# Tractor extended start times and loss of power



## JD3430 (Jan 1, 2012)

Changed fuel filter and checked fuel/water separator for water or air. Looked OK.

Whats the next step you take on a tractor which takes too long to start and is down on power?


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## paoutdoorsman (Apr 23, 2016)

If it was just taking extra cranking to start on a cold morning, I'd suspect a possible glow plug issue. But with hard start and down on power, I'd be curious if compression was in spec.


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## JD3430 (Jan 1, 2012)

No discolored smoke.

Had extended start times when engine was cold in summer or winter. Once engine has been run a while, it starts a lot faster.

How about injection pump/timing?


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## IHCman (Aug 27, 2011)

injector pump going bad? how new of tractor? emissions dpf plugged?


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## chevytaHOE5674 (Mar 14, 2015)

Extended crank times in warm weather after sitting can also be a leak in the fuel supply to the injector pump. Air is introduced and allows the fuel to drain back to the tank, the extended cranking is needed to pump fuel back to the pump.


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## JD3430 (Jan 1, 2012)

IHCman said:


> injector pump going bad? how new of tractor? emissions dpf plugged?


2011 no dpf 
2400hr


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## stack em up (Mar 7, 2013)

I’d check injectors, not out of the question for one to go bad, even at that low of hours. Injection timing is probably fine as it started fine previously. Fuel inlet pressure is also something to check, if delivery valve getting weak it can cause low power and hard starts


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## slowzuki (Mar 8, 2011)

Almost certainly losing prime. Which tractor? Need to know more about fuel system type.

My M120 leaked a tiny bit at the water separator. It will look fine but gets air in there. Would loose prime sitting or under high load.


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## Tx Jim (Jun 30, 2014)

slowzuki said:


> Almost certainly losing prime. Which tractor? Need to know more about fuel system type.


Knowing brand,yr built & model would help one to give correct advice.


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## JD3430 (Jan 1, 2012)

Tx Jim said:


> Knowing brand,yr built & model would help one to give correct advice.


2010 Kubota M135X 2400hrs
When I first got it this summer, the fuel water separator was bubbling. Changed out gaskets and it seemed to stop bubbling, but the start times are still too long and the power is down.
One other thing of note; when it fires over, it starts in a strange way, it sort of does a "brrrrappppp" and then idles fairly smooth. It doesn't sound the same as the other Kubota I have which has same engine and drivetrain. 
Something else: Noticed the other Kubota, which is slightly newer, has a larger fuel water separator with a draincock. They must have upgraded it between building these tractors.


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## Ox76 (Oct 22, 2018)

Small leaks in the fuel system are the worst to chase down. They'll allow air in but no fuel will seep out to give a tell tale wet spot to find.

I guess I'd pressurize the fuel system at the tank to check up to the lift pump if there is one. Then pressurize at the lift pump to the injector pump to check there. Squirt everything with some soapy water and look for bubbles. I wouldn't pressurize more than about 2 psi. The power air has is amazing - I once badly deformed a home heating oil fuel tank using only 5 psi, so be careful!

If no leaks found I guess I would then pull the injectors and test them. Maybe you need to install a gremlin bell.... good luck.


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## slowzuki (Mar 8, 2011)

This is what mine did. Mine came with it bypassed with an automotive filter spliced inline, I was thinking oh I'll fix that but have had heck of a time getting it to seal up. Parking it siphons back into the tank. Running it sucks air at high load. I thought I had it licked 3 or 4 times.

Also found the primer seal up at the pump leaks so was sucking air there. Needed a couple of o-rings.

EDIT

I see in the parts book there have been a few revisions to the separator. One style looks like the old one on my L5030 that uses a pressed in fitting with o-ring that leaks easily. Makes me even more suspicious.



JD3430 said:


> 2010 Kubota M135X 2400hrs
> When I first got it this summer, the fuel water separator was bubbling. Changed out gaskets and it seemed to stop bubbling, but the start times are still too long and the power is down.


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## slowzuki (Mar 8, 2011)

Other item is the electric lift pump might be getting weak. Mine is mechanical on my M120. My MF has an electric lift pump and causes same issues when it goes bad.

Note there are 3 fuel filters in series on the tractor too, if you haven't checked them all. One is hidden in a metal can thing it looks like.


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## Tx Jim (Jun 30, 2014)

The 3rd filter slowzuki referred to is part # 1G410-52300 hidden in electric fuel pump.

Due to the fact I have zero knowledge of common rail fuel system I'll just observe this thread.

After the horror problems my neighbor experienced getting fungus in fuel system on his M8560 that cost him over $7K to get repaired I'll stay with older style inj pump/injectors engines.


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## JD3430 (Jan 1, 2012)

slowzuki said:


> Other item is the electric lift pump might be getting weak. Mine is mechanical on my M120. My MF has an electric lift pump and causes same issues when it goes bad.
> 
> Note there are 3 fuel filters in series on the tractor too, if you haven't checked them all. One is hidden in a metal can thing it looks like.


Yeah I'm going to look at that today


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## r82230 (Mar 1, 2016)

chevytaHOE5674 said:


> Extended crank times in warm weather after sitting can also be a leak in the fuel supply to the injector pump. Air is introduced and allows the fuel to drain back to the tank, the extended cranking is needed to pump fuel back to the pump.





slowzuki said:


> Almost certainly losing prime. Which tractor? Need to know more about fuel system type.
> 
> My M120 leaked a tiny bit at the water separator. It will look fine but gets air in there. Would loose prime sitting or under high load.


I had a tractor that did this (losing prime), what I did to help identify the loss of prime, was just turn the key on for 20-30 seconds, before trying to start the engine. Seems I had a electric fuel pump and it lost prime when setting for a week or so, I learned to live with it, until it became someone else's problem.

This could be one problem (doesn't explain the lack of power, just the hard starting).

Larry


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