# Help with Johnson Grass



## Fireman355

I have Johnson grass coming up in a field that has been cut for hay, it is covering more and more of the field, looks like it has grown from a small area to over an acre in the past two weeks. Local feed store has recommended Maverick, anybody had any luck with this and how would you use it? It is only a 20 oz bottle. I have a 150 gallon tank on a 3 point hitch frame, I have attached a couple of pictures of the spray rig, it is a boom-less model and is working great.

What do I need to get and how do I need to mix it? any advice on how I need to attack this?


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## Hayman1

Fireman355 said:


> I have Johnson grass coming up in a field that has been cut for hay, it is covering more and more of the field, looks like it has grown from a small area to over an acre in the past two weeks. Local feed store has recommended Maverick, anybody had any luck with this and how would you use it? It is only a 20 oz bottle. I have a 150 gallon tank on a 3 point hitch frame, I have attached a couple of pictures of the spray rig, it is a boom-less model and is working great.
> 
> What do I need to get and how do I need to mix it? any advice on how I need to attack this?


I don't know anything about maverick but have used good Roundup very successfully to eliminate JG from my farm. The key is let it get tall and head out but not drop seeds. Then nuke it with Roundup. If you spray it too early it does not translocate the roundup to the rhyzomes and kill all of the plant. Then with each successive year, you have more and more coming back. If you want to be even more sure cut the seed heads off but that seems like a lot of snipping on an acre.


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## RockyHill

We have some fields that we've been working on getting rid of scattered Johnson grass. Have used a 'weed wiper' with round-up when it gets taller than the good grass. Have used it with ATV mounting but works better on the 40 JD - better clearance and visibility plus easier to drive tractor than ATV. In some spots have used backpack spray with roundup mixed according to label. Was told by some highway department folks that when they sprayed Johnson grass that when they made it too strong it just killed the foliage and not the entire plant and we've had good results with following label rates. However, the 'wiper' does use a strong dose and does work. Our weed wiper is one with pvc covered with a fabric. The instructions do not recommended using the 'ultra' roundup, it is harder to clean the wiper fabric (found that to be true by experience).

Shelia


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## Tim/South

What kind of hay is in the field the Johnson grass has invaded? There may be a specific herbicide that will not harm the hay and kill the JG.

I have always had to spray Johnson Grass twice. Once to make it sick and turn yellow. Then again while it is weak.


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## Fireman355

I have a mixture of Fescue, Orchard and a little Bermuda coming out now. I just got in from walking over it, I think I have more that 4 acres that has a good stand on it. It varies in height from 10 to 14 inch's. Tim what do you use to spray it and how do you apply it?


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## bluefarmer

I have been told pastora is the herbicide to use


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## Tim/South

Fireman355 said:


> Tim what do you use to spray it and how do you apply it?


On big patches I use a sprayer much like the one you have and spray with 2-4-D and spray it twice or more. It is easier to kill after it has been cut and is in the tender regrowth stage.

I have hand sprayed with an electric sprayer from the Gator. When I try that I use Round Up and just spray the top half since it is usually taller than the other grasses.

One of my friends just bought one of these: http://www.weedproblems.com/index.php/products/grassworks-weed-wipers/tractor-model-weed-wiper

He intends to use it on various weeds but mainly to get rid of Johnson Grass and Reed Canary Grass in his Bermuda fields. His is the 10 ft. model and cost @ 5k with shipping. I wish I could rent one of those for a day.


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## Fireman355

Thanks Tim, we are getting rain showers this week, it is suppose to let up after the weekend, I think I will try the round up on the thick patches and strong 2*4 D on the small patches, then I will have to drill something where This stuff was.......


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## Vol

Pastora works great on Bermuda and Orchard Grass......kills Timothy and Fescues thou....and stunts the Bermuda and Orchard Grass for a few weeks. But oh how it wipes out the Johnson Grass.

Regards, Mike


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## Fireman355

It won't hurt me to loose that much fescue, if I get rid of that johnson stuff, I can always drill in more orchard.


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## FarmerCline

Tim/South said:


> On big patches I use a sprayer much like the one you have and spray with 2-4-D and spray it twice or more. It is easier to kill after it has been cut and is in the tender regrowth stage.
> I have hand sprayed with an electric sprayer from the Gator. When I try that I use Round Up and just spray the top half since it is usually taller than the other grasses.
> 
> One of my friends just bought one of these: http://www.weedproblems.com/index.php/products/grassworks-weed-wipers/tractor-model-weed-wiper
> 
> He intends to use it on various weeds but mainly to get rid of Johnson Grass and Reed Canary Grass in his Bermuda fields. His is the 10 ft. model and cost @ 5k with shipping. I wish I could rent one of those for a day.


 2,4d wont kill Johnson grass....at least not the Johnson grass I have.


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## Bonfire

Fireman355 said:


> Thanks Tim, we are getting rain showers this week, it is suppose to let up after the weekend, I think I will try the round up on the thick patches and strong 2*4 D on the small patches, then I will have to drill something where This stuff was.......


Johnson Grass here would laugh at 24D. You can dig JG up, hang it upside down on a clothes line for a month, replant it and it would start growing again.

Roundup would just create dead patches in your field. If you could get your hands on some Maverick (its called something else now). If you were a neighbor of mine, I'd let you use mine. I have half a bottle left. Got mine at an elevator in OK one time when I was passing through. It's used/was used for grass control in wheat. Has one hellava residual. Don't spray it anywhere you may plan a summer annual crop.

Outrider, that's the name of it! Outrider/Maverick. I guess Outrider is labeled for grass and Maverick is labeled for wheat.

http://www.monsanto.com/sitecollectiondocuments/ito/outrider-in-bermudagrass-hay-and-pasture-fields.pdf


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## Fireman355

So forget 2*4 D and go with Maverick, How much do you use? how do you mix it in your tank?


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## Bonfire

I applied it at the labeled rate for wheat. 2/3 oz per acre. I have a digital scale to weigh it out with. It is a granule. I add it to the tank as it is filling with water and pump engaged for agitation. When full, i let it agitate some more. And add a surfactant.

And please don't use your underline emphasis to me. I feel like your poking your finger in my chest. I might bite back.


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## RockmartGA

The problem with Johnson grass in a Fescue field is that everything that kills JG also kills the fescue.

I've got a rope wick applicator that I made from a piece of 4" pvc pipe. Bought the wicks and fittings and made the rest myself. Still had about $200 in it.

Works well, but you have to keep after it. You can't just treat it one time and forget about it. It's an ongoing battle.


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## Vol

Rockmart....that makes me think that Johnson grass wiped with pastora after the first cutting of grass is off just might be the ticket for fescue fields.

Regards, Mike


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## Fireman355

Bonfire, i didn't mean to a fend you, I was simply asking the question of how you use the product in your equipment,

I have never used it and I am trying to learn about this from experienced users.

we are neighbors, we just have a few miles separating our fences.


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## jamesntexas

cant answer your question but i was hoping i could ask you one.....why do you want to get rid of it?


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## Fireman355

I do not want that kind of grass in my pastures and hay fields, it is not good for hay , it has little feed value, I have found that if you turn the cows on it, they will eat it before they eat the other grass. it doesn't seem to stick to their ribs, just passes right through them.


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## jamesntexas

You might want to research that a little bit more. I dont think you will find anything that says it makes bad hay or that it has low feed value. If you can find something that says that i would like to see it.

Under certain circumstances you have to watch for prussic acid and nitrate poison. Ive never heard of anyone having a problem with it personally though.


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## RockmartGA

Vol said:


> Rockmart....that makes me think that Johnson grass wiped with pastora after the first cutting of grass is off just might be the ticket for fescue fields.


You may be right. I'll have to try that.

There are a couple of things that make it difficult to get rid of JG in fescue/orchard.

1. JG is a prolific seed producer.

2. JG growth cycle is at it's peak during the hot summer months when fescue/orchard growth is low.

3. I swear, JG grows faster than Kudzu.


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## Fireman355

I have always been told by the old farmers around here that the johnson grass that comes up after you first cutting of hay does not have as good of a feed value as other grasses due to it not being fertilized. your first cutting eats up your fertilizer so nothings left. I have always listen to the old guys and followed most of what they have told me.

You think I need to do some more research.


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## mshayfarm

Outrider or Pastora


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## bluefarmer

There has been times in dry weather if it hadn't been for JG I wouldn't hav had hay to bale


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## jamesntexas

well everyplace is different and maybe you have a much better grass to replace it with i dunno. I am no expert but i would imagine if the feed value is low for johnsongrass it will equally low for you other grasses as well.

As a kid that is all we ever fed was johnsongrass hay. Thats what we raised. Mostly because you could count on it growing and it didnt require reseeding. Scratch the ground helps.

I really expected you to say you were raising hay to sell for horse people and you had a mostly pure field of whatever they wanted. I really dont know why you would poison johnsongrass myself if you are baleing for cows.

Just think, you have a grass that you dont have to baby, cows eats it well, if you kill it you will have to put somthing in the bare spots (expense), poison (expense.........i think the nutrional value is just fine and everything i have read on it says the same....you will have to research that yourself. I serioulsly think you should consider embracing it .------you have to watch for prussic acid and nitrate problems though. I have it in my hay field and i wouldnt think about poisoning it. I need to take steps to get it thicker.


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## davang

I spot spray with Pastora, which is Nicosulfuron plus MSM. It works best they say when the plant is small. I have also notice that Chapparal which also has MSM in it stunts it but does not kill. I don't broadcast because Pastora will stunt JIggs according to the label. tried Roundup once but my "helper" killed a bunch of good grass with it.


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## purplewg

Fireman, can you post a picture of the seed head or root system? I have another thread on misidentifed Johnsongrass.


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## Fireman355

Here is what I have. It has been sprayed with Roundup.


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## purplewg

Fireman355 said:


> Here is what I have. It has been sprayed with Roundup.


Yup, that is Johnson grass sorry. Harder to deal with than Vasey.


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## Tx Jim

Fireman355 said:


> I do not want that kind of grass in my pastures and hay fields, it is not good for hay , it has little feed value, I have found that if you turn the cows on it, they will eat it before they eat the other grass. it doesn't seem to stick to their ribs, just passes right through them.


 The reason cows eat Johnson grass 1st when turned in to a field is it's "more palatable" than other grasses. Any lush grass will cause cows poop to get loose and go through them. My cows have the green squirts eating Bermuda grass.. Johnson grass hay baled correctly before heading out is hard to beat & most animals will walk away from other grass hay to eat GOOD Johnson grass hay. BUUUT I don't like JG in my Coastal because it takes longer to dry to correct moisture than other grasses especially if no conditioned PLUS local HORSEY hay buyers don't like JG in Coastal hay because they think it will kill a horse!! YEA RIGHT!


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## purplewg

The problem with all those seeding grasses is the cows eat them and poop out the seeds in your good hay pastures.


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## Fireman355

That is right , cows eat it walk over the fields and leave seeds everywhere, The stalks of grass in the pictures got a dose of Round up, since that they had seeded out the other has spread to over 5 acres so I cut it an have it sold to people who want to feed their goats.

the other fields have anywhere from 1 or 2 stalks in then to an area 5-6 feet across, those also got hit with Round up.

We are trying something new call Eraser, it show the same chemical mix as round up. I will let you know how it does

Soon as I get this finished with the hay, I will fertilize as my soil test has recommended, and set back to watch the rain, When the johnson grass pops up again I plan on hitting it with Maverick. Got to get that stuff gone.

I plan on drilling in orchard clover mix this fall.

I do want to thank everyone for their comments, This has been very helpful.


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## purplewg

Yep, Vaseygrass got away from me last year while I was laid up. I hated to do it but I had to Glyphosate almost half of one of my pastures due to Vaseygrass. It dealt with it but it also dealt with the grass. I had to have it gone though. I spot sprayed the field behind it. Hopefully I can control anything that sprouts from leftover seeds with 2-4D if I catch it early. If not Maverick might.


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