# 10,000 hour IVT



## paoutdoorsman (Apr 23, 2016)

Looking at a 20 series Deere with an IVT trans. It would make an awesome mowing and baling tractor for me. The hour meter is currently showing 24.9 hours. I suspect it could have 10,024,9 hours on it, but the tractor doesn't really show it. Auction catalog lists it as 'Engine hours not showing correctly'. Per selling dealer, the trans slips in low gear, then gets traction. It's a gamble all around, but if it sells right... Has anyone had an IVT with high hours? Issues/concerns?


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## SVFHAY (Dec 5, 2008)

I thought the newer tractors didn't turn over like that, in other words it would read hours up to 99,999.9. Maybe the display was replaced.

On a 6xxx series, at least the early zf built transmission, Deere considered them non serviceable, just replace the whole deal. The right tech can work on them and get parts through Deutz.

I've been told later models, like 30 series on up can be worked on by Deere.

Hopefully Todd will chime in as he has some experience in this.

I had a 6420 ivt. It was awesome but it burned up around 3k hours.


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## carcajou (Jan 28, 2011)

A Deere dealership took in a 7420 with an IVT about 7 years ago. Salesman told me they replaced the IVT and it come close to $40,000 CDN all in. Scared me off as a new power quad was only $17,000 installed at that time. If you can buy it right thats all that matters but i would expect the worst and plan accordingly.


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## JD3430 (Jan 1, 2012)

paoutdoorsman said:


> Looking at a 20 series Deere with an IVT trans. It would make an awesome mowing and baling tractor for me. The hour meter is currently showing 24.9 hours. I suspect it could have 10,024,9 hours on it, but the tractor doesn't really show it. Auction catalog lists it as 'Engine hours not showing correctly'. Per selling dealer, the trans slips in low gear, then gets traction. It's a gamble all around, but if it sells right... Has anyone had an IVT with high hours? Issues/concerns?


I don't know if you mean a "Deere IVT with high hours", or "any IVT with high hours"?
I have a MF7495 with 5600 hours and a Fendt IVT and rear axle. 5600 hours is not exactly high, but I was a little nervous when the "high pressure transmission filter" light kept coming on. Even after replacing the filter, the light would come back on. I thought the worst, but it turns out the brakes were on their way out causing metal flakes to contaminate the fluid and clog the very sensitive high pressure transmission filter sensor to trip.
After a pretty expensive brake job (rear and front cardan brakes), I'm in the clear.
The IVT transmissions can be tested and analyzed by a good tech. I had a laptop diagnosis done on mine and I was given a chart with a column with the test results alongside a column with acceptable parameters. Thankfully the IVT was given a clean bill of health. 
Although my IVT is a Fendt, maybe you can get a Deere tech to do the same tests and see what's up with the one you're looking at and give you a similar chart?
Information is power. Might be something that can be repaired.


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## paoutdoorsman (Apr 23, 2016)

SVFHAY said:


> I thought the newer tractors didn't turn over like that, in other words it would read hours up to 99,999.9. Maybe the display was replaced.
> 
> On a 6xxx series, at least the early zf built transmission, Deere considered them non serviceable, just replace the whole deal. The right tech can work on them and get parts through Deutz.
> 
> ...


I think you have to get into the 30 series premium tractors to get a 5 digit hourmeter. I believe the hours are stored in the ECM rather than the display on the 20 series. This is a 7420 and I'm not sure if it would be same zf built trans or not. I'll see if I can find out. I know Todd bought a 6420 that had IVT trouble and Deere said it had to be replaced - $20k.


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## paoutdoorsman (Apr 23, 2016)

Thanks JD. I wasn't sure who built these trans for Deere or if they were built by Deere themselves. I know they try to keep all of their parts proprietary even if they are sourced from other manufacturers. I've got about 3 weeks to learn what I can.


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## paoutdoorsman (Apr 23, 2016)

Well I did end up with this tractor. Figured out the hours were just over 5,000. Just arrived from Oklahoma Friday evening. It's going to make a really nice tractor. Clutches for first range seem to be the issue. I can drive it if I can I set set the speed for first range relatively slow, de-clutch gently, and get it into the second range before coming to much of a grade. It seems it will do anything in the second range without issue. First range starts to slip with a little load or grade. I guess it'll be in the shop thread soon.


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## JD3430 (Jan 1, 2012)

paoutdoorsman said:


> Well I did end up with this tractor. Figured out the hours were just over 5,000. Just arrived from Oklahoma Friday evening. It's going to make a really nice tractor. Clutches for first range seem to be the issue. I can drive it if I can I set set the speed for first range relatively slow, de-clutch gently, and get it into the second range before coming to much of a grade. It seems it will do anything in the second range without issue. First range starts to slip with a little load or grade. I guess it'll be in the shop thread soon.


So you are going to fix it?

Or are you going to just run it with the low range slipping?

Reason i ask is because I usually use the low range in my Massey in the field and hi range over the road. I was talking to the tech that did my my brakes and he said "most guys just keep them in hi range over the road and in the field"

Wonder if you could get by without the repair?


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## paoutdoorsman (Apr 23, 2016)

Yeah I'm going to fix it. If I could run the season with it as is, I probably would, but it doesn't take much of an incline or drag for it to start losing speed when in low. I'm pretty certain I wouldn't be able to stop mid-pass with the discbine, and get started going again without raising the discbine, backing up some, then getting rolling again before dropping back into cutting. Can't live with that. Just monkeying around with it, it seems I have to get about 1.5 mph in the first range before it will shift into the second range.


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## Tx Jim (Jun 30, 2014)

I thought hours of use were stored in ECM. How did you come up with 5000 hrs?


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## paoutdoorsman (Apr 23, 2016)

Tx Jim said:


> I thought hours of use were stored in ECM. How did you come up with 5000 hrs?


I used to think the same was true Tx Jim. The original selling and servicing dealer had hour history with each service. It was in the shop a month earlier with the original cluster and the hours were recorded. The customer self installed a new cluster for some reason, and the hours were never applied in the new cluster. I'm hoping to get that resolved.


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## Gearclash (Nov 25, 2010)

JB Tractors in Millerville MN supposedly has a pretty good handle on repairing IVTs without the great expense that dealers incur.


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## woodland (May 23, 2016)

Those are quite the racing slicks on the front of that tractor. Looks nice otherwise. Our one 4760 has 17,000 hours on the original transmission and still runs like a champ. The repair cost doesn’t go very far compared to payments and depreciation on a new one. Good luck with your new unit. ????


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## JD Mechanic (May 21, 2020)

There are solutions availible for ivt's. The ZF built ones are cheaper to repair than the 7and 8 series, but all can be repaired.
I still a young guy, don't have a lot of experience under my belt, but I just repaired a 6620. It would be the European version of about 7320, but has the 6420 transmission in it. It has the common problem with the '20 series, the C1 clutch was fried. (this comes from a designing flaw; its improved in the '30 and R's)
We repaired it for under 5k in parts( we did a couple updates,too) and $2500 in labor. A lot cheaper than a power shift; we just put 25k in an old 4450 tranny.

I'd be more than willing to find you a solution for your tractor('s)


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## somedevildawg (Jun 20, 2011)

Sorry i missed this during my absence.....nice tractor Dana, I’m sure you’re loving that IVT....hard to believe how easy it is when working the FEL. Does that tractor have the pilot controls for the FEL (electric over hydraulic) looks like it’s got most everything else, about the only thing it doesn’t have is front fenders, Most of the IVT I see for sale are loaded up with options......


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## paoutdoorsman (Apr 23, 2016)

somedevildawg said:


> Sorry i missed this during my absence.....nice tractor Dana, I'm sure you're loving that IVT....hard to believe how easy it is when working the FEL. Does that tractor have the pilot controls for the FEL (electric over hydraulic) looks like it's got most everything else, about the only thing it doesn't have is front fenders, Most of the IVT I see for sale are loaded up with options......


Yeah this one is pretty well loaded. Original build sheets were in the owners manual compartment on the back of the seat, and front fenders is one of the options that were not chosen. (Heated leather seats were not chosen either ) Turned out the BCM was replaced in this tractor in an attempt to resolve the slipping C1 clutch, and the tractor only had 5300 hours on it according to the other controllers on the tractor that also log hours. I pulled the IVT out the end of last summer, rebuilt with 30 series components, and got it back in late fall. Too late to put hours on it last hay season. New Firestones on all 4 corners in December when they had a kick-butt rebate on. I'm chomping at the bit to put some hours on it this spring.

I also picked up a 6420 IVT last summer - the one in the pic I sent you yesterday. Absolutely love that tractor for mowing and baling! It was a little rough around the edges, but I've been slowly loving on it.


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## Trillium Farm (Dec 18, 2014)

JD3430 said:


> I don't know if you mean a "Deere IVT with high hours", or "any IVT with high hours"?
> I have a MF7495 with 5600 hours and a Fendt IVT and rear axle. 5600 hours is not exactly high, but I was a little nervous when the "high pressure transmission filter" light kept coming on. Even after replacing the filter, the light would come back on. I thought the worst, but it turns out the brakes were on their way out causing metal flakes to contaminate the fluid and clog the very sensitive high pressure transmission filter sensor to trip.
> After a pretty expensive brake job (rear and front cardan brakes), I'm in the clear.
> The IVT transmissions can be tested and analyzed by a good tech. I had a laptop diagnosis done on mine and I was given a chart with a column with the test results alongside a column with acceptable parameters. Thankfully the IVT was given a clean bill of health.
> ...


Actually you have a CVT and JD has an IVT they are very similar, but not the same.

"*A classic CVT uses a belt between two cones to vary the gear ratios. An IVT is basically a CVT with a zero ratio*"

AGCO CVTs are reputed to be bullet proof whereas JD IVT not at all. These transmissions are very sensitive to fluid quality. For me a JD IVT with that many hours would be a real gamble,


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## JD3430 (Jan 1, 2012)

Trillium Farm said:


> Actually you have a CVT and JD has an IVT they are very similar, but not the same.
> 
> "*A classic CVT uses a belt between two cones to vary the gear ratios. An IVT is basically a CVT with a zero ratio*"
> 
> AGCO CVTs are reputed to be bullet proof whereas JD IVT not at all. These transmissions are very sensitive to fluid quality. For me a JD IVT with that many hours would be a real gamble,


Thanks, I didn't know the difference! 
Mine was gone through pretty thoroughly and serviced last year. 
So far, I'm really impressed and I can see why such a big fuss is made about them. They are so nice to drive. It's like you think a full power shift is as good as it could get, then you drive a CVT or IVT and you can't believe it could be that much better, and it is!

on edit: mine actually says "Dyna VT" on the hood.


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## JD Mechanic (May 21, 2020)

I'm not sure I agree with the Fendt trans. being more bullet proof. They run more power through the hydro at low speeds than the JD and CNH do. At full speed the Fendt tran is fully mechanical, which is cool for running the road, but what about tillage?

We are currently running two JD ivt's over 10,000 hrs that weren't touched yet. A 6820 and a 6170R.

I like the Fendt's alright, I mean their luxury is top, but for tillage and general use I'd take a JD or CNH.

The '20 series Deere's had bad engineering in the C1, and that gave them a bad name.

BTW, I was calling it the Fendt trans because that is who made the trans for Massey


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## JD3430 (Jan 1, 2012)

JD Mechanic said:


> I'm not sure I agree with the Fendt trans. being more bullet proof. They run more power through the hydro at low speeds than the JD and CNH do. At full speed the Fendt tran is fully mechanical, which is cool for running the road, but what about tillage?
> 
> We are currently running two JD ivt's over 10,000 hrs that weren't touched yet. A 6820 and a 6170R.
> 
> ...


I hear they make the whole transaxle. Trans, rear, axle housing, brakes, wheel ends, everything. Massey seems like a Fendt Tractor without a Mann Diesel or a Fendt cab, front axle. I really like the fingertip control on the column. Makes it so easy to mount mower on front or rear attachments


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## somedevildawg (Jun 20, 2011)

I think the biggest design flaw on the IVT in the 6-series Tractors was sharing a common sump with the rest of the hydraulic system. My understanding is the 7-series had its own sump and didn't have the same problems normally seen in the 6-series....mine was expensive to replace. Took it out and JD sent a new one (rebuilt) in a crate. $28k for the IVT and install and service. But they allowed me $6k on the core  my transmission would kick out at about 9-11mph. Had a couple of teeth off the planetary gear as I remember...they thought it was because the tractor belonged to a dairy and they speculated that carrying heavy silage bales across rough ground cause bouncing at higher speeds and caused the damage....idk, I just know it didn't work and it cost me a bundle of dollars. I also know that for my type of work, there is no better method of delivery of energy to the wheels on a tractor.
Hope you enjoy this year Dana


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## stack em up (Mar 7, 2013)

Our dealer has 86 CVT tractors out running since 2004, only one CVT replaced as of yet. Not sure the cause of failure but I will say the owner is not super gentle on machinery.


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## Hay diddle diddle (Nov 17, 2017)

Neighbor had a 7830 ivt.....till it burnt..... shaft between the motor and gearbox dropped a uni and took out all the ancillaries like the steer valve and hydraulic pumps....that was over 20k. Then a hydraulic line that looped it's way up near the exhaust, burst, sprayed oil all over the exhaust manifold at base of cab . Went up in a ball of flames. Bloke driving had to jump through flames to get out. There were about 6 7930's sold locally that were nothing but trouble too.


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## JD Mechanic (May 21, 2020)

Well, if anybody runs into a problem with a JD ivt, contact me and I will try to help you out. For a lot cheaper than a dealer would. Frankly the dealers are screwing their customers over when they charge $26000 for a remanned trans.

I heard of a guy in Canada that works on Fendt trans.

I'm curious if there's anyone out there that does the CNH cvt's


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## stack em up (Mar 7, 2013)

JD Mechanic said:


> Well, if anybody runs into a problem with a JD ivt, contact me and I will try to help you out. For a lot cheaper than a dealer would. Frankly the dealers are screwing their customers over when they charge $26000 for a remanned trans.
> 
> I heard of a guy in Canada that works on Fendt trans.
> 
> I'm curious if there's anyone out there that does the CNH cvt's


Far as I remember, there is no one licensed In the world to repair Fendt transmissions. Not saying there isn't now or someone doing it on the side. The reasoning is the Fendt CVT has capability of 64 miles per hour. The only thing limiting that is the computer governor. Huge liability issue. It's why it took almost 30 years from invention of CVT to rollout in the '90s, there wasn't a controller smart enough to control it properly.

Flat rate time to R&R Fendt CVT is less than 8 hours. Lots of oil changing and calibration after that eats up lots of time and dollars.

And as expensive as it sounds, rebuild a PS and honestly not going to be a whole lot less than that honestly.


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## Trillium Farm (Dec 18, 2014)

JD Mechanic said:


> Well, if anybody runs into a problem with a JD ivt, contact me and I will try to help you out. For a lot cheaper than a dealer would. Frankly the dealers are screwing their customers over when they charge $26000 for a remanned trans.
> 
> I heard of a guy in Canada that works on Fendt trans.
> 
> I'm curious if there's anyone out there that does the CNH cvt's


Can you post who does Fendt in Canada?


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## JD Mechanic (May 21, 2020)

not sure who it is, but I heard about him from a couple different sources, so I don't think its just a rumor.


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## swmnhay (Jun 13, 2008)

Currently Fendt,Chalenger and MF are built in same factory at Jackson,Mn.A lot of same components in each tractor

I need to take the tour one of these days.


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## JD Mechanic (May 21, 2020)

I found another guy in Ohio that did a couple Fendt tranny's. He would be worth a try.

L.B. Newswanger

3065 US 250
Greenwich, OH, USA 44837
Phone: +1 419-929-1792
Contact: Loren Newswanger


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