# Square bales



## carroyo49 (Dec 26, 2016)

Don't know if I am in the right place, and if I am not I apologize. I bought a John Deere 8440 tractor 4x4. I also bought a square baler 570 new holland and a kuhn 902 disc mower. I heard someone say that my tractor is too powerful for those machines and that I would have to buy a smaller tractor so as to not damage the two units. Now I don't want to go ahead on making another purchase for a tractor if the one I own can do the job. The kuhn and the new holland baler are each 20 feet long, so they are not necessarily small machines. Can anyone help out? Has anyone done this before?


----------



## Tx Jim (Jun 30, 2014)

Although an 8440 is a very large tractor @ 175 pto hp as long as slip clutches aren't stuck & properly adjusted you should be fine. Your other obstacle is the 8440 only came with a 1000 rpm pto speed and most hay equipment runs @ 540 rpm's.


----------



## mlappin (Jun 25, 2009)

Tx Jim said:


> Although an 8440 is a very large tractor @ 175 pto hp as long as slip clutches aren't stuck & properly adjusted you should be fine. Your other obstacle is the 8440 only came with a 1000 rpm pto speed and most hay equipment runs @ 540 rpm's.


I much prefer 540 shafts for two reasons:

1: if they get a little wear at 540 they don't vibrate near as much as a slightly worn 1000.

2: A 540 shaft doesn't throw grease near as far as a 1000rpm shaft.


----------



## carroyo49 (Dec 26, 2016)

Tx Jim said:


> Although an 8440 is a very large tractor @ 175 pto hp as long as slip clutches aren't stuck & properly adjusted you should be fine. Your other obstacle is the 8440 only came with a 1000 rpm pto speed and most hay equipment runs @ 540 rpm's.


That is the problem. Running a 1000 rpm pto on a 540 rpm equipment is a recipe for disaster. What would you suggest as far as tractor pto and hp for hay equipment?


----------



## carroyo49 (Dec 26, 2016)

mlappin said:


> I much prefer 540 shafts for two reasons:
> 
> 1: if they get a little wear at 540 they don't vibrate near as much as a slightly worn 1000.
> 
> 2: A 540 shaft doesn't throw grease near as far as a 1000rpm shaft.


Thanks


----------



## endrow (Dec 15, 2011)

Seems like we move from one end of the spectrum to the other. Tomorrow someone will want to know if they can do a bit of that size with 25 horsepower.


----------



## Teslan (Aug 20, 2011)

endrow said:


> Seems like we move from one end of the spectrum to the other. Tomorrow someone will want to know if they can do a bit of that size with 25 horsepower.


i think this is the first time someone had that large of a tractor for a small square. If it was a dealer who sold him this package I wouldn't go back to that dealer as they don't have his best interests in mind. I don't know about the disc mower and I'm feeling to lazy to look it up, but for the baler I think an 85 or 90 hp would be great. Just for the fact that it might not require that many much but a little bigger is usually needed at some point.


----------



## Teslan (Aug 20, 2011)

Wow I just looked up the tractor. Did you purposely buy that for baling and mowing hay? Sorry if I sound a little rude. If it has duals on it that won't work for baling with that baler. Heck I wouldn't want to use it on any baler of any type. I don't really know mowers but I don't think it will work for that either


----------



## thendrix (May 14, 2015)

I run a Kuhn GMD600 mower and a NH 273 baler with a 68 pto hp Long. Hp hasn't been an issue and weight hasn't really been but it would be nice to have a few weights up front. I would agree with Teslan in saying 85 to 90 would be great


----------



## Hayman1 (Jul 6, 2013)

carroyo49 said:


> That is the problem. Running a 1000 rpm pto on a 540 rpm equipment is a recipe for disaster. What would you suggest as far as tractor pto and hp for hay equipment?


I run a 570 with thrower and 5 kicker wagons the longest of which is 22 feet and will hold 185 50#+ bales. I am assuming you are not going to have hill issues in Fla. I run the baler and my discbine with a JD6115M which clocks in around 100 pto hp, 540. I have run it with a 2755 jd which really had enough power (75-80 PTO-HP) just did not want to hold it on steeper hills. Bear in mind, this isn't the hill country of Tenn or Pa but I was thankful for all pto hp and weight when I was baling alfalfa down the road for a client. I would think that 80-90 pto hp on a two wheel drive tractor would be just the ticket in Fla. Of course, if you are ground dropping the bales, it is a whole different matter.


----------



## somedevildawg (Jun 20, 2011)

Welcome to haytalk......that is one big ass tractor to hay with, but I see no reason why it won't handle the mower and the baler, not sure if that 902 has a 1000 option or not but it's a purty good size mower, I would say about 90-110 hp with some counter balance on the front of the machine, in your case, no counterbalance needed 
Would definately not want to run those machines at higher than rated pto speed.....


----------



## somedevildawg (Jun 20, 2011)

Well, just looked at the 8440...., didnt realize we were talking about that series of tractors. I think I would purchase another more "suitable" tractor and leave that for row crop work...


----------



## Greasy30 (Mar 15, 2010)

Where in Florida are you from? And where did you find that size tractor?

The 3 big hay producers around me run 100-120hp tractors.

My "big" tractor is 70 hp & 62 PTO hp. And have no issues.


----------



## gosh (Sep 28, 2014)

carroyo49 said:


> Don't know if I am in the right place, and if I am not I apologize. I bought a John Deere 8440 tractor 4x4. I also bought a square baler 570 new holland and a kuhn 902 disc mower. I heard someone say that my tractor is too powerful for those machines and that I would have to buy a smaller tractor so as to not damage the two units. Now I don't want to go ahead on making another purchase for a tractor if the one I own can do the job. The kuhn and the new holland baler are each 20 feet long, so they are not necessarily small machines. Can anyone help out? Has anyone done this before?[/size]


Unless you have a really large place, I predict that you will be pleased with the increased maneuverability and decreased fuel costs associated with a smaller tractor (in addition to the other points already made).


----------



## carroyo49 (Dec 26, 2016)

Teslan said:


> i think this is the first time someone had that large of a tractor for a small square. If it was a dealer who sold him this package I wouldn't go back to that dealer as they don't have his best interests in mind. I don't know about the disc mower and I'm feeling to lazy to look it up, but for the baler I think an 85 or 90 hp would be great. Just for the fact that it might not require that many much but a little bigger is usually needed at some point.


This is one lesson that I learned. I bought all three from an auction site. I got all three for a very good price, under 20,000 for all three. In my naive mind I thought that all I needed to worry about was the ability of a tractor to pull machinery along, never once did I worry about rpm.


----------



## carroyo49 (Dec 26, 2016)

Teslan said:


> Wow I just looked up the tractor. Did you purposely buy that for baling and mowing hay? Sorry if I sound a little rude. If it has duals on it that won't work for baling with that baler. Heck I wouldn't want to use it on any baler of any type. I don't really know mowers but I don't think it will work for that either


I wanted to do baling, mowing and plowing.


----------



## IH 1586 (Oct 16, 2014)

What size plows were you looking to get???? One point from your post is lack of equipment knowledge. I think before you do anymore buying or planning you should study what it is you are looking to do. You either have too much time or money or both. Right now we know you have the wrong equipment and don't know your full intentions. Acres of land, are you doing custom, doing your own, selling it, feeding own animals,


----------



## carroyo49 (Dec 26, 2016)

IH 1586 said:


> What size plows were you looking to get???? One point from your post is lack of equipment knowledge. I think before you do anymore buying or planning you should study what it is you are looking to do. You either have too much time or money or both. Right now we know you have the wrong equipment and don't know your full intentions. Acres of land, are you doing custom, doing your own, selling it, feeding own animals,


I am already looking for a smaller tractor with the ability to do 540 rpm. Land is about 200 acres. I paid about 20k for all three equipment. The big tractor can be used for plowing as I will be buying a big plow for farming maybe 50 acres. The rest will be for cutting hay for sale and for my animals. You are correct on that I know squat about equipment knowledge but I am a newbie and will definitely be doing lots of research before buying. If I don't need the big tractor I will be selling it.


----------



## gosh (Sep 28, 2014)

One thing that I have observed about the crew that hangs out here: New people are welcome and can learn a lot if they show the willingness to do so and can handle the truth, sometimes stated more bluntly than you'd like to hear.

That said, it looks like you're going to fit in just fine.


----------



## Vol (Jul 5, 2009)

carroyo49 said:


> You are correct on that I know squat about equipment knowledge but I am a newbie and will definitely be doing lots of research before buying. If I don't need the big tractor I will be selling it.


Hang in there carroyo.....we will get you headed in the correct general direction. Just ask and we will gently guide you.

Regards, Mike


----------



## Trotwood2955 (Sep 4, 2012)

If you are only needing to work ground on 50 or so acres and the rest is hay I'd sell the 8440 altogether. A 100hp hay tractor (or even smaller for that matter) and matching tillage equipment will be more than enough for 50 acres in my opinion. 8440 seems like an awfully big tractor for that many acres when a good all-around big utility or small row crop tractor would be dual purpose and much more handy.


----------



## Wethay (Jul 17, 2015)

A 100 hp tractor, give or take will most likely keep up with everything you want to do. Plowing, especially if it's a moldboard plow hp requirements varies on soil type. If you have a friendly neighbor ask how many hp he is running, and how many acres an hour he is getting done. If you are going to want to do tillage 4 wheel drive (or mechanical front wheel assist) usually gets more horse power to the ground. Hills and a front end loader (FEL) can factor into the decision also.


----------



## carroyo49 (Dec 26, 2016)

gosh said:


> One thing that I have observed about the crew that hangs out here: New people are welcome and can learn a lot if they show the willingness to do so and can handle the truth, sometimes stated more bluntly than you'd like to hear.
> 
> That said, it looks like you're going to fit in just fine.


Thanks, I don't mind tough criticism. It can be helpful. I am glad I found this forum. Everyone has been extremely helpful.


----------



## gosh (Sep 28, 2014)

How sandy is the soil on your place? What town are you near? (If you don't mind me asking?)


----------



## somedevildawg (Jun 20, 2011)

Carroyo, what ya gonna be farming on those 50 acres of tillable land? The crop you intend to grow makes a difference in tractor requirements so it's critical knowledge when shopping for iron. It sounds like you will be fine with "Utility" type tractors, they are capable tractors for a wide range of uses. Most are about 80-120 hp.....maybe sell the 8440 to a earth moving company


----------



## Wethay (Jul 17, 2015)

The 8440 is only about 180hp, it's big brother at the time the 8640 was about 230hp, a decent amount of horses at the time. Now straight tractors go way bigger than that. A 8440 is kind of a dinosaur anymore, not a lot of pull for the footprint. I second the opinion that you will find help here, some opinions and maybe things stated a bit blunt.


----------



## aawhite (Jan 16, 2012)

Considering the acreage you are farming/haying I would look for a 40 series Deere of the 2wd variety. A JD 4440 would pull a decent sized plow (we pulled either a 4-18 or a 5-16 with ours for years) and be more than enough to handle the baler and mower.

Sell the 8440 fast. On a side note, the JD 8440 was underpowered for its weight, and the engine block serves as part of the frame. If you drive thru ditches or terraces much that cause the front axle to oscillate to the stops, they tend to crack engine blocks. This ends up being a $15,000+ repair.


----------

