# Sudangrass Hay Advice



## lgn98868 (Jun 15, 2015)

Looking to get the most $/acre out of some hay ground that I have leased. This is in KY.

Right now planning to cut fescue mid-May then till that ground and put 30-40 lbs/a of sudangrass and a little shot of nitrogen. Want to try to mow it under 3 feet to make it easier to dry down and just better quality hay. Planning on applying around 30 units of nitrogen after each cutting and hope to get 3 cuttings like this if I can get it in the ground by May 20th and wrap up final cutting around end of August.

My questions are how tough will it be to get to dry down to bale for hay in my area even though I'm mowing it earlier than most? Will be in big squares and will use HayGuard on it. Does 3 cuttings over this time period sound feasible, and what kind of tonnage per acre would you expect in this situation?

This hay will end up in a dry cow ration, do you think there will be any problems putting it in a mixer wagon or will it be similar to fescue?

Thanks.


----------



## hillside hay (Feb 4, 2013)

Packer cutter on baler? Takes me 5-8 days to get it dry enough. Probably 4-5 ton over 3 cuts


----------



## lgn98868 (Jun 15, 2015)

Nope, just straight up krone bp1290hdp


----------



## Tx Jim (Jun 30, 2014)

Are you going to cut crop with a cutter with a conditioner(crimper)?


----------



## lgn98868 (Jun 15, 2015)

Moco with impellers and willing to use Tedder twice if I need to. I know.....need rollers not impellers but that's what I've got.


----------



## r82230 (Mar 1, 2016)

lgn98868 said:


> My questions are how tough will it be to get to dry down to bale for hay in my area even though I'm mowing it earlier than most?
> 
> Thanks.


With given humidity in the summer in your area, balage could be a much better option. IMHO.

Larry


----------



## lgn98868 (Jun 15, 2015)

r82230 said:


> With given humidity in the summer in your area, balage could be a much better option. IMHO.
> 
> Larry


No feasible way to sell baleage as buyer just needs something for roughage in dry cow diet. They have plenty of haylage that they do themselves.


----------



## Vol (Jul 5, 2009)

Just don't let the Sudan get any taller than three feet or it will be a nightmare with the impellers.

Regards, Mike


----------



## Circle MC Farms LLC (Jul 22, 2011)

It is definitely possible albeit harder to do than down here in Texas. Lots of people will tell you that the only way to put it up is wet but if you play your rain windows correctly it is feasible.

Biggest thing, as was mentioned by some others is do not let it get too tall. The taller it get the longer the stems you have to deal with, and the more mature the plant gets the thicker and woodier the stem gets which makes it hold onto water longer. You should be fine with your impellers as long as you cut it short but let it get long and you'll be wishing for a crimper. Post some pictures of how it goes, love seeing the sudan hybrids.


----------



## lgn98868 (Jun 15, 2015)

McDonald Family Farms said:


> It is definitely possible albeit harder to do than down here in Texas. Lots of people will tell you that the only way to put it up is wet but if you play your rain windows correctly it is feasible.
> 
> Biggest thing, as was mentioned by some others is do not let it get too tall. The taller it get the longer the stems you have to deal with, and the more mature the plant gets the thicker and woodier the stem gets which makes it hold onto water longer. You should be fine with your impellers as long as you cut it short but let it get long and you'll be wishing for a crimper. Post some pictures of how it goes, love seeing the sudan hybrids.


I really think a field full of it is really pretty.

What kind of tonnage would you see on dry hay per cutting or annually down there?


----------



## Circle MC Farms LLC (Jul 22, 2011)

lgn98868 said:


> I really think a field full of it is really pretty.
> 
> What kind of tonnage would you see on dry hay per cutting or annually down there?


Well managed on good soil we will see (Edit) ~4 tons per acre on the first cutting (or 6 tons if you let it get 8 foot tall and stemmy) and then the second cutting is much more variable because we often have limited rain to grow a second cutting. Keep in mind yours may be on the lower end of that range because you can't let yours get as tall but yield should still be good. I would also recommend putting down 50lb/acre of seed to keep your stem size down.

I'm going to be planting about 65 acres of Gotcha Plus sorghum sudan for this summer, the seed is relatively inexpensive compared to some of the BMR varieties and it has a delayed maturity trait bred into it which can save your butt if rain keeps you out of the field. Supposed to head out at 70-85 days of age vs approx 45 days on most hay grazers.

https://www.geneticseed.com/comm_viewproduct.aspx?ID=1330


----------



## hillside hay (Feb 4, 2013)

I have seeded at 70 lbs per acre. Acts a lot like orchard grass at that rate as far as drydown. Cut it just below the first leaf roughly 10 in. I just Ted once to keep the wheel tracks down. I feed that and sell the grass hay.


----------



## lgn98868 (Jun 15, 2015)

hillside hay said:


> I have seeded at 70 lbs per acre. Acts a lot like orchard grass at that rate as far as drydown. Cut it just below the first leaf roughly 10 in. I just Ted once to keep the wheel tracks down. I feed that and sell the grass hay.


What are y'all seeing on seed price for straight sudangrass?


----------



## hillside hay (Feb 4, 2013)

Year before last I bought two years supply at 32 per bag. Haven't priced this year's yet.


----------



## lgn98868 (Jun 15, 2015)

How do yall think it would affect dry down ability if i went with sorghum sudan and seeded it at high rate vs sudangrass?


----------



## Circle MC Farms LLC (Jul 22, 2011)

lgn98868 said:


> How do yall think it would affect dry down ability if i went with sorghum sudan and seeded it at high rate vs sudangrass?


Should be pretty similar seeded at high rate because the stems will be finer.


----------



## FarmerCline (Oct 12, 2011)

Here I wouldn't be able to get sorghum/Sudan dry without rolls to crimp/split the stem and squeeze the juice out even if cut when it is still short. Personally I wouldn't even attempt it with impellers......If the stem is not split I just don't see any way it will dry down in a reasonable amount of time.

I have grown it for a few years but I'm not going to any more because it was just too dang hard to get dry here. Best I could do using rubber rolls to crimp and tedding at least twice was 5 days.....the temps were in the mid 90s as well. Last year I had it on the ground for over a week and never could get it dry enough before it got rained on.

It can make really good hay when cut before it gets too big and stalky. I liked growing it because it was a good option for a summer annual hay crop but it is just too risky for me to grow it anymore here because sometimes 3-4 days is all we have between rains. I planted it at 50 pounds an acre to keep the stems smaller. Also if you get a rainy spell where you can't cut, it can go from three feet tall to over five feet in just a little over a week.


----------



## lgn98868 (Jun 15, 2015)

Where is here cline?


----------



## FarmerCline (Oct 12, 2011)

lgn98868 said:


> Where is here cline?


 North Carolina.


----------



## azmike (Jan 4, 2015)

We pay $22 a bag for a variety called "Super Sugar--delayed maturity" This next year we are planning on more cuttings. We put it into baleage and are hoping to cut shorter to eliminate the roping effect when feeding. I agree don't let it get too tall. This hybrid we use is smallish stems but still can pull out of the feeding bunks. We also are going to try a sudan/alfalfa blend for cattle feed.


----------



## luke strawwalker (Jul 31, 2014)

Yep that's how we used to do it... plant thicker than hair on a dog's back and cut it at waist high-- makes a very nice fine stemmed leafy hay that dries quickly (at least here in TX).

Later! OL J R


----------



## Tx Jim (Jun 30, 2014)

McDonald Family Farms said:


> Well managed on good soil we will see 4-6 tons per acre on the first cutting


How mature was this Sudan that made 4-6 tons per acre on 1st cutting IE how many days after planting was it cut?


----------



## Circle MC Farms LLC (Jul 22, 2011)

Tx Jim said:


> How mature was this Sudan that made 4-6 tons per acre on 1st cutting IE how many days after planting was it cut?


That stuff was a neighbor's of mine that let it get 8 foot tall and headed that made 6 tons per acre. I don't endorse nor recommend that lol. Not sure how many days after planting. Also the stuff that made ~ 4 tons per acre was my boss's hay which was well managed and heavily fertilized. It was cut before heading out and had fine stems and averaged 9 950-1000lb rounds per acre on 90 acres. It was a pioneer variety, some of that $60/bag seed but it's ok because he gets a dealer discount 

Edit: I edited my earlier post, after re-reading I can see how it was confusing.


----------



## Wcbr1025 (May 1, 2015)

I've had pretty good luck planting my Sudex with my JD 7200 planter with sorghum cups, it's a 30" planter so I set it at a half rate and split the 30" rows to make 15" rows. Setting the rate takes a little guesswork but I think that the sudex planted in rows has smaller stems because there is very little space between plants vs a 7.5" drill which would have twice as many rows therefore the plant spacing in the row would be double at the same seeding rate. I have found that this method yields just as well as drilled sudex for me and I can get smaller stems without increasing the seeding rate much.

As far as drying here it can be difficult but I can get it dry in 5 days if the weather cooperates (if the weather always cooperated we'd all be rich) but that's running a haybine and then a pull type crimper on the day after cutting. I try to mow at 48" or less.

Clear as mud right?
-WCBR


----------



## jdhayday (May 12, 2014)

As far as seeding rate with sorg/sud, I might have a different opinion. I have been making dry hay out of it for a few years now. What I see is that with a higher population sure you have smaller stems, but for every extra seed you put in the ground you just get more stems. Also it seems like the higher the population you get smaller stems but the leaves are also smaller. I started out planting 60lbs then 50 and now this year I will be planting 40 lbs/a. It is relatively good drying conditions here though and I crimp it to the point the stem is pretty smashed. Just my 2 cents


----------



## lgn98868 (Jun 15, 2015)

Where you at jdhay?


----------



## jdhayday (May 12, 2014)

Central Nebraska. I might add that it is worth the extra money to go with a BMR variety, I have tried some conventional and you can definitely tell that cows like the BMR better. I have never used an impeller type conditioner so there is a chance the bigger stem could hurt you.


----------



## lgn98868 (Jun 15, 2015)

The thing about BMR to me is that I'm not going to feed this to my cows, and the people feeding it don't really care about the protein or tdn on it. They just need some roughage for their dry cows so that makes me not want to spend extra $ on it.

But, if BMR varieties would give me more tonnage I'd go for it all day as long as it was cost effective.


----------



## jdhayday (May 12, 2014)

From my experience tonnage is not affected by BMR vs non BMR as much as just the variety of either you choose.


----------

