# SP haybine or pull-type diskbine?



## gwillie44 (Nov 24, 2008)

I am in process of purchasing a hay cutting machine. From what I see can afford a a used self-propelled haybine or a pull-type diskbine. In the past we hired our hay cutting done, but that just isn't working very well. We grow about 175 acres of alfalfa/grass mix. Any thouhgts or comments would be great. Please keep in mind that I will be putting hired labor on the machine to run it. Thanks for the input.


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## mmaddox (Jun 3, 2008)

I would think the first question would be if you had a power unit to use on a pull type machine. And even if not, and you have to add one, what other uses could you find for it. SP's are probably easier to operate, everything is out in front to see, and avoid as much chance for damage. It also eliminates the need to work in lands if you are not looking at a swing hitch towed unit. You will also avoid a little downed crop as you should not need to run over standing crop with the SP unit. You mention a disc-bine, I assume you are looking at the same type of cutting assembly on both, otherwise that's a whole 'nother discussion. A pull type also allows you to switch to another power unit if the need arises.


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## gwillie44 (Nov 24, 2008)

Looking at a sp sickle type haybine or pull-type diskbine.


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## BCFENCE (Jul 26, 2008)

I would have to go with a discbine if i bought a pull type


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## JoshA (Apr 16, 2008)

Ditto on what mmaddox said.

I'm assuming you have an available over-100hp tractor with a cab? If so, I'd say go with the pull-type discbine. Honestly, they're not that bad. I've ran both sickle and disc both in PT and SP, and I've gotta say, if it's sickle, I definitely want it in front, with a disc, doesn't matter to me.

SP's are nice, but I don't mind the PT discbine ----- AS LONG AS IT'S A CENTER PIVOT WITH A PROPER HITCH. If we're talking side-pulls........ then go with the self propelled for sure.

You're doing 175 acres, not like you're going to be spending months looking behind you, and I find I didn't spend that much time cranked around anyhow, more-so on the rake/baler than the mower. Mirrors are a wonderful asset.

I actually prefer opening a field with the pull-type than the self-propelled unit. I hear a lot of guys saying "the SP can get into areas and make corners a PT can't get to" yea, well is your rake a SP too? And how about the baler? Exactly. No sense cutting what you can't get to later.

Sounds like the sickle/disc decision for you is is budget based, so I won't get into that.
-Josh


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## gwillie44 (Nov 24, 2008)

Great info, thanks for the feedback. I planned on cutting with a 4440 john deere. I was thinking a used Hesston or New Holland pull-type diskbine. Both have good dealer support in my area. I like the idea of the Hesston with a one steel and one rubber conditioning roll. Otherwise I think it is a toss up between the two machines. Any comments would be great.


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## JoshA (Apr 16, 2008)

gwillie44 said:


> Great info, thanks for the feedback. I planned on cutting with a 4440 john deere. I was thinking a used Hesston or New Holland pull-type diskbine. Both have good dealer support in my area. I like the idea of the Hesston with a one steel and one rubber conditioning roll. Otherwise I think it is a toss up between the two machines. Any comments would be great.


Actually, I'm pretty sure it's the New Holland that has the one steel one rubber conditioners. The Hesstons have both steel.

What year are you thinking for the discbines?

I only have experience with the Hesston discbines. We ran our pull-type hard (15+ mph, 13 seconds on the headlands) and didn't really have many issues. After the first 30 acres the first year, the right-hand hydraulic lift cylinder developed a major leak. Dealer replaced it with one off a used machine they had on the lot. After that, I don't recall a single issue. About 20 acres into the second year, EXACT same thing. Again, dealer replaced it with one of another used one they had on the lot.

Also, in the second year we had to adjust the roller timing once, and I had one of the hydraulic hoses get crimped in between the swing blocks. Aside from that, no issues.

Either way, MAKE SURE YOU GET THE PIVOT HITCH, be it 3pt or drawbar.

-Josh


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## Hayboy1 (Jul 19, 2008)

I am not too sure about the Hesston, I think Josh would know about those more than I, I run two NH 1431's with the rubber rolls and have not really too many issues with them. I pull them with a JD 4250 MFWD. It is nearly a perfect match for weight, power, and stability. We have some decent hilly terrain around here and have not had any issues as far as that goes. You can knock down a lot of hay with any discbine, and I would personally only hook a haybine to my tractor to haul it to someone else after running the disc mowers. They are a bit more pricey, but worth it ten-fold when the hay is heavy or wet. Center pivots are definetly the way to go, but if that is out of your price league, the JD, Kuhn, and NH's are all good side pull machines and are usually a lot cheaper in our area due to smaller farms (New England). I ran a JD 926 for a few years and I loved it, ran a 411 for what seemed to be forever and liked that one too. Just had to go bigger. Good Luck to you. Mike


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## swmnhay (Jun 13, 2008)

DISCBINE is the only way to go,especially in down,wet,heavy hay.We always have some hay that gets cut late due to wheather delays and may get blown flat.The discbine will suck it rite up.The only place I wouldn't recomend it is rocky conditions.Or very short hay they streak,under 1/2 ton acre.My cutter choice is a Vermeer 1030 disc pro.


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## Rodney R (Jun 11, 2008)

I would think that if you'd be comparing the used SP haybine and a PT discbine, you'd be looking at a wore-out SP, or something that you would not be happy with. It's only the past few years that SP machines have been available with disc heads, and older sickle head machines are hard to find, have no resale, and the owners know that they're stuck with them, so they're gonna run them till the wheels fall off.....

A NH 1431 would work well for you. Cuts around 13 ft, center pivot (be sure to get the one that fastens on the 3pt). The 3pt versions will turn a little tighter (but I would think they're harder to hook up?). We had an OLD IH center pivot, and that thing got hooked to a tractor in spring, and unhooked in fall...... Make sure you look them over pretty good - some of the used ones are well worn (even thought they might not look it) - you'd be looking at huge dents in the shielding - that gives an indication of what the thing was cutting. Look at the rolls - are they shot? Look at the modules - loaded with twine, caps almost wore out? Lots of things to look at, and some of the stuff can cause a lot of headaches, or add up $$$ real quick.

Rodney


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## mmaddox (Jun 3, 2008)

As it seems the discussion has moved on to sickle bar vs. disc, there are several things to consider. What will you be cutting, alfalfa tends to doe better with SB and grass with a disc. The disc will allow higher ground speed and will most likely need more often replacement of knives. A SB can often go an entire year with very little section attention. Both depends on the conditions. The biggest difference for most comes if/when the discbine bar needs repair, I have spend several thousand dollars on fixing the gear drive, fortunately, never mine. We have had/used/fixed several, of different colors, and are currently using a NH sickle bar. That being said, it's almost all straight alfalfa on good, level ground.


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## BCFENCE (Jul 26, 2008)

Im not going to disagree with you because you know what works best for your operation, But for me the disk bine works better in any hay because you can drive faster, not worry about clogged sections and get in the feild when the hay is wetter and cut after the dew falls , Here in kentucky you cant cut any type of thick hay after a heavy dew because the sections clog up. The disk bine just takes alot of worry out of it. thats just my two cents thomas


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## HALLSHAY (Nov 30, 2008)

I vote sickle, but that is what we have used all along. Good guards and a good top serrated sickle will cut about anything you can throw at it. I read once that with an impact cut, the plants recover slower. A clean cut is important to keep the dead trash out of the next cutting. My biggest problem with a disc mower though is sand or dirt. Sandy soil gets hoovered right into the windrow. I also hate trying to swath at the high speeds the disc mower manufactures say you can run.


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