# How to rent hay field?



## Blackhawk15 (Jan 9, 2019)

Hello All - First post here. My Mother owns 40 acres that's been in her family forever. The land is located in southwest Virginia. She just turned 90, so I have started taking care of more and more things for here. The land has never had crops on it that I am aware of. It has always been used for either hay or pasture. Our current tenant is raising beef cattle and has been on the land for at least 15 years. There are only about 30 acres that are viable for pasture or hay production, as the rest is wooded. The current tenant is leaving. To my knowledge, the tenant has never put down any fertilizer or lime. I want to give the land a break from cattle for a while. He kept about 25 head on the land, which I felt was too many for the size of the land.

I want to just grow hay on the land for the next several years. What would be a fair price to charge someone to harvest the hay on those 30 acres using all their own equipment? Do you base it on acreage or number of bails harvested, etc.? I'm just hoping to get enough to offset the biggest part of the property taxes.

For the first 2-3 years, I am guessing that the quality and quality won't be great until we get down some fertilizer and lime in order to get things back in shape. Would it be fair for me to pay for the fertilizer and lime and the other person to supply the labor and equipment, then probably charge a reduced rate for the hay for those first years?

Thanks


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## Idaho Hay (Oct 14, 2016)

In my neck of the woods, if the the farmer does everything (including pay for fertilizer), the norm is a 70/30 split. 70% to the farmer and 30% to the land owner (either in yield or market value of crop). If the farm agrees to plow and reseed the land, then either they sign a 5 year contract, or the land owner pays for all the plowing and planting to be done.


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## swmnhay (Jun 13, 2008)

1- Soil test

2- Haying it isn't going to be any easier on the land.The nutrients are hauled off with the hay.If you are grazing they are returned in the manure.

3- Land rents are different all over the country.From free to $200+ acre just for grassland.So its hard to put a price on it for your area.I've rented some on shares 50-50 and split fert costs.


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## Farmerbrown2 (Sep 25, 2018)

I agree soil test then you have a baseline of your soil quality good or bad you will know.

My uncle rents out part of his farm he has tenant soil test every year so his soil isn't mined . He always says he took care of the land for 50 years and expects to pass it on to his son in good shape.

Have a signed lease that way there is no misunderstandings. Big thing in my area the last 10 years is hunting leases. Someone may give you $500 or more to hunt your property. There is a 12 acre parcel close to me land owner has a father son mowing grass all summer just to go hunting.


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## RockmartGA (Jun 29, 2011)

swmnhay said:


> Land rents are different all over the country.From free to $200+ acre just for grassland.So its hard to put a price on it for your area.


Very true. In my area, I've had several people offer me small tracts of land for free. Mother-in-law has a small field (<20 ac) that she leases to a guy for row crops - doesn't make enough to pay the property taxes, but at least it keeps me from having to haul my equipment to maintain it for her. I don't have the time anyway....


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## Trillium Farm (Dec 18, 2014)

Blackhawk15 said:


> Hello All - First post here. My Mother owns 40 acres that's been in her family forever. The land is located in southwest Virginia. She just turned 90, so I have started taking care of more and more things for here. The land has never had crops on it that I am aware of. It has always been used for either hay or pasture. Our current tenant is raising beef cattle and has been on the land for at least 15 years. There are only about 30 acres that are viable for pasture or hay production, as the rest is wooded. The current tenant is leaving. To my knowledge, the tenant has never put down any fertilizer or lime. I want to give the land a break from cattle for a while. He kept about 25 head on the land, which I felt was too many for the size of the land.
> 
> I want to just grow hay on the land for the next several years. What would be a fair price to charge someone to harvest the hay on those 30 acres using all their own equipment? Do you base it on acreage or number of bails harvested, etc.? I'm just hoping to get enough to offset the biggest part of the property taxes.
> 
> For the first 2-3 years, I am guessing that the quality and quality won't be great until we get down some fertilizer and lime in order to get things back in shape. Would it be fair for me to pay for the fertilizer and lime and the other person to supply the labor and equipment, then probably charge a reduced rate for the hay for those first years? Thanks


Frankly in your situation I think that you could get very little if you can even find someone to cut,rake & bale it as it would probably be only just dry grass. The good thing is that all that cattle would have contributed to fertilization, but the best way is to get a soil test and follow the advice given. The best way would be to find someone who will seed red clover then plow it under as green manure to improve the tilth of the soil following this with seeding grass, legumes or a combination of these, then you could get hay prices and divide it accordingly as Idaho Hay mentioned.


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## Hayman1 (Jul 6, 2013)

In my area of northwestern Va, an awful lot of land is rented free to keep it qualified for the owner to participate in land use tax reduction programs. So you could consider the reduction in property taxes (which is substantial) the "rent". Farmer supplies everything but gets everything. Mostly for hay or grazing. If someone has a good sized area with good fencing and water, you can get grazing rent. Cropland (assuming the property owner will allow cropping) is another story which I don't have experience in. For the most part, I am talking about tracts 50 ac or less where the owner does not want tillage or crops, excessive herbicides and the like. I have never had issues with reasonable herbicide applications to control weeds with these folks but forget biosolids or poultry litter. We do not have large numbers of BTOs in row crops and very few are making small squares to sell.


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## Blackhawk15 (Jan 9, 2019)

Thanks everyone for the responses.

Hayman1 - After your post, I checked and my county does not participate in the land use tax reduction program. Too bad, that was good info.

This land is used by me and my sons for hunting and is really the only place that we have to hunt, so I don't want to lease it for hunting. This is one of the reasons that I want to just produce hay. The cattle drive us crazy during hunting season. They are almost always crowded around at least one of our treestands when we are there. With cattle on the land, I can't lay out any deer food or mineral blocks.


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## chaded (May 13, 2018)

Around here you really wouldn't be able to do a cash lease thing with land like that unless it was flat and it was going to be used for row crops. But for hay, no. Most around here will make hay off of it and want to keep 2/3. Some will fertilize, some won't. Then there are some (not many) that will make the hay and split it 50/50 but you will foot the fertilizer bill. That's what I do with mine. I'm not fertilizing and only getting a third...

As it has been mentioned, get a soil test. I can understand not wanting the cattle there in your situation but as was also mentioned, making hay isn't going to be easier on the land.


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## Vol (Jul 5, 2009)

Blackhawk15 said:


> Thanks everyone for the responses.
> 
> Hayman1 - After your post, I checked and my county does not participate in the land use tax reduction program. Too bad, that was good info.
> 
> This land is used by me and my sons for hunting and is really the only place that we have to hunt, so I don't want to lease it for hunting. This is one of the reasons that I want to just produce hay. The cattle drive us crazy during hunting season. They are almost always crowded around at least one of our treestands when we are there. With cattle on the land, I can't lay out any deer food or mineral blocks.


I suggest you look into just letting the grass grow and do nothing with it until the following late winter and then do a controlled burn(each year). You potentially could get the local volunteer fire fighters to assist you with this. You will have much more game if you do not harvest the hay or let cattle graze it. The deer love tall grass fields.....maybe sow down some red clover right now so that you can be fixating nitrogen to the field. No tax benefits, but the hunting benefits will be much greater.

Regards, Mike


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## Hayman1 (Jul 6, 2013)

That’s a good idea Mike. Red clover is cheap, not sure how it will do competing with the tall grass if it doesn’t get cut. Might add some buckwheat if you have turkey


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## cjsr8595 (Jul 7, 2014)

if it’s had cows on it the ground probably isn’t in as bad of shape as you think. How about letting it grow up and bush hog it a couple times the first year. Then soil test and go from there. We’ve done that before and has worked well for us.


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## Hayjosh (Mar 24, 2016)

I have several different arrangements I do. On one field, I use it for free and do anything I want to it. I spray it, fertilize it every year and I overseeded it last year with timothy, alfalfa, and orchard grass.

On another field, I pay $50/acre but I can't spray it or use fertilizer because the property owner wants to soil to remain like 'organic.' I did talk her into letting me use RoundUp on milkweed last year and I used a spot sprayer. I do spread dairy manure on this field and will be going to that for everything, and it costs me nothing to have MSU haul it in and spread it at 6 ton/acre. The field is very close to my house, usually yields pretty well, borders one customer's house so makes unloading easy, and landowner is easy to deal with. So it's worth it to me.

On a different field, I pay 25% of my sales. If I keep hay for myself I pay him 25% of fair market price or what I'd otherwise sell it for. This field is 5 miles away from me and the gravel road is extremely bumpy and hard on the equipment so it's bottom priority. In this case paying a percentage is more beneficial to ME because I'm not out anything if I don't harvest the field, or as was the case last year, the field yielded very poorly and I didn't even bother with third cut.

A fourth landowner also lets me use his field for free and I can do whatever I want to it. He is just glad to have it mowed and maintained. His field started out very weedy with lots of holes and soil nutrition wasn't great. I filled in all the holes, took out the weeds, and started manure on the field. It looks like a different field now and he sees it.

My agreements are just handshake agreements, I'm super small time/hobbyist/wannabe, and the landowners I deal with are friends and they appreciate me and I appreciate them.

One thing is for sure--all land owners I deal with, especially the ones letting me farm it for free, definitely notice the improvements to the field. They see no more weeds, rich growth, and looks really nice when it's fresh cut and also looks really nice when it's ready to be harvested. If you have somebody farming it who's a good steward of the land, they can get it in good shape; this is also a benefit for you. I'd avoid somebody who doesn't want to fertilize; they'll mine what nutrients are left and probably cut a lot of corners.


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## Blackhawk15 (Jan 9, 2019)

Hayjosh - Your arrangements sound very close to what I am looking for. I probably wouldn't mind letting someone use the hay for free if they really improved the land like you are doing. The overpopulation of cows that have been on my land have trampled a lot of places into mud pits and wore down a lot of paths. I also have 3 springs on the property that need some ditching. If someone helped clean up those things, that would be a good trade for the hay.

The good thing about my land is that the access is right off a paved road. I have a 70 ft entrance before the gate. I put in several tons of gravel there and a new gate this past summer.


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## Hayman1 (Jul 6, 2013)

Blackhawk15 said:


> Hayjosh - Your arrangements sound very close to what I am looking for. I probably wouldn't mind letting someone use the hay for free if they really improved the land like you are doing. The overpopulation of cows that have been on my land have trampled a lot of places into mud pits and wore down a lot of paths. I also have 3 springs on the property that need some ditching. If someone helped clean up those things, that would be a good trade for the hay.
> 
> The good thing about my land is that the access is right off a paved road. I have a 70 ft entrance before the gate. I put in several tons of gravel there and a new gate this past summer.


BH- Maybe you can rip some of those mud pits and start food plots in them. Kill two birds with one stone as it were.


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## Hayjosh (Mar 24, 2016)

Blackhawk15 said:


> Hayjosh - Your arrangements sound very close to what I am looking for. I probably wouldn't mind letting someone use the hay for free if they really improved the land like you are doing. The overpopulation of cows that have been on my land have trampled a lot of places into mud pits and wore down a lot of paths. I also have 3 springs on the property that need some ditching. If someone helped clean up those things, that would be a good trade for the hay.
> 
> The good thing about my land is that the access is right off a paved road. I have a 70 ft entrance before the gate. I put in several tons of gravel there and a new gate this past summer.


It sounds like there will be a lot of preparation for the field and I'm guessing most larger hay producers won't have time for it. I'd doubt there'd be many people who will want to put the effort into getting it farmable again especially if they're having to rent the ground. Then there's little hobby farmers like me who will take (just about) anything they can get, and are willing to do extra work to the land because that's part of the fun.


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## Ray 54 (Aug 2, 2014)

More fully stating what your goal is help in giving possibilities of things to do with this property.

Since hunting is something you want from the property that narrows down some of the uses.Being in the cattle business I can see many ways cattle could use your property and not interfere with hunting. But it takes a willing cattleman to work with you. Being on the other side of the country I have no idea of what is practical in your environment. So if you don't find a hay grower don't rule out a cattle person, but come right out with your goals of the best hunting.


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