# Which will dry out faster after being rained on Netwrap or Twine Bales ?



## Grateful11 (Apr 5, 2009)

My wife has a question before pursuing a Netwrap baler. We're going to assume less rain would penetrate a Netwrapped bale but once it's in there, as tightly as the surface appears to be matted down, does it dry out slower than a Twine wrapped bale?


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## ANewman (Sep 20, 2012)

Don't really have facts to back it up...thinking out loud. The net holds the hay tighter so water wouldnt penetrate as deeply as it would with a fluffy twine bale, so I would think it would dry quicker. It seems the net would allow the bale to shed water better. I have looked at string tied bales to see how deep they were wet, but never actually parted the net and hay to see on a wrapped bale.


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## Tim/South (Dec 12, 2011)

Net wrapped bales will not soak up nearly as much rain as string bales.

Net creates a smooth surface. String creates ridges and valleys across the bale surface. Those valleys soak up the rain.

I just had 102 net wrapped rolls endure 6 inches of rain. After 3 days of almost 90 degrees you can not tell they were rained on except the bottom of the rolls.

Some say that net holds moisture on the bottom side. I believe any hay stored outside on the ground will absorb what moisture the ground has to offer.

In my experience with round bales, net allows less water in and later allows that moisture to evaporate. Rain goes in as a solid, leaves any bale as vapor no matter the wrapping.


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## rjmoses (Apr 4, 2010)

Several years ago, I read a report that net wrapped bales will have up to 10% less losses compared to string wrapped in the outer 8". That's a significant amount when you consider the amount of volume of hay in each outer inch.

Here's another study which says basically the same thing in Table 3, 15-25% loss using net vs 25-35% loss using twine :

http://www.ca.uky.edu/agc/pubs/agr/agr171/agr171.pdf

Hope this helps.

Ralph


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## hay wilson in TX (Jan 28, 2009)

Really hate to add to supurb answers.

Still if you want your bottom of the bales to stay dry store them on a 4 inch pad of rocks, to keep the soil moisture from wicking up into the hay.

For sure Do Not Stack roundbales for outdoors storage, unless you are in Montana. That will put rain water from the top bales into the lower bales.

Store the hay in LoooooooN rows butted end to end. If possible running N & S and if possible pointing down hill.


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## NDVA HAYMAN (Nov 24, 2009)

I keep my rb's on a rock pad but stacked and tarped with holdowns. When they come out from under the tarps, there is not much difference from when they went in. We stack all of our hay in ND and it keeps pretty well. Not much humidity there. I feel that netwrap does shed a lot of water especially if you add a couple of extra wraps. If I know that a customer will not be tarping his bales, I will add the extra wrap for him. Mike


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## rjmoses (Apr 4, 2010)

hay wilson in TX said:


> Really hate to add to supurb answers.
> 
> Still if you want your bottom of the bales to stay dry store them on a 4 inch pad of rocks, to keep the soil moisture from wicking up into the hay.
> 
> ...


My storage pad is 4" of 2-3" big rock on top of 3-4" of CA6 (waste rock). Just yesterday, I ran my arena tool over it to loosen the big rocks up because it had become packed down from traffic over the last several years.

I believe that having the big rock loose allows the rain to drain through and moisture to escape faster.

If I have too much have, I stack in a 3-2-1 pattern under tarps otherwise I just leave it in rows packed tight end-to-end with about 18" between rows.

Ralph


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## slowzuki (Mar 8, 2011)

In a really high moisture area like where we are it doesn't matter, losses for unprotected outdoor storage is nearly 100% for both types.


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## Grateful11 (Apr 5, 2009)

Thanks for all the info.

Thing is the more she looks the more frightened off she gets by prices. This is the 4th season of using a JD 448 with twine electric tie, slip clutch, left side twine adjuster and pickup gage wheels which came in around $18-19K. A 459 with wide pick up and netwrap is going to run about $34-35K. Everything we've looked at used that suppose to be in so called awesome or like new condition has been a huge let down from rust to cracking hydraulic lines to [email protected] left packed into nearly every spot that can hold [email protected] The baler here puts them all to shame. It's blown off with a leaf blower or the air compressor everytime after it's used, it doesn't take but a few minutes. We look at a new Massey/Hesston 1745 yesterday and it's not a bad looking unit and you can get into netwrap with it for about $24-25K. Also looked at a NH 450 Utility and it can be had for about the same money. I'd say they're machines that are in the 500-1000 bales a year range which is about where the operation here is at.

We talked at length to one dealer that has cows and he bales his own hay and pretty much told us about what you folks have told us as far as water penetration and drying back out. He said he sales many more twine balers than netwrap but it's pretty much a personal preference. He was the Massey dealer. I guess my thing with Massey is they seem to have been pushed around from company to company quite a few times and I have to wonder about parts availability down the road. The one main thing I didn't like about the NH 450 is there no available slip-clutch, shear bolt only.

She'll probably talk herself out of whole thing before it's over with.


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## deadmoose (Oct 30, 2011)

Just curious why is a Vermeer Rebel not in the comparison?


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## JD3430 (Jan 1, 2012)

Net wrap is also a faster machine. 
When I was looking at new net wrap balers last year, NH was running around 24k. Deere was 34k. 
Couldn't afford it.


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## mlappin (Jun 25, 2009)

Grateful11 said:


> The one main thing I didn't like about the NH 450 is there no available slip-clutch, shear bolt only.


My NH644 was shear bolt only, made a great bale, netwrap always worked but hated the shear bolts.


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## Grateful11 (Apr 5, 2009)

deadmoose said:


> Just curious why is a Vermeer Rebel not in the comparison?


My wife, myself and FarmerCline saw the Rebel 5420 in action last Sat. at a nearby Hay Day. I talked with the Rep. at length and I liked the Baler and the Monitor it came with but there's no sensors on the Rebel for bale shape nor mechanical indicators on the baler itself according to what he told me. I definitely didn't like the idea of not having any kind of bale shape indicators. FarmerCline said the 504N had them and so much more so we may look at it. The Reps. way of looking at was if your windrows are right you don't need shape indicators, sorry Mr. Rep but not all windrows are perfect in the real world.


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## FarmerCline (Oct 12, 2011)

If it were me I would steer clear of the NH 450, I know of three people that bought them last year and had nothing but problems. It is also a very light weight baler only weighs 3300 pounds, my haybine weighs more that that. The vermeer 5420 that we saw weighs 4700 pounds and the 504n weighs 5168 pounds. When I was looking at net wrap balers back in the winter it seemed to me that the Vermeer was simpler to load the net wrap than the New Holland. I am probably going to be by the Vermeer dealer in the morning I know he has a 504n on the lot, I will see what he is asking for it as I am wanting to think it was around $25,000 but I might be wrong.


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## swmnhay (Jun 13, 2008)

Grateful11 said:


> My wife, myself and FarmerCline saw the Rebel 5420 in action last Sat. at a nearby Hay Day. I talked with the Rep. at length and I liked the Baler and the Monitor it came with but there's no sensors on the Rebel for bale shape nor mechanical indicators on the baler itself according to what he told me. I definitely didn't like the idea of not having any kind of bale shape indicators. FarmerCline said the 504N had them and so much more so we may look at it. The Reps. way of looking at was if your windrows are right you don't need shape indicators, sorry Mr. Rep but not all windrows are perfect in the real world.


The Bale Expert monitor is a option on the Rebel 5420 which should have the bale size indicators on it then.

Not positive but it is listed as a option ,so maybe check that out.Maybe the dealer was pushing a baler he had on hand??


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## Grateful11 (Apr 5, 2009)

swmnhay said:


> The Bale Expert monitor is a option on the Rebel 5420 which should have the bale size indicators on it then.
> 
> Not positive but it is listed as a option ,so maybe check that out.Maybe the dealer was pushing a baler he had on hand??


The Monitor itself has them but it was the district rep. I talked to and he said no bale shape indicators. I downloaded their latest brochure and in the back it has all the features and options listed and Bale Shape Feedback, they call it, is blank on both the 5420 and 5520, what is available as an option is marked Optional. If they had that I think they'd have a winner. I've known the dealer and his Dad, who started the business, for close to 40 years and they've never pushed anything on anyone, he doesn't need to they have all the business they can handle without being pushy.


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## swmnhay (Jun 13, 2008)

Yea I don't know much about the Rebels.Find it strange if the Bale Expert monitor is available that shows the bale shape that it doesn't have the bale size indicators available on the baler??


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## Grateful11 (Apr 5, 2009)

They opened a bale that's been in the field and rained on about 3 times for a total of about 1.5" and within 2" it was as fresh as if it were just been baled. The spot on the bottom was not really bad at all. This bale happen to be touching another bale slightly and that was the worst spot of the whole bale, it was dark and wet in that spot for about 2-3" deep.

As far as heat the inside of the bale, it was cooler than the air temp of about 76˚.

The main shed is full and she has a guy adding a 16'x48' section on the back. That should hold an additional 132 - 4x4' bales. The shed will then be 40x48' with a 6' overhang on the front.

Hay from bale that was opened today.


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