frontier 1010 and it plugged constantly. The high capacity design of the Ogden has reduced them to near zero, and then only because my son tries to make sharp turns in heavy crop. I use a tedder so I don't need the center wheels. The field rakes clean with no issues. Mine ran me $7K and so far the best upgrade for performance and time compared to other equipment. Some of my fields are pretty rough and in two seasons, zero problems with the Hayrunner. The pickup on the JD 328 and the NH BR740 are almost the same, so I don't have to adjust windrow width. I do wish the rake width had cranks instead of turn buckles but I also never have to adjust them (maybe on extra light third cutting).


Do you have the Hybrid Hayrunner or the RCR Hayrunner?

Regards, Mike


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## MistyRidgeFarm (Jun 30, 2012)

10 wheel Hybrid.

https://www.ogdenmetalworks.com/hybrid-hay-runner


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## Vol (Jul 5, 2009)

I wonder why Ogden is using turnbuckles instead of the ratchet adjusters like they did not long ago?

Regards, Mike


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## Tx Jim (Jun 30, 2014)

Vol said:


> I wonder why Ogden is using turnbuckles instead of the ratchet adjusters like they did not long ago?
> 
> Regards, Mike


But as I previously stated changing windrow width on the Ogden also changes raking width unlike my H&S as those 2 adjustments are independent of each other plus I can change raking width(1-3 nine ft swathes) while remaining on tractor


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## swmnhay (Jun 13, 2008)

Vol said:


> I wonder why Ogden is using turnbuckles instead of the ratchet adjusters like they did not long ago?
> 
> Regards, Mike


I would guess cost?


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## Vol (Jul 5, 2009)

Tx Jim said:


> But as I previously stated changing windrow width on the Ogden also changes raking width unlike my H&S as those 2 adjustments are independent of each other plus I can change raking width(1-3 nine ft swathes) while remaining on tractor


 Yes, we remember Jim.

Regards, Mike


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## Bruce Hopf (Jun 29, 2016)

W Bench Farms said:


> I have been looking at v rakes this week, and found several that may work. Looked at a nearly new Vermeer VR1022 at an auction yesterday. I think I would really rather have a hi capacity rake. It brought $5200. Told myself I would go $4000 on it since it wasn't exactly what I think I want. I found 2 Sitrex Mk-12 and an Mx-10. I think all have kicker wheels. One 12 wheel is within 25 miles of one of our farms for $6950. The other 12 wheel was $6500 and the 10 $6250. Both close to where we run a semi weekly. I'm thinking the 10 wheel would fit better, but would the best option be to go with a 12 wheel for more speed in later cuttings for almost the same money? Don't want to go too big for the baler and fields, but want to speed up my raking. Took about 3 hours to rake 8.5 acres the other day.


If your going to spend that much money, on a used rake, why not go and spend a little more, on a new rake. I too looked around for a Wheel rake, used, and the prices they were asking.
Just for curiousity, I priced out a new 10 wheel Vermeer VR1022 rake. The dealer told me, the Vermeer 10 wheel rake, was a very versatile rake, just had to remove 4 pins, pull the centre wheel, as it's all by itself, slide the front wheel dual assembly, and you now have an 8 wheel rake.
He also told me, Vermeer offered $2,000.00 Cnd, and finance the rest, making a yearly payment, for 3 years, at 0% Interest. The rake alone, was almost $8,000.00, Canadian.
I decided later, that I wanted the kicker wheel assembly as well, and the price, was just under 10,000.00, Canadian, for the rake and kicker wheel assembly. That 0% Interest, and $2,000.00 Down, is what sold, on the rake, plus, the rake is covered, under Warrenty, for a year. 
And quite often, buying a used wheel rake, can turn into a money pit, or get something, with obsolete parts, such as bearings. I ran into that, with an older Vicon wheel rake.


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