# Confinement



## RuttedField (Apr 24, 2016)

Sheep are grazers, I know that because I know sheep, but as you guys know, I must get bigger as I make the switch from logging to farming. But as I am crunching the numbers I keep coming back to a 100% confinement operation as being much more profitable then a grazing situation. This is Maine so there is NO WAY I can winter graze, and while I can do some stuff to extend the grazing season on each end, it really comes down to my land base.

Every acre I have of open land is pasturable/hayable and tillable.It is because back in 1900 most of the land base here was open land, but now has reverted back to being 90% forest. Yes I am clearing much of it back again, but the big rocks, boulders, and terrain has already been shaped making it much easier to make tillable again. In other words, if I had some crappy land that could only be pasture it would be one thing, but all of it is capable of growing feed (corn/hay/etc)

I can rotationally graze between the fields as I do now I know, but every time I do the math, it seems like the "cut winter feed/graze" option nets about 150 sheep, where as the "100% winter feed" option, nets 250 additional sheep.

You guys (and gals) are MUCH smarter than I am, but am I missing something? It just does not seem like confinement only would net such a higher return?


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## glasswrongsize (Sep 15, 2015)

My uncle does a quasi-confinement operation for his sheep and his goats. I say quasi-confinement because the term "confinement" (to me) makes me think of a swine operation where there is adequate room and on slats to keep manure away from them, under roof, climate controlled, etc... ya'll know what I mean. That works great for swine to give a good rate-of-gain, for biosecurity, etc and it might be good for sheep to as it might help with the wormload of sheep as well as the feet trimming aspect if they're on cement.
The quasi-confinement to which I refer is @100 sheep on an acre or two of dirt with a shelter/water etc. he has multiple "pens" like that. He feeds hay and feed (soy hulls, corn, etc) year around. I've not crunched the numbers and I assume he hasn't either. I run too few sheep on too much pasture and feed no corn or hay until late in the year. Mine have hay now, but still graze because it's their nature.
I don't know about the numbers aspect of it; just relating a real-life instance in which it kinda sorta happens.
Mark


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## stack em up (Mar 7, 2013)

You really need to come tour western MN. There are quite a lot of confined sheep operations of varying degrees by Pipestone MN.

http://www.mnwest.edu/programs-courses/training-management/lamb-and-wool/sheep-facility-tours


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## PaMike (Dec 7, 2013)

There are additional costs when going confinement...a lot more manure to haul, so need good manure equipment. A lot more bedding needed. Usually in confinement when animals get sick it happens quick and spreads fast...pros and cons both ways...


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## RuttedField (Apr 24, 2016)

Thanks Stack...and Glasswrongsize too...

I have been to Western MN a few times back when I worked for the Railroad out of Minneapolis. I also get my vet supplies from Pipestone. A few of those people on the list would be really helpful to talk to and they might be willing to share because my market is Flames in MA and New Holland n PA and not out west like them.

We went to Ireland on a sheep farm learning venture, and while it was fun (it was Ireland after all), we did not learn much as Ireland has weather similar to Florida and where they can graze year around. It is quite different in Maine.

I might take a trip out there after all. For a honeymoon the wife and I jumped in the truck and hit I-91 out of Vermont and just hit the open road for a few weeks. I always said I should take her to MN and show her around, see the Mall of America...not nearly as big as the West Edmonton mall granted, bu still pretty darn big...and other sights. A trip to a good sheep farm would be great!


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## RuttedField (Apr 24, 2016)

PaMike said:


> There are additional costs when going confinement...a lot more manure to haul, so need good manure equipment. A lot more bedding needed. Usually in confinement when animals get sick it happens quick and spreads fast...pros and cons both ways...


Thanks PAMike, and I have not forgotten your friend either. I am not quite ready to call him and see what he can get me for ewes (assuming he can), but there is no way I can find 250 in Maine.

(I was not snubbing you on the thanks either, you typed and posted while I was typing; otherwise I would have certainly noted your reply.)


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## PaMike (Dec 7, 2013)

RuttedField said:


> Thanks PAMike, and I have not forgotten your friend either. I am not quite ready to call him and see what he can get me for ewes (assuming he can), but there is no way I can find 250 in Maine.
> 
> (I was not snubbing you on the thanks either, you typed and posted while I was typing; otherwise I would have certainly noted your reply.)


I think you got me confused with someone else. I don't think I know any sheep people that I put you in contact with..


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## Lostin55 (Sep 21, 2013)

AZmike maybe?


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## PaCustomBaler (Nov 29, 2010)

Ruttedfield...like the others said, there's pros and cons to both. If you're looking for confinement, check out Matt Kyle and his accelerated lambing operation in Avon, NY. He runs about 3k dorest ewes and operates in three large barns. He'll graze in warm months but primarily, most of his stock is inside. I do some shearing for him and it's a hell of a setup.

Other guys rather run outside year-round (like myself). The numbers are a little lower but I could care less about numbers, I just want to make the most $ per head (expenses vs. incomes). I shear for Dave Shoemaker in PA, he runs 1k north country cheviots outside and lambs in May. Low-intensity operation that him and 1 other person can take care of everything.

Two completely different setups but both very successful. Whichever fits with you best IMO. Not sure which setup nets more per head, but Feasibility and Comfortability for you're type of work comes into play when deciding against confinement or pasture/rangeland.

Cheers


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