# Annual grass control in cool season grasses



## FarmerCline (Oct 12, 2011)

Are there any options for controlling annual warm season grasses in cool season perennials like orchard grass and smooth brome? I'm not aware of anything that is labeled to use but I might be overlooking something. Crabgrass and goosegrass are my two main problems. I'm having a pretty bad issue in one of my fields of smooth brome. Im hoping to move away from growing as much alfalfa and plant more grass this fall but I need to be able to find something that will control the annual grass weeds for that to be a viable option in most fields.

Hayden


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## rjmoses (Apr 4, 2010)

A thick stand is your best control. Otherwise Sencor and Dual Magnum may work when applied after the grass has gone dormant, but I don't know about labeling for your area,

Ralph


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## valleyforage (Apr 28, 2015)

Quinstar has worked in orchard for foxtail and crabgrass for me. Use a good surfactant and don't add fertilizer.


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## FarmerCline (Oct 12, 2011)

rjmoses said:


> A thick stand is your best control. Otherwise Sencor and Dual Magnum may work when applied after the grass has gone dormant, but I don't know about labeling for your area,
> 
> Ralph


 Even with a thick stand the summer annual grasses come in after first cutting or later on in the summer. As the cool season grasses slow down during the summer it gives the annuals a chance to invade. Here the grasses never fully go into winter dormancy so I have always been afraid of spraying something that requires it to be dormant.....same deal with alfalfa.....it doesn't grow much but stays green all winter. Not against spraying something slightly off label in certain cases if it works.....for example I found Basagran works very well for controlling yellow nutsedge in alfalfa.


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## FarmerCline (Oct 12, 2011)

valleyforage said:


> Quinstar has worked in orchard for foxtail and crabgrass for me. Use a good surfactant and don't add fertilizer.


 Just looked up the label for Quinstar and it looks like it might just be the ticket. It is even labeled for grasses grown for hay and has a short (7 day) waiting period for cutting. The only thing is that it doesn't list goosegrass as a weed controlled.....guess I might just have to spray and see.

When you have used Quinstar did it hurt or stunt the grass any? I'm guessing when you said don't use fertilizer you meant not mixing it with liquid N? I have already topdressed these fields with grandular N a few weeks ago.


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## valleyforage (Apr 28, 2015)

No damage, I usually put ammonium sulfate in with herbicide but was told not to with quinstar. I did mix it with generic weed-master.


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## FarmerCline (Oct 12, 2011)

Did a little more reasearch on the Quinstar herbicide. I found some info on a lawn site that said it was useless on goosegrass. But it does appear like it is a good postemergence option for crabgrass as well as foxtail and barnyard grass. Only thing I don't like is that it does have a long rotation period for sensitive crops like alfalfa and other broadleaf crops (24months).

http://www.cdms.net/ldat/ld7DM001.pdf


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## VA Haymaker (Jul 1, 2014)

valleyforage said:


> Quinstar has worked in orchard for foxtail and crabgrass for me. Use a good surfactant and don't add fertilizer.


Sounds like the perfect herbicide to use with timothy. With the timothy going dormant and non-competitive, something to use for late summer control of foxtail would be great.

Question is - what will Quinstar to do a field of timothy?


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## FarmerCline (Oct 12, 2011)

leeave96 said:


> Sounds like the perfect herbicide to use with timothy. With the timothy going dormant and non-competitive, something to use for late summer control of foxtail would be great.
> 
> Question is - what will Quinstar to do a field of timothy?


 I would suspect it might be safe on Timothy since it is okay to use on other cool season grasses and it only controls warm season annual grasses. I would try a small pass to see how it reacts before spraying a whole field. My experience with Timothy is that it seems more sensitive to herbicides than other grasses.

Quinstar does appear like it might be an excellent option for much needed control of most summer annual grasses.....just wish it would control goosegrass. I kind of wonder why Quinstar isn't more well know.....I wasn't aware of any herbicides that would control the summer grasses selectively. Glad I posted this thread.


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## FarmerCline (Oct 12, 2011)

Valleyforage, what rate of Quinstar do you use and how much are you paying for it? Looked online and I found some but it was super expensive.


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## 8350HiTech (Jul 26, 2013)

Prowl H2O is labeled for orchard grass now. Not sure if timothy will handle it.


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## FarmerCline (Oct 12, 2011)

8350HiTech said:


> Prowl H2O is labeled for orchard grass now. Not sure if timothy will handle it.


 Good to know.....I had read on here a while back of Prowl H2O being a preemerge option but didn't realize it had actually been labeled for use on cool season grasses. Before posting this thread I actually figured that was probably going to be my only option.....labeled or not.

Just looked up the label on Prowl H2O and didn't see at first where it was labeled for use on cool season grasses for hay but then I found a supplemental label for use on cool season grasses. It does state that it can be used on Timothy as well. Also, unless I'm overlooking something else Prowl H2O is my only option for annual grass control if I decide to add some grasses to my alfalfa stands.

http://www.cdms.net/ldat/ld6CT002.pdf


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## valleyforage (Apr 28, 2015)

FarmerCline said:


> Valleyforage, what rate of Quinstar do you use and how much are you paying for it? Looked online and I found some but it was super expensive.


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## valleyforage (Apr 28, 2015)

1lb to the acre, $41 per lb, I bought mine at Coastal Ag... yes expensive but seemed to work well for me this year to rescue a couple of fields.


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## FarmerCline (Oct 12, 2011)

valleyforage said:


> 1lb to the acre, $41 per lb, I bought mine at Coastal Ag... yes expensive but seemed to work well for me this year to rescue a couple of fields.


 Thanks! What size were the weeds when you sprayed? I'm guessing the smaller they are the easier to kill. This year the crabgrass had already headed out so I figured it was too late to spray. I'm sure I will have even more next year so what I think I'm going to do is spray Prowl H2O as a preemerge and they use the Quinstar as a post emerge if I have to. That is pricey but it would be worth it to have clean hay.


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## Palmettokat (Jul 10, 2017)

DO NOT take this without checking it but per my reading of Clemson's guide, Pastora has best results on Goosegrass. Been a while since I printed this off about April but if you go to their web site and search it their Grass Forage Weed Control should be easy to find. I was looking only for Coastal and that is what I printed off. They have a chart in it you can look up your weed to see quickly how a wide range of herbicides are rated for treating it.


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## FarmerCline (Oct 12, 2011)

Palmettokat said:


> DO NOT take this without checking it but per my reading of Clemson's guide, Pastora has best results on Goosegrass. Been a while since I printed this off about April but if you go to their web site and search it their Grass Forage Weed Control should be easy to find. I was looking only for Coastal and that is what I printed off. They have a chart in it you can look up your weed to see quickly how a wide range of herbicides are rated for treating it.


 Pastora would work on Bermuda grass but isn't for use on cool season grasses. It actually controls some of the cool season grass species.


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## valleyforage (Apr 28, 2015)

Small, I mowed late may and sprayed first week of June. I think the label even says less than 3" for max control. It did "tick off" the goosegrass but it seemed like it came back thicker than ever. But I'll take it with a grain of salt b/c this summer has seemed to be horrible for goosegrass even in mixed grass, and or undisturbed soils.

Pastora-- not in orchard, tried that once, will not do it again. Great tho in your wick bar for Johnsongrass.

Prowl- I have ordered some to spray early next year on some 1 yr old orchard.. thanks for that info by the way, I bought some b/c of this website.


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## Palmettokat (Jul 10, 2017)

FarmerCline said:


> Pastora would work on Bermuda grass but isn't for use on cool season grasses. It actually controls some of the cool season grass species.


 And that is why I said check on it. I only printed off the info for Coastal Bermuda. That is also what is so great about this site, pros like you to point out mistakes. Thanks. KT


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