# What do you guys know about Biomass Energy?



## sedurbin (May 30, 2009)

I am interested in learning more about BioMass Energy and particularly how we can develop grass to use for generating power or supplying heat, maybe in the form of pellets. I know there have been some discussions about the Power Plants use of hay. What is going on? Does anyone have any new information? Does anyone have any information about Pelletizing Straw or Hay to be used for heating?

There is some information at the UC Davis website and also at GrassBioenergy.org home

This looks like a possibility for us to develop another use for our product. What do some of you "Smart Guys" know about these issues? It's okay for the "dumb ones" to comment too, you be the judge of who is who


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## Heyhay..eh (Aug 7, 2009)

I am by no means an expert in the field but have followed with interest over the years. Some of the things that I have gleaned.

Heat from composting.

looked into generating heat from composting manure & animal bedding. Have to build a storage bunker with coils in the concrete floor. The heat is transferred from the bunker to the building using liquid medium. Compost material needs to be agitated regularly and fresh material added to sustain composting activity.

Heat from traditional wood burning.

There are a lot of canadian manufacturers of outdoor solid fuel furnaces which generally burn wood or other solid fuels which might not be considered biomass.

Heat from non traditional biomass.

Pellet stoves/furnaces

There are more of these coming on the market in Canada using all types of pellets made from grain, straw, corn ... Not sure how they make the pellets but they are like alfalfa pellets or briquettes, so basically grind down add a binder and reform/press.

Straw furnace

Read on one of these high capacity furnaces last year. They cost but put out a lot of btu.
Basically you put 4-5 round bales on a trolley and as needed they advance and are ground (off the face as needed) then blown into the furnace to provide heat.

A lot of what you invest in will depend upon the months you need to heat and the heat that you need to extract during those months. In my case I am just about at the point where we need to heat the house which will continue until may give or take. From Dec to Mar we will need to heat intensively as we will have many days below 0c and some as low as -35c.

Hope this helps a little.

Take care


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## swmnhay (Jun 13, 2008)

A lot of corn furnaces around here.Some mix wood pellets with it to get it started easier.Why couldn't you pellet poor hay and burn it in a corn burner ?Don't know if it would be fesible BTU's,cost of pelleting,etc.?????


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## sedurbin (May 30, 2009)

From what I have read, The folks, at Cornell, conducted tests in a corn stove and found that the hay pellets left a little more ash. They thought that the stove makers could modify the stoves to make it work. I can't help but think that it would be less costly to pelletize hay than it is to pelletize wood. You would think that grinding the hay would take less energy than grinding the wood???

I guess that certain types of grass have less ash content than other types. Who would be more motivated to find out, than a bunch of hay producers? It would be nice to have a market for some junk, low food value hay. IMHO


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## swmnhay (Jun 13, 2008)

Some use sawdust from sawmills to make the pellets.Noticed a lot of them in the Black Hills of SD.I agree about macking pellets out of junk hay.I wonder what it would take to setup a system to make hay pellets?


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## Heyhay..eh (Aug 7, 2009)

Spoke to a friend who had built a furnace for his shop & out buildings. He used to burn small square straw bales in it. 1 over night and 2 in the day to get the heat up (in the dead of winter). He says that he would also use old (dry) hay in the furnace to get rid of it. This was not pelletized just the bale strings and all. Yes it was a big furnace with a large door.

He could also burn 36"+/- length logs if need be.

So maybe your niche is the furnace and the fuel supply.

Take care


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## sedurbin (May 30, 2009)

> October 5 Webinar: Federal Funding Opportunities for Your Biomass Company
> Webinar Overview
> 
> The biomass industry is the second largest renewable energy industry in the country, accounting for 8,500 MW of electricity each year - 45% of the total renewable energy produced in the United States. The industry grew rapidly in the late 1990s and early 2000s, but was hit hard by the recent downturn in the economy. As a result, the industry has developed a strong interest in Federal financing alternatives which are available from a variety of agencies including the Departments of Treasury, Energy, and Agriculture.
> ...


 I wish I didn't have to work on Monday, so I could hear what these guys have to say about this topic. Maybe one of you could get some good from it.


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## Hayboy1 (Jul 19, 2008)

Switchgrass seems to be the grass of choice for most when it comes to making pellets out of grass. But upon further searching, Miscanthus seems to be even better for two reason, one is the ethanol it contains and secondly for the shear size and texture. There was a gentleman around here a few years ago who was trying to do grass pellets at shelburne farms in vt. Shelburne Farms - Cultivating a Conservation Ethic ( you have to see this place!) I do not believe they were working as good as hoped but were still trying to do something with them. I was seriously contemplating the switchgrass pellets at one point until I found out they were willing to pay me $35/ton for the bales!! Hence the reason we opted to go with sunflowers and make our own fuel! Wondering what the stalks of sunflowers would do as far as BTU's go??


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## UpNorth (Jun 15, 2009)

Hayboy1 said:


> Switchgrass seems to be the grass of choice for most when it comes to making pellets out of grass. But upon further searching, Miscanthus seems to be even better for two reason, one is the ethanol it contains and secondly for the shear size and texture. There was a gentleman around here a few years ago who was trying to do grass pellets at shelburne farms in vt. Shelburne Farms - Cultivating a Conservation Ethic ( you have to see this place!) I do not believe they were working as good as hoped but were still trying to do something with them. I was seriously contemplating the switchgrass pellets at one point until I found out they were willing to pay me $35/ton for the bales!! Hence the reason we opted to go with sunflowers and make our own fuel! Wondering what the stalks of sunflowers would do as far as BTU's go??


Trouble with Miscanthus is it won't survive the winters west of the Northeast. Somebody got all excited about it out here last year and had all their plots die off last winter all across WI. Miscanthus does sound exciting, but outside of the Northeast and maybe the Pacific Northwest I don't see it surviving very long in the northern part of the country.


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## sedurbin (May 30, 2009)

Thats pretty much what was presented at the Bio-Energy Conference on Dec 1st. It should establish and grow alright in Missouri but.... At $1.80 per plant and 4000 plants per acre, I don't think I will be planting any for a while. Sounds like the best deal would be selling the starter plants.


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## downtownjr (Apr 8, 2008)

When I get back from my latest trip I'll try to get the slides from the conference we both attended on 1 Dec. I know some guys are playing with a small plot of Miscanthus in southern IN and University of IL have some plots in IL...a couple near Decatur on the the Farm Progress Show grounds. The biggest problem is a market...One of the briefers discussed how there was a loophole in the cellulose ethanol production rules that allows the companies to buy themselves out of buying cellulose ethanol...therefore only corn ethanol is being bought. Also, no raise in the 10% mark being seen anytime soon...and the entire 85% needs can be covered by one plant. I hope to have some more discussions soon with the guys at the Energy Center at Purdue...but I don't see any movement outside of Tennessee and the Show Me CO-OP guys in Missouri really doing much in the biomass arena. Maybe in South Dakota if they can pull it off. What do you guys think?


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