# How to rake after haybine swathing



## fastline (Mar 2, 2013)

The obvious paths for a haybine on a square property is pretty much cutting in a spiral. However, when raking, it is my understanding that V rakes don't do well in the corners so keep them running straight.

I am curious how you guys mow and rake typically with a haybine?


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## blainalbin (Jun 14, 2011)

I'm fairly new to the hay business so I'm still learning the best way to attack cutting and raking. I have small, odd shaped fields so I always do the spiral. Some neighbours of mine who have bigger fields and making small squares will do 3 or 4 rounds around the outside. Then rake and bale that. Then the interior part they will cut in straight rows. Their fields are big enough that those first 3 or 4 rows amounts to enough for them to do that. My fields are so small that I want to cut the whole thing in one shot. I'm also making round bales which is quicker than making small squares.

I find raking to have been the trickiest art. I have a small rotary rake that you have to raise and lower by hand. I seem to try to rake the hay into straight rows instead of the spiral. Straight rows seem to be easier for me to bale with my round baler. I will usually rake 2 windrows into one unless there's a lot of hay.


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## JD3430 (Jan 1, 2012)

I'm right there with you. When I cut or rake, I'm always thinking "will my tractor and baler be able to make this turn without trouble?" 
I usually make a racetrack around the outside, then shoot for long lines inside since once the headlands are baled up, there's room to turn around.


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## fastline (Mar 2, 2013)

To get nice straights, I would need to constantly swing the haybine right to left and get all lined up again. I would think it would be a big time waster but maybe you can make that up with smooth raking and baling?


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## hay wilson in TX (Jan 28, 2009)

Here is some poor advise.

The usual is to mow as you say then rake making reasonably good corners, then raking out the mess on the corners. This results in too much dead heading but that is the way we always did it.

If your swather can lay the hay out flat and wide then you can rake to the end, reverse your travel and rake the full length of the field only.

Better yet if your fields are such that you can run a long length and a short cross section.

Figuring the cost per hour to run each piece of equipment, the abler is the highest cost per hour. Save time here save money.

Next is the mower conditioner. Some mower conditionesr can turn and cut back next to the opening swath, but many are not that fortunate.

The least cost per hour to run but the most crucial for good bales is the rake.

Most of my hay fields are 138 feet wide, and are long.


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## Will 400m (Aug 1, 2011)

Mowing I do circles and most of my fields are realy weird shapes so that works. And I know alot of people have trouble with haybines and point rows but I never had any issues dont know why but I dont. I tedd everything so as long as it gets cut I dont have to go the same way to rake. I do the outside lap doubled up and then a lap or two then strate lines as best as I can.


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## mlappin (Jun 25, 2009)

Best way to avoid dealing with corners and the resulting mess in the corners is to not make any more corners than absolutely required, in other words don't mow in a freakin circle.

Mowing in a circle came about from the old sickle bar mowers that had a manual lift and unless you folded the bar up for transport may or may not lift high enough to get over the cut hay.

You don't plow, disc, plant corn, side dress or cultivate in a circle in a 20 acre field


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## Josh in WNY (Sep 7, 2010)

On big fields I will mow 5 or 6 laps (with our 9 foot cut disc mower/conditioner) and maybe split the field in half by taking a few straight runs up and down the middle. This is usually enough hay for me to want to do in a day. Once the field is opened up, it is straight lines all the way. On smaller fields (5 acres or less), I will do pretty much the same thing, but will mow it all at once. This means I'm driving on the mowed hay in the headlands, but that usually hasn't caused a problem.

I run two NH rollerbar rakes rather than a V-rake, but since they are hooked in tandem, corners are still a pain.


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## mlappin (Jun 25, 2009)

Josh in WNY said:


> I run two NH rollerbar rakes rather than a V-rake, but since they are hooked in tandem, corners are still a pain.


I hear yah there, had a pair as well with the hitch, on small fields that were ten acres or less I'd only take one rake as the tandem was too much of a PITA for that small a field.


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## JD3430 (Jan 1, 2012)

I have also noticed that on like a 20 acre field, a guy will mow ~5 laps then cut a few long straight passes down the middle and then bale it. I guess that's a good way to stop from mushing headlands into the ground. 
Once I get in a field, I'm cutting the whole thing.


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## urednecku (Oct 18, 2010)

I'll make the first 5 or 6 passes mowing around the outside, then thru the middle. Yea, turning on the first cut, outside rows. When I come back with the tedder, and rake, I'll start with the straight rows, again turning on the headlands, then tedd or rake the outside last. Then bale the outside first.


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## traden86 (May 16, 2013)

6 swaths along the outside perimeter of the field no matter the shape or size, and then it's long straight rows whenever I can. We only have grass hay around here so I'm not worried about turning on the headlands.


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## mlappin (Jun 25, 2009)

JD3430 said:


> I have also noticed that on like a 20 acre field, a guy will mow ~5 laps then cut a few long straight passes down the middle and then bale it. I guess that's a good way to stop from mushing headlands into the ground.
> Once I get in a field, I'm cutting the whole thing.


When I was still messing around with the rolabar rakes if another field was close enough I'd mow one then go take just the outside rounds of the next. Then finish mowing the second field after I'd get the outside rounds off as we had the older non hydraulic twin hitch and it took a lot of room to get it turned around. Could rake a lot of hay with it in an afternoon, not near as much as my vrake now but much better than using a single rake.


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## fastline (Mar 2, 2013)

I am quickly learning to hate the pull behind hydroswing. I have about 3hrs on it now and just too many negatives like sore neck, harder to create ideal baler passes, tires on the outside so hard to mow edge of ditches, etc.

So again, 5-6 passes on perimeter, then straight passes BUT is that with a hydroswing? I have to pick up, swing all thee way over to the other side and dial in, etc. On EVERY pass!

Is it possible to rake across windrows? So if I cut in a spiral then drag the hay into straight rows after? I know some don't recommend driving on the windrow but I may not have too much choice here.


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## JD3430 (Jan 1, 2012)

fastline said:


> I am quickly learning to hate the pull behind hydroswing. I have about 3hrs on it now and just too many negatives like sore neck, harder to create ideal baler passes, tires on the outside so hard to mow edge of ditches, etc.
> 
> So again, 5-6 passes on perimeter, then straight passes BUT is that with a hydroswing? I have to pick up, swing all thee way over to the other side and dial in, etc. On EVERY pass!
> 
> Is it possible to rake across windrows? So if I cut in a spiral then drag the hay into straight rows after? I know some don't recommend driving on the windrow but I may not have too much choice here.


Sometimes I have to do that. I'm sure a lot of hay farmers have fields surrounded by trees like me. The trees create a lot of shade and so my outer rings I cut first always give me trouble. 
What I do sometimes is cut and rake the whole field then bale the middle. Then I take the outer rings and rake them away from the trees towards the center, which is now just clean stubble. This allows the outer rings to get a chance to dry. They never seem to dry near the trees. I have limbed them back as much as the owners will allow. 
I have more than my share of "foggy bottom" type fields, near rivers, surrounded by trees.


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## mlappin (Jun 25, 2009)

fastline said:


> I am quickly learning to hate the pull behind hydroswing. I have about 3hrs on it now and just too many negatives like sore neck, harder to create ideal baler passes, tires on the outside so hard to mow edge of ditches, etc.
> 
> So again, 5-6 passes on perimeter, then straight passes BUT is that with a hydroswing? I have to pick up, swing all thee way over to the other side and dial in, etc. On EVERY pass!
> 
> Is it possible to rake across windrows? So if I cut in a spiral then drag the hay into straight rows after? I know some don't recommend driving on the windrow but I may not have too much choice here.


You'll get used to it, most everybody I know once using a center pivot mower would never go back to a side pull.



JD3430 said:


> Sometimes I have to do that. I'm sure a lot of hay farmers have fields surrounded by trees like me. The trees create a lot of shade and so my outer rings I cut first always give me trouble.
> What I do sometimes is cut and rake the whole field then bale the middle. Then I take the outer rings and rake them away from the trees towards the center, which is now just clean stubble. This allows the outer rings to get a chance to dry. They never seem to dry near the trees. I have limbed them back as much as the owners will allow.
> I have more than my share of "foggy bottom" type fields, near rivers, surrounded by trees.


I had a few like that as well, if the weather allowed I'd rake it out of the shade and let it dry more, if not I'd bale and back up to the tree line then dump those bales and get em fed up to the cows asap.


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## JD3430 (Jan 1, 2012)

mlappin said:


> I had a few like that as well, if the weather allowed I'd rake it out of the shade and let it dry more, if not I'd bale and back up to the tree line then dump those bales and get em fed up to the cows asap.


Now I just need some cattle to feed em too!!!
My wife would kill me. Lol


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## fastline (Mar 2, 2013)

Let me ask, I am having two issues.

1. Cut is uneven. I am not dropping to the ground and riding on the skids. I drop, then pickup a touch. Do I just need to leave it on the ground?

2. It plugged up twice on me. I was trying to cut at sundown and other was dark. I also noticed the drive belt is not super tight and heard it MUST be super tight?

Other than that, it is running pretty darn well.


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## JD3430 (Jan 1, 2012)

fastline said:


> Let me ask, I am having two issues.
> 
> 1. Cut is uneven. I am not dropping to the ground and riding on the skids. I drop, then pickup a touch. Do I just need to leave it on the ground?
> 
> ...


I let mine ride across ground in a "float" position. Might be hard on hydraulic system to have it up slightly. 
Plugging a haybine at the time of day you're cutting is normal. You have dew on the grass. Once it gets wet and sticky, she'll plug. Mine does. I cut at night once and pugged the machine more times than I'd like to have.


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## fastline (Mar 2, 2013)

We watched specifically for dew and nothing really felt wet or transferred to the tires. I am not sure if it would still get "tougher" with the sun down though. If that is the case, I should be able to put the hammer down today.


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## Josh in WNY (Sep 7, 2010)

JD3430 said:


> Sometimes I have to do that. I'm sure a lot of hay farmers have fields surrounded by trees like me. The trees create a lot of shade and so my outer rings I cut first always give me trouble.


That's the other reason I like to mow, rake and bale the outside of the field before working on the middle, I can let the hay set a little longer to get dried down enough. One thing I notice is that the hay always seems a little thinner near the treas, so I think the outside lap dries down at about the same rate as a few swaths into the field.


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## fastline (Mar 2, 2013)

I ended up running as explained here. It worked reasonably well though there is a LOT of "air" time not cutting while jogging over. I ran 6 passes on the outside, then ran a pass right down the center and worked side to side on the two halved down the center until it was wide enough that I started working each half.

One small issue I need to overcome is when you get to the end and end up slightly off and have a tapered pass? The swather does not handle going over another windrow very well,


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## swmnhay (Jun 13, 2008)

fastline said:


> I ended up running as explained here. It worked reasonably well though there is a LOT of "air" time not cutting while jogging over. I ran 6 passes on the outside, then ran a pass right down the center and worked side to side on the two halved down the center until it was wide enough that I started working each half.
> 
> One small issue I need to overcome is when you get to the end and end up slightly off and have a tapered pass? The swather does not handle going over another windrow very well,


I thought you had a hydro swing?Why dead heading on the ends if you do.

On a previous post you also said you needed to dial in when you swung side to side.There should be no need for that.There should be stops for the correct position.


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## fastline (Mar 2, 2013)

I never did swing to the left. Not sure it is my tractor or what but I could not get turned all the way around and swung without reversing so it was easier to just jog over and stay swung right. I am sure I could knock a couple hour off the clock if I can reduce jog time.


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## mlappin (Jun 25, 2009)

fastline said:


> Let me ask, I am having two issues.
> 
> 1. Cut is uneven. I am not dropping to the ground and riding on the skids. I drop, then pickup a touch. Do I just need to leave it on the ground?
> 
> ...


Leave it all the way down, that's what the skid shoes are for.

Discbine or haybine? You mentioned a haybine a few posts back so I'm assuming a sickle machine. Not uncommon for them to plug in certain conditions.


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## JD3430 (Jan 1, 2012)

fastline said:


> I ended up running as explained here. It worked reasonably well though there is a LOT of "air" time not cutting while jogging over. I ran 6 passes on the outside, then ran a pass right down the center and worked side to side on the two halved down the center until it was wide enough that I started working each half.
> 
> One small issue I need to overcome is when you get to the end and end up slightly off and have a tapered pass? The swather does not handle going over another windrow very well,


That's an advantage of a discbine that I like. You can run a discbine over freshly cut windrows and it will just reprocess them. My SP haybine would clog or "snowplow" the grass into a big pile that I would have to kick apart when I had narrow uncut patches that had windrows on both sides. 
Advantage discbine.


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## Colby (Mar 5, 2012)

This is how we "cut out the corners" when we rake and bale around the field instead of up and down. Say the small lines are your windrows left by your cutter and the big one is a raked windrow. 
First make about 3 rounds or so then go follow your corner on one side to the other and turn around and come back this picture only does so much the people who know what I'm talking about will understand. But otherwise if you don't I'd have to take a video or get someone to better explain it.... Lol


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## Teslan (Aug 20, 2011)

Colby said:


> This is how we "cut out the corners" when we rake and bale around the field instead of up and down. Say the small lines are your windrows left by your cutter and the big one is a raked windrow.
> First make about 3 rounds or so then go follow your corner on one side to the other and turn around and come back this picture only does so much the people who know what I'm talking about will understand. But otherwise if you don't I'd have to take a video or get someone to better explain it.... Lol


Yes that is very confusing to me. We cut 4 swaths around the edges of the field for big squares then just go back and forth in a straight line or folowing the sprinkler pivot tracks. For small squares and rounds it's either 2 or 3 around the edge of the fields depending on the size of baling tractors. This isn't just used for square or rectangle fields, but anything. I didn't even know there was any other way to cut a hay field before getting on Haytalk. Much like my ignorance of tedders.


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## DSLinc1017 (Sep 27, 2009)

Colby said:


> This is how we "cut out the corners" when we rake and bale around the field instead of up and down. Say the small lines are your windrows left by your cutter and the big one is a raked windrow.
> First make about 3 rounds or so then go follow your corner on one side to the other and turn around and come back this picture only does so much the people who know what I'm talking about will understand. But otherwise if you don't I'd have to take a video or get someone to better explain it.... Lol


If I understand your drawing, you rake the corners ( big lines) into windrows. I sorta do the same, accept I don't rake them, after I rake the round and round, bale, what I miss in each corner I run the baler down what would be your big line. With that said, our fields are everything but perfect shapes, I have one that's best described as a tear drop. Every time I rake it, I'm reinventing the wheel. The wheel never comes out round...


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## mlappin (Jun 25, 2009)

Teslan said:


> I didn't even know there was any other way to cut a hay field before getting on Haytalk. Much like my ignorance of tedders.


I have one and only one person I bale hay for regularly that mows in a circle, I don't understand as to why though, when they ted and rake they do what 99.9% of what's considered normal around here, ted and rake it straight with four outside rounds.


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## DSLinc1017 (Sep 27, 2009)

mlappin said:


> I have one and only one person I bale hay for regularly that mows in a circle, I don't understand as to why though, when they ted and rake they do what 99.9% of what's considered normal around here, ted and rake it straight with four outside rounds.


I hear you! On most of my fields, by the time I do 3 to 4 rounds, I'm done, or have some odd shape left. I do have one large field that I always look forward to being that its sorta normal big rectangle, that one is mostly back and forth.


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## JD3430 (Jan 1, 2012)

I don't have one field that is rectangular or square. Mine are pork chop, triangle, teardrop, or 2 smaller fields that are disjointed. etc. 
what I usually do is outline fields with 3-5 loops. Then I try to fix the field so it ends up in a rectangle so the rest of the cutting is reasonably straight. Why I do it? I don't know.


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## Colby (Mar 5, 2012)

It may be different for y'all because I rake and bale at the same time with one tractor like y'all have seen. I cut out the corners like that so when I turn the baler doesn't miss any hay it's pretty simple just hard to describe


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## mlappin (Jun 25, 2009)

swmnhay said:


> I thought you had a hydro swing?Why dead heading on the ends if you do.
> 
> On a previous post you also said you needed to dial in when you swung side to side.There should be no need for that.There should be stops for the correct position.


Hmm, neither of my New Holland center pivots had any kind of stops....

I swing clear in one direction or the other then bring it back a bit, hit it practically dead on every time with a little practice.


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## rwskinner (Jun 27, 2013)

May be I'm doing it wrong, but I cut 2 or 3 around the perimeter then straight lines.

When I rake, I rake all in straight lines and when I'm done, I do a couple rounds around the outside to clean up the mess.

Then I bale the outside and clear them, then straight lines back and forth.

Seems to work for me and my 489 Haybine.

Richard


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## swmnhay (Jun 13, 2008)

mlappin said:


> Hmm, neither of my New Holland center pivots had any kind of stops....
> 
> I swing clear in one direction or the other then bring it back a bit, hit it practically dead on every time with a little practice.


Heck I thought they all had stops.Had a 116 NH that did and I've been running the Vermeer 1030's now and they do.I do pull it in if laying out a 10' swath driving one wheel along the uncut hay instead of stradleing windrow.Or on a sidehill I may have to suck it in because of side draft.


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## Chessiedog (Jul 24, 2009)

I get what your showing Colby you rake the conners down at a 45 degrees towards the center of the field ,seen it done some times. Just depends on the field shape what works best . As far as mowing with a center piviot . I open the field up with 6 swaths around the outside to give me turing room .Then starting on the straightest and longest side of the field I would mow all the way to the end ,swing right back around moving the mower to the other side and back to the other end ,do this all the way across the field .

Mowing without s center pivot . Would open the field up same way so many swaths around the outside . Then go over how ever far you want and start dividing the field into sections .

I will say raking is a little bit of an art . Some guys can go into a crazy shaped field and just lay it out perfect . While others get it raked , but thats about all you say . LOL

I haven't raked with a roller bar rake for a long time . But if remember I would start on the out side of the field thrownig that swath in, back to were I started at . Spin around thrown the next swath into the one I just raked . Then I would start my straight swaths the same way , finsh by cleaning up the last two swaths around the out side .


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