# Legal standing



## hillside hay (Feb 4, 2013)

I have a neighbor who is a serial trespasser, litterbug,vandal, and seems to like to target practice when I'm working the fields close by. Local law enforcement says they can do nothing. Just work it out between you and your neighbor they say. A decade of trying to work it out with zero improvement. I'm at a loss as it is potentially the best ground I have provided they aren't tearing it up with dirt bikes snowmobiles and 4 wheelers. Cutting fence throwing trash and ild car parts tires and the like. Can I sue to force him to sell and move? The justice system won't do anything. The civil system is all I have left.


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## Hayjosh (Mar 24, 2016)

If you post a no trespassing sign can you prosecute trespassers?

This would have to be extremely frustrating and I'd find it unacceptable that LEO can do nothing.


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## Tim/South (Dec 12, 2011)

Can you prove it was them? That is going to be the legal question. Cutting fences is a major no-no.

Our Wildlife division will go after poachers in a heart beat. They do not play around.

If that had been going on here in the Deep South there would have already been a house warming.


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## JD3430 (Jan 1, 2012)

What a great, but frustrating topic!
I remember being a teenager, me my dad and older brother having to physically remove fishermen & hunters off our property.
Then they'd come back and vandalize our property to get back at us!
You'd lose sleep at night over it.
Now 30 years later, I'm having my equipment vandalized and its on a customers property.
I'd seriously doubt you can sue to force him to sell.
I know its difficult, but the best thing you can do is arrange a meeting with him and someone of authority (sheriff, police, JP, etc) and get it out in the air.
OR if thats not possible, post your property as clearly as possible and set up game cameras.
I know its not easy, but if you catch them, you can sue them civilly and collect your expenses in catching them.
I would think a JP in your farm area would be very sympathetic to your loses and have the trespasser compensate you and then some.
Remember, its very easy to sue. You dont need a lawyer, but it would help. What if you talk to a lawyer and describe your problem, and see what he suggests???

My dad always used to say that "neighbors can make or break you". I'm pretty lucky on 3 sides of my property but have some city assholes on one side who flood my back yard with their rainwater.
I'd love a reason to bitch slap this greasy punk, but I keep thinking "love thy neighbor".
Too bad his philosophy is "screw thy neighbor"


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## hillside hay (Feb 4, 2013)

It's posted fenced the whole nine. Local sheriff says they need to actually catch them in the act and have to remove them for trespassing to go anywhere. Tracks leading right to their garage don't count. Neither do hot snowmobiles sitting just over the line. Ripping out the 50 year old patchwork fence and putting in a new one this spring. Needs to be done anyway and I'm hoping the point gets across. All four of them. Related question,; how many volts can I charge a fence with? How anyone ever charged a short section with a taser? Haha that'd be some funny stuff right there!


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## hillside hay (Feb 4, 2013)

Hayjosh said:


> If you post a no trespassing sign can you prosecute trespassers?
> 
> This would have to be extremely frustrating and I'd find it unacceptable that LEO can do nothing.


It is frustrating but to be fair they do have their hands full with other pressing matters. The opiate problem is consuming all resources at this point.


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## hillside hay (Feb 4, 2013)

Tim/South said:


> Can you prove it was them? That is going to be the legal question. Cutting fences is a major no-no.
> Our Wildlife division will go after poachers in a heart beat. They do not play around.
> 
> If that had been going on here in the Deep South there would have already been a house warming.


Therein lies the problem. NY State where criminals problem tenants and welfare queens reign supreme


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## JD3430 (Jan 1, 2012)

hillside hay said:


> It is frustrating but to be fair they do have their hands full with other pressing matters. The opiate problem is consuming all resources at this point.


I wouldn't let them off quite so easy....people can get killed over trespassing issues. Although I know there are more pressing matters, I am very good friends with a cop and he tells me thats one of the lines *SOME* of the cops give to people with "minor" complaints to keep their case load lighter.
I think the game/video cameras are the way to go. Photographic evidence catching people in the middle of wrongdoing is difficult to refute. If its an ongoing issue, I would think you'll have evidence in a week or 2.

Another thought: I know it seems like a "bridge too far", but when I had my tires slashed, I was surprised at the reaction one of the local cops had. I told him the out of town property owners asked me to run off trespassers. I told him several times I have caught drunks, migrants, motorcycles, snowmobiles, etc off the property. His reaction kind of was like "oh, come on man, whats the big deal? What are they doing to bother you?"
I'm like "huh?"
And this was the day after the tires were slashed. I was really surprised that someone charged to uphold the law, knowing the property is posted, would almost seem to side up with the trespassers. Had another time where i called the police about a beligerant trespasser on my property. he asked for my address and when I gave it to him he said "oh, thats a private lane. We get trespassers on private lanes all the time". And I'm thinking "OK...whats that supposed to mean?"
Arent you going to do something about it?


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## hillside hay (Feb 4, 2013)

Yes that is the public perception that hay and pasture are not real crops. To quote my neighbor"Relax man, it's just grass!"


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## hillside hay (Feb 4, 2013)

I saw your post with the tire situation JD. That bites. I really wish we could take some of these people to the woodshed. Seeings as the sheriff's are all too busy. Pretty sure they'd make the time to haul our asses in though. Some people just aren't raised right.


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## mlappin (Jun 25, 2009)

Thats too bad LEO won't do anything. Here they've been great about crap like that. Course, I have a good friend thats a county officer, and Dad goes to church with several as well so that helps.

Last problem I had I put up more no trespassing signs, took my friend to see where the four wheelers were going in and out of the field out of their yard. Took him back to his car then he followed be to their house. He got out and leaned against his car while I did the talking, probably helped they could see his nice shiny handcuffs as well. Next day two four wheelers were for sale in their yard.

Only suggestion is too fix the fence, post signs and transplant some poison ivy into the new fence, worked great at the section 8 housing that buts up to one of our fields.


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## JD3430 (Jan 1, 2012)

Made me think of a story while I was growing up in my teens. My dad had 2 ponds. One was 2 acres, filled with LM bass. The other was small, maybe bigger than a swimming pool and was shady and fed by a cold creek (or "crick" as they say in my area). This small, deep cold pond was stocked with 2 foot long rainbow trout that you could feed out of your hand. 
So one day I see these 2 guys fishing in our big pond (a little background- our property was an only cattle farm with barbed wire fence and many well maintained "no trespassing" signs). So me and dad approach these two ass clowns all dressed up like city boys with brand new camo on just standing there like they were in their own back yards, fishing poles in hand, slapping the water with the dumbest looking fishing lures you ever saw. My dad says to them, what the f*ck you boys think you're doing here? My old man was not a person to be messed with. They said "oh, we're with the bass fishermans society" or some crap like that showing us their silly licenses on their hats. My dad goes postal and these two guys start looking like they want to go. We had a stare down and they left.
Next day I go down to the big pond, walking past the small pond, I notice a empty styrofoam cup and a bunch of cigarette butts on the edge of the water.
These assholes came back and fished out all the trout. Took everyone of them. My dad was never the same after that. He became very difficult and rough to deal with.
Trespassing can have profound effects on people's security and well being.


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## Teslan (Aug 20, 2011)

JD3430 said:


> Made me think of a story while I was growing up in my teens. My dad had 2 ponds. One was 2 acres, filled with LM bass. The other was small, maybe bigger than a swimming pool and was shady and fed by a cold creek (or "crick" as they say in my area). This small, deep cold pond was stocked with 2 foot long rainbow trout that you could feed out of your hand.
> So one day I see these 2 guys fishing in our big pond (a little background- our property was an only cattle farm with barbed wire fence and many well maintained "no trespassing" signs). So me and dad approach these two ass clowns all dressed up like city boys with brand new camo on just standing there like they were in their own back yards, fishing poles in hand, slapping the water with the dumbest looking fishing lures you ever saw. My dad says to them, what the f*ck you boys think you're doing here? My old man was not a person to be messed with. They said "oh, we're with the bass fishermans society" or some crap like that showing us their silly licenses on their hats. My dad goes postal and these two guys start looking like they want to go. We had a stare down and they left.
> Next day I go down to the big pond, walking past the small pond, I notice a empty styrofoam cup and a bunch of cigarette butts on the edge of the water.
> These assholes came back and fished out all the trout. Took everyone of them. My dad was never the same after that. He became very difficult and rough to deal with.
> Trespassing can have profound effects on people's security and well being.


How is your well being after your tire vandalism?


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## carcajou (Jan 28, 2011)

8 ft high game fence and a camera might be worth the investment.


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## hillside hay (Feb 4, 2013)

Teslan said:


> How is your well being after your tire vandalism?


Good point. How is that situation going?


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## JD3430 (Jan 1, 2012)

hillside hay said:


> Good point. How is that situation going?


I'd rather not hijack your thread, but not well. As you would expect, just like clockwork, my customers hay feeders are close to empty.
No way to deliver a 900lb RB into a muddy field. Not with the epic rainfall we've had here. We have trees just falling over cause the ground is so soft.

Back to your topic...


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## hillside hay (Feb 4, 2013)

mlappin said:


> Thats too bad LEO won't do anything. Here they've been great about crap like that. Course, I have a good friend thats a county officer, and Dad goes to church with several as well so that helps.
> 
> Last problem I had I put up more no trespassing signs, took my friend to see where the four wheelers were going in and out of the field out of their yard. Took him back to his car then he followed be to their house. He got out and leaned against his car while I did the talking, probably helped they could see his nice shiny handcuffs as well. Next day two four wheelers were for sale in their yard.
> 
> Only suggestion is too fix the fence, post signs and transplant some poison ivy into the new fence, worked great at the section 8 housing that buts up to one of our fields.


Haha poison ivy! I just spent nearly a decade eradicating it from the lower 12 acre portion of that field. I won't be intentionally planting that ever! Lots of passes with the sprayer


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## hillside hay (Feb 4, 2013)

carcajou said:


> 8 ft high game fence and a camera might be worth the investment.


I have feeling I'd wind up buying the camera back off of Craigslist a time or two. We lease to a hunting club and they have a few come up disappeared every year. One of my bulls took one out this fall. Pulled off the Velcro strap from around the trunk. Hunter said he had a few laughs over it as Ol Coop took the camera with him back to the other boys and they proceeded to endurance test the product.


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## Tim/South (Dec 12, 2011)

All private property in our state is posted by law. That came about during the late 70's. People would knock the signs down and say it was not posted.


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## carcajou (Jan 28, 2011)

http://calgarysun.com/opinion/columnists/bell-rural-folks-at-boiling-point-over-scumbag-thieves


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## Tim/South (Dec 12, 2011)

carcajou said:


> http://calgarysun.com/opinion/columnists/bell-rural-folks-at-boiling-point-over-scumbag-thieves


http://calgarysun.com/opinion/columnists/gunter-self-defence-is-a-right-especially-for-rural-residents/wcm/40718f8c-8e9d-4946-9e92-632febee0339

I found this cross linked to the one you posted.

What a shame that people can not defend themselves or property.

That dog would not hunt in these parts.


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## JD3430 (Jan 1, 2012)

Tim/South said:


> http://calgarysun.com/opinion/columnists/gunter-self-defence-is-a-right-especially-for-rural-residents/wcm/40718f8c-8e9d-4946-9e92-632febee0339
> I found this cross linked to the one you posted.
> What a shame that people can not defend themselves or property.
> That dog would not hunt in these parts.


No shit, right?
Anyone comes in my house while I'm there is gonna learn what 3" magnum buckshot is.
Thank the Lord for the 2nd amendment.

An excerpt from the article "We don't need to turn rural properties into Wild West shooting galleries. We don't need laws that permit rural residents to shoot first and ask questions later."

Really? Without police protection, YES THEY DO!!
Why dont liberals understand that with no protection, people are helpless to criminals?
Why should an innocent person have to be harmed when they could defend themselves?
Are people so stupid that they dont understand cops dont show up in a Star Trek transporter?


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## Palmettokat (Jul 10, 2017)

Reason to be glad to serve on jury.

Shame respect for each other and this country is not popular by so many.


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## IH 1586 (Oct 16, 2014)

hillside hay said:


> Yes that is the public perception that hay and pasture are not real crops. To quote my neighbor"Relax man, it's just grass!"


Or in my case it was "it will be alright" as she proceeded to spin out trying to get out of the field.



JD3430 said:


> Made me think of a story while I was growing up in my teens. My dad had 2 ponds. One was 2 acres, filled with LM bass. The other was small, maybe bigger than a swimming pool and was shady and fed by a cold creek (or "crick" as they say in my area). This small, deep cold pond was stocked with 2 foot long rainbow trout that you could feed out of your hand.
> So one day I see these 2 guys fishing in our big pond (a little background- our property was an only cattle farm with barbed wire fence and many well maintained "no trespassing" signs). So me and dad approach these two ass clowns all dressed up like city boys with brand new camo on just standing there like they were in their own back yards, fishing poles in hand, slapping the water with the dumbest looking fishing lures you ever saw. My dad says to them, what the f*ck you boys think you're doing here? My old man was not a person to be messed with. They said "oh, we're with the bass fishermans society" or some crap like that showing us their silly licenses on their hats. My dad goes postal and these two guys start looking like they want to go. We had a stare down and they left.
> Next day I go down to the big pond, walking past the small pond, I notice a empty styrofoam cup and a bunch of cigarette butts on the edge of the water.
> These assholes came back and fished out all the trout. Took everyone of them. My dad was never the same after that. He became very difficult and rough to deal with.
> Trespassing can have profound effects on people's security and well being.


Yes it does.


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## hillside hay (Feb 4, 2013)

That's getting to be the sentiment around here as well Ray. The sad state of criminals having more protection under the law than their victims thanks to lawyers. Add to that the insane idea that precedent supercedes established law. One good note locally county legislation is trying to get doctors to stop doing out oxy like pez. Why can't it just go back to Motrin and ibuprofen like it was when I was a kid. Break a leg? Give you something for the inflammation and just take the edge off. Pain is information rushing to the brain! Used to be if they gave you morphine you were either under major surgery or there was a priest there ready to do last rites


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## JD3430 (Jan 1, 2012)

hillside hay said:


> That's getting to be the sentiment around here as well Ray. The sad state of criminals having more protection under the law than their victims thanks to lawyers. Add to that the insane idea that precedent supercedes established law. One good note locally county legislation is trying to get doctors to stop doing out oxy like pez. Why can't it just go back to Motrin and ibuprofen like it was when I was a kid. Break a leg? Give you something for the inflammation and just take the edge off. Pain is information rushing to the brain! Used to be if they gave you morphine you were either under major surgery or there was a priest there ready to do last rites


A further indication of the "wussification" of America.
Life not going your way? OK, we put you on psychotropic drugs to make you feel better.
Just like the kid in Florida. What they don't tell the public is these drugs have side affects. A few of those side affects are sudden outbursts of rage and violence.


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## luke strawwalker (Jul 31, 2014)

hillside hay said:


> I have a neighbor who is a serial trespasser, litterbug,vandal, and seems to like to target practice when I'm working the fields close by. Local law enforcement says they can do nothing. Just work it out between you and your neighbor they say. A decade of trying to work it out with zero improvement. I'm at a loss as it is potentially the best ground I have provided they aren't tearing it up with dirt bikes snowmobiles and 4 wheelers. Cutting fence throwing trash and ild car parts tires and the like. Can I sue to force him to sell and move? The justice system won't do anything. The civil system is all I have left.


As a lawyer friend of mine once told me when we were doing Grandma's will and she wanted a "no contest" clause put in it, he told me "they're meaningless-- you NEVER give up your right to sue, even when you do... you can ALWAYS sue no matter what the contract says".

Thing is you need DOCUMENTATION. You have to prove the damages you've had, harassment you've faced, etc. You need police reports, video or photographic documentation, bills or proof of damages to your equipment from junk they've thrown into the field, cleanup costs (even if "billed to yourself" for your time and disposal fees, etc.) You need evidence that they're actually the ones culpable and liable for the damages. If you're gonna go to the expense to do it, you have to do it right... and even then I wouldn't expect much...

If the cops aren't doing their job, then you need to go to the state attorney general's office and file an official complaint against the department... after all, if the cops won't deal with the problem and it's been an ongoing thing and is well documented (and I'd get the reports from every time you've reported it if possible, though you'll almost certainly have to pay for them) you can make the argument to the attorney general's office that you're being denied your rights under the law and the police department may be guilty of misconduct or favoritism, which can be very serious. At the very least it will "rattle some cages" and maybe get their attention to start dealing with this problem before you have to... and of course it begs the question-- how are you supposed to "work it out with the neighbors?? With a 12 guage??"

Fence cutting and trespassing are serious charges, at least in Texas, and can get you a felony record and state jail time for repeat offenders... make sure you have posted signs everywhere (not just one or two) paint the tops of fence posts purple (another way of marking "no trespassing" in a way that cannot be torn down like a sign can and then claim "it wasn't posted as no trespassing" and of course document, document, document... game cams and stuff to obtain photographic evidence is the best bet. H3ll of it is nowdays, you can have some sumb!tch DEAD TO RIGHTS ON CAMERA doing something and a lot of @sshats will argue "I didn't do that-- you didn't see me do that-- that's not me; that's not my kid!" BTDT with parents at the school when the bus camera SPECIFICALLY SHOWED their [email protected] worthless brats cutting bus seats to shreds and there was NO DOUBT that it was them... you could even SEE it was them and their motion showed them doing it (cutting a huge "X" corner to corner across the back of the seat in front of them, which is VERY obvious). And, of course, the limp-wristed principal doesn't want to "make waves" or face them down and make them pay for it... Which sounds about like your limp-wristed cops that are too lazy to do their job, easier to just say "deal with it yourself" and get back to the donut shop... Til someone gets their head blown off, THEN suddenly it's a big deal!!!

Anyway, best of luck, but remember, you've got to have every possible bit of evidence you can get your hands on as far back as you can and preferably photographic evidence of them "in the act"..

Onelonleyfarmer on YouTube had a similar situation where he had some scumbag neighbor stealing corn out of his field... and of course the cops would do nothing... til he caught them 'in the act" one night in his field with their side-by-side loaded down with corn, and later during harvest he found several bushel baskets out in the field where evidently his sons had been out in the field picking corn that night and had ran off and left the baskets full of corn behind when the cops showed up and arrested their old man... took an act of Congress to prosecute it, as the cops and DA wanted to just blow it off, and when he finally DID get it prosecuted it was maybe a $500 fine and about $700 "restitution" (which of course the state keeps-- you never see a penny of it) for the corn he stole, which like OLF said didn't even cover the cost of the seed of the corn he stole for ONE YEAR, let alone the fact he'd been doing it SEVERAL YEARS, and he could approximate how much corn they'd stolen from the lost yields in that field compared to the one next to it and yields before they had moved in... but of course 'that don't count'... .

Later and best of luck! OL J R


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## luke strawwalker (Jul 31, 2014)

hillside hay said:


> It's posted fenced the whole nine. Local sheriff says they need to actually catch them in the act and have to remove them for trespassing to go anywhere. Tracks leading right to their garage don't count. Neither do hot snowmobiles sitting just over the line. Ripping out the 50 year old patchwork fence and putting in a new one this spring. Needs to be done anyway and I'm hoping the point gets across. All four of them. Related question,; how many volts can I charge a fence with? How anyone ever charged a short section with a taser? Haha that'd be some funny stuff right there!


I got a 10,000 volt low impedance Parmak fencer from some place up in Oklahoma years ago that we run on our fence. It's designed to electrify 100 miles of fence, even though our perimeter fence is only 1.5 miles long. The cows don't mess with it AT ALL. I know I was hooking up one of those flashing fence detectors to it by my driveway so I can SEE that it's on and I got within an inch of the wire clipping the thing to it and it lit me up and I think you could have heard the "FVCK!!!" I shouted five miles away in town when it zapped me!!! Thtat's what I'd put on it if I were you. You're entitled to use electric fencing if you're "thinking about putting livestock" on the field (course you probably will never get around to it, but you gotta "be prepared"...) Low impedance chargers put extremely high voltage but short duration "pulses" of electrical energy onto the fence every second, so that nothing gets "locked" onto the fence. That's what you want. It certainly trained ME not to mess with it, and I haven't seen a cow one try the fence since we put it up... (or anybody else).

Later! OL J R


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## luke strawwalker (Jul 31, 2014)

hillside hay said:


> It is frustrating but to be fair they do have their hands full with other pressing matters. The opiate problem is consuming all resources at this point.


Yeah, pressing matters at the donut shop. Don't buy into that line of BS "we're too busy" that's just an excuse for lazy cops that don't want to do their job. They're not out arresting dope heads night and day all day every day; they're just like lightning-- "path of least resistance" and you're problem to them is a "non-problem" they can ignore so they do ignore it. I'd call the state attorney general and discuss your options. You might need to sue-- sue the department! After all, what are YOU supposed to do?? Solve your neighbor problems by camping out next to the fence with a 12 gauge??

The law exists so people "don't have to take the law into their own hands", ie they are supposed to be the voice of the law and enforce the existing laws to protect EVERYBODY'S rights and property... but when they DON'T, what's left BUT to "take the law into your own hands??"

Like all this school shooting anti-gun nonsense... a bunch of libtard cops/sheriff come on TV saying "Yall don't need guns that's what you have trained police for" but then the sorry chickensh!t SOB's are out hiding in the parking lot and won't go into the school when people are getting killed, so what the h3ll good are they?? Heck they had a cop IN THE SCHOOL and the gutless wonder hid out til it was all over, then quit rather than face investigation for being a [email protected] COWARD and not doing his job (which used to be in the Army that'd get you SHOT). Lousy sumb!tch should be up on charges if you ask me!

If the cops won't do their job, WHAT'S THE ALTERNATIVE??? That's the question I'd be asking...

Later! OL J R


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## luke strawwalker (Jul 31, 2014)

JD3430 said:


> I wouldn't let them off quite so easy....people can get killed over trespassing issues. Although I know there are more pressing matters, I am very good friends with a cop and he tells me thats one of the lines *SOME* of the cops give to people with "minor" complaints to keep their case load lighter.
> I think the game/video cameras are the way to go. Photographic evidence catching people in the middle of wrongdoing is difficult to refute. If its an ongoing issue, I would think you'll have evidence in a week or 2.
> 
> Another thought: I know it seems like a "bridge too far", but when I had my tires slashed, I was surprised at the reaction one of the local cops had. I told him the out of town property owners asked me to run off trespassers. I told him several times I have caught drunks, migrants, motorcycles, snowmobiles, etc off the property. His reaction kind of was like "oh, come on man, whats the big deal? What are they doing to bother you?"
> ...


Tell them "okay then I'll just shoot the sumb!tch" guarantee THAT will get a response... (probably not the one you're looking for).

Seriously I'd be questioning the cops and filing some complaints with the state attorney general or some of the law enforcement licensing organizations.

If the cops won't do their job and handle the problem, WHAT IS THE ONLY OPTION LEFT??

A lot of times a visit from a uniformed officer will get their attention and let people like that know "we're watching you", and solve the problem before it can escalate out of hand. That is SUPPOSED to be the cops job. If they're TOO [email protected] LAZY to even make the effort, then SOMETHING is bad wrong... It doesn't necessarily work every time; some people are idiots who just will flaut anything and anyone, but at least it's ON THE RECORD and the EFFORT WAS MADE, and next time there SHOULD be an arrest or more effort put into solving the problem, BEFORE it becomes a "well, I felt threatened so I shot him" situation...

Just got NO sympathy for cops who won't do their jobs... and shamefully there are too many that are that way... Most cops are honest guys trying to do a very difficult job-- but then there's a handful of lazy good-for-nothings and do-nothings and gun-happy racists or nutcases with a chip on their shoulder and a gun and a badge that think they can do anything they want, which gives the other 99% a bad name...

Later! OL J R


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## JD3430 (Jan 1, 2012)

Most of the cops I deal with are VERY helpful. Its just that one cops comments really had me scratching my head.

I can remember growing up as a kid in my area...lots of farms fenced in rarely would you see an electric fence. You'd always see a strong fence, but not the wiring. WHY you may ask, let me tell you why.
In nearly every cattle operation, the owner would have one NASTY, UGLY mean ass BULL with sharp horns and that ol boy was just snorting and waiting for you to "enter his domain".
My wife and I are inching closer to our dream of having our own farm. It'll have black angus on it and a well secured, electrified fence.
But I kind of think that back to when I was a kid and that mean nasty bull and how it made me never want to jump the neighbors fence and trespass on his property. He didnt care, because we were friends, but I'd never challenge his big bad bull.


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## luke strawwalker (Jul 31, 2014)

JD3430 said:


> Most of the cops I deal with are VERY helpful. Its just that one cops comments really had me scratching my head.
> 
> I can remember growing up as a kid in my area...lots of farms fenced in rarely would you see an electric fence. You'd always see a strong fence, but not the wiring. WHY you may ask, let me tell you why.
> In nearly every cattle operation, the owner would have one NASTY, UGLY mean ass BULL with sharp horns and that ol boy was just snorting and waiting for you to "enter his domain".
> ...


I guess...

We never had "big bad crazy bulls". Don't want that kind of nutcase crap in my herd...

One reason I love Herefords... they're so gentle and easy to handle. Not worth the crap to put up with crazy wild cattle, I don't care how much they're supposedly worth. Let someone else deal with the nutcases...

Later! OL J R


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## Palmettokat (Jul 10, 2017)

I have family who were police men. One was old timer and my dad was a policeman before I was born for some short period of time, 40's or early 50's. Lot changed since then.

No way will I think their job is easy but it bugs me when I have conversation with one who does not care or is lost at the facts of life.


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## JD3430 (Jan 1, 2012)

luke strawwalker said:


> I guess...
> 
> We never had "big bad crazy bulls". Don't want that kind of nutcase crap in my herd...
> 
> ...


I dont disagree with you, I'm just saying thats the way it was done in my area. Wouldnt want a mean bull, either.
I remember my parents telling me about 2 real estate agents being "treed" by a bull when they decided to trespass on a farm for sale. Lol
I don't think the bull was actually mean to its herd, but it didn't take to well to people jumping the fence.
I think the reason it was done around here is the 20 minute response time by police.
Can still remember walking down the country road I grew up on and seeing that nasty Brama bull or maybe it was a Texas longhorn.
None of the kids on my street would enter the field. Sort of worked like a big barking dog. Whether or not it was actually going to run you down, who knows.


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## hillside hay (Feb 4, 2013)

They may have just given me access to a more vigorous enforcement agency. Seems they decided to play in the waterways. The DEC takes a very dim view of that. I took tons of pictures. The snowmobilers crossed in 5 locations. Completely rooted up the ryegrass bottom and rutted it pretty bad. Think I'm going to swing by Fisher Ave on my way back through town. I don't want to pay the 10k each occurrence fine.


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## hog987 (Apr 5, 2011)

The thing to do if you know who is trespassing is serve them trespassing letters. Than set up cameras. If they enter with picture proof after being served than you sue them for damage to the place and the trouble they caused you. Also reportthem to police. The police wont do anything but a police report will help the civil claim.


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## hillside hay (Feb 4, 2013)

Excellent idea. The thought of a process server never entered my mind.


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## Palmettokat (Jul 10, 2017)

hillside, a thought along the line you are following came to me also. Is the littering they are doing an issue any regulator agency would care about? State or Federal? Would not count on the police to know but solicitors office might.


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## hillside hay (Feb 4, 2013)

No, the litter is mainly trash from tjeir dogs playing with the trash cans. Nothing environmentally hazardous. Sometimes car parts and other types of potentially damaging debris. I've been fortunate to only lose one tire over the decade


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## JD3430 (Jan 1, 2012)

I can understand the stress it's causing you. I go up to the farm everyday almost expecting vandalism.
I'm moving pieces off the farm to friendlier places. Can't wait to have a secure tractor shed with locking doors. 
Sounds like these clowns would be easy to catch in the act. Like the idea of "serving" them. Send them a letter certified mail. That's considered "mail received and read" IIRC. Then do the camera(s). 
Made me think of another trespassing story. I farm another piece of junky old farm property-about 20 acres. Was once a nice farm, but the guy who owned it was a terrible money manager. His kids got big ideas of a horse boarding operation and you guessed it, the old man signed the loan and the kids went and bought diesel trucks, daughter bought a Benz and within 3 years, they went under. The old man had the farm sold at Sheriffs auction and lost everything. 
So while in foreclosure and after the developer bought it, I farmed it for years. Local kids, both in my sons grade were into dirt bikes and this farm conveniently became their new 50 acre playground. They thought nothing of riding all over the crops, cutting trails through the woods on the property, even growing marijuana. 
At one point, I was ready to ink a deal on buying the place. The parents of the trespassing boys were always being my new best friend for life, so I wouldn't get mad at their kids running all over the farm. When they caught wind I might be buying the old farm, they went into full tilt revolt, signaling that their kids "worked hard to build dirt bike trails" (I'm thinking to myself, yeah, on other people's property LOL) and with nothing to do, they would get into trouble. 
So let me see if I have this right, your kids are already trespassing, destroying crops, running dirt bikes through creeks and growing weed on someone else's property, and you're "worried they might get into trouble?" 
Now here comes the fun part. My son plays lacrosse and football and is the kid on the team other kids wont mess with. He NEVER bullies or fights anyone and he doesn't have to. Just a strong, quiet kid. So then one of these 2 clowns decides to try out for football with my son being one of the bigger ass kickers on the team and me being a coach. Well, as you can imagine, he got the message really quick from him and the dirt bikes went away. So I got kind of lucky. I didn't really have to do much. About a year later, the kid got caught with enough weed in his truck that he was expelled from high school and Sent to rehab to get his HS diploma. The other one is probably still doing drugs and driving his weak, intimidated parents crazy.

Bottom line is, I can't understand why/how people feel like open land is their right to trespass on and shit all over it. Bad parenting is probably 90% of it. 
I just don't understand most people at all....so poorly raised, so inconsiderate. 
I think they listened to that Woodie Guthrie song "this land is your land, this land is my land, from California to the New York islands...." while smoking their weed a little too much.

Assholes....they cause the world so much unecessary lost sleep, stress, money.
I hope you catch them and stick it to them.


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## hillside hay (Feb 4, 2013)

Yep, the DEC has been notified and they are on board with enforcement. The Army Corps of Engineers has been informed as well. I am getting signs through them with the statutes regarding prohibited activities for the areas of fields that are under their jurisdiction. The fields and pastures are on owned and leased land.the totality of the federal leased land is about 200 acres


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## JD3430 (Jan 1, 2012)

Sorry to continue the rant, but let's say Hillside puts signs up and sends letters and they stop trespassing? Is that "all good"? I know I'd feel a deep sense of relief, but what about the damage that's been done? The ruts, trash, damaged ecosystems, lost sleep, etc?
I think this is where society has gone wrong. 
Had a well-meaning friend call me relieved that my tires would be replaced today and he's right, I am relieved, but what about the cost, the ones that got away with damaging my property, Hillsides property, and all others that are left picking up the pieces, paying higher insurance premiums, etc?
We need to punish crime more seriously. It's the only way to get it reduced in our society.
Too much probation. Too many slaps on the wrist. Too much support for the criminal.
We wonder why we have prison overcrowding! It's because it's no big deal if you get caught! It's barely even punishment! In some circles, it's a badge of honor!


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## hillside hay (Feb 4, 2013)

I hope it fixes it. I should've put my foot down ten years ago.


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