# Fall seeding Timothy into an existing stand of T/A



## MikeRF (Dec 21, 2009)

I have about 150 acres of 3 year old stands that the Timothy has struggled in. We usually seed down a 65/35 mix but for some reason these fields have become almost 90% alfalfa. Does anyone have any ideas how best I can interseed more grass after second cut and get a fast response to stop the dandelions taking hold.
I have tried knifing in through the coulters of a 750 no till drill with very varied success.


----------



## carcajou (Jan 28, 2011)

I've had poor luck with fall seeded timothy up here but we cut our 2nd cut about the middle of Sept. I tried a double disk press drill this spring on a similar field, overseeded timothy and meadow brome but i'm having my doubts due to the heavy competition of the established alfalfa. We took off the 1st cut 2 weeks ago so i'll go check this field and get back to you. If this didn't work the only other idea i have is kinda radical, perhaps retarded. I'm thinking of spraying this field with 3 active ounces of MCPA amine next spring then overseeding again. I'm pretty sure it will just retard the alfalfa growth temporarly, hopefully long enough to give the timothy a chance. May only get one late cut but it would be worth it. This spring i underseeded 2 lbs of timothy when i seeded a spring wheat field. If the stand looks good then i'll broadcast and roll in 10 lbs of alfalfa. This should give the timothy the headstart it seems to need.


----------



## MikeRF (Dec 21, 2009)

Do you mean you will lose your first cutting altogether? That does seem a fairly radical approach. Good luck!!
Supposedly fall is the best time of year to plant grasses on the eastern side of the continent. I will be trying this out this year as the wet spring stopped us from from seeding any hay at all. I have 20 acres of direct seeding to do towards the end of August and this overseeding. The other approach I had considered to the overseeding was to float the Timothy on with fall fertilizer and then roll it in after a rain to try and get seed to soil contact.


----------



## rjmoses (Apr 4, 2010)

Mike:

You might consider frost seeding. I typically overseed my pastures in late Feb./early March by broadcasting on top of the "last" snow of the season. I've had reasonable success with this method since the frost/freeze cycle carries the little seeds just down into the ground. This works better on small seeds like timothy and clovers than larger seeds like orchardgrass. The trick is to make sure that you have enough bare ground.

Ralph


----------



## MikeRF (Dec 21, 2009)

Thanks Ralph
Frost seeded perennial ryegrass this way into a similar situation with great success a couple of years back. Always thought Timothy was not aggressive enough.
Maybe I could try the belt and brace approach and do both fall and spring overseed. These stands are young enough to make the cost and aggravation worthwhile. 
Any thoughts on rate per acre for frost seeding Timothy?
Mike


----------



## rjmoses (Apr 4, 2010)

Timothy has about 1.2 million seeds/lb and is going for about $1.50 here.

Depending on your current ground, I would think somewhere in the 6-8 lb range would be appropriate

Ralph.


----------

