# Starting gettings bids for a new hay barn today.



## Teslan

I have one bid from Morton Buildings for a 60x150x18 building. $100k not counting dirt work. (sigh). Called two other more local builders. No call backs in a day. (sigh).


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## somedevildawg

Wow 100k that's higher than I would expect....


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## Teslan

somedevildawg said:


> Wow 100k that's higher than I would expect....


I was thinking it would be around $80k or so. The problem is they are so busy. If I agreed it would be November before it would be built. I don't need it until 2016. Basically the same building in 2001 was $56k.


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## somedevildawg

Yea, I agree, maybe is the decline in the "value" of the almighty dollar....


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## 8350HiTech

I don't understand the excitement over Morton. The warranty is nice but it seems it allows them to really inflate the price.


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## Lostin55

Ouch! That price is painful.

There has been an ad on C-list in your area, can't remember exactly where, that is hawking red iron buildings pretty reasonable. Who knows what the snow load and wind load are though.


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## NewBerlinBaler

Teslan - I assume your building would have a dirt floor? How many (and what size) doors?

Last year, I thought about a 60 x 100 x 14 building with a concrete floor. I crunched some numbers and figured it would be around $100K for that. At least around here.

Gary


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## snowball

Tealan JMO but that seems high I know morton is good but have you though about checking into a Cleary ? the last 1 I built 7 years ago Cleary was 30% lower the Morton the warranty is better also I went with the Cleary and really glad I did Keep us updated


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## Teslan

Yes dirt floor. Morton is the top priced building. Even the sales guy said 90% of competitors would be lower. But we have had them build 5 buildings from garages to haybarns and each time the experience has been very very good. So that's why I lean to them. Gary mine will be 50 feet longer and taller. I will have two split 30x16 foot doors one on each narrow side. Not in the center, but from the center to the corner of the building. See picture. This is a customization that makes it kinda expensive compared to your average building. So I would suppose my $100k bid really compares with your number crunching then.



NewBerlinBaler said:


> Teslan - I assume your building would have a dirt floor? How many (and what size) doors?
> 
> Last year, I thought about a 60 x 100 x 14 building with a concrete floor. I crunched some numbers and figured it would be around $100K for that. At least around here.
> 
> Gary


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## Teslan

snowball said:


> Tealan JMO but that seems high I know morton is good but have you though about checking into a Cleary ? the last 1 I built 7 years ago Cleary was 30% lower the Morton the warranty is better also I went with the Cleary and really glad I did Keep us updated


I've thought about Cleary. Though I haven't heard anything good locally about them from my haybuyers and the experience a friend went through with them a year or so ago.


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## snowball

Well I an't blame you if you have heard so bad things, I guess if I had the Big M on 5 buildings I would go that way again too if it was me. hope is all goes well for you


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## Teslan

snowball said:


> Well I an't blame you if you have heard so bad things, I guess if I had the Big M on 5 buildings I would go that way again too if it was me. hope is all goes well for you


Well I sent an inquiry through Cleary's website. We'll see if I hear from them. I'm not opposed to trying someone new. It's just when you know you can trust a certain building company through my own experience. That means at least a couple thousand to me over an unknown company. It's funny though. Morton building has some upgrades since the last time we built like stainless steel screws and a new process for the poles to be in the ground. I told the Morton sales guy that he has a tough sell with me for those upgrades as we have a 21 year old Morton without those special upgrades that is still standing strong. So he quoted me the older style of building.


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## snowball

I'am just going off of memory but the Cleary used screws and the Morton used nails the screws on the roof were on the ribs and Morton was not so the Clarey salesmen told me that they do that so the water won't leak, I do know that when Cleary was building mine they had one side of the roof on and a storm came up with 75mph winds I and the crew were in the barn and the steel they had staked in there was getting spun around like fan blades,they dented up some of the side sheets but none got tore off , it was a 45x120 with 16' walls I was shocked at how well it stood I don't know but maybe when you build as big as you are a Morton might be the best, I do like Mortons door system I don't know what Clarey's is like I used over head doors from a door company


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## 8350HiTech

snowball said:


> I'am just going off of memory but the Cleary used screws and the Morton used nails the screws on the roof were on the ribs and Morton was not so the Clarey salesmen told me that they do that so the water won't leak, I do know that when Cleary was building mine they had one side of the roof on and a storm came up with 75mph winds I and the crew were in the barn and the steel they had staked in there was getting spun around like fan blades,they dented up some of the side sheets but none got tore off , it was a 45x120 with 16' walls I was shocked at how well it stood I don't know but maybe when you build as big as you are a Morton might be the best, I do like Mortons door system I don't know what Clarey's is like I used over head doors from a door company


I can't believe someone is still going in the ribs. Any of the steel manufacturers around here won't even listen to a warranty claim unless they're screwed in the flats.


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## Teslan

snowball said:


> I'am just going off of memory but the Cleary used screws and the Morton used nails the screws on the roof were on the ribs and Morton was not so the Clarey salesmen told me that they do that so the water won't leak, I do know that when Cleary was building mine they had one side of the roof on and a storm came up with 75mph winds I and the crew were in the barn and the steel they had staked in there was getting spun around like fan blades,they dented up some of the side sheets but none got tore off , it was a 45x120 with 16' walls I was shocked at how well it stood I don't know but maybe when you build as big as you are a Morton might be the best, I do like Mortons door system I don't know what Clarey's is like I used over head doors from a door company


Mortons nails are kind of ribbed nails with a little rubber gasket under the head. Never have had a leak or anything blown off. They are probably comparable. The thing I've noticed between Morton and local builders is the quality of wood is better. Probably same as cleary. But the poles are closer together and the spaces between the ribs are closer. Again probably same as cleary but better then local builders.


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## Grateful11

Not what you're looking to build but a friend of mine had a 24' x 100' building with 12' sides built for hay storage for $9000. a few years ago. Basically a tall and very long metal carport with covered sides and open ends. You could build 4 of those and have 96'x100' of storage for around $40K.

BTW: Every time we've had Morton quote anything they are the highest but they do build very nice buildings.

This is their new special post instead of using like 1 - 6"x6" post they laminate multiple boards together. They say a 6x6" tends to twist and warp.


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## Teslan

Grateful11 said:


> Not what you're looking to build but a friend of mine had a 24' x 100' building with 12' sides built for hay storage for $9000. a few years ago. Basically a tall and very long metal carport with covered sides and open ends. You could build 4 of those and have 96'x100' of storage for around $40K.
> 
> BTW: Every time we've had Morton quote anything they are the highest but they do build very nice buildings.
> 
> This is their new special post instead of using like 1 - 6"x6" post they laminate multiple boards together. They say a 6x6" tends to twist and warp.


Yeah those are what he wanted to bid. Our hay barns posts are made of 3 2x8s. The garage is 3 2x6s. Neither of which has twisted. So he couldn't convince me I needed that. We also don't have a lot of moisture in the soil here.


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## Vol

Grateful11 said:


> This is their new special post instead of using like 1 - 6"x6" post they laminate multiple boards together. They say a 6x6" tends to twist and warp.


Any treated solid post can warp.....the longer the more the chances increase for warpage. I have been building "King" posts and regular long posts out of 2 x for about 25 years. They are much stronger.

Regards, Mike


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## PaCustomBaler

Our new shop uses laminated 2x6s. 100K does seem pretty salty, but I believe what you're saying about when it comes to customer loyalty based on service...hard to put a price on that sometimes.


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## Teslan

PaCustomBaler said:


> Our new shop uses laminated 2x6s. 100K does seem pretty salty, but I believe what you're saying about when it comes to customer loyalty based on service...hard to put a price on that sometimes.


Morton says because our buildings are 18 feet high that they need to use the 2x8 laminate. If it's lower then they use 2x6. I suspect Cleary does the same thing as their website says there are 2x8 and 2x10s available. Local smaller outfits? I hope to find out if they see fit to call me back.


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## PaCustomBaler

I'm waiting to get a price back on a 3-sided hay barn we will put up....60x80x20. I suspect he'll use 2x8s laminated for it. Get a concrete truck in to pour each hole once the posts are in. Our shop is 16' to the square using those 2x6's.


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## SVFHAY

At that width I think all steel is the way to go.


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## FarmHand78

Teslan,
Where are you located? I own a post frame and steel frame building company. You should get the building you described for $75-80k. I like bidding against big M, I'm normally 20-30% lower in price. Cleary is starting to get up there in price as well.

A lot has changed in the last few years in post frame buildings, hence the price increase. I sold a 72x224x20 part shop part storage in 2012 for $250k today the same building would be $80-100k more.

Column size requirements, wind loadings, truss design and bracing requirements are all higher.


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## Teslan

FarmHand78 said:


> Teslan,
> Where are you located? I own a post frame and steel frame building company. You should get the building you described for $75-80k. I like bidding against big M, I'm normally 20-30% lower in price. Cleary is starting to get up there in price as well.
> 
> A lot has changed in the last few years in post frame buildings, hence the price increase. I sold a 72x224x20 part shop part storage in 2012 for $250k today the same building would be $80-100k more.
> 
> Column size requirements, wind loadings, truss design and bracing requirements are all higher.


I'm in Northern Colorado. I'm getting a bid also from a local builder that has a very good reputation in this area and has built probably 7 large buildings within 5 miles of me over the last 2 years. I agree. I was thinking $75k-$80k, but then I know nothing about building. I sell hay to the owners of General Steel buildings, and have thought about asking about trading hay for a building, but I've read not so good things about their company.

I asked the Morton guy to check to see what the prices are if I made the building 54 feet wide. That dropped it to $93,000. I suspect my dirtwork will be $10,000 as the location is kind of on a slope and one corner is probably 1 1/2 feet lower then the other corner. The Morton guy suggested longer columns on the lower end so more length could be put deeper in the current soil rather then what was filled in.


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## Vol

Teslan said:


> The Morton guy suggested longer columns on the lower end so more length could be put deeper in the current soil rather then what was filled in.


Very good advice.

Regards, Mike


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## swmnhay

When I built my shed I got references of buildings and went to look at them and talk to the owner.It was huge decide ing factor in seeing workmanship of the buildings and talking with other farmers directly about any issues they had.The building crew can turn a good building into a POS.One crew dug post holes to deep then added a scab to the top of the post after it was to short.Another building the screws were put in haphazardly with a lot of them missing the studs.Some the poles were not in line and the walls had a weave to them.

Some salesman were so full of crap alsne claimed his building was stronger with the posts farther apart.Another claimed bracing made a building weaker.Most of the salesman didn't understand ventilation at all.Here we can have a lot of condensation in spring when frost is comeing out and a lot of sheds I've seen drip terribly.The salesman of my building knew exactly what I wanted and I have soffit all along the 2' overhang along with a roof vent the length of the building.
Snow load and wind load were my major concerns and I got a much heavier building for less then a lot of co's that were just built to code,not anything more.


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## IHCman

Cy, what brand of building did you eventually go with? I've wanted to check into the Foltz buildings over in Detroit Lakes MN. I know of a few that have been built around here but haven't talked to the owners or went and seen them yet.

Dad put up a Goodon building a few years ago and so far are quite happy with it. Only issue we've had is that they don't put the sealing strip on the end caps going up the sides of the roof. They do put it on the cap way up top just not on the sides. Get a little snow blowing in at times. Talked to the guy who runs the crew that put it up and he told us to get some cans of spray foam and go up and seal it up. That kinda pissed me off but Dad didn't want to raise to much of a stink as that guy that runs that crew is the son of a neighbor we've gotten along with good for years and rent some of his parents ground.


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## swmnhay

IHCman said:


> Cy, what brand of building did you eventually go with? I've wanted to check into the Foltz buildings over in Detroit Lakes MN. I know of a few that have been built around here but haven't talked to the owners or went and seen them yet.
> 
> Dad put up a Goodon building a few years ago and so far are quite happy with it. Only issue we've had is that they don't put the sealing strip on the end caps going up the sides of the roof. They do put it on the cap way up top just not on the sides. Get a little snow blowing in at times. Talked to the guy who runs the crew that put it up and he told us to get some cans of spray foam and go up and seal it up. That kinda pissed me off but Dad didn't want to raise to much of a stink as that guy that runs that crew is the son of a neighbor we've gotten along with good for years and rent some of his parents ground.


It's a Ram building out of Winstead,Mn.I know they were building out in the oil fields so they go your way.

http://rambuildings.com/


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## FarmHand78

Teslan said:


> I'm in Northern Colorado. I'm getting a bid also from a local builder that has a very good reputation in this area and has built probably 7 large buildings within 5 miles of me over the last 2 years. I agree. I was thinking $75k-$80k, but then I know nothing about building. I sell hay to the owners of General Steel buildings, and have thought about asking about trading hay for a building, but I've read not so good things about their company.
> 
> I asked the Morton guy to check to see what the prices are if I made the building 54 feet wide. That dropped it to $93,000. I suspect my dirtwork will be $10,000 as the location is kind of on a slope and one corner is probably 1 1/2 feet lower then the other corner. The Morton guy suggested longer columns on the lower end so more length could be put deeper in the current soil rather then what was filled in.


Well, Colorado is a little far for me to send a crew. Sound like you are on the right track. Morton build a good building, but that big M stands for money, ya pay for the name. Morton, Lester, and Cleary are the big three in post frame, there are a ton of us reputable privateers out there, and sorry to say more and more fly by night/ half a$$ builders. Check references, and look at buildings, and make sure the buildings they show you are of the same general size your looking at or bigger. 3ply2x8 columns would be the minimum column size for that category of building, snow load is important, as is wind loading. Make sure columns are set below your areas frost depth, and set in Un disturbed soil. Good call on longer columns. Lost of bracing is necessary, not matter what salesmen say.

Some thing to check is even if your not in an area with building codes and inspection, there may be state laws saying builders must build to a certain code standard. Also check with your insurance provider, they may also have a minimum requirement, or offer discounts when built to a certain code.

Something to ask your builders is to price trusses that are rated foe ceiling load, you may think you'll never put a ceiling or insulation in, but never is a long time. All my buildings come that way standard, only cost a few buck per truss more for the heavier loading.


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## Teslan

FarmHand78 said:


> Well, Colorado is a little far for me to send a crew. Sound like you are on the right track. Morton build a good building, but that big M stands for money, ya pay for the name. Morton, Lester, and Cleary are the big three in post frame, there are a ton of us reputable privateers out there, and sorry to say more and more fly by night/ half a$$ builders. Check references, and look at buildings, and make sure the buildings they show you are of the same general size your looking at or bigger. 3ply2x8 columns would be the minimum column size for that category of building, snow load is important, as is wind loading. Make sure columns are set below your areas frost depth, and set in Un disturbed soil. Good call on longer columns. Lost of bracing is necessary, not matter what salesmen say.
> 
> Some thing to check is even if your not in an area with building codes and inspection, there may be state laws saying builders must build to a certain code standard. Also check with your insurance provider, they may also have a minimum requirement, or offer discounts when built to a certain code.
> 
> Something to ask your builders is to price trusses that are rated foe ceiling load, you may think you'll never put a ceiling or insulation in, but never is a long time. All my buildings come that way standard, only cost a few buck per truss more for the heavier loading.


Thanks for the advice. Let me ask you this. Morton trusses are bolted into the columns. I think the columns are about 8 foot apart. The local builder does his trusses different. He has them setting on top of what I guess I'll call a header piece at the top of the building. Kinda like a house is framed, but this guy does it every 4 feet. They are engineered trusses. And the columns are every 8. Which is better? I would think the Morton way would be but I could be wrong. The local builder said sometimes on a tall building he even does columns of 4 2x8s.

As said above we have had Morton build 2 hay barns, 1 tractor building and 2 garages. So I'm well familiar with how they do things and am satisfied. So that means to me a few thousand dollars over an unknown to me contractor.

This building would get what we call an ag exempt building and we get an ag exempt permit. Which means that no inspections are needed or other building permits. You just promise to never park a licensed vehicle in it (Yes no one EVER breaks that promise).


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## FarmHand78

Morton normally has columns 7ft 6in on center. The way they are doing it is the industry standard. The other builder is using what we call an "eve collar" your right it is a header. Some reasons to utilize this is 2x4 purlins can be laid flat, instead of on edge, instalation is easier. Also if installing a ceiling no extra ceiling supports are needed. Or there truss supplier doesn't have the ability to build the heavier trusses that are needed for 8th on center. Two things to worry about with an eve collar; is the header strong enough for it's use. [I've seen old buildings where just 2= 2x6's where used] Also the truss connection, a hurricane clip or truss strap should be used.

I just bid a 72x120x22 a shop I needed to use 4ply 2x4 columns on the standard building columns, 5 ply 2x8 at overhead doors, and 10ply 2x8 at a 50 ft wide high lift door... One of the 10ply 2x10's was over a grand, my cost.


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## FarmHand78

As far as General Steel buildings, I've heard bad things, but I have never seen one. I'm a Ceco steel frame dealer, second in sales nation wide in 2013. Your building is still a little small for steal frame to be competitive with post frame. Without the foundation cost post frame and steel frame would be close for you, but you would have over 40k in a foundation, no floor.

Steel frame becomes cost effective in wide span, 90ft or more, or complex structures. I've sold many smaller steel frame buildings, small as 12x18x9, to as big as 565x1050x24 (just shy of 13 acers)


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## swmnhay

My poles and rafters are 6' apart.I payed a little extra but it was till cheaper then other buildings with 7-8 ft spaceings.60' wide building..


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## slowzuki

RE the truss spacing, they pricing and strength are all similar when done right but depending on local snow load and if you want interior ceilings there are a few savings to be gain or lost.

Locally a lot of crews don't like working up top on 4 ft plus truss spacing because they can't reach the next truss when flipping them up. They like 24-32" truss spacing with headers on the posts.

If you have a lift you can run around inside on the wider spacings work ok. I did my shop on 8 ft and used extension ladders leaning on the on edge purlins but it takes forever. Framed the shed off side with tighter spacing and flat purlins and it went much faster, far easier to walk around on top off to do the steel too.


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## Teslan

slowzuki said:


> RE the truss spacing, they pricing and strength are all similar when done right but depending on local snow load and if you want interior ceilings there are a few savings to be gain or lost.
> 
> Locally a lot of crews don't like working up top on 4 ft plus truss spacing because they can't reach the next truss when flipping them up. They like 24-32" truss spacing with headers on the posts.
> 
> If you have a lift you can run around inside on the wider spacings work ok. I did my shop on 8 ft and used extension ladders leaning on the on edge purlins but it takes forever. Framed the shed off side with tighter spacing and flat purlins and it went much faster, far easier to walk around on top off to do the steel too.


Most of the time builders around here hire cranes. With our Morton hay barns Morton had this specialized loader tractor that could lift the trusses up.


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## Teslan

Well I got a bid from Cleary. $106k. So I'm not going to use them. I also got a negative endorsement for Cleary by the guy that is building my cousins house. He said Cleary builds to the very minimum snow load. Several years ago we had heavier snows then normal. He had to replace quite a few Cleary building roofs that next spring.


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## FarmHand78

Wow... Cleary has gone up... that's good news for me. The more I work with emgineers, the more I understand how loads, values, reactions and so on, can be manipulate with math figures. My truss designer helped me pick apart a competitors truss design to prove the 35 lbs. ground snow load they claimed was it all actuality only a 15 lbs ground snow load. I for one never want to have a building fail, bad for the customer, bad for my reputation, and I don't want to be sued. I've never heard of Cleary cheating, but they use in house engineers, but anything is possable.


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## swmnhay

It amazes me that people will just build to code and not a little extra.For 5-10% more you will have a building still standing compared to a pile of mangled tin and rafters on top of everything.100's of roofs caved in here in 96 when we got a couple inches of ice that stayed all winter and snow built up on top of that.After seeing that and the occasional wind storm that goes threw I decided always to build it better then code.


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## Teslan

It's also interesting I've found out from Cleary and another builder with a very good reputation don't want to put skylights on top of the building for fear of damage during hail. For a 150 foot building I like natural light. I'm not even sure I'm going to power up this one. They want them on the sides. So I asked the Morton guy are your skylights that much better or have we just been lucky with our 3 buildings skylights, one of which is 23 years old. He said he's seen Morton steel totaled by hail, but the skylights remain undamaged.


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## FarmHand78

I sell the stuff, and I won't put it on the roof of my own building. The new poly ridge light is a hot seller, not a fan. Side light/ eve light is the way to go, put on both sides if ya cam swing it.


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## Teslan

FarmHand78 said:


> I sell the stuff, and I won't put it on the roof of my own building. The new poly ridge light is a hot seller, not a fan. Side light/ eve light is the way to go, put on both sides if ya cam swing it.


Yes that's what my other builder is doing.


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## Matthew0209

For the guys that don't get a whole lot of snow, how about guardrail. I've had mine for about 4 years and love it. It basically bolts together in 25 foot sections. Took me and two other guys to build in a month with the rented genie lift.


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## somedevildawg

Matthew0209 said:


> For the guys that don't get a whole lot of snow, how about guardrail. I've had mine for about 4 years and love it. It basically bolts together in 25 foot sections. Took me and two other guys to build in a month with the rented genie lift.


And what are you using the guard rail for? And how did you find guard rail, it's fairly expensive here IF you can find it.....


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## Teslan

I got another bid from a local very reputable builder. He's built quite a few buildings around us the last few years. So I've seen that he gets them built in quick order. He came in at about the same as Morton, but he puts a lot more in his buildings. He pointed out that Morton has gotten cheaper in build, but not in cost. For example our Morton 1994 bulding the wall girts are 2 feet apart. Our 2001 one they are 3 feet as is our 2008 machine shop. He does 2 feet. My dad remembers being annoyed with Morton about that. This local builder also recommends overhead doors not sliders. I like the idea also, but didn't know they made them so big. The local builder also puts actual concrete footings in the ground. Morton does not. I have another bid coming maybe. It took the guy 2 weeks to return my call after I called him. So we will see how long it takes him to get me some numbers. So I suspect I'm going with the local guy. Now to decide if I want to put power to the building. $2000 for a transformer and meter never mind anything else. There already are lines and a pole to the building site. I suspect the dirt work will be a lot also. I figured from the start this would be a $100k job.


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## Matthew0209

There were around 135 pieces in this 50x100. 20ft on the front and 18 on the back. I had about 7000 in guardrail


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## swmnhay

Teslan said:


> This local builder also recommends overhead doors not sliders.


The rave here is hyd doors,I went with a insulated overhead door 24' wide.Hyd doors are slow.Park in front of them someone may open the door and hit something.If snow blew against it you may have to scoop out of way before opening.No power you cant get hyd door open.

Wind raises hell with a lot of slider doors also.


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## Teslan

swmnhay said:


> The rave here is hyd doors,I went with a insulated overhead door 24' wide.Hyd doors are slow.Park in front of them someone may open the door and hit something.If snow blew against it you may have to scoop out of way before opening.No power you cant get hyd door open.
> 
> Wind raises hell with a lot of slider doors also.


I have battled wind with our sliders for years. I'm ready for something different.


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## slowzuki

What are you gonna use the power for? Lights? The LED floods are bright enough and low enough draw a small solar cell and battery is extremely cheap vs install plus a few bills.



Teslan said:


> I got another bid from a local very reputable builder. He's built quite a few buildings around us the last few years. So I've seen that he gets them built in quick order. He came in at about the same as Morton, but he puts a lot more in his buildings. He pointed out that Morton has gotten cheaper in build, but not in cost. For example our Morton 1994 bulding the wall girts are 2 feet apart. Our 2001 one they are 3 feet as is our 2008 machine shop. He does 2 feet. My dad remembers being annoyed with Morton about that. This local builder also recommends overhead doors not sliders. I like the idea also, but didn't know they made them so big. The local builder also puts actual concrete footings in the ground. Morton does not. I have another bid coming maybe. It took the guy 2 weeks to return my call after I called him. So we will see how long it takes him to get me some numbers. So I suspect I'm going with the local guy. Now to decide if I want to put power to the building. $2000 for a transformer and meter never mind anything else. There already are lines and a pole to the building site. I suspect the dirt work will be a lot also. I figured from the start this would be a $100k job.


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## SVFHAY

Teslan said:


> I have battled wind with our sliders for years. I'm ready for something different.


I hear ya on the sliders, I have the same problems. I also just dropped $450 replacing bottom section on a 20' insulated rollup door because I mangled it with a skidsteer. So, if your putting a door tall enough for that stack cruiser there will be track bellow the rafters 18' inside. I know I would hit that with the top bale on the business end of the volvo.

About the most trouble free doors around this place are the 16' swing doors on the 100 year old barn.

Btw, I like your offset doors on opposite ends, makes a lot of sense on a hay barn.


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## Teslan

SVFHAY said:


> I hear ya on the sliders, I have the same problems. I also just dropped $450 replacing bottom section on a 20' insulated rollup door because I mangled it with a skidsteer. So, if your putting a door tall enough for that stack cruiser there will be track bellow the rafters 18' inside. I know I would hit that with the top bale on the business end of the volvo.
> 
> About the most trouble free doors around this place are the 16' swing doors on the 100 year old barn.
> 
> Btw, I like your offset doors on opposite ends, makes a lot of sense on a hay barn.


This builder that is proposing the overhead doors is also building the building 19' 6" to the rafters on the inside. So I guess I could go 6 high with my bales if needed some day. Though not with my NH stacker. Also he uses flat trusses and at 18 feet my stacker when dumping loaded with 3x3 bales comes to close to comfort to the trusses in our current Morton buildings right by the walls. So we needed the building a bit taller. Morton uses raised trusses every 8 feet so I don't worry about it in the middle of the building or even 2-3 feet from the walls. This builder has the trusses every 4 feet. Swing doors would be good, but can you imagine how expensive they would be to build at 15 feet wide 18 feet high or so for one door? I can see something like that cheaply built sagging in a few years.


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## Teslan

Also as Cy mentioned about the hydraulic doors. I had thought about those, but I like to leave my doors open in the summer to get some air through the building when there is hay in it. and I'm pretty sure leaving a hydraulic door open in a windstorm probably isn't a good idea.


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## FarmHand78

Big no no to leave hydro doors open... but many people do. I've had three guys in the past three weeks ask for prices on 50 wide hydro lift doors.... that's a lot of money in a door that you don't NEED that often.

The biggest overhead door I've put in a building is 36x20... for the cost of the same hydro I could put the overhead door in and raise the ceiling to 23ft for room for tack and springs.


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## Teslan

FarmHand78 said:


> Big no no to leave hydro doors open... but many people do. I've had three guys in the past three weeks ask for prices on 50 wide hydro lift doors.... that's a lot of money in a door that you don't NEED that often.
> 
> The biggest overhead door I've put in a building is 36x20... for the cost of the same hydro I could put the overhead door in and raise the ceiling to 23ft for room for tack and springs.


I had previously thought only people that owned airplanes had hydro doors.


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## slowzuki

I put in split bi-folds, work sort of like a giant closet door except track is aligned so they can fold back out of the way instead of blocking the doorframe. They do need a latch in the wind to hold them open. The load on hinges is highest when open but the doors fold in half so leverage is low against the hinge. 30 ft opening -> 15 ft door -> 7.5 ft leaf

I think I used some 1" sch 40 pipe for hinges with 1" pins, welded some 1x3 channel to the chunks of pipe for the hinge straps.

Below is the link to what I followed:

http://www.cps.gov.on.ca/english/be9000/be9342.htm



Teslan said:


> This builder that is proposing the overhead doors is also building the building 19' 6" to the rafters on the inside. So I guess I could go 6 high with my bales if needed some day. Though not with my NH stacker. Also he uses flat trusses and at 18 feet my stacker when dumping loaded with 3x3 bales comes to close to comfort to the trusses in our current Morton buildings right by the walls. So we needed the building a bit taller. Morton uses raised trusses every 8 feet so I don't worry about it in the middle of the building or even 2-3 feet from the walls. This builder has the trusses every 4 feet. Swing doors would be good, but can you imagine how expensive they would be to build at 15 feet wide 18 feet high or so for one door? I can see something like that cheaply built sagging in a few years.


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## Teslan

slowzuki said:


> I put in split bi-folds, work sort of like a giant closet door except track is aligned so they can fold back out of the way instead of blocking the doorframe. They do need a latch in the wind to hold them open. The load on hinges is highest when open but the doors fold in half so leverage is low against the hinge. 30 ft opening -> 15 ft door -> 7.5 ft leaf
> 
> I think I used some 1" sch 40 pipe for hinges with 1" pins, welded some 1x3 channel to the chunks of pipe for the hinge straps.
> 
> Below is the link to what I followed:
> 
> http://www.cps.gov.on.ca/english/be9000/be9342.htm


Do they have a track at the bottom?


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## slowzuki

No. I left a 1/2" gap to a concrete apron. That was dumb, I should have left 4" and screwed a rubber skirt so I could avoid scraping in the winter. I planned on locking pins in the middle but have never got around to it because of this one door has warped about 1" out of plane at the join in the middle after 5 years, still works fine.



Teslan said:


> Do they have a track at the bottom?


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## swmnhay

Teslan said:


> I had previously thought only people that owned airplanes had hydro doors.


It's the rage here.I'd say over 50% of new machine sheds and Prly 75% of the shops have hydro doors.I know of one 60' wide.There are a couple of hydro door manufactures within 60 miles of me.Also schwiese bi fold doors which were fairly popular before the hydro doors.

Another option one builder had was inside sliders.The doors were inside the walls not on outside of the poles.You do loose some space along the wall were they need to slide when opening.


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## whitmerlegacyfarm

2 sets of prices I just got even though I'm so far away from you. 40x60x14 with (2) 14ft slider doors with dirt floor, quoted at $21,000. 50x80x14 same options $30,000 (added an extra 10ft slider for possible horse stable in one corner. Really want to go 50x80 just not in the budget of a hobby hay maker.


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## PaMike

Just a thought...a lean to would be fairly easy to add later on to a smaller building. Build what you can afford now, then put the leanto on later for some of the lower equipment that doesnt need the 14 ft clear....


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## Hugh

Wouldn't the 2x laminated/treated have better preservative penetration that solid 6x or 8x? I suppose they treat first then laminate.


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