# Crazy round baler/tractor issues today



## JD3430 (Jan 1, 2012)

I made 60 4x5 round bales in just a few hours Friday. Ran tractor in high range 1st gear and everything went great. It rained later that afternoon, so I left about 3/4 of my hay in raked windrows. Came back saturday and tedded. It was sunny, but ground was a little damp to bale. Came back again today, tedded out at 10AM after dew burned off. Raked at about 1PM. Started round baling again.

This time, it was a totally different story. Tractor wanted NO PART of round baler once bale size reached 56" on Bale Command. I was down to low range 2nd gear once I hit 56". Couldn't even make a 60" bale if I wanted to. I made 2 or 3 bales that way and thought, this is f'-d up, so I dropped the pressure on the baler from 2000lb to 1000lb and it made little to no difference. Tractor still struggled at 56" bale size!!!!

I had to get baled up and done because of rain tonight. Struggled through 10 more bales this way. I had one row left to go that looked like it might be a little on the damper side in a lower area of the field. I shut down and checked everything. All looked normal. Fired up tractor again and ran through that windrow and made a 60" bale in high range 1st gear. Tractor and baler ran fine.
Checked moisture in 56" bales and they were only slighty higher than ones from Friday. I want to think the 56" bales were causing me trouble because of moisture, but that seems hard to believe and the last bale that went to 60" easily kind of makes that seem impossible.

Seems like the tractor was 30HP weaker than Friday.

I'm really scratching my head on this one.....Any ideas what happened? Tractor or baler?


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## Iowa hay guy (Jul 29, 2010)

might check your air filter and fuel filter and dump all your water traps
if theres much water toss the filters and get new ones
50 bucks in filters aint worth tryin to cut corners on filters and blow an injector pump


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## FCF (Apr 23, 2010)

Also may want to check for "junk" in the fuel tank. Sounds to me like the fuel flow was restricted in some way and when you shut down the restriction moved away from the tank outlet and didn't move back to restrict flow.


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## Will 400m (Aug 1, 2011)

On my 5030 I have had the filter fill with a gel even when it's warm out but it's a cartrage and has a clear holder so you can see whats going on. I also used to use some old jerry cans and one of them had the liner coming off and ended up in the fuel tank and blocks the pickup tube. It's easy to tell I leave the right side panel off and when it starts to act up I have a pair of plier's and pull the line going to the filter off and if the flow is reduced I get a mouth full fo diesle and blow in the line and you can feel it clear. Solves the problem till I can get her shut down for a day or so and clean it out. It only acts up as the fuel level gets realy lov like one or two bars.


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## JD3430 (Jan 1, 2012)

Funny you mention that.....I let the fuel level go low a couple times very recently. Wonder if I sucked up some junk??


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## mlappin (Jun 25, 2009)

I'm certain this isn't JD3430's problem, but the first year I had one of my Whites it would miss once in awhile then one day when the fuel was under half a tank it was short on power climbing hills. A few rows later it just died, got it running baled another row, then would die climbing the same hill, changed filters, didn't help, checked fuel lines no obstructions. Then noticed the fuel looked like it was swirling funny in the water separator. Turns out the diaphragm check valve on the inlet side of the fuel pump came out of it's seat. I reinstalled it and restaked it and end of problem.


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## JD3430 (Jan 1, 2012)

[sub]So you don't think I have a clogged filter/fuel sytem trash? [/sub]


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## mlappin (Jun 25, 2009)

JD3430 said:


> [sub]So you don't think I have a clogged filter/fuel sytem trash? [/sub]


Oh you could, I just threw my experience out as an example of weird things that could happen. The only reason I found my problem as quick as I did was that when looking at the clear water separator you could see fuel enter then looked like it was sucked right back out. Had another tractor act up and it had the vented fuel cap plugged with dust and spider nests.

Take the line of at the filter and see if you have full flow, if so then try again when the tractor seems sluggish. We had one years ago with a 110 gallon tank that the internal baffle broke loose, the baffle would move around then finally cover the fuel outlet, hit with an air hose and the baffle would move around and uncover the hole for awhile.

Knew of another one that the fuel suction hose was starting to separate internally, tractor might run fine for 10 minutes or even an hour then would get short on power till it eventually died, once the tractor cooled off (and the fuel hose) it's run fine again for awhile.


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## NDVA HAYMAN (Nov 24, 2009)

You might want to call the Kubota dealer and talk to one of their mechanics.


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## CockrellHillFarms (Aug 30, 2011)

I'm not as knowledgeable with the kubotas but I would say something is in the fuel line or filter. That's usually the problem, at least in my experience. That's what I would check before you look into more serious things. Now on my new tractors, there is a screen on the fuel line inside the tank. You have to pull the sending unit out to see what I mean (ask kubota if they have this). It helps screen small particals, dirt, grass, etc. I dumped some pieces of hay in my tank on accident. They clogged the screen up good. Its just a little wire screen that might need to be cleaned. This type of thing is usually the easiest to fix, just not always the easiest to find. When you have another problem like this. Stop the tractor and pump on your primer. If the primer doesnt get hard, or isnt hard. Then you know you dont have fuel to the primer/injectors. Just process of elimination. Then you can always go backwards toward the fuel lines, fuel filter, sending unit.


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## rjmoses (Apr 4, 2010)

I had the fuel pickup line crack inside the tank on my NH TS135. There was no problem when I had a full tank, but at about 1/2 full, it would start sucking air and get worse. NH repaired it under warranty with a redesigned pickup.

Ralph


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## CockrellHillFarms (Aug 30, 2011)

rjmoses said:


> I had the fuel pickup line crack inside the tank on my NH TS135. There was no problem when I had a full tank, but at about 1/2 full, it would start sucking air and get worse. NH repaired it under warranty with a redesigned pickup.
> 
> Ralph


I had the same thing happen on a new tractor. Funny thing is, its a steal line in the tank. Both return line and sending line. Now how in the world does a steel line crack. Most be cheap stuff. I dunno.


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## j316deere (May 24, 2009)

What kind of baler? Check the scraper near the belt guides. Last year I had a similar problem. I had baled some shorter, very dry late summer hay in a pasture field which made for very dusty conditions. Next field we baled was much taller and had a higher moisture content. The combination allowed residue to build up between the scrapper and the belt roller. Once the bales reached a certain size it started pulling the tractor down to nothing. The dry grass/dirt residue became like concrete once the moisture allowed it to set up and compact. Had to slide a sawzall blade into the gap to clear out the build up.


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## JD3430 (Jan 1, 2012)

j316deere said:


> What kind of baler? Check the scraper near the belt guides. Last year I had a similar problem. I had baled some shorter, very dry late summer hay in a pasture field which made for very dusty conditions. Next field we baled was much taller and had a higher moisture content. The combination allowed residue to build up between the scrapper and the belt roller. Once the bales reached a certain size it started pulling the tractor down to nothing. The dry grass/dirt residue became like concrete once the moisture allowed it to set up and compact.	Had to slide a sawzall blade into the gap to clear out the build up.


I will check tomorrow. I hope thats all it is. Cant spend anymore money on repairs. It got worse today. Cant even make a 48" bale !!!!
This problem has me scratching my head and really worried. To access the scrapers, I lift the back door right?


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## Will 400m (Aug 1, 2011)

Did you check the fuel at the filter housing or check the fuel filters? If was it acting up at the time and how does it idle compared to when it was not having a problem? Mine would idle realy low and rough when the line would get blocked.


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## jchay (Jun 21, 2012)

j316deere said:


> What kind of baler? Check the scraper near the belt guides. Last year I had a similar problem. I had baled some shorter, very dry late summer hay in a pasture field which made for very dusty conditions. Next field we baled was much taller and had a higher moisture content. The combination allowed residue to build up between the scrapper and the belt roller. Once the bales reached a certain size it started pulling the tractor down to nothing. The dry grass/dirt residue became like concrete once the moisture allowed it to set up and compact.	Had to slide a sawzall blade into the gap to clear out the build up.


i will second that happened to a buddy of mine he never really cleaned the chaff and dirt/dust out of the scaper area and left his baler out uncovered and it rained a few times next time he baled that stuff was like concrete in there.


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## endrow (Dec 15, 2011)

On your 648 are you sure it does not have the optional bale slice. Our 648 had it and when you engaged the slicing knives it took considerably more power to run the baler.


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## j316deere (May 24, 2009)

JD3430 said:


> I will check tomorrow. I hope thats all it is. Cant spend anymore money on repairs. It got worse today. Cant even make a 48" bale !!!!
> This problem has me scratching my head and really worried. To access the scrapers, I lift the back door right?


First release the belt tension. Now for the fun part - you get to crawl up inside so that you can get a good look at the back side of the belt roller. Pretty sure the tailgate was down. Just make sure to take the tractor key out so no one accidentally fires it up with you in there!


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## JD3430 (Jan 1, 2012)

j316deere said:


> First release the belt tension. Now for the fun part - you get to crawl up inside so that you can get a good look at the back side of the belt roller. Pretty sure the tailgate was down. Just make sure to take the tractor key out so no one accidentally fires it up with you in there!


you mean turn the baler pressure down to zero?


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## JD3430 (Jan 1, 2012)

OK, now it just took a turn for the worse, much worse. Tractor came off the dyno making more PTO HP (64) than from the factory (62), so that's the good news. Checked baler, couldn't find anything out of place.
Called NHservice (there goes my money). Sent mechanic up to me. He thought the problem was in the BALE COMMAND. He thought the "bale calibration" was wrong. Damn if he wasn't right. The "60 inch" bales I struggled to make that I thought were 54" were actually 60" !!! It was me that was the problem.The readout would show 54", the tractor would bog down and I was thinking the bales were 54", but in fact, they were really 60" bales!!! OMG, I must have been in the sun waaaay too long. I feel so dumb, relying on the bale command readout of 50-54", instead of actually takng out a tape measure!!!
OK, so back to the mechanic- he pushes the "book" button on the bale command plus and "adjusts" the monitor to compensate for the readout reading smaller than the bale. It just happens that I had just dropped some fresh hay, so we made a 60" bale. No problem. Bale was a little small-about 58-59". he adjusted it again and we made a full 60" bale.
Problem solved,,,,,, right?
WRONG!!!!

Today, I ted, rake the rest of the 20 acre field and prepare to bale. I'm all excited to get back to using the baler, all fixed and ready to go. Made first bale 60"-GREAT. Make a second bale, monitor reads 54" alarm goes off, makes a smaller bale.....WTF??? That's just the opposite of what was happening before!!!
Made a bunch more bales. All different sizes. Anything from 52" to 60" coming out of baler. Now B/C reads 60", but is only dumping out a 54" bale!!! With rain only 2 hour away, I had to finish making these stupid odd size bales. My buyer is gonna be disgusted. Ended up makin a bunch of smaller bales. Couldn't change anything in the bale command.
Any ideas? Ready to push this god forsaken pile of crap into the river next to the field. Looks like a brand new baler. Only has made 470 bales!!! I hate it and it hates me.
Please help me before I lose it!!!


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## mlappin (Jun 25, 2009)

Well....get the bale command manual, will save you a ton of money in service calls. Personally I leave mine at a 58" bale when it says 60" on the bale command just in case a person can't get stopped in time.


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## JD3430 (Jan 1, 2012)

So do you think this is an issue with adjusting the bale command? Why would it work one day and not the next day? Not screaming at you, just desperate for answers and frustrated.
You've always been a big help to me and everyone else!!!!!
Does the manual have a section that deals with "random sized bales" or "adjusting bale size compared to readout"?
Bydays end, I was only making a useless 48" bale!


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## mlappin (Jun 25, 2009)

I had a very similar problem once with my 644, I'm guessing I got to close to a tree and a branch snagged the wires on the sensor for the bale size on the right side of the baler. Did exactly what you described, would make a few bales too big then the next ones would be too small. It pulled a connection apart in the plug just enough it wasn't grounding correctly all the time.

I see you have a 648 which was practically identical to the 644's. I don't have my Bale Command manual atm, the neighbor has it as he left it out one of the few times it has rained since haymaking started. I have a BR740A but I believe the Bale Commands are all the same. I'll see if I run into him in the American Legion in the Am during breakfast.

A quick fix would be to check and make sure all the linkage moves freely on the bale size sensor.


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## Nitram (Apr 2, 2011)

Don't have JD but You might try checking the reed switches and the arm that triggers it. Sounds like it is moving back and forth on you. Is the B C reading 60 every time? if it is it has to be the switch that is telling it that its time to tie. If the switches are tight and so is the trigger arm or what ever JD uses to trigger the switch then its back to the B C module. Hope this helps Martin


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## JD3430 (Jan 1, 2012)

I dont have a lot of seat time with the baler, but when it worked correctly, it would start and stay at 30" for a while then go 32", 34",36"......to 60" then the alarm would sound and it would bale perfectly.
Now it climbs faster because the command thinks the bale is 60", but it's not.

One thing I noticed **might*** be different is when I close the tailgate, the baler goes backwards from 54", back down to 30" on the readout when I commence making a new bale. Didn't notice that before (but as I said, only maybe 10 hours seat time). Sometimes it will sound the alarm at 54" or 58" (even though it's set on 60"), but that seemed to subside after about the 20th bale. It's so inconsistent, there's no way to explain it in a way that would probably be understandable.
What it seems like to me is that there's a sensor sending bad info to the bale command plus.....but I'm also the one who thought I was making 54" bales when I was making 60" bales!!


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## mike10 (May 29, 2011)

Had a guy last week that had similar problems with a BR7090. Bale size shown on the display would be correct but the bales coming out the back were different sizes. He was wanting 60" bales and they were coming out at different sizes. The bale size would remain fixed on one number and then suddenly jump up to a different number. He tried recalibrating, and installed a new potentiometer. Turned out his problem was at the connection between the tractor harness and the operators panel in the cab. The way he had the operators panel installed in the cab, the harness just dangled from the bottom of the panel. He tied the harness up so the weight was not pulling down on the connection and that solved his problem. Be sure you also turn the locking ring so it locks securely into place. The other place you need to look is at the connection between the tractor and the baler harness. The three notched tabs in the locking ring need to be in line with the rest of the locking ring or the baler connector will not lock into position. Either you will not be able to lock the ring on the tractor connector or the ring will allow the connector to back partially apart. You should see the knobs on the tractor connector through the holes in the locking ring tabs and they should be close to being aligned. If the knobs are to the front of the holes, you are not getting a good connection.


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## JD3430 (Jan 1, 2012)

That could very well be the problem. I haven't checked te connection between BCP and the harness that goes into it from the bottom!!!
Will check today.


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## NDVA HAYMAN (Nov 24, 2009)

Jd3430, You do need to recalibrate the bale size by pushing the bale size button and then the plus or minus button to the left of that. I would set it for 58" and go from there. You might also take some electronic contact cleaner and spray in all of your connections.That would be a start in my opinion. You can roll out some hay and see what it does by rebaling. Mike


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## Nitram (Apr 2, 2011)

Overfill bale size setting could it be overriding your full bale size setting? It shouldn't let you set below full bale size but it's something more to look at. Martin


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## JD3430 (Jan 1, 2012)

I made about 75 round bales. First 25 were all different sizes-anything from 60"-50".
The final 50 bales were all 48". It's as if it defaulted to 48" and stayed there for the final 50 bales.
I checked the electrical connections. The one between baler & tractor was tight. The one going up into the BCP was just slightly loose. Maybe a 1/2 turn. I don't think that would have been a problem.
BCP bale setting is on 60.
I have enough hay on the ground to make maybe 2-3 more bales. I could unroll a few that didn't bale very nicely and re-bale them.


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## mike10 (May 29, 2011)

Here is how you calibrate bale size. Immediately after you eject the bale and close the endgate, go and measure the bale. Say it is 50" for this example. Go back in the cab and press and *HOLD* the open book key until the alarm sounds. You will see 1 on the left of the display and 60, or the bale size you have programed on the right side of the display. Repeatedly press the plus or minus keys until the bale size is what actually came out of the baler. In this example it would be 50. Once you get the bale size entered, then press and *HOLD* the bale size key until the alarm sounds. You are now calibrated. Turn off the panel and turn back on and you should be ready to go. You may need to do this more than once to get it correct, but it should change the size of the bale after you do this.


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## JD3430 (Jan 1, 2012)

That's exactly what we did and it didn't work. I will try again tomorrow.


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## JD3430 (Jan 1, 2012)

mike10 said:


> Here is how you calibrate bale size. Immediately after you eject the bale and close the endgate, go and measure the bale. Say it is 50" for this example. Go back in the cab and press and *HOLD* the open book key until the alarm sounds. You will see 1 on the left of the display and 60, or the bale size you have programed on the right side of the display. Repeatedly press the plus or minus keys until the bale size is what actually came out of the baler. In this example it would be 50. Once you get the bale size entered, then press and *HOLD* the bale size key until the alarm sounds. You are now calibrated. Turn off the panel and turn back on and you should be ready to go. * You may need to do this more than once to get it correct, but it should change the size of the bale after you do this*.


OK, I tried to do it three times instead of all at once and it seems to have worked. We went from a 48" to a 52" to a 58" to a full 60" bale.
The first time we recalibrated, we went from a 48" all the way to a 60" and it didn't work.
What I would like to know is why is came out of calibration in the first place???


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## mlappin (Jun 25, 2009)

If I recall correctly, somewhere in that system should be a hearing aid type battery, this is for memory kinda like a bios battery on a MB in a PC. Mike10 will know better. If it doesn't do it again, I'd call it a fluke and not worry about it. You'll love this baler once you get used to it. I made a LOT of bales with my 644, only reason I got rid of it was to get a Silage Special and the Xtra Sweep.


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## mike10 (May 29, 2011)

I think when you posted that you could turn the locking ring on the bottom of the operators panel a half turn is when you found your initial problem. You should feel that locking ring snap into place and lock with no movement when properly tightened. Any looseness in this connector will give you problems.

As for why your initial calibration did not work was probably due to a missed step or the controller did not see things done in the right order. It is not unusual to have to calibrate more than once to get the right bale size since some of it depends on fast you stop when the alarm sounds or how heavy the windrow is at that particular time. It does not take much travel distance to increase the size of the bale in a heavy windrow.


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## JD3430 (Jan 1, 2012)

I also found the "volume control" for the BCP. man that thing was LOUD!!! Now I can turn it down.


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