# DEF



## endrow (Dec 15, 2011)

For those of you that use DEF in your pickup , Do you buy it in containers and pour it in or get it somewhere where it can be pumped


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## r82230 (Mar 1, 2016)

Usually get where it's pumped in, use containers on telly. Rational: don't like partial open containers around. Telly takes whole 2.5 or 5 gal if i let it get low enough. Pickup will take 2.5 gal only if low enough (4.3 gal tank ??). Pick up more of a PITA to fill/over fill too.

I have absolutely zero gals sitting around in the winter, so I don't have to worry about any freezing. Maybe I wouldn't do either (containers/winter storage) if I had higher usage. I'd be guessing maybe 15-25 gallon usage a year and both seem to sip the DEF. Truck might use 3-5 gals total per year. First 3 years, GM filled it with free oil changes (had to remind them however, that it was included  ).

Larry


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## somedevildawg (Jun 20, 2011)

Buy it at pump....I hate dealing with the waste of the jugs.


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## JD3430 (Jan 1, 2012)

Both, Pump or wal mart type jugs. I don't like to have it sitting around.


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## Cactus50 (Nov 26, 2020)

I have my DEF topped off every time I have the truck serviced; that way I don't have to deal with the containers. My wife on the other hand has a 2019 JD5100M so in that case I buy the 2.5gal containers.


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## MtnHerd (Jul 6, 2011)

Don't have any pumps around here. My truck is only thing that uses def, just let it get low enough and buy the 2.5 gallons and pour it in. No storage.


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## endrow (Dec 15, 2011)

Another ? All my diesel trucks farm tagged fill out of our farm tank and i treat the fuel as delivered . I now have a truck that cant use dyed diesel and I will Fill it at the local truck stop. For

those who fill at the pump do you carry treatment along for lubricity and cold weather and add before you pump or is some fuel at the pumps already treated . For those who add curious what treatment you use


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## endrow (Dec 15, 2011)

If your DEF Freezes in the tank on your pickup is that an issue


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## JD3430 (Jan 1, 2012)

endrow said:


> If your DEF Freezes in the tank on your pickup is that an issue


Today's DEF trucks go into limp mode if DEF is not delivered properly to the SCR. It has to be something like exactly 32.5% urea and 67.5% deionized water. 
Don't quote me on the exact percentages, but that's close.

I think my Ram tank is heated to prevent freezing. A frozen DEF tank or pump or lines is an issue that will cause limp mode. *DEF freezes at 12 degrees F.

DEF begins to break down above 86 degrees F*, so I do not store it on my property anywhere that gets real hot.

My usual procedure is to go buy 2) 2.5 gallon jugs and fill my tank right in the parking lot and the store will recycle or dispose of the plastic jugs.

I use Power Service products in my fuel as much as I can especially in winter.


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## FCF (Apr 23, 2010)

Don't have a diesel truck that uses DEF but buy fuel at local truck stop. Vehicle enforcement does check if you are running dyed fuel in an licensed vehicle. Carry treatment along in the truck and added before pumping fuel. Use Power Service products; in warmer weather their Diesel Kleen + Cetane Boost and in colder weather their Diesel Fuel Supplement + Cetane Boost. Use both products at the same rate of treatment, 1 once to 3 gallons of fuel. Have used them for about 30 years with absolutely no problems with gelling, dirty injectors or pump failure.


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## haybaler101 (Nov 30, 2008)

No DEF on farm in anything. I have bulk red and clear diesel that comes from country mark coop and that treat if for temperature and never had a problem. Semis run clear and my pickup may or may not run red.


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## r82230 (Mar 1, 2016)

If you are asking about treating fuel, here's what I use:

https://opti-lube.com/opti-lube-xpd-all-in-one-diesel-fuel-additive-1-gallon-without-accessories-treats-up-to-512-gallons/

Carry small bottle in truck, add before filling. One ounce of XPD per 4 gallons.

Have bought a couple of these kits:

https://opti-lube.com/opti-lube-xpd-all-in-one-diesel-fuel-additive-1-gallon-without-accessories-treats-up-to-512-gallons/

Seems I have a couple of boys with diesel trucks too, so little bottles come up missing now and then for some odd reason. 

I don't treat the DEF, if that's the question. I think my Dura-Max has some sort of heater build in, I know my telly does.

Back to additives, there can be several trains of thought, are you looking for the best:


Cetane improvement Perhaps you want to try - Stanadyne Performance Formula
Stabilizer Perhaps you want to try - STA-BIL 360° Performance
Injector cleaner Perhaps you want to try - Lucas 10013 Fuel Treatment
Anti-gel Perhaps you want to try - Howes Lubricator 103060 Diesel Treat
Lubricity Perhaps you want to try - Bio Diesel or Opti-Lube XPD Diesel Fuel Additive

I was after the *lubricity* to minimize the wear factor, the other factors became secondary. If Bio-diesel was available in my area, then I might change my additive. Notice: price was not a factor in my case. 

Larry


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## CowboyRam (Dec 13, 2015)

Has anyone deleted the Def on the pickups. Our mechanic recommended that we delete the Def system on ours. I am not so sure that is a good idea.


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## JD3430 (Jan 1, 2012)

CowboyRam said:


> Has anyone deleted the Def on the pickups. Our mechanic recommended that we delete the Def system on ours. I am not so sure that is a good idea.


Tampering with a federally required emissions device is illegal, but the chances of getting caught are minimal and depending on where you live could be about nonexistent, especially if you don't have emissions inspection 
The DEF system actually has minimal effect on performance compared to a DPF. A DPF is a massive honeycomb restrictive filter that becomes more and more restricted as the miles increase which decreases engine performance. A DEF SCR system is an exhaust after treatment system that drastically lowers the concentration of nitrogen oxides emissions into the atmosphere. Although the components make the vehicle more expensive and complicated (and therefore unreliable), they really don't affect engine performance like a DPF does by restricting exhaust flow or a cooled EGR does by pumping exhaust back into the engine.
The other thing DEF does is it lowers the need for the amount of exhaust gas recirculating (EGR) needed since it cleans the exhaust better than a DPF 
The newer DEF systems have been improved over the systems from 10 years ago.

You never want to add anything to DEF. It will affect the chemical balance of the urea and water and could actually cause truck to throw a fault code.

Light reading: https://www.cumminsfiltration.com/sites/default/files/MB10033.pdf

https://www.capitalremanexchange.com/20-facts-you-need-to-know-about-diesel-exhaust-fluid-def/


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## somedevildawg (Jun 20, 2011)

CowboyRam said:


> Has anyone deleted the Def on the pickups. Our mechanic recommended that we delete the Def system on ours. I am not so sure that is a good idea.


Deleted mine at 100k. Has 260k now....no problems. 
The reason I deleted was the countdown timer was giving issues and not resetting, then the heater malfunctioned.....it was time.


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## CowboyRam (Dec 13, 2015)

I don't think I am going to have any problems emission inspections here in Wyoming. My worry is more along the lines of trade in value. My mechanic said as long as I have the equipment that was taken out I should be fine, but I am not so sure about that. I would hate to be trying to trade it in, and the dealer tell me they won't take my trade.


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## JD3430 (Jan 1, 2012)

CowboyRam said:


> I don't think I am going to have any problems emission inspections here in Wyoming. My worry is more along the lines of trade in value. My mechanic said as long as I have the equipment that was taken out I should be fine, but I am not so sure about that. I would hate to be trying to trade it in, and the dealer tell me they won't take my trade.


there's a private truck dealer near me in Maryland. He has a bunch of newer clean used deleted diesels. Sells them out of state because of MD emissions. I think you are right in that it make the buying audience for your truck smaller. Dealers generally don't want to buy/sell tampered with pollution systems


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## slowzuki (Mar 8, 2011)

It's a tough one on the delete, I personally would not buy a DEF deleted truck even though I drive a DPF deleted truck.

Deleting causes some long term issues that cause headaches. Dealer is ok with it here but still will blame any issue that comes up on the delete. Currently when it's below freezing my truck will dump the boost and fuel to 0 on a cycling timer. Very annoying while driving / towing. It's only about 1/4 second and jerks the whole driveline and occupants. Dealer says it's the delete but truck ran fine deleted for 7 years before this started.


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## somedevildawg (Jun 20, 2011)

CowboyRam said:


> I don't think I am going to have any problems emission inspections here in Wyoming. My worry is more along the lines of trade in value. My mechanic said as long as I have the equipment that was taken out I should be fine, but I am not so sure about that. I would hate to be trying to trade it in, and the dealer tell me they won't take my trade.


Kept all of mine.....I doubt I'll get shed of truck, maybe tho....never know.


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## Bonfire (Oct 21, 2012)

endrow said:


> If your DEF Freezes in the tank on your pickup is that an issue


The DEF tank should have a heater built into it. I think it starts getting slushy around 17?


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