# Health Insurance increase



## swmnhay (Jun 13, 2008)

Went in on Wed to review health ins policy and get the new rates.

58.4% increase. 

Asked agent why.Because you have to pay for the ones that don't pay.


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## mlappin (Jun 25, 2009)

swmnhay said:


> Went in on Wed to review health ins policy and get the new rates.
> 
> 58.4% increase.
> 
> Asked agent why.Because you have to pay for the ones that don't pay.


How much higher is your deductible as well?


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## somedevildawg (Jun 20, 2011)

Paying about 1700 per month here thru usaa with 5k deductible, 3 younguns.....Usaa is great to business with however....now have my homeowners and auto, not because the made me, which is so common nowadays, because they are better....glad I switched, BCBS was 2500 monthly and we have more coverage with Usaa


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## ontario hay man (Jul 18, 2013)

You guys can keep your private health care. How do you afford that junk. I just about cry when I gotta pay my $150 truck insurance.


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## Vol (Jul 5, 2009)

somedevildawg said:


> Paying about 1700 per month here thru usaa with 5k deductible, 3 younguns.....Usaa is great to business with however....now have my homeowners and auto, not because the made me, which is so common nowadays, because they are better....glad I switched, BCBS was 2500 monthly and we have more coverage with Usaa


That is unreal dawg....I have bcbs and it less than half per month of yours with 1k deductible and 3 insureds....million $ coverage per person.

Regards, Mike


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## rjmoses (Apr 4, 2010)

swmnhay said:


> Asked agent why.Because you have to pay for the ones that don't pay.


That used to be called communism. Which we all know doesn't work!

Ralph


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## swmnhay (Jun 13, 2008)

mlappin said:


> How much higher is your deductible as well?


It's 5,200 ded,why the extra 200?beats me.

That's the max ded the policy allowed.BCBS.

It is a unlimited policy,just in case a million is not enough.And it is good at all the Hospital Networks in our area.Sanford,Avera and Mayo.

When the locals can't figure it out they send you to Mayo .


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## somedevildawg (Jun 20, 2011)

ontario hay man said:


> You guys can keep your private health care. How do you afford that junk. I just about cry when I gotta pay my $150 truck insurance.


It shouldn't be that high.....I don't thnk it's the insurance companies that are screwing us, it's the damned high cost of health care....multiple reasons for that (posted many times on this forum), insurance companies work with data and dollars and they're very good at that. And it didn't use to be junk, but it certainly is slowing going to metamorphicize into a overburdened health care service with inadequate doctor to patient ratio, in a lot of cases we still have the best health care in the world....believe me, if my life is in the balance, I won't be making a trip to Canada.....

[quote name="Vol" post="113275" timestamp="1385763991"]That is unreal dawg....I have bcbs and it less than half per month of yours with 1k deductible and 3 insureds....million $ coverage per person.

Yes it is.....hence the reason I switched, I should be fair however, deductible with BCBS was 2k I think, switched about 2 yrs ago. We have a group plan for employees that would be half of that as well but we can't participate in the group plan with employees....
Had cancer with BCBS but no mental health (& drug abuse) coverage....
Usaa has both and unfortunately already had to collect on one of those....


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## ontario hay man (Jul 18, 2013)

Health care is all the same. If you are going to die or get sick it would happen here or there just the same. You have the same medicine and doctors have the same training as we do.


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## somedevildawg (Jun 20, 2011)

ontario hay man said:


> Health care is all the same. If you are going to die or get sick it would happen here or there just the same. You have the same medicine and doctors have the same training as we do.


You're wrong....but keep believing that, I would if I lived with socialized health care


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## somedevildawg (Jun 20, 2011)

Wait....I do live with socialized health care......


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## ontario hay man (Jul 18, 2013)

I guess its why canadians have over 2 years longer life expectancy then americans lol. I guess it wouldnt be the health care. Must be the igloos we live in that make us live longer lol.


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## swmnhay (Jun 13, 2008)

ontario hay man said:


> I guess its why canadians have over 2 years longer life expectancy then americans lol. I guess it wouldnt be the health care. Must be the igloos we live in that make us live longer lol.


The cold air kills the "Bugs"


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## ontario hay man (Jul 18, 2013)

swmnhay said:


> The cold air kills the "Bugs"


Ya you northern americans are probably more healthy lol.


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## Teslan (Aug 20, 2011)

I used to think my health insurance premiums were high (though not nearly as high as you guys for a family of 3) until it paid my healthcare bills of up to $100,000 in 6 months time without any kind of trouble. Now I appreciate it more.


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## Vol (Jul 5, 2009)

ontario hay man said:


> Health care is all the same. If you are going to die or get sick it would happen here or there just the same. You have the same medicine and doctors have the same training as we do.


Right....keep repeating that to yourself next time you have to wait 4 months to see a specialist.....or need a major transplant.

Regards, Mike


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## Vol (Jul 5, 2009)

Teslan said:


> I used to think my health insurance premiums were high (though not nearly as high as you guys for a family of 3) until it paid my healthcare bills of up to $100,000 in 6 months time without any kind of trouble. Now I appreciate it more.


Know exactly what you mean Teslan....I have been down that road more than once....my primary care physician was somewhat alarmed by some of my test results....i saw a specialist 1 week later and found out I had a very aggressive form of cancer and that I had to have immediate surgery to stop it from spreading. If I had to wait 3-4 months to have seen that specialist, I most likely would not be typing now. It has been over 5 years now and I have been classified as a cancer survivor....which I am very grateful....for life...and for my insurance that allowed me to see high quality cancer physicians.

Regards, Mike


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## ontario hay man (Jul 18, 2013)

We dont wait that long and I would rather wait then pay half my monthly wage for insurance. I read a thread devildawg posted a few days ago that he paid $700 to clear up a rash on top of his $1700 health insurance. I would have had to work a month to pay for that. Then what do you pay the rest of your bills with. No doubt so many people are on welfare down there the price you pay for health care would break most people. I had a rash one time. Called up doc. Went in the same day he give me a cream for $80 that my benefit plan from my job paid for and it was gone in a few days. No insurance no pay the doc no pay the cream. It cost me $5 in fuel to get to the doc thats it. But you would rather pay a grand in insurance and $700 for cream to do the same thing??? Dont make sense to me I like the money I work for staying in my own pocket. I dont know where you guys hear we wait forever for health care because we definitely dont.


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## mlappin (Jun 25, 2009)

I can't wait till people finally wake up, the economy is going to take a hit. Regardless of what the media might claim, people who will be getting their healthcare free now from the ACA had free healthcare available before if they were willing to look around for it and do the paperwork.

If people are going to be paying 58% more for coverage, that's 58% less of their income they have to spend on a new pickup for starters, or new windows and insulation for the house, it's also 58% less they have to help the kids with college, or 58% less they have to go out and eat once a week, it's 58% less they have to splurge on a new big screen TV or 58% less to remodel their home with. It's also 58% less people have to donate to charities.

It's also unfortunately 58% less our customers are going to have to pay for their hay.


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## mlappin (Jun 25, 2009)

From numerous trips to the UK and having the gift of gab I've heard some real horror stories about "free" healthcare. Of course I've heard some that claim it's the best thing since pre sliced cheese. All depends on how lucky you are I guess.

Tammy's oldest cousins wife was diagnosed with breast cancer, just so happens the hospital in the area is the best in the UK with breast cancer, bing bang boom her breast cancer was taken care of. No deductibles or anything out of pocket. Another family friend over there wasn't so lucky, suffered stomach problems for years, had to see the same doctor unless he could afford to pay out of pocket to see another more qualified one. Same hospital that the cousins wife went to for the breast cancer also seemed to be the worst in the nation for stomach cancer. Took them four years to diagnose the stomach cancer, he's living on a liquid diet now as they jacked around so long they had to remove his stomach. Another cousins son in law is living with a colostomy bag now from the incompetence of "free" healthcare, he's only 32.

Tammy's favorite cousin had numerous surgeries on his ear, turns out had some kind of growth that turns the skull into a spongy mass behind his ear. Had maybe half a dozen surgeries in the UK to try to fix it, his Mom ponied up the money to send him to Mayo's, one surgery and it was fixed and he got to keep his hearing.

They take a quite a healthy chunk of your check every week over there which is fine I guess as long as you happen to live in the right area and have breast cancer.

They also think their system is the greatest in the world, which would be par for course if that's all you've had for the last 70 years.

Just have to remember that the ones that got mediocre care, got it for "free".


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## ontario hay man (Jul 18, 2013)

mlappin said:


> From numerous trips to the UK and having the gift of gab I've heard some real horror stories about "free" healthcare. Of course I've heard some that claim it's the best thing since pre sliced cheese. All depends on how lucky you are I guess.
> Tammy's oldest cousins wife was diagnosed with breast cancer, just so happens the hospital in the area is the best in the UK with breast cancer, bing bang boom her breast cancer was taken care off. No deductibles or anything out of pocket. Another family friend over there wasn't so lucky, suffered stomach problems for years, had to see the same doctor unless he could afford to pay out of pocket to see another more qualified one. Same hospital that the cousins wife went to for the breast cancer also seemed to be the worst in the nation for stomach cancer. Took them four years to diagnose the stomach cancer, he's living on a liquid diet now as they jacked around so long they had to remove his stomach. Another cousins son in law is living with a colostomy bag now from the incompetence of "free" healthcare, he's only 32.
> Tammy's favorite cousin had numerous surgeries on his ear, turns out had some kind of growth that turns the skull into a spongy mass behind his ear. Had maybe half a dozen surgeries in the UK to try to fix it, his Mom ponied up the money to send him to Mayo's, one surgery and it was fixed and he got to keep his hearing.
> They take a quite a healthy chunk of your check every week over there which is fine I guess as long as you happen to live in the right area and have breast cancer.
> ...


Cancer is one of those things that each person has their own odds you and me could have the exact same cancer at the exact same stage and get treated at the same time and place.You could live til your old I could die in a year. It all depends how each person fights it


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## swmnhay (Jun 13, 2008)

ontario hay man said:


> Cancer is one of those things that each person has their own odds you and me could have the exact same cancer at the exact same stage and get treated at the same time and place.You could live til your old I could die in a year. It all depends how each person fights it


I think the point was the sooner it is treated the better your odds are.If you have to wait for months for Socialized medicine it could be to late.


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## swmnhay (Jun 13, 2008)

mlappin said:


> Tammy's favorite cousin had numerous surgeries on his ear, turns out had some kind of growth that turns the skull into a spongy mass behind his ear. Had maybe half a dozen surgeries in the UK to try to fix it, his Mom ponied up the money to send him to Mayo's, one surgery and it was fixed and he got to keep his hearing.


I did pick a policy that includes Mayo Clinic in the network of hospitals you can go to.It was only about 10 per month more.

There is a reason you see planes from all over the world In Rochestor,Mn.Seen a Shieks plane there one time.757.Big ******** turbin on tail fin.


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## ontario hay man (Jul 18, 2013)

Ya I just dont get where you guys think it takes forever to get seen here


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## mlappin (Jun 25, 2009)

ontario hay man said:


> Ya I just dont get where you guys think it takes forever to get seen here


Not so much that it took too long for the friend in England to get seen, it's the fact that a second or third opinion was not an option for him unless he paid out of pocket for it and the first opinion he got was wrong, as well was the second and third opinions from the same doc/hospital.

If I believed the first opinion I had on the wife when she started having problems, she'd be dead now.


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## mlappin (Jun 25, 2009)

swmnhay said:


> I did pick a policy that includes Mayo Clinic in the network of hospitals you can go to.It was only about 10 per month more.
> 
> There is a reason you see planes from all over the world In Rochestor,Mn.Seen a Shieks plane there one time.757.Big ******** turbin on tail fin.


If I didn't find the specialist I did in Indianapolis for the wife, it was Cleveland Heart Clinic next then Mayo's. I bet I won't have that option once the Unaffordable Care Act is truly the law of the land.

Seems that Adult Congenital Heart Defect specialists that have any experience with my wives condition are rare indeed as most that were born with what my wife had in that time frame never made it to adults.


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## Vol (Jul 5, 2009)

ontario hay man said:


> We dont wait that long and I would rather wait then pay half my monthly wage for insurance. Dont make sense to me I like the money I work for staying in my own pocket. I dont know where you guys hear we wait forever for health care because we definitely dont.


Go back and re-read my post. I did not say you waited to see a general practitioner, I said you had a long wait to see a specialist.

I guess we get our ideas from Canadian surveys, publications, and general complaints by those who have to wait. http://www.fraserinstitute.org/research-news/display.aspx?id=20516

Regards, Mike


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## ontario hay man (Jul 18, 2013)

Vol said:


> Go back and re-read my post. I did not say you waited to see a general practitioner, I said you had a long wait to see a specialist.
> 
> I guess we get our ideas from Canadian surveys, publications, and general complaints by those who have to wait. http://www.fraserinstitute.org/research-news/display.aspx?id=20516
> 
> Regards, Mike


Because of less doctors. It doesnt matter if its private or public health care when there is a doctor shortage. Im sure it happens in many states as well.


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## ontario hay man (Jul 18, 2013)

The thing I dont get is a young family that cant afford health insurance down there what do they do. Go broke? Or suffer without care? For people better off its ok to have private healthcare if you want it but what do the poorer people to do? I know I couldnt afford a grand a month for insurance so if I lived in the states whats my options?


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## Grateful11 (Apr 5, 2009)

somedevildawg said:


> Paying about 1700 per month here thru usaa with 5k deductible, 3 younguns.....Usaa is great to business with however....now have my homeowners and auto, not because the made me, which is so common nowadays, because they are better....glad I switched, BCBS was 2500 monthly and we have more coverage with Usaa


.


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## JD3430 (Jan 1, 2012)

mlappin said:


> I can't wait till people finally wake up, the economy is going to take a hit. Regardless of what the media might claim, people who will be getting their healthcare free now from the ACA had free healthcare available before if they were willing to look around for it and do the paperwork.
> If people are going to be paying 58% more for coverage, that's 58% less of their income they have to spend on a new pickup for starters, or new windows and insulation for the house, it's also 58% less they have to help the kids with college, or 58% less they have to go out and eat once a week, it's 58% less they have to splurge on a new big screen TV or 58% less to remodel their home with. It's also 58% less people have to donate to charities.
> It's also unfortunately 58% less our customers are going to have to pay for their hay.


I just heard this today, straight from one of my customers. They said SINCE OBAMA CARE STARTED, they have had a 20% dip in horse and pet boarding.
Notice I did not say since Obama was elected, just since Obama care STARTED.

Of course, people now have even less disposable income. And it's not like they had a lot of disposable income before Obama care, either. This is a HUGE kick in the groin to disposable income.


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## Grateful11 (Apr 5, 2009)

.


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## JD3430 (Jan 1, 2012)

There's only 2 exclusively private health professions not covered by insurance. LASIK eye surgery and cosmetic surgery. Adjusted for inflation, the cost of both have fallen, while every other type of health care costs have risen.

That tells me that govt needs to get out of the way and concentrate on safety standards. Let the private sector compete across state lines and driver prices down.


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## ontario hay man (Jul 18, 2013)

Grateful11 said:


> Here's what's wrong with healthcare in the US. This is a very interesting read. Basically healthcare in this country is broken and has been broken for a long time.
> 
> Need a new hip, go to Belgium:
> http://www.nytimes.com/2013/08/04/health/for-medical-tourists-simple-math.html?pagewanted=all&_r=1&


Sure makes that insurance worth paying lol I rest my case.


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## somedevildawg (Jun 20, 2011)

ontario hay man said:


> Sure makes that insurance worth paying lol I rest my case.


If you want to believe what the ny times has to say....believe it....personally i dont read the ny times, nor do i put much weight in anything they print....there are plenty of people going to other countries to get hip/knee replacements, cosmetic surgery, etc. alot of them will fly you over and it's all included....hell you can make it a vacation if you want.....I prefer to work a little harder and not go to the lowest bidder when it comes to healthcare.....not all doctors and nurses graduated in the top of the class.....guess where they go.....no thanks, might end up with a new pair of surgical scissors embedded in your chest......I generally don't even use the lowest bid when having my vehicle repaired.......I'll continue paying my premiums and hope I never have to use them again.....



Grateful11 said:


> What kinda coverage do you have? My wife is paying $450/month for some sorta BCBS through Farm Bureau. It covers her and our son for another 2 years. So far it's covered everything they've needed done which hasn't been a lot because both are pretty healthy and rarely go to the Dr. Her's is going to $800/month but she qualifies for a subsidy and if they ever get it to go through it will cut it way down. If it stays at $800/month she'll have to do without, just can't swing it. The paperwork is filled out at FB she's just waiting for a phone call for when they can get into the website and finalize it.


1 mil ea. on wife and I and 3 children age 15-20, cancer and mental health included with a 5k deductible....I would rather have a 10k deductible and they don't pay for routine visits or meds....no dental, and other smoke screens....and pay say $600 per month, but I ain't an insurance company and I'm sure they've done the cost of such a plan and it doesn't work out for them....once again, this is not in a group plan, as employees are able to benefit from....no pre existing conditions either....


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## Teslan (Aug 20, 2011)

ontario hay man said:


> The thing I dont get is a young family that cant afford health insurance down there what do they do. Go broke? Or suffer without care? For people better off its ok to have private healthcare if you want it but what do the poorer people to do? I know I couldnt afford a grand a month for insurance so if I lived in the states whats my options?


They get Medicaid. I don't know the specifics of how people get it or the income requirements.


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## somedevildawg (Jun 20, 2011)

Teslan said:


> They get Medicaid. I don't know the specifics of how people get it or the income requirements.


You got that right, nor do I know the requirements, they need to privatize the Medicaid program and have insurance companies administer it, no more paying for two arm/ elbow surgeries for a guy who had that arm removed 10 years earlier......insurance companies don't play that game, I'm sure all have heard them horror stories of how that system is brutally corrupt and inept....


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## deadmoose (Oct 30, 2011)

The flawed system doesn't make me feel any better about insurance. Much worse in fact. The amount of inefficiencies coupled with beurocratic red tape, over regulation, litigation and paper work make what we have today.

Mlappin-do you think that stomach Dr would have made it here 15 years ago? Maybe but probably not. Allowing supply and demand used to weed out people incapable of doing their jobs. When gov gets involved they stay. Look at our public school system.


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## somedevildawg (Jun 20, 2011)

Good point moose, I was talking with a teacher in the family over thanksgiving.....they get paid based on performance of their students now.....what's happening...they're cheating (teachers) on standardized scores so they can get paid more....despicable

Just arrested and terminated some for it here....and the principal at one of our schools got busted after it was discovered that she had her kids in the free lunch program....between her and her husband they brought in 154k a year....dig a lil deeper you'll find she also applied for other programs.....


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## Teslan (Aug 20, 2011)

somedevildawg said:


> You got that right, nor do I know the requirements, they need to privatize the Medicaid program and have insurance companies administer it, no more paying for two arm/ elbow surgeries for a guy who had that arm removed 10 years earlier......insurance companies don't play that game, I'm sure all have heard them horror stories of how that system is brutally corrupt and inept....


There are also people that work the system with regards to marriage and families. Say there is a woman that has 3 kids that earns only $18k at a part time job, but yet lives with her longtime boyfriend that earns much more. Still could qualify for Medicaid and other gov benefits.


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## Grateful11 (Apr 5, 2009)

ontario hay man said:


> Ya I just dont get where you guys think it takes forever to get seen here


.


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## JD3430 (Jan 1, 2012)

Yeah maybe, but I also read that it takes longer to get seen because the health care workers are unionized and don't work on weekends? So because they don't work 7 days/week, there's more backlog?
Also, the death rates from the most curable cancers, like prostate and breast cancer are higher in Canada than the US. Explain that.
Thousands flee Canada for healthcare in US in 2011 as wait times for procedures have doubled since 1993:

http://o.dailycaller.com/thedailycaller/#!/entry/thousands-fled-canada-for-health-care-in-2011,51a05e78da27f5d9d0cd91c0

You may think of him as Rush Limpball, but we need people like him to keep these weasel liberal and rino politicians honest. We need to keep a healthy discussion out in the open. If we didnt have people like him, we'd be over run by liberal professors and extremists by now.
I guarantee you this: if the govt takes over the health care insurance system, more people will die from cureable diseases (because of rationed health care), , less effective new drugs and apparatuses will be brought to the market (taxes on med devices) and the length of life expectancy will become shorter (death panels, end of life care will be reduced for old people).
Competition for health care is the only way to bring down price and increase quality. See LASIK surgery and cosmetic surgery.


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## somedevildawg (Jun 20, 2011)

Let me just ask you this simple question...if you attended school for 11 years, graduated at the top of your class and became a....orthopedic surgeon, would you apply somewhere you make say 100k a year or apply somewhere you make 1mil a year....where ya gonna apply.....liar, liar, pants on fire if you say India, Canada, china, Bangladesh....the brightest and the sharpest also want to be paid well for their hard work and expertise.....that's why the are here.....we like to have the best, that's who we are, course we also have the brightest sharpest attorneys here, the brightest sharpest chemists, and the latest in technology.....part of the reason for the expensive system, there is no cure all for our high cost of healthcare.....like farmers, lots of people in the pocket of healthcare. Competition, is the only thing that will drive down prices here, coupled with some types of reform to ensure comp. like JD said....check out what it costs for LASIK, orthodontics, things typically not covered by insurance....the price is very reasonable

As for Rush, don't make the mistake of thinking that all conservatives listen to Rush and watch Fox....I never have listened to Rush and I only watch Fox News on occasion (and id like to throw that stupid football back at Hannity), most of the time it's my local NBC affiliate....that's about all I can stomach of the "news" I don't need it, I'm out in the world everyday, don't need to watch the news channels and their poor attempt at journalism....they sensationalize every news story and if it isn't sensational, it's not a news story.....propaganda runs to the right and left, takes a bit of intelligence to weed through it but it can be done....but the government ain't gonna do it for you, if you think they will, you are mistaken....

You wouldn't believe the number of people that thought they were fixing to get a check in the mail as soon as Mr. Obama was elected....dead serious, they thought that, and in a way he's delivering on that promise......just not exactly what they had in mind, they wanted enuf to go buy a big screen at Walmart....


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## Grateful11 (Apr 5, 2009)

.


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## JD3430 (Jan 1, 2012)

Sorry if I offended, but death panels are very real.

If you think Canadian health care is the way to go, you better read this. Written by a Canadien 
Not exactly "right wing trash". 
http://www.city-journal.org/html/17_3_canadian_healthcare.html

An excerpt: "This is a country in which dogs can get a hip replacement in under a week," he fumed to the New York Times, "and in which humans can wait two to three years."


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## discbinedr (Mar 4, 2013)

ontario hay man said:


> The thing I dont get is a young family that cant afford health insurance down there what do they do. Go broke? Or suffer without care? For people better off its ok to have private healthcare if you want it but what do the poorer people to do? I know I couldnt afford a grand a month for insurance so if I lived in the states whats my options?


Maybe if your taxes weren't so high to pay for your"free"health care you could afford private insurance. Nothing is free dude. The problem here in the States is over regulation. I know of some Christian cost sharing groups that have family coverage for around $350 a month.


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## mlappin (Jun 25, 2009)

Interesting points on where doctors practice. The surgeon who implanted the wife's AICD in 2008 did it for free as she'd lost her town job and the insurance that went with it and was still trying to find something permanent with group insurance as she was uninsurable then and still is now. She had 2 open heart surgeries as a child, the third in 2010. The surgeon who did the AICD not only didn't charge us for any of his time, he also got St. Judes to give Tammy the AICD. He's Iranian and Dutch, his wife is Dutch and a radiologist, they both left Holland and started practices here as they were tired of the red tape and limited resources they had to deal with in Holland.

Tammy's lady cardiologist rather than deal with the new reg's from obabacare decided to retire early instead, her partners both quit as well and went to work for much larger practices so they wouldn't have to deal with the LABS (lies and bullshit) from Obamacare. So not only did Tammy not get to keep her doctor, the three girls working in the office and half a dozen nurses/techs also didn't get to keep their jobs because of Obamacare.

Buddys girlfriend works in the medical recording field, she's seriously considering quitting as all the new codes she's required to learn for the Unaffordable care act are a nightmare.

Dozens of ways could have been implemented to lower costs. Group buying plans like mentioned, getting leaches (lawyers) out of medicine, allowing people to buy health insurance across state lines so insurance companies would actually have to compete with one another nationally instead of having fifty little monopolies going on, etc.

When they started seriously discussing Obamacare I thought it was a horrible ideal and this was after paying for the wife's medical bills after a week in intensive care after her attack in 2008, still thought it was a horrible ideal in 2010 when we were trying to figure out how to pay for a third open heart surgery, still think it's a horrible ideal now as it has absolutely ZERO to do about insuring the un-insured. It's just another attempt at wealth redistribution, plain and simple, then when the ACA fails they can simply place everybody on Medicare so the government can have more control over EVERYBODY which is what it's been about for the last hundred year anyways.


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## JD3430 (Jan 1, 2012)

That's what ACA is all about. Redistribution of wealth. Just like the progressive tax system, it takes from the hardworking and gives to the lazy.
Problem with applying that principal to healthcare is that the ripple effects of not being able to keep plan, doctor, death panels, etc is it effects everyone who really works hard, does the right thing and pays into the system.


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## hillside hay (Feb 4, 2013)

The biggest lie about the ACA is that it has anything to do with healthcare. It's not even so much about redistribution. It is however about control. It's the backdoor to all personal decisions as the EPA is the backdoor to all our financial decisions. (agriculture) If there were even the slightest bipartisan desire to fix our healthcare woes it would have been done already.


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## JD3430 (Jan 1, 2012)

ACA website can't handle more than 6 applicants at a time. 
Amazon website can handle 1 million transactions per minute.


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## Teslan (Aug 20, 2011)

JD3430 said:


> ACA website can't handle more than 6 applicants at a time.
> Amazon website can handle 1 million transactions per minute.


I bet you when Amazon first started and they were just selling books it cost much less then the ACA website and still did a better job.


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## deadmoose (Oct 30, 2011)

http://www.cnn.com/2013/11/11/tech/web/alternate-healthcare-site/


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## ETXhayman (Jul 19, 2012)

The reality is that there will never be a perfect health care system. Whether it's a private health care system or a government subsidized health care system, there are pro's and con's to both forms and there will always be a portion of the population that takes a hit. Not to derail this topic off into religious matters but as a christian I think more churches need to help those in the surrounding community. There have been several instances at my church where a member or a person in the community who didn't have enough money needed an operation and the church paid to get them taken care of. Call me a simpleton but I think that is how its supposed to be.


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## JD3430 (Jan 1, 2012)

I bet the government could have just insured all the uninsured for a lot less taxpayer money than the cost of FORCING everyone onto the govt death panel regulated obama health care system.


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## Vol (Jul 5, 2009)

ETXhayman said:


> Call me a simpleton but I think that is how its supposed to be.


Simplicity makes life much more pleasurable.

Regards, Mike


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