# Educate me on carted wheel rakes



## Hayboy1 (Jul 19, 2008)

I have never run any rakes other than NH rolabar breaks with a hydraulic bridge hitch. It works but we are getting bigger every year and are going to need to get another set. I have some guys we buy from that just bought an H&S 12 wheel rake with the kicker wheel. Said he loves it. We bale roughly 30,000 bales and run two older NH balers. One with an 18 bale accumulator and one with a pan thrower. Would this be ok for size or should I consider stepping it down a little bit. I cannot justify $25k for rotary setup and I need to be able to take 2ton first cutting without overloading the balers. Also can you adjust the width of the windrows coming out the back? What if you need to flip the row over the following day? Is that feasible? I have lots more questions, but will start with the basics. TIA


----------



## hillside hay (Feb 4, 2013)

My cousin took the money he saved not buying the double rotary and got a used inverter to flip the windrow. I believe the NH whell rake you can flip a couple wheels up to adjust in heavier crops.


----------



## Hayboy1 (Jul 19, 2008)

I have a NH144 inverter, pile of crap for the most part.


----------



## Teslan (Aug 20, 2011)

I have a 12 wheel Kuhn Speedrake. It's good. I don't know how it would compare to a rolabar rake. It seems many guys around here are going to big Darf wheel rakes. I went to a double Krone Rotary and it's a lot better then the Kuhn wheel rake. I'm keeping the wheel rake for a backup. Though I know you said you couldn't justify the cost of a rotary and if you have to ted anyways where you are maybe a rotary rake wouldn't help things dry faster. Those big Darf wheel rakes cost as much as a double rotary rake. Do you combine two windrows now with your roabar rake. I can't see an older NH small square baler being able to handle my 1st cutting grass hay if I combined two windrows.

Maybe you need a single rotary rake?


----------



## Hayboy1 (Jul 19, 2008)

I double if I can, single plus a half row . I make big rows, bale slow, and it works good, just trying to think ahead. I wouldn't go any larger than a 12 wheel model for sure. I really like the speed factor and they seem to make a fluffy row vs the roping of the nh


----------



## Teslan (Aug 20, 2011)

Hayboy1 said:


> I double if I can, single plus a half row . I make big rows, bale slow, and it works good, just trying to think ahead. I wouldn't go any larger than a 12 wheel model for sure. I really like the speed factor and they seem to make a fluffy row vs the roping of the nh


I find that my wheel rake does rope hay. I didn't think it really did that much until I got the Krone. I can bale 1-2 miles an hour faster after having raked with the Krone rotary then the Kuhn wheel rake. It just feeds better into my 3x3 baler. But then I'm raking windrows and not a tedded field. So the rolabar must really rope.


----------



## Hayboy1 (Jul 19, 2008)

It does, but if you've raked as much as I have with them you can somewhat avoid it. I love rotary style rakes, just not a $25-30k kind of love...lol


----------



## 8350HiTech (Jul 26, 2013)

Hayboy1 said:


> It does, but if you've raked as much as I have with them you can somewhat avoid it. I love rotary style rakes, just not a $25-30k kind of love...lol


They sell used rakes too.


----------



## Nitram (Apr 2, 2011)

How wide is your cutter? My 12 wheel combines two rows leaving 5ft wide windrows. My discbine is 13'3''. It matches up.


----------



## Hayboy1 (Jul 19, 2008)

Nitram said:


> How wide is your cutter? My 12 wheel combines two rows leaving 5ft wide windrows. My discbine is 13'3''. It matches up.


I run a center pivot disc that does 13'6


----------



## Nitram (Apr 2, 2011)

Should be fine as you narrow your windrows more than I the rake will be spread out further (wider reach)


----------



## Hayboy1 (Jul 19, 2008)

I know they sell used rakes, guys I buy from said they spent $6600 on the H&S. That's a big difference vs even a used double rotary. I guess my question is....if you had a choice for the money? I know rotary rakes do a wonderful job, but there are a lot of things that could go wrong.V-rakes seem to be much simpler, and less costly to repair


----------



## somedevildawg (Jun 20, 2011)

If you're doing grass, I see no problem with a carted wheel rake, h&s is a good one, 6.6k seems like a lot....
Fantastic mobility between fields, does rope hay but the dryer the hay, the less it ropes....flipping windrows is not too bad, more like moving them over, but some of it is flipped.....windrow is adjustable, get a kicker wheel if you can, unless you ted every cutting....then it's no big deal. Very fast, exponentially faster than a rollabar. Kicks a bit of dirt/rocks into the winrow, not too bad tho....
Check the prices in the frontier rakes, I bought a 8- wheel with kicker several (6) yrs ago for 3.8k...prolly 4.5 now
For the best, the kuhn speedrake is arguably the best engineered.....hth


----------



## cmd (Oct 26, 2012)

I am buying a carted rake this fall. I have looked at every one I can around the neighborhood and farm shows. NH, kuhn, vermeer, ogden, h&s, enorossi, etc, given what I know from running a kuhn speedrake of a friends a lot and being around other wheel rakes I had some key designs I wanted on my new rake....... I rank the Pequea and CURRENT MODEL NH as pretty much equal and best. then kuhn and ogden, then vermeer, h&s, and enorossi, and whatever else is left, those three are all made cheaply and I won't even consider them. The big vermeer rakes look nice but not the 8-12 wheel size.

That said, I am planning on going with the Pequea. I like it's width adjustment a little better than the NH but I do like that the NH can pin up the two first wheels. I'm sure I can make the Pequea though if if doesn't already.


----------



## Tx Jim (Jun 30, 2014)

I like my H&S Hi-cap bi-fold 14 wheel rake I've owned since '02 and it has raked 1000's upon 1000's of acres. My neighbor had a Krone rotary but it has too many moving parts and too many little tires for my liking plus I didn't like the type windrow it made. I like a 5' flat,even windrow raking three 9'3" cuts together


----------



## Teslan (Aug 20, 2011)

Tx Jim said:


> I like my H&S Hi-cap bi-fold 14 wheel rake I've owned since '02 and it has raked 1000's upon 1000's of acres. My neighbor had a Krone rotary but it has too many moving parts and too many little tires for my liking plus I didn't like the type windrow it made. I like a 5' flat,even windrow raking three 9'3" cuts together


Not like the windrow a Krone rotary rakes makes? To each their own I guess. To me it makes it just right so that the hay will dry fast (I don't ted). Grass and alfalfa dries much faster then with my wheel rake. It also saves way more leaves on alfalfa then my speedrake does. Though I know I shouldn't compare my Kuhn rake to your H&S rake though. I also rake two windrows together from a 15 foot cut.


----------



## cmd (Oct 26, 2012)

Tx Jim said:


> I like my H&S Hi-cap bi-fold 14 wheel rake I've owned since '02 and it has raked 1000's upon 1000's of acres. My neighbor had a Krone rotary but it has too many moving parts and too many little tires for my liking plus I didn't like the type windrow it made. I like a 5' flat,even windrow raking three 9'3" cuts together


need to point out, your rake is not what is considered a "carted rake" like this topic is about...


----------



## endrow (Dec 15, 2011)

We have a carted H&S V-12 . We like it . You cant beat it for speed 28 ft at 9 mph . We use a rotary for real Heavy crops . But for the later cuttings a wheel rake is fine . If you had all big fields I would go bi fold . But if you had some small fields go carted .


----------



## endrow (Dec 15, 2011)

Teslan said:


> I have a 12 wheel Kuhn Speedrake. It's good. I don't know how it would compare to a rolabar rake. It seems many guys around here are going to big Darf wheel rakes. I went to a double Krone Rotary and it's a lot better then the Kuhn wheel rake. I'm keeping the wheel rake for a backup. Though I know you said you couldn't justify the cost of a rotary and if you have to ted anyways where you are maybe a rotary rake wouldn't help things dry faster. Those big Darf wheel rakes cost as much as a double rotary rake. Do you combine two windrows now with your roabar rake. I can't see an older NH small square baler being able to handle my 1st cutting grass hay if I combined two windrows.
> 
> Maybe you need a single rotary rake?


Very good point your not going to rake 30'of heavy 1st cutting hay on a single row and have a good day if you have a smaller 315 NH


----------



## Hayboy1 (Jul 19, 2008)

so the overall consensus seems to be that H&S is a fairly decent rake. I think I will be looking for a high capacity 10 to 12 wheel V-rake, not the carted kind.Sorry if I added confusion. 
We ted everything at least once, mainly twice. We have no problem retaining moisture in these parts, it's getting rid of it, that is tricky. My main concern for right now, is not having a wide enough pick-up on the balers compared to the newer big throated NH's. Those are next for replacement, but not just yet. I know a single rotary won't cut it and for the money of even a good used tandem rotary, I could almost buy two new 12 wheeled v-rakes. Right now we are putting roughly 15-18' through the balers and they handle it well. I can add a cheap third baler if needed. Most of our fields are 15 acres plus and I straight line mow as much as possible


----------



## Tx Jim (Jun 30, 2014)

cmd said:


> need to point out, your rake is not what is considered a "carted rake" like this topic is about...


Nor is a rotary rake like what this topic is about. Since I'm off topic my bi-fold will do a better raking job than a carted rake in heavy hay.


----------



## somedevildawg (Jun 20, 2011)

Hayboy1 said:


> so the overall consensus seems to be that H&S is a fairly decent rake. I think I will be looking for a high capacity 10 to 12 wheel V-rake, not the carted kind.Sorry if I added confusion.
> We ted everything at least once, mainly twice. We have no problem retaining moisture in these parts, it's getting rid of it, that is tricky. My main concern for right now, is not having a wide enough pick-up on the balers compared to the newer big throated NH's. Those are next for replacement, but not just yet. I know a single rotary won't cut it and for the money of even a good used tandem rotary, I could almost buy two new 12 wheeled v-rakes. Right now we are putting roughly 15-18' through the balers and they handle it well. I can add a cheap third baler if needed. Most of our fields are 15 acres plus and I straight line mow as much as possible


I believe you are talking about a carted rake....bi folds are a bit different in design but the same method of operation. For your info, I don't buy hay equipment now if I can help it, especially not new....
Three years ago, in the dead of winter I bought a double rotary kuhn rake for $5k, had to drive 320 miles to get it but It has been an awesome rake....1 busted hydro line.....damned euro fittings tho....


----------



## TJH (Mar 23, 2014)

I agree with Devildawg, do not buy equipment in "season" unless it's absolutely necessary. They are more willing to deal in Dec, Jan, and Feb.


----------



## Tx Jim (Jun 30, 2014)

endrow said:


> Very good point your not going to rake 30'of heavy 1st cutting hay on a single row and have a good day if you have a smaller 315 NH


That's part of the reason a bi-fold rake similar to my H&S H-cap is far SUPERIOR to a carted rake because with the touch of a hyd lever I can rake one,two or three 9'3" cuts to accommodate rd or sq baler and amount of hay in each 9'3" swath. Not to mention that the rake wheels are in front of instead behind the rake frames so my rake will rake thicker hay without plugging. In 2007 when we had above normal rainfall I had to rake one 9'3" swath for rd baling as this one Coastal field made 7 rd bales per acre in one cutting.


----------



## cmd (Oct 26, 2012)

Many of the current high capacity carted rakes have hydraulic width adjustment as an option and will flow a good bit of hay. much more than the old low frame type. For only getting 12 wheels I'd think carted would be fine for most people.


----------



## Tx Jim (Jun 30, 2014)

cmd

I will agree carted rakes have been improved a lot since their introduction. On my bi-fold I can adjust raking width and windrow width totally independent of the other but I think would those 2 functions on a carted rake would be dependent on each other even with hyd windrow width adjustment.although I haven't seen that type rake


----------



## cmd (Oct 26, 2012)

Tx Jim said:


> cmd
> 
> I will agree carted rakes have been improved a lot since their introduction. On my bi-fold I can adjust raking width and windrow width totally independent of the other but I think would those 2 functions on a carted rake would be dependent on each other even with hyd windrow width adjustment.although I haven't seen that type rake


That is my only real complaint with them and I think Pequea is the only one that has a good solution. Going to find out soon enough... They do all have both overall and windrow width adjustment but like you said they are dependent on each other. That said, we aren't adjusting more than once a day and more or less from big baler to little baler or 1st to 2nd cutting.


----------



## Fowllife (Sep 10, 2010)

I have a Case WR101 (same as NH 5920 or Sitrex QR-8.) The rake width and windrow width can both be adjusted independently. The angle of the wings can be adjusted by moving the pins in the frame to make it rake narrower or wider. The arm the wing mounts to can also be moved in and out to adjust windrow width. Hopefully that makes sense?

With the carted Hi-Cap rakes you can also plumb the sides separate to use single sided if you need to also. Min is plumbed together right now but I can still raise it up and pin one side and single rake if I want to. Comes in handy in odd shaped fields and against tree lines.

They all have there place. In most of my small, odd shaped fields anything bigger then a carted 12 wheel would be a bigger pain then it was worth.


----------



## cmd (Oct 26, 2012)

Fowllife said:


> I have a Case WR101 (same as NH 5920 or Sitrex QR-8.) The rake width and windrow width can both be adjusted independently. The angle of the wings can be adjusted by moving the pins in the frame to make it rake narrower or wider. The arm the wing mounts to can also be moved in and out to adjust windrow width. Hopefully that makes sense?


It's not independent, if you push the front wheels out wider to take a bigger swath, you in turn, narrow the windrow as the back comes together, so then you have to widen the "beam" to move the whole wings out to get the windrow width back. A high capacity rake pivots at the back instead of the middle so windrow width doesn't change.


----------

