# 1980 JD 346 Wire Tie Baler Maintenance



## qcfarms (Dec 14, 2014)

I am in the process of putting new billhooks and the billhook shafts on the baler. I've done the billhooks before and they were easy but never have tried to replace the shafts. It looks like the shaft is held by a roll pin that is attached to the gear drive. I've run through my operator's manual but no joy. If any of you have replaced the shafts, is it just a matter of getting the right sized punch and knocking the roll pins out? I've attached a photo of what I think is the roll pin. Appreciate any help.....


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## urednecku (Oct 18, 2010)

I've answered a lot of this type question from the JD parts catalog. IF that shaft is the one I'm thinking, (looking @ the parts catalog---IF I'm looking @ the right section,) looks like there might be a roll pin on both ends.

I have an old 530 round baler that would trip & tie with a 3 to 4 foot bale, had a JD mechanic spend couple hours with us & could not figure out the cause. I took the printed part breakdown of that area & sat down & studied each part, & how it went together, till I found the broken roll pin letting it trip.

Good luck!


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## qcfarms (Dec 14, 2014)

Thanks for the link. I'll poke around on the site and see what I can find. Thanks again......


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## Tx Jim (Jun 30, 2014)

Yes drive 1/4'' roll pin out of gear & shaft to R&R twister shaft being sure to replace shim washers. A Mayhew roll pin punch makes removing roll pin a lot easier. What's the reason for changing shaft? Does old shaft have a wire groove worn in both sides? You can remove nut(parts key 27) 11/16 wrench required to rotate knotters for easier access for repairs. BTW wire balers don't have billhooks but instead have twister hooks.


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## qcfarms (Dec 14, 2014)

Tx Jim,

Thanks for the info and clarification on the part (bill vs twister). The twister shafts have grooves in them from the wire so I felt I needed to replace them. Last year the baler was missing too many bales for me (2-3 every 100 bales) so I thought I would see if I could make an improvement in that area this year. I will see if I can find that punch you referenced as well. Thanks for the assist!


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## Tx Jim (Jun 30, 2014)

You're welcome. If twister shaft has wire groove in only one side one can rotate twister shaft 180° to help keep wire from clinging to shaft. When your baler mis-tied what did both ends of wire resemble? Was twist caught in hook or wire just broken? IMHO wire isn't made or oiled as good as it once was. I always pour used oil on the wire after I install it in my 347. You also need to check wire guide rollers to be sure they turn freely with no flat spots worn in them. Another very important thing to do is check for correct operation of plunger head safety stop.


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## qcfarms (Dec 14, 2014)

I should have taken a picture last year of the wire that would break. If you're looking at the back of the baler to the front it was always the right side that would not make a good twist. There would be times that the wire would just bunch up on the twister shaft but that was constant. I also think that windrow density and/or moisture plays a role as well. I have two 5A Bermuda meadow separated by a dry creek. On one field i was busting bales quite often. I went to the other field and did not bust a bail in 250 bales. Both of those fields were cut and raked at the same time. I agree with you on the quality of wire as well. Last year I just started putting oil on the wire as well. I will check the guide rollers as well as the safety stop. I put a new spring on the safety stop last year as well.


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## Tx Jim (Jun 30, 2014)

Wire bunching up on twister shaft can be caused by several things including wire groove in twister hook or shaft or not enough oil on wire.


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## qcfarms (Dec 14, 2014)

Well, I think I may have found part of the problem to the twister mechanism not being consistent on twisting the wire . There is a lot of slop where the twister shaft goes up through the cast iron support into the bevel gear. I am going to try to bale with it tomorrow just to see how it works. If it works then great......if not then looks like a trip to JD parts. The cast replacement part runs around $280. I've added a quick video on how much slop the twister shaft has.

View attachment File Mar 23, 22 09 46.mov


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## Tx Jim (Jun 30, 2014)

Before I would replace those $280 frame casting I'd suggest to add shims(parts key 16) to remove play from twister shaft or check with machine shop on cost of boring frame and install bushings. Another important thing to do is clean dirt out of tube(parts key 19) and never,never lube the guides(parts key 18)


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## qcfarms (Dec 14, 2014)

Tx Jim,

Good idea on the shims....I'll swing by the local JD store tomorrow to see if they have them in stock. Looking at the play in the shafts, i'm guessing 2 shims per bevel gear. Thanks for the pics as well.....


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## qcfarms (Dec 14, 2014)

Just a quick update. Was able to bale 250 bales with the new shims, twister shafts, and twister hooks installed. So far so good........no missed bales yet. Thanks again for all the help.


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## Tx Jim (Jun 30, 2014)

Thanks for update,


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## qcfarms (Dec 14, 2014)

Well looks like I'm back in the repair mode again. I am attaching a few pics as well. One of the twister is missing the twist but it does not happen all the time. Nor is it tied to speed and size of windrow as I varied that tonight as well. I would not think it is the twister shafts of twister hooks as I put them on new at the start of this hay year. Have approx 1200 bales on the current hooks and shafts. the pic of the wire shows that it is being cut but does not look like it is getting twisted. There is a pic of a decent wire twist which is occurring on the same hook as well. There is also a pic of the twister mechanism. i plan to hit the local JD place tomorrow to talk to them about what the think the problem might be. Running thru the operator's manual it say "Wire not twisted together" could be "Needles not adjusted properly". I'll check those tomorrow as well.

At this point, I've just about pegged my fun meter. Might be time to start looking for a newer model "slightly used" baler. Hard to justify a brand new one for just 3000 "id10t bricks" a year.


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## Tx Jim (Jun 30, 2014)

It appears wire that needle brings up to twister hook is being pulled out as twisting is trying to be accomplished. Are all 6 hay dog & springs intact and operating correctly. If so then I'll guess wire has tension on it between wire box & twister hook caused by groove in wire guide or faulty wire roller. Does back of needle have a deep groove worn in it?????


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## qcfarms (Dec 14, 2014)

Tx Jim said:


> It appears wire that needle brings up to twister hook is being pulled out as twisting is trying to be accomplished. Are all 6 hay dog & springs intact and operating correctly. If so then I'll guess wire has tension on it between wire box & twister hook caused by groove in wire guide or faulty wire roller. Does back of needle have a deep groove worn in it?????


The roller was gone but the bushing and screw were still there. I replaced the bushing and the roller thinking that would correct the problem. Baled about 15 bales before it started missing twists again. Looked at the needle again and the roller was gone. Also it looks like the needle was not aligned properly with the wire guides so I made that adjustment and put another roller on. Baled about 40 bales before it started missing twists again. This time I had wire wrapped around the twister shaft hook as well as another busted roller. I check the hay dogs next time at at the baler as well as the needle to see if the glove is there. Thanks again for all the help!


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## Tx Jim (Jun 30, 2014)

Broken roller in needle indicates needle is adjusted too close to nose of gripper. Do you adjust needles ONLY when they are up in tying system? Needle should clear twister shaft by only about 1/8-3/16's of an inch and roller just misses nose of wire gripper while needles enters/exits gripper area..


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## qcfarms (Dec 14, 2014)

Tx Jim said:


> Broken roller in needle indicates needle is adjusted too close to nose of gripper. Do you adjust needles ONLY when they are up in tying system? Needle should clear twister shaft by only about 1/8-3/16's of an inch and roller just misses nose of wire gripper while needles enters/exits gripper area..


I'm out of town this week until Friday but will get the new rollers on and re-adjust the needles as you indicated with the needles up in the tying system. I'll update my progress though it will be a few weeks before I get some more hay down. Thanks again!


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## Tx Jim (Jun 30, 2014)

You're welcome,Jim


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## qcfarms (Dec 14, 2014)

Well, added a few new parts to the old baler today and ran it thru its' wire twist cycle. I've attached a photo that I think shows what the problem is. Looks like the right needle is not coming up high enough thus allowing the wire gripper to slide across and hit the idler which breaks it.


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## qcfarms (Dec 14, 2014)

Adjusted the needle with no success. Attaching another pic to show the issue. What started this whole mess was the pin fastener on the plunger head had worked its way out a bit and the auger side needle hit it which caused the cam shear bolt to shear. I am guessing that it may have either bent the needle a bit or it could have bent the needle frame. I guess I could move the flywheel side needle over to the auger side and see if it will adjust properly. If it does then looks like I will need a new needle.


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## Tx Jim (Jun 30, 2014)

Height that needle enters tying system is limited to height of needle while under wire when needle frame is in home position. If needle is too high in "home position" then if wire ever gets beside instead of over needle it will not come back over needle by itself. Only correct way to adjust RH needle roller back away from gripper arm is loosen top needle attaching bolt a little & tighten bottom bolt a little. Clear as MUD I'll bet.


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## qcfarms (Dec 14, 2014)

Tx Jim said:


> Height that needle enters tying system is limited to height of needle while under wire when needle frame is in home position. If needle is too high in "home position" then if wire ever gets beside instead of over needle it will not come back over needle by itself. Only correct way to adjust RH needle roller back away from gripper arm is loosen top needle attaching bolt a little & tighten bottom bolt a little. Clear as MUD I'll bet.


Makes sense to me......I think. So it looks like I need to take the needles back to the home position (needle frame to the back of the baler) and adjust so the needle lets the wire "float" over the top of it then run back thru the twisting sequence and see where it goes with respect to the gripper arm. If it is still hitting the gripper arm would you assume that the needle is bent or go back to the home position and readjust again.


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## Tx Jim (Jun 30, 2014)

Technically one needs to adjust needle farther enough away from nose of gripper when up in tying system so as gripper just misses needle roller. In reference to needles not traveling high enough in tying system check condition of LH brg(parts key 11) on needle lift shaft.An excessively worn brg will not pull needles as high as a good brg.


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## qcfarms (Dec 14, 2014)

So I ended up getting a new needle and installed it this morning. Baled some alfalfa and all went well. Put 100 bales on the ground without a miss so I think all is good. Thanks again for all the inputs!


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## Tx Jim (Jun 30, 2014)

Thanks for update & ongratulations,Jim


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