# Twinstar vs Vermeer hydraulic basket rakes



## FarmerCline (Oct 12, 2011)

I'm getting ready to buy a new rake this year and I am looking at either a Vermeer r2800 or a Twinstar 2027. Any thoughts to which is the better rake? Would love to hear any reviews or opinions on either one. Both rakes operate on the same basic concept but are designed quite a bit different in how the baskets are carried on the frame. The ground I farm is quite hilly with a lot of uneven terrain......which rake will operate best in these conditions?

Hayden


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## Trotwood2955 (Sep 4, 2012)

I've never used either rake but there are a handful of the Vermeer twin basket rakes around here and I think they must do an ok job. I looked at pics of the Twinstar and seems to me like it would be better suited to flat land simply because of the design and how the baskets are mounted to the frame and wheels. Compared to the Vermeer that has wheels at each end of the basket - I think it would follow hills and rolling ground better.


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## Gearclash (Nov 25, 2010)

Can't compare with Twister, but we have had a good run with a Vermeer R23 and now an R2300. An R2800 is gonna cost a small fortune . . .


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## RCF (Sep 14, 2009)

The R2800 is a good rake. We have used it to rake anything from really light fluffy grass to some heavy spring crop for silage. The rake is really heavy especially compared to the R2300. Takes some good hydraulics to turn it too. The one problem you will have is if the ground has holes in it and the gauge wheel falls in the hole the rake will stop turning. Also if you use to small a tractor if you don't shut the rake off at the end the oil will heat up.

Sorry dont know anything about a twinstar.


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## FarmerCline (Oct 12, 2011)

RCF said:


> The R2800 is a good rake. We have used it to rake anything from really light fluffy grass to some heavy spring crop for silage. The rake is really heavy especially compared to the R2300. Takes some good hydraulics to turn it too. The one problem you will have is if the ground has holes in it and the gauge wheel falls in the hole the rake will stop turning. Also if you use to small a tractor if you don't shut the rake off at the end the oil will heat up.
> Sorry dont know anything about a twinstar.


 I don't really have holes in the fields......it's undulating ground with some rolling terraces. I'm planning on using a 4020 with a freshly rebuilt hydraulic and trans pump to run the rake.


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## carcajou (Jan 28, 2011)

Twinstar and a NH 216 are of similar design. We have had the odd skip or miss on the tops of knolls but not enough to worry about. We don't run the little gauge wheels either. One feature i like on this style rake is the ability to turn two windrows at once without blending them. I can't see how that could be done with the R2800.


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## Tx Jim (Jun 30, 2014)

FarmerCline said:


> I don't really have holes in the fields......it's undulating ground with some rolling terraces. I'm planning on using a 4020 with a freshly rebuilt hydraulic and trans pump to run the rake.


You need to be sure the 4020 hyd oil cooler is spiffy clean. IMHO closed center hyd's such as the 4020 has and orbit motors isn't a good combination

I once owned an R23A and now have a H&S Hi-cap wheel rake. For my way of thinking hyd driven rake causes hyd oil to get too hot.so I powered my R23A with a pto hyd pump converting tongue into an oil reservoir.

I know nothing about a Twinstar.


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## SVFHAY (Dec 5, 2008)

Hayden, just curious why this type of rake for your application? Great choice for later cuttings, not sure how I would utilize one on heavy first. Maybe its time for me to update my thinking, not sure how important windrow curing is in the age of the tedder. I have always figured a double rotary gave the most flexibility but I feel I now need to move to the widest of these.

Never used either you ask of but both have great reputations if the hydraulics are adequate.


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## Lostin55 (Sep 21, 2013)

I can tell you that I run a R23A with a JD 4000. It is basically the same as the 4020 just lighter. Same motor etc. The oil gets hot. It gets really hot. 
As to the performance of the rake, it does well with all cuttings of irrigated alfalfa. It also follows the ground well.


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## IAhaymakr (Jun 4, 2008)

I have had Vermeer rakes for a long time. Started with R23a, R24a and R2300. Now have two R2800 rakes with center spinners. They have all been very good rakes with minimal repairs. Never had any frame breakage to fix. Overall I have been very satisfied with these rakes, but if I were to upgrade right now it would be to a Twinstar. The Twinstar is a superior design, with the build quality of a Vermeer. The design of the Twinstar allows it to follow the ground better and rake cleaner with less ground contact than anything else on the market except for mergers. Definitely the Cadillac of rakes.


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## K and B hay (Jan 12, 2016)

I have ran Vermeer R23 ,new holland 216, and now own a twinstar. I love my twinstar but you do have to make sure you have enough hydraulic flow from your tractor. Sometimes with our 216 rake we would spend an hour just getting it set right. The twinstar can be adjusted on the fly "baskets in and out" and "basket angle". The Vermeer are nice rakes but I hated not being able to lift it when turning in the field. You would wind up with a big ball of hay at the end of the row that a lot of the time would not dry. We are currently running a 4440 John Deere on our twinstar which is a bit of overkill for hp but it has plenty hydraulic flow.


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## FarmerCline (Oct 12, 2011)

SVFHAY said:


> Hayden, just curious why this type of rake for your application? Great choice for later cuttings, not sure how I would utilize one on heavy first. Maybe its time for me to update my thinking, not sure how important windrow curing is in the age of the tedder. I have always figured a double rotary gave the most flexibility but I feel I now need to move to the widest of these.
> Never used either you ask of but both have great reputations if the hydraulics are adequate.


 There are a couple reasons for me going to this style of rake. I'm currently using a single rotor rake and it takes forever to get anything done. I like the rotory rake in grass I'm not pleased with it in alfalfa.

I'm needing to have hired help run the rake while I bale so I need a rake that is very simple to run so a center delivery looks like the ticket. Wheel rakes don't work for me because I grow a lot of oat hay on soybean ground and the wheel rake picks up last year soybean straw into the windrow. Don't like the center delivery rotary rakes because it appears they are all 2 point hitch instead of drawbar hookup and the transport height is an issue getting into some places......combined with the fact I'm not pleased with a rotary in alfalfa that eliminates that option. So that left me with the hydraulic basket rakes.

One of my initial concerns with a center delivery was that in a heavy first cut that the windrow would be too large to square bale but I got to thinking in most cases now I'm still making two passes with the single rotor to make a windrow so that's about 20 feet of hay.......I have been told the Vermeer is adjustable from 19-28 feet raking width......not sure on the Twinstar but I would think it would be similar. I have also been told that I can leave one basket folded up and only rake with one and use it like a side delivery if the hay is super heavy. Maybe I'm missing something and my thinking is off?


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## FarmerCline (Oct 12, 2011)

Kandbhay said:


> I have ran Vermeer R23 ,new holland 216, and now own a twinstar. I love my twinstar but you do have to make sure you have enough hydraulic flow from your tractor. Sometimes with our 216 rake we would spend an hour just getting it set right. The twinstar can be adjusted on the fly "baskets in and out" and "basket angle". The Vermeer are nice rakes but I hated not being able to lift it when turning in the field. You would wind up with a big ball of hay at the end of the row that a lot of the time would not dry. We are currently running a 4440 John Deere on our twinstar which is a bit of overkill for hp but it has plenty hydraulic flow.


 The Vermeer r2800 will lift for turning at the end of the field but the r2300 won't. That is why I'm not considering a r2300......It seems like if the rake won't pick up to turn at the end it is going to make a lumpy mess.


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## K and B hay (Jan 12, 2016)

I have operated Vermeer R23, new holland 216, and now own a twinstar. I love my twinstar you just have to make sure you have enough hydraulic flow to operate it. We are currently using a John Deere 4440 to run ours bit of overkill on hp but plenty of hydraulics. The 216 would take an hour sometimes to get it set right for the conditions where the twinstar can all be adjusted on the fly. You can adjust the baskets in and out, the angle of the baskets, and raise and lower them. The Vermeer rakes are good but I hated not being able to lift at the end of a row, leaving a big ball of hay that sometimes would not dry.


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## K and B hay (Jan 12, 2016)

Sorry I guess that got posted twice. Think my internet is on the fritz.


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## K and B hay (Jan 12, 2016)

Are you Tedder raking your alfalfa?


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## Bhay (Dec 18, 2015)

The Twinstar will give you the most versatility and as mentioned above its the Cadillac of rakes. We just ordered a new 2030 G3 with the seven tine bars per basket to replace our Allen 8827.


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## FarmerCline (Oct 12, 2011)

Kandbhay said:


> Are you Tedder raking your alfalfa?


 Not quite sure what you mean by tedder raking. I try not to use a tedder on alfalfa but sometimes I have to if we only have a narrow window of dry weather before the next rain. On grass hay I just about always use a tedder.


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## K and B hay (Jan 12, 2016)

I was thinking if you used a Tedder on your heavier cutting you could make smaller windrows. With the twinstar you can not open it up as wide and then angle the baskets to what width of row you want to grab.


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## FarmerCline (Oct 12, 2011)

Kandbhay said:


> I was thinking if you used a Tedder on your heavier cutting you could make smaller windrows. With the twinstar you can not open it up as wide and then angle the baskets to what width of row you want to grab.


 So the raking width is not adjustable on a Twinstar? It is fixed raking width with only the windrow width being adjustable if I'm understanding correctly?


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## K and B hay (Jan 12, 2016)

You can adjust the raking width and the windrow width on a twinstar. For us we don't Tedder so we just put 2 windrows together but having a 15 ft swather can make the balers run pretty slow.


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## FarmerCline (Oct 12, 2011)

Kandbhay said:


> You can adjust the raking width and the windrow width on a twinstar. For us we don't Tedder so we just put 2 windrows together but having a 15 ft swather can make the balers run pretty slow.


 Ok, I must have misunderstood when you said the baskets couldn't be angled in to grab the desired amount of hay. How do you adjust the raking width and what is the minimum raking width? The Twinstar literature doesn't list the minimum only the max of 27 feet.


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## K and B hay (Jan 12, 2016)

They use a electric over hydraulic manifold on the rake. So you have a small control box with 5-7 switches that mounts in the tractor cab. G2 has 5 switches and G3 has 7. So the G2 switch one moves left basket in or out. Switch two moves the right basket in or out. Switch three changes the angle of the left basket. Switch four changes the angle of the right basket. Switch five runs both baskets up and down. On the G3 you have all the functions I mentioned above but you also have switches to run each basket up and down independently. On the width question I think as long as you put enough angle to move the crop sideways is as wide as you need to go so 12-15ft. We single rake with ours if we need to just roll a row over just put one basket out and adjust the angle so the row is making a half turn. Where most rakes you just set with stops this one you can change all the angles and width on the fly from the tractor seat.


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## SVFHAY (Dec 5, 2008)

I get what your saying about hired help and that makes a lot of sense. Center delivery is way easier to operate than a twin.

The windrow won't be too big for the baler, the bigger the better IF it is dry. That is the part that might bother me. If your keeping your little rotary you'll have some flexibility for cloudy days.


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## Hank- in or (Feb 12, 2009)

I run 2 sets of the Twinstar 2030 G2. The beauty of these rakes is that you run the baskets much slower than the 5 bar rakes and being able to make all adjustments on the fly which is a big deal in pivots with corner systems. If you are using a 14' for smaller swather the 2027 will work just fine but if you are using a 16' header and lay it out wide you will need the 2030.

I have these rakes behind a JD 6410 and a JD 6430 and both rakes are set on the open center setting. I have added a second set of hoses for better lift times and cooler oil. I have the extra teeth in both sets along with font and rear gauge wheels. When you find where you want to run the slideouts you need to take a marker pin and draw a line on the beam so it will be the same all the time. I thought the ball hitch would be a pain in the ass but now I really like them because the rakes don't bounce on the hitch like a pin does.

These rakes are more designed for smoother fields. One thing I wish they would do is to make the front to back offset on the tandem wheels about 5" or 6" longer so when crossing a pivot track both wheels would not fall in the track. I have been tempted to try it on a set of mine and see how it would work.

I have never been around the Vermeer, just NH , Allen and Twinstar.


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## FarmerCline (Oct 12, 2011)

SVFHAY said:


> I get what your saying about hired help and that makes a lot of sense. Center delivery is way easier to operate than a twin.
> The windrow won't be too big for the baler, the bigger the better IF it is dry. That is the part that might bother me. If your keeping your little rotary you'll have some flexibility for cloudy days.


 Selling the single rotor......think I have it sold for 9k or was offered 8k on trade so I can't see its worth that much to keep around.


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