# Twinstar rake



## FarmerCline (Oct 12, 2011)

I bought a new Twinstar hay rake last spring and it unfortunately did not work out as I had hoped. No matter what I did or adjusted the windrow was roped up really bad. Before buying this rake I was assured that roping would not be an issue so I was very displeased. After many discussions with the tech dept. of the company they came to the conclusion that I came to after using it a couple times......it is not designed to work in tedded hay.....alfalfa in particular. Here not tedding the hay is simply not an option if I want it to get dry. They said the rake was designed to combine two swaths of a mower and would not rope when used like that.

I have since moved on to a double rotary rake and am much more pleased with the windrow.....no rope and it finishes drying down nicely. The roped up windrow of the Twinstar would not finish drying down and held moisture.

The trouble is I still have the Twinstar rake I am not having any luck at all trying to sell it because they simply are not used or even heard of in the eastern US. I tried to trade it with a couple dealers out west where those rakes are popular but the best trade offer I got was a little less than half of what I paid for it new last year. I really need to move this rake but not sure what direction to go with it. Seems they have extremely poor resale value? Thought I would post on here to see if anyone knew of an area that I might have luck selling it in or if any of the western guys might be interested in it. Im kind of at a loss of what to do with it.

Hayden


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## Colby (Mar 5, 2012)

Have you talked to dealers and told them that you want to trade the rake in for a new discbine?


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## FarmerCline (Oct 12, 2011)

Colby said:


> Have you talked to dealers and told them that you want to trade the rake in for a new discbine?


 Yep, I tried hard to trade it for a disc moco all winter with no luck. Best offer I got was in Yakima Washington where those rakes are made and they offered less than half what I paid new and were 3k higher on a new moco than my local dealer....and I still had the freight bill to pay. Just couldn't make that work.


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## Lostin55 (Sep 21, 2013)

If you still have that box truck and flat bed trailer......


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## FarmerCline (Oct 12, 2011)

Lostin55 said:


> If you still have that box truck and flat bed trailer......


 I was going to try to haul it myself even though it will be considerably over width. Just couldn't stand taking less than half what I paid new and 3k high on a moco and still have to haul it completely across the country.


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## Gearclash (Nov 25, 2010)

Half price! Shaking my head. I would think as long as you got west of the Mississippi you would find a market. Wish there wasn't so many dollars involved, I'd try to talk my brother into buying it. The R2300 we have now is an excellent rake but raking two 16' swaths with it is rather a tightrope act. Have you tried advertising it in the classifieds of newagtalk?


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## FarmerCline (Oct 12, 2011)

Gearclash said:


> Half price! Shaking my head. I would think as long as you got west of the Mississippi you would find a market. Wish there wasn't so many dollars involved, I'd try to talk my brother into buying it. The R2300 we have now is an excellent rake but raking two 16' swaths with it is rather a tightrope act. Have you tried advertising it in the classifieds of newagtalk?


 Yep, they offered 19k and I paid 38k. I would probably let it go for 25k just to move it. Only raked 200 acres and has all the options.


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## Lostin55 (Sep 21, 2013)

Half of new seems to be fairly common lately for auction prices. I seem to have to learn the same lessons over and over again. You make your money when you buy them rather than when you sell them. 
I am selling 7 pieces of haying equipment, I can feel your pain.


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## Trillium Farm (Dec 18, 2014)

FarmerCline said:


> Yep, they offered 19k and I paid 38k. I would probably let it go for 25k just to move it. Only raked 200 acres and has all the options.


Maybe it's a case of cutting your losses. Get what you can and get out of it, it won't appreciate as time goes by. I know it hurts, but sometimes we have no choice


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## Idaho Hay (Oct 14, 2016)

That's a real bumber. The Twin Star rakes are popular here in north Idaho, and though I don't have one (a bit out of my price range and needs), guys seem to be very happy with them. But, I will say that I don't know of anyone raking tedded alfalfa with one. I could see where that could change things.

We have a dealer here for them, but I can't imagine that they're going to give you much better of a deal then what you're seeing. After all, I'm sure they make the real money on selling new ones...not used ones.

Sorry for your losses.


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## Waldo (Apr 29, 2016)

OK farmer clime might be able to help out here the neighbor imports twin star rakes to oz.and I am about ready to bring some nh balers and rakes here to work out what you want for it and i'll see what we can do.it winter here so this is the time to get gear in for spring


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## FarmerCline (Oct 12, 2011)

Lostin55 said:


> Half of new seems to be fairly common lately for auction prices. I seem to have to learn the same lessons over and over again. You make your money when you buy them rather than when you sell them.
> I am selling 7 pieces of haying equipment, I can feel your pain.


 Half price for something that was only used on 200 acres just seems awfully low......heck it could be called a new demo machine. I never would have thought the resale value would be that terrible. It's not worth anything out here but I would have thought that out where it is popular in Washington and surrounding areas it would be worth more than half price.

I made some really poor hay equipment purchases 2015-2016......all made with the best intentions but most of which were not well suited to my area. I learned real quick that haying conditions here in the east are much different than out west and sometimes the equipment that is used out west is not out here for a reason. Lesson learned.....it has made me very hesitant of buying other hay equipment (especially new) in fear that if may not work out.


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## FarmerCline (Oct 12, 2011)

Waldo said:


> OK farmer clime might be able to help out here the neighbor imports twin star rakes to oz.and I am about ready to bring some nh balers and rakes here to work out what you want for it and i'll see what we can do.it winter here so this is the time to get gear in for spring


 I really need to try to get 25k.


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## swmnhay (Jun 13, 2008)

List on Tractor House,Fastline maybe??

https://www.tractorhouse.com/listings/farm-equipment/for-sale/list/category/1133/hay-and-forage-equipment-rakes-tedders/manufacturer/twinstar


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## Waldo (Apr 29, 2016)

farmer cline will talk with neighbor tomorrow he,said sold over 100 machines here.they are very popular,but as swnhay says put it on tractor house at your money and being brand new it would be the cheapest on there.if it doesn't happen for you I will put a container together with either a nh 5070 baler or 216 rake


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## FarmerCline (Oct 12, 2011)

swmnhay said:


> List on Tractor House,Fastline maybe??
> https://www.tractorhouse.com/listings/farm-equipment/for-sale/list/category/1133/hay-and-forage-equipment-rakes-tedders/manufacturer/twinstar


 My JD dealer has been advertising it on tractorhouse since Christmas and we haven't had a single inquiry. They are advertising it for 29k.....I think I would be getting around 27k if it sold.


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## FarmerCline (Oct 12, 2011)

Waldo said:


> farmer cline will talk with neighbor tomorrow he,said sold over 100 machines here.they are very popular,but as swnhay says put it on tractor house at your money and being brand new it would be the cheapest on there.if it doesn't happen for you I will put a container together with either a nh 5070 baler or 216 rake


 Ok, thanks.....let me know if you can help me out. I just so happen to have a nice NH 5070 hayliner for sale as well.


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## Waldo (Apr 29, 2016)

farmer cline the cheapest on tractor house new was about 37000 us so there a lot of bread left in the samwich at you price they retail here for 65000 oz dollars here. Anyway will do the homework on it,1 or 2 twins tars imported might not upset the neighbor


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## Waldo (Apr 29, 2016)

Farmer cline looked at the pictures it's is mickey mouse


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## Lostin55 (Sep 21, 2013)

Which model is it?


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## JMT (Aug 10, 2013)

https://www.tractorhouse.com/listings/farm-equipment/for-sale/17290429/2016-twinstar-2027

I assume this is the add for your rake. In my opinion the description needs to be much more detailed. You mentioned it has lots of features, raked only 200 acres, like new or demo... All that should be in the description plus some more pictures, especially if your expecting some interest from long distance.

Just scrolling through the list on tractorhouse the price on your add would catch my attention, but then used and long distance would not be worth a closer look. Maybe that's just me though?


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## Lewis Ranch (Jul 15, 2013)

Definitely need better pictures and description. You can list it on tractor house yourself and the first time is free. Easy to change pictures description and price, I can send you my reps number and he can take care of the whole process over text message.


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## FarmerCline (Oct 12, 2011)

Lostin55 said:


> Which model is it?


 2027 G3-7


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## FarmerCline (Oct 12, 2011)

JMT said:


> https://www.tractorhouse.com/listings/farm-equipment/for-sale/17290429/2016-twinstar-2027
> I assume this is the add for your rake. In my opinion the description needs to be much more detailed. You mentioned it has lots of features, raked only 200 acres, like new or demo... All that should be in the description plus some more pictures, especially if your expecting some interest from long distance.
> Just scrolling through the list on tractorhouse the price on your add would catch my attention, but then used and long distance would not be worth a closer look. Maybe that's just me though?


 I agree on the description. I have asked my dealer a couple times to include a description and it never seems to get done. The pictures are my own fault as I was the one who took them. If Waldo can't help me out on the rake I will take some better pictures and insist they include a description.


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## FarmerCline (Oct 12, 2011)

Waldo said:


> Farmer cline looked at the pictures it's is mickey mouse


 I have to ask is that a good or bad thing? Around here that would mean kind of cheap or rinky dink but it might have a different meaning down under.


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## Waldo (Apr 29, 2016)

Farmer Cline mickey mouse here is great top stuff or the duck,so guts (that a pretty old one)no it is as you have said great machine. The twin star guy here away back after weekend,so will talk to him rather see him then phone him


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## woodland (May 23, 2016)

Waldo said:


> Farmer cline looked at the pictures it's is mickey mouse


Good thing that we've established Mickey Mouse doesn't mean the same thing to all people. Up in Canada it means the same as "made in China ". I imagine that's pretty universal........ maybe not though??


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## woodland (May 23, 2016)

Farmer Cline we bought an identical set of rakes as yours except ours are 30 foot and we paid $25k US to a dealer in Idaho last spring and they were only used on a couple hundred acres as well. Up in Alberta they are unknown but so are tedders and we just bought one this spring. What moisture were you raking your tedded crop and was it alfalfa or grass? Just some questions since we're going be learning about tedding and only got to use these rakes on a few acres since we silaged most of last years crop. We've had good luck buying and selling equipment through kijiji which is the same idea as Craigslist. It's free and if you have a reasonable price you can usually have it sold in a week or so. We find it tough being the first in the area trying new equipment or practices but it keeps things interesting as well. Good luck with finding a new home for your rake. Too bad it didn't work out for you.


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## Trotwood2955 (Sep 4, 2012)

Yeah, have you tried Craigslist yet? Or possibly putting a picture add in Lancaster Farming equipment section?

I know those rakes are "off brand" for east coasters, but seems to me the concept is not that different from the twin basket Vermeer or older NH 216 rakes, and I see quite a few of those in my area (not as common as wheel rakes, or rotary rakes, but still see them).

I would have to think if you just hit up some wider ranging adds (plus sprucing up the Tractorhouse one a bit) that might yield some results? My local Deere dealer is the same parent company as yours...and I hope your local dealership is more motivated at selling used equipment than ours is here. That's why I think you might have better luck trying to list it and market it yourself on a wider regional scale.


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## somedevildawg (Jun 20, 2011)

Mickey Mouse means good huh....
Lol....that's funny. Around here one might ask "what kind of Mickey Mouse crap is this...." 
"Man this is one Mickey Mouse piece of junk..."
"The guy that repaired this last time did some Mickey Mouse wiring...."

I've never heard it used in the exact opposite context.....guess that's about "par for the course" I suppose. Interesting....


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## FarmerCline (Oct 12, 2011)

woodland said:


> Farmer Cline we bought an identical set of rakes as yours except ours are 30 foot and we paid $25k US to a dealer in Idaho last spring and they were only used on a couple hundred acres as well. Up in Alberta they are unknown but so are tedders and we just bought one this spring. What moisture were you raking your tedded crop and was it alfalfa or grass? Just some questions since we're going be learning about tedding and only got to use these rakes on a few acres since we silaged most of last years crop. We've had good luck buying and selling equipment through kijiji which is the same idea as Craigslist. It's free and if you have a reasonable price you can usually have it sold in a week or so. We find it tough being the first in the area trying new equipment or practices but it keeps things interesting as well. Good luck with finding a new home for your rake. Too bad it didn't work out for you.


 I was raking grass and oat hay when it was pretty much ready to bale....was tolerable in grass but it still made a bit of a rope. In alfalfa I was raking with a little moisture to save the leaves and it made a terrible tightly roped windrow no matter how it was adjusted. It was roped so bad I could pull into the windrow of hay with the baler and stop the tractor and it would keep pulling the windrow towards the baler.

My theory was that since the tedded hay is spread wide over the complete width of the rake it gets rolled over multiple times by the time it gets to the center of the rake and alfalfa being kind of viney in gets roped up. The company agreed to this and said the raked was designed to flop two mower swaths together and since the hay isn't spread over the complete width of the rake it is not getting rolled over as much and therefore is not as prone to making a roped windrow. I will also add that the gauge wheels at the end of the baskets were constantly getting wrapped up the hay. The company said that the gauge wheel were not designed to be running over hay.....again get this is not possible when raking tedded hay.


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## FarmerCline (Oct 12, 2011)

Trotwood2955 said:


> Yeah, have you tried Craigslist yet? Or possibly putting a picture add in Lancaster Farming equipment section?
> 
> I know those rakes are "off brand" for east coasters, but seems to me the concept is not that different from the twin basket Vermeer or older NH 216 rakes, and I see quite a few of those in my area (not as common as wheel rakes, or rotary rakes, but still see them).
> 
> I would have to think if you just hit up some wider ranging adds (plus sprucing up the Tractorhouse one a bit) that might yield some results? My local Deere dealer is the same parent company as yours...and I hope your local dealership is more motivated at selling used equipment than ours is here. That's why I think you might have better luck trying to list it and market it yourself on a wider regional scale.


 No, I haven't done craigslist. I'm not really into the whole craigslist thing.....selling or buying.

I realize the rake is the same basic raking concept of the Vermeer rakes......it doesn't make any sense but I have watched a few Vermeer r2800 raking since purchasing the Twinstar and they were not having near the roping issue that I was having with the Twinstar. Granted it was still more roped than what a rotary rake windrow is.

If Waldo isn't able to help me out on selling the rake I'm going to either get the tractorhouse add updated or may just put my own add on tractorhouse. Im not a fan of James River Equipment as a whole but the dealer I use is pretty decent. I actually drive past a different JRE location to go to the one I deal with. I have kind of become friends with my salesman but he isn't the one that takes care of the online adds and the person that takes care of that doesn't seem very motivated to get my add updated.


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## JD3430 (Jan 1, 2012)

woodland said:


> Farmer Cline we bought an identical set of rakes as yours except ours are 30 foot and we paid $25k US to a dealer in Idaho last spring and they were only used on a couple hundred acres as well. Up in Alberta they are unknown but so are tedders and we just bought one this spring. What moisture were you raking your tedded crop and was it alfalfa or grass? Just some questions since we're going be learning about tedding and only got to use these rakes on a few acres since we silaged most of last years crop. We've had good luck buying and selling equipment through kijiji which is the same idea as Craigslist. It's free and if you have a reasonable price you can usually have it sold in a week or so. We find it tough being the first in the area trying new equipment or practices but it keeps things interesting as well. Good luck with finding a new home for your rake. Too bad it didn't work out for you.


I spent hundreds advertising a tractor on tractor house. I got no calls. Ended up selling it free on craigslist. Never had much luck with tractor house. I had great luck with craigslist selling and buying items.


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## Lostin55 (Sep 21, 2013)

Speaking of CL, and hay rakes, there is a brand new Kuhn center delivery rotary rake on CL for $22,500. It's in Bozeman, MT farm and garden. Ad was placed on the 13th. Kuhn GA7501.
They claim a rake close out sale. 
It would be hard to compete with a new rotary rake at a lower price point, I would think.
With all of that being said, I don't know squat about rotary rakes.


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## Trillium Farm (Dec 18, 2014)

""My theory was that since the tedded hay is spread wide over the complete width of the rake it gets rolled over multiple times by the time it gets to the center of the rake and alfalfa being kind of viney in gets roped up. The company agreed to this and said the raked was designed to flop two mower swaths together and since the hay isn't spread over the complete width of the rake it is not getting rolled over as much and therefore is not as prone to making a roped windrow. I will also add that the gauge wheels at the end of the baskets were constantly getting wrapped up the hay. The company said that the gauge wheel were not designed to be running over hay.....again get this is not possible when raking tedded hay.""

What I find amazing is that NH didn't mention this in the brochure or did they?. I think that they misled you and if you have no luck in sell it I'd talk to a lawyer I really would.


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## Lostin55 (Sep 21, 2013)

Trillium Farm said:


> ""My theory was that since the tedded hay is spread wide over the complete width of the rake it gets rolled over multiple times by the time it gets to the center of the rake and alfalfa being kind of viney in gets roped up. The company agreed to this and said the raked was designed to flop two mower swaths together and since the hay isn't spread over the complete width of the rake it is not getting rolled over as much and therefore is not as prone to making a roped windrow. I will also add that the gauge wheels at the end of the baskets were constantly getting wrapped up the hay. The company said that the gauge wheel were not designed to be running over hay.....again get this is not possible when raking tedded hay.""
> 
> What I find amazing is that NH didn't mention this in the brochure or did they?. I think that they misled you and if you have no luck in sell it I'd talk to a lawyer I really would.


Most folks don't put a bean header on a combine to do corn either.


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## FarmerCline (Oct 12, 2011)

Trillium Farm said:


> ""My theory was that since the tedded hay is spread wide over the complete width of the rake it gets rolled over multiple times by the time it gets to the center of the rake and alfalfa being kind of viney in gets roped up. The company agreed to this and said the raked was designed to flop two mower swaths together and since the hay isn't spread over the complete width of the rake it is not getting rolled over as much and therefore is not as prone to making a roped windrow. I will also add that the gauge wheels at the end of the baskets were constantly getting wrapped up the hay. The company said that the gauge wheel were not designed to be running over hay.....again get this is not possible when raking tedded hay.""
> 
> What I find amazing is that NH didn't mention this in the brochure or did they?. I think that they misled you and if you have no luck in sell it I'd talk to a lawyer I really would.


 It is not a NH rake it is a Twinstar. I do feel sort of mislead because the company promised I would not have a roping issue and that it would make a fluffy windrow. With the design of the rake being similar to a rolabar rake roping was one of my initial concerns but I was assured it would not be an issue......the roping issue is way worse than any rolabar rake I have been around. In all fairness though I may or may not have mentioned that I would be raking tedded hay before I bought the rake.

I do feel that at the very least the company should have been willing to help me resale the rake considering the problems I had and that this was the first one they had sold in the eastern states. The head of the company/sales acted like I was making an issue out of nothing and I really don't think he actually believed I was having problems. The tech dept of the company is who finally told me that his conclusion was the same as mine and that the rake just wasn't designed to rake tedded hay. Anyway I'm not interested in getting a lawyer.....that might end up costing even more money and is not worth the hassle.


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## JD3430 (Jan 1, 2012)

FarmerCline said:


> It is not a NH rake it is a Twinstar. I do feel sort of mislead because the company promised I would not have a roping issue and that it would make a fluffy windrow. With the design of the rake being similar to a rolabar rake roping was one of my initial concerns but I was assured it would not be an issue......the roping issue is way worse than any rolabar rake I have been around. In all fairness though I may or may not have mentioned that I would be raking tedded hay before I bought the rake.
> I do feel that at the very least the company should have been willing to help me resale the rake considering the problems I had and that this was the first one they had sold in the eastern states. The head of the company/sales acted like I was making an issue out of nothing and I really don't think he actually believed I was having problems. The tech dept of the company is who finally told me that his conclusion was the same as mine and that the rake just wasn't designed to rake tedded hay. Anyway I'm not interested in getting a lawyer.....that might end up costing even more money and is not worth the hassle.


Sounds like you got bad advice driven by greed to make a sale. 
Although it's "on you" (buyer beware) I do think the dealer should be reported to whatever manufacturer he represents for making incorrect representations on equipment he sells. If you told him the operations you conduct thoroughly, he should not have sold you that rake.
If it's such an amazing rake, you'd think the dealer would buy it back from you at an amazing buy back price. Not 1/2 what you paid.


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## FarmerCline (Oct 12, 2011)

JD3430 said:


> Sounds like you got bad advice driven by greed to make a sale.
> Although it's "on you" (buyer beware) I do think the dealer should be reported to whatever manufacturer he represents for making incorrect representations on equipment he sells. If you told him the operations you conduct thoroughly, he should not have sold you that rake.
> If it's such an amazing rake, you'd think the dealer would buy it back from you at an amazing buy back price. Not 1/2 what you paid.


 I don't blame the local dealer that sold me the rake because all he did was organized the transaction for me and had never sold or even heard of one of these rakes before. I blame the company that makes the rakes because I was dealing with them directly.....actually the owner of the company and his son......they would not however sell direct to an individual so I talked a local dealer here into getting the rake for me....my salesman actually tried to talk me out of it so I don't blame him at all.

Before purchasing the rake I fail to remember if I mentioned to the owners of the company that I tedded practically all of my hay. I think I did but around here tedding the hay is so common I may have overlooked mentioning that.

I was shocked when I called dealers out west where I was under the impression that those rakes are super popular and work well that the best offer was half of what it cost new.


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## 8350HiTech (Jul 26, 2013)

FarmerCline said:


> I don't blame the local dealer that sold me the rake because all he did was organized the transaction for me and had never sold or even heard of one of these rakes before. I blame the company that makes the rakes because I was dealing with them directly.....actually the owner of the company and his son......they would not however sell direct to an individual so I talked a local dealer here into getting the rake for me....my salesman actually tried to talk me out of it so I don't blame him at all.
> 
> Before purchasing the rake I fail to remember if I mentioned to the owners of the company that I tedded practically all of my hay. I think I did but around here tedding the hay is so common I may have overlooked mentioning that.
> 
> I was shocked when I called dealers out west where I was under the impression that those rakes are super popular and work well that the best offer was half of what it cost new.


Half price may be the best they can do but they also know they have you over a barrel.


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## r82230 (Mar 1, 2016)

As others have said - get better (more) pictures rake (even in operating position), list all the options/features that you have on rake (perhaps include a dealer brochure if you can find a pdf file). DEFENITELY mention only raking 200 acres (which could be a lot less than a demo machine) and list on TractorHouse, Craig's List and where ever you can. This might cost you a few bucks, but the quicker you get your cash is good, the longer you have the rake the lower the value is bad. IMHO

I would also mention the reason you are getting rid of (doesn't seem to work well in tedded alfalfa). The pricing at $30K, seems reasonable (and dropping down is generous).

I would have the same problem as you, no such rake in MY neck of the woods either (so not much market to re-sell).

Hope it sells soon.

My two pennies today.

Larry


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## Trillium Farm (Dec 18, 2014)

FarmerCline said:


> It is not a NH rake it is a Twinstar. I do feel sort of mislead because the company promised I would not have a roping issue and that it would make a fluffy windrow. With the design of the rake being similar to a rolabar rake roping was one of my initial concerns but I was assured it would not be an issue......the roping issue is way worse than any rolabar rake I have been around. In all fairness though I may or may not have mentioned that I would be raking tedded hay before I bought the rake.
> 
> I do feel that at the very least the company should have been willing to help me resale the rake considering the problems I had and that this was the first one they had sold in the eastern states. The head of the company/sales acted like I was making an issue out of nothing and I really don't think he actually believed I was having problems. The tech dept of the company is who finally told me that his conclusion was the same as mine and that the rake just wasn't designed to rake tedded hay. Anyway I'm not interested in getting a lawyer.....that might end up costing even more money and is not worth the hassle.


Farmer Cline, sorry for the mix-up (NH/TwinStar) I know you are not interested in a lawyer, but think of this. If you threaten to sue them they too will have to ponder if it is cheaper for them to buy back the rake or fight you in court with all the bad publicity that will ensue. You don't have to go through with it, but the threat of legal issue may push them in your favour.


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## Waldo (Apr 29, 2016)

Not good new on the oz side the twins tar bloke only brings the bigger 30 series in 30 foot raking area. Dawg remember we,re down under reverses. The mickey mouse thing being shonky goes back to the watch,s that was sold,yonks back if they went more than five minutes without losing time you had a good one. Anyway farmer,sorry on the rake but the baler what would you like for it,on top of price factor in price on packing .


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## FarmerCline (Oct 12, 2011)

Waldo said:


> Not good new on the oz side the twins tar bloke only brings the bigger 30 series in 30 foot raking area. Dawg remember we,re down under reverses. The mickey mouse thing being shonky goes back to the watch,s that was sold,yonks back if they went more than five minutes without losing time you had a good one. Anyway farmer,sorry on the rake but the baler what would you like for it,on top of price factor in price on packing .


 Thanks for looking into it for me anyway. Any reason they won't consider bringing in a 27 foot rake at the right price?

Just sold the 5070 baler today.....that was the only piece of equipment I had for sale that was marketable locally. Not sure if it would be of any interest or not but I also have a very nice NH 499 haybine for sale that has only cut about 400-500 acres of hay.


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## HALLSHAY (Nov 30, 2008)

If it was a 30' rake, I would be all over it. Have you tried raking less hay with the rakes set at a steeper angle? That is the advantage of the 30' model is the longer basket so you can rake at a steeper angle even on windrows.


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## FarmerCline (Oct 12, 2011)

HALLSHAY said:


> If it was a 30' rake, I would be all over it. Have you tried raking less hay with the rakes set at a steeper angle? That is the advantage of the 30' model is the longer basket so you can rake at a steeper angle even on windrows.


 Yes, I tried raking with the rake not fully opened up to the complete raking width where the baskets were at a steeper angle. It still made a tightly roped windrow. I also adjusted the tilt of the baskets all the way back to where it was supposed to make a fluffy windrow and it didn't help any either. I have moved on to a rotary rake now so I really need to move this Twinstar rake.


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## Jay in WA (Mar 21, 2015)

Ship it west and it will sell fast. Twinstar has completely taken over the market is this part of the country. I own a pair of 2030 G2's

What model is your? 5 or 7 bar?

I don't know anything about tedders but have you tried raking when the hay is dryer? The 7 bar rakes are very gentle on the hay. Especially compared to a rotary rake. I like to rake with the least amount of dew that I can get away with.


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## FarmerCline (Oct 12, 2011)

Jay in WA said:


> Ship it west and it will sell fast. Twinstar has completely taken over the market is this part of the country. I own a pair of 2030 G2's
> 
> What model is your? 5 or 7 bar?
> 
> I don't know anything about tedders but have you tried raking when the hay is dryer? The 7 bar rakes are very gentle on the hay. Especially compared to a rotary rake. I like to rake with the least amount of dew that I can get away with.


 It is a 2027 G3 7 bar rake. None of the dealers out your way would give anything for it. Are there any farm papers out there that you would suggest that I try to advertise it in? I can arrange shipping if someone wants to buy it.

Yes, I tried raking the hay when it was almost too dry and it helped some but not much. I will agree that is was very gentle on the leaves and that was actually the main reason I ended up buying the rake because it was promoted to be the most gentle rake on alfalfa......I do believe that is true but at the end of the day in the humid climate out here I need a rake that makes a fluffy, fast drying windrow that isn't roped even if it means losing a few more leaves.


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## Gearclash (Nov 25, 2010)

My experience is with the Vermeer twin rake, but I can see why Cline couldn't get the result he wanted when raking teddered hay, especially alfalfa. When a twin bar rake is rolling two swaths together, there is a rolling, roping action that takes place as the hay is moved to the center of the rake. However, if everything is woking right, that "roll" at least partially unrolls as it is exiting the rake. In thin crop or as the case is with a teddered crop, the rolling action is too intense to get unrolled properly as the hay is exiting the rake. Grass is more forgiving as it tends to slide or flow better than alfalfa. My experience has been that wheel rakes are worse for roping alfalfa than a bar rake.


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## Jay in WA (Mar 21, 2015)

Bookerauction.com They will sell it for you and good equipment sells very well there. However the short baskets are going to hurt the resale a lot.


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## FarmerCline (Oct 12, 2011)

Jay in WA said:


> Bookerauction.com They will sell it for you and good equipment sells very well there. However the short baskets are going to hurt the resale a lot.


 I will give them a call and see what they say. I tend to avoid selling equipment at auctions because in the past I have never been able to get close to what I wanted and thought it was worth. Sure would hate to send something across the country and no sale it because it didn't bring enough and then have to figure out what to do with it when it is sitting out there.


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## Jay in WA (Mar 21, 2015)

This is hay country and Twinstar owns the rake market. The only thing hurting your rake resale value is the short baskets.


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## FarmerCline (Oct 12, 2011)

Jay in WA said:


> This is hay country and Twinstar owns the rake market. The only thing hurting your rake resale value is the short baskets.


 In your opinion what would be a realistic expectation of what it might bring in your area? I was shocked at how low of a price the dealers I called out there offered.


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## Jay in WA (Mar 21, 2015)

No idea because of the smaller baskets. Remember dealers are in the business of buying low and selling high.


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## mike10 (May 29, 2011)

Jay, just a slight variation on your observation. Dealers, like all business people, are in business to make money, at least if they want to stay in business. In order to do that they need to buy low and sell high.


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## somedevildawg (Jun 20, 2011)

Always better off, financially, to sell to an individual.....usually dealing with a dealer will offset aggravating hassles of selling yourself. So generally I think it's best to deal with a dealer for such long range transactions....


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## FarmerCline (Oct 12, 2011)

I know dealers have to be able to make money and that means buying low and selling high and that they can't pay as much as an individual who is going to use it rather than resell it. With that being said I just think that an offer of half what it cost new when it is a year old and hardly used is unreasonably low. That is unless it is an undesirable piece of equipment with no resale value......and that is the impression I was starting to get about this rake. Half price of new on a year old piece is terrible even for a trade value.


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## Waldo (Apr 29, 2016)

Farmer Cline yes no go at all he has only bought in the 30foot machines,and I can see the problem ever one wants bigger.but buy the same circumstances twins tar make them and sell them ask the question where they place the 27footers


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## Trillium Farm (Dec 18, 2014)

FarmerCline said:


> I know dealers have to be able to make money and that means buying low and selling high and that they can't pay as much as an individual who is going to use it rather than resell it. With that being said I just think that an offer of half what it cost new when it is a year old and hardly used is unreasonably low. That is unless it is an undesirable piece of equipment with no resale value......and that is the impression I was starting to get about this rake. Half price of new on a year old piece is terrible even for a trade value.


In the end any item is only worth what people are willing to pay for it. I don't think that your rake is undesirable, but it may be not suitable for your area which puts you in a pickle. I truly feel that you should sell it for the best price you can get, even if below your expectations and move on.


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## Three44s (May 21, 2016)

Waldo said:


> Farmer Cline yes no go at all he has only bought in the 30foot machines,and I can see the problem ever one wants bigger.but buy the same circumstances twins tar make them and sell them ask the question where they place the 27footers


The twin star people you saddled you with this, they at least owe you that much courtesy. .... but don't hold your breath.

The premiere ag paper in this area is the Capital Press out of Salem OR. We have had excellent performance with it. That said, Craigslist would my pick in this instance as the Capital Press has lost ground in recent years to the internet and you have lost much money already.

Barring any help from Twinstar, I'd it put on Craigslist in areas where smaller hay growers reside since your machine is a 27'. Growers like Jay in WA are running on big wide open areas with big equipment so only a big rake makes sense. To growers in that setting they look at 160 ac. like some would look at a "40". You will have to figure out a freight solution that you and a prospective buyer can both live with since you will need to get your rake back west likely.

My area .... Yakima Wa ... is one such area but better would be north of Spokane Wa and Northern Idaho. Many places in Oregon would qualify as well.

Good luck and Best regards

Three 44s


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## FarmerCline (Oct 12, 2011)

Three44s said:


> The twin star people you saddled you with this, they at least owe you that much courtesy. .... but don't hold your breath.
> The premiere ag paper in this area is the Capital Press out of Salem OR. We have had excellent performance with it. That said, Craigslist would my pick in this instance as the Capital Press has lost ground in recent years to the internet and you have lost much money already.
> Barring any help from Twinstar, I'd it put on Craigslist in areas where smaller hay growers reside since your machine is a 27'. Growers like Jay in WA are running on big wide open areas with big equipment so only a big rake makes sense. To growers in that setting they look at 160 ac. like some would look at a "40". You will have to figure out a freight solution that you and a prospective buyer can both live with since you will need to get your rake back west likely.
> My area .... Yakima Wa ... is one such area but better would be north of Spokane Wa and Northern Idaho. Many places in Oregon would qualify as well.
> ...


I initially called the Twinstar folks to see if they would be willing to help me sell my rake or guide me to a dealer that would be willing to work with me but the response I got was that they had a list of their distributors and dealers on the website and to start calling them to see if they could help me. I was kind of put off by this response.

The dealer I ended up calling was Washington tractor in Yakima. I figured since Yakima is where that rake was made they had to be more popular there than anywhere else. I was hoping to trade for a JD moco so I looked up the JD dealer out there and gave them a call. They referred me to another store location in Okanogan Washington and that is the dealer who gave me the best offer of 19k and was 3k high on the new moco. I also called Agri service since I wouldn't be against a Hesston moco either but they didn't want to trade.

At this point I would really prefer to just sell it than trade it because it will cost me less on shipping and make it easier if I'm just sending something out there and not bringing something back east.

I guess I never would have thought that the three foot difference in my 27' and the 30' rake would make that big of a difference in resale.....especially considering how much less than new I'm asking for it.


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## Three44s (May 21, 2016)

I could see Okanogan WA being advantageous for your rake but there is a lot of territory between there and your location that should hold a market for a 27 footer which also means less freight bill.

Also, I know this a long shot but I was curious about Twinstar prices and was looking at the Machinery Pete web site. There I saw a listing for a Twinstar in Chehalis Wa. at a Washington Machinery dealership. Now I would not advocate necessarily trying to sell your rake way over there but for point of reference, Chehalis Wa is closer in climate to your country than you might think. For what it is worth, you might try calling the salesman to see if there is some stone unturned as to getting your rake to work for you. Who knows what might come from it?

If you care to call, the name is Brad Mass and number is 253-943-2217

Maybe he would put you in touch with growers there with experiences that could help you?

And if not there then perhaps another dealership because there the whole area from the Canadian border down to west central OR (the Willamette valley) that has hay and grass seed operations there.

Three 44s


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## Hay diddle diddle (Nov 17, 2017)

Had an Allen for last 20 years. Dealer had been trying to sell me a Twin star as a replacement. Didn't want an updated version of the same thing , so went with one of these. They're built 45 kms down the road from me so service if needed is extremely handy.

.http://www.berrimahayrakes.com.au/rake_models/1

So far so good. Cut my raking time in half and that was still only pulling to 13 foot swaths together. It can easily pull 3 together but obviously ground speed is reduced.


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## Three44s (May 21, 2016)

It seems every day in the hay field is another day "at school"!

Our last cutting was late and we were pushing the envelope.

The subject rake was an antique by any measure, even mine and that takes a real oldie to get there with me.

We were short on time to finnish and our 3 pt pto rake broke. I ordered the parts with next day air.

There was nothing to lose by trying something out of the box so we went and got our old and I mean OLD IH ground drive tow behind rake.

Of course it roped our alfalfa just as it always does and we only suffered one round trip. On a wild hair we took off the frozen rusted adjuster off and took it to the shop and gave it a couple thousand degrees of gas wrench and some aerokroil for good measure. My guy gave it a once over with his threader dies and taps andfinnshed with some anti seize.

My operator came back from the field with a huge grin!

The adjuster we tackled had likely never moved in the 65 years my dad has owned the rake and as touted as the Twin Star rake is ... it does not look like it has such an adjustment. I may not have the right pictures or my old glasses are too old but I am not seeing this on their rake.

What I am referring to is an adjustment that changes the angle of attack of the teeth to the hay. Not a simple tilting of the basket but specifically the tooth angle.

Laugh if you will but this rake which is a FOUR BAR is now beating much better 3 pt pto rakes in making the windrow fluffier. The parts came in and we just kept going with the IH.

I just acquired a whole mess of orbit motors, me thinks Mr. International ought to get an upgrade?

Three44s


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## Hay diddle diddle (Nov 17, 2017)

My old man was keen on the Twin star. (even though he hasn't done any of the haymaking for the last 23 years....) But having used the allen for 20 years , I knew what I wanted out of the next rake.

And so far the Berrima delivers. It has a massive lift of the baskets to clear rows, the splitters (optional) don't drop until the baskets are down so it's easy enough to leave them up if you are only pulling 2 together , then if you need to rake that pesky 3rd half row in , just hold the switch down. It's so easy to adjust raking width on the go as opposed to the Allen or twin star. And when you need to adjust the raking width the windrow width remains the same as you first set it when you started the paddock. The bloke that builds them also said if you have windrowed hay that gets rained on, rather than just rolling it over again and roping it tighter, you pull it apart with the splitters and can offset the rake so as you rake it together again you can put the row on dry ground. For a small manufacturer (still built in a shed on his farm) he does a tremendous job.


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## Grateful11 (Apr 5, 2009)

I've halfway kept up with this thread. About 2 or 3 months ago we were in Statesville, NC and drove by Tri-State Distributors and sitting on their lot was a new Twinstar rake. This place is a wholesale distributor only, no sales to individuals. Just about every farm equipment dealer around here buys certain things from them. Anyway I kinda got the gist of part of what been said here and it seems that some say maybe this rake won't work properly on east coast crops. Well why would they sell them in NC if they don't work around here? There's lots of guys around here using twin Vermeers and basically it's about the same design.


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## FarmerCline (Oct 12, 2011)

Grateful11 said:


> I've halfway kept up with this thread. About 2 or 3 months ago we were in Statesville, NC and drove by Tri-State Distributors and sitting on their lot was a new Twinstar rake. This place is a wholesale distributor only, no sales to individuals. Just about every farm equipment dealer around here buys certain things from them. Anyway I kinda got the gist of part of what been said here and it seems that some say maybe this rake won't work properly on east coast crops. Well why would they sell them in NC if they don't work around here? There's lots of guys around here using twin Vermeers and basically it's about the same design.


 That rake has been sitting there since last spring. It is Twinstars new single basket rake and not the double basket like the one I have. Up until I bought my rake there were no dealers for the Twinstar rakes in the east. James River Equipment became a dealer for them to get me my rake. Tri-State handled some of the Twinstar companies smaller items but not the rakes at that point. Since then apparently Twinstar convinced Tri-State that there was interest and a market for their rakes in the east (mostly because I bought one) and got them to stock one. Randy down at JRE told the guys at Tri-State about my troubles and not to start handling those rakes but I guess they did anyway.

I have been extremely disappointed in the response I got from Twinstar about my troubles with their rake. I suggested to them that after the problems I have had with their rake that it might be best not to try to further market it in the east so another farmer wouldn't have to go through the loss that I'm going to take on it......it was then made out that I was the problem and not the rake.


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## Grateful11 (Apr 5, 2009)

Without going back and reading the entire thread again did anyone come out and help set it up? One of the largest beef cattle operations in NC use several Vermeer twins and I realize it's not exactly the same rake but it's the same concept. They could afford any type rake they want but use the Vermeer twins. I wish I could have seen yours in operation. There's guys close enough around you that maybe several could get together and take a look at it in operation. I hate to see you take such a big lose on it.


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## FarmerCline (Oct 12, 2011)

Grateful11 said:


> Without going back and reading the entire thread again did anyone come out and help set it up? One of the largest beef cattle operations in NC use several Vermeer twins and I realize it's not exactly the same rake but it's the same concept. They could afford any type rake they want but use the Vermeer twins. I wish I could have seen yours in operation. There's guys close enough around you that maybe several could get together and take a look at it in operation. I hate to see you take such a big lose on it.


 No they didn't send anyone from the factory in Washington state to set up the rake. They did walk me through it on the phone and I do feel that I had it set up correctly. The conclusion I came to was that it wouldn't rake tedded out alfalfa without the windrow being a rope.....in grass hay it wasnt too bad. One of the engineers out at Twinstar finally agreed that was the issue. Their solution though was to stop tedding the alfalfa.....I told them if I wanted to get it dried without getting rained on that wasn't an option most of the time here.....being from the arid west I guess they have a hard time understanding how much more difficult hay drying is here in the humid east.

I did try leaving the alfalfa in a swath and not tedding a couple times this summer. Once on some very mature alfalfa and it dried down okay. The second time on some very nice late bud-early bloom alfalfa......and as expected it wouldn't dry and I ended up baling it too wet to beat the rain. If I had tedded it I'm sure it would have been dry enough to bale. It proved my theory was correct though and there was minimal roping of the windrow since the alfalfa was not tedded. Even if there was some way to solve the roping issue in tedded hay I have some other issues with the rake so I just don't think it's going to work out for me.

One of my other issues with the rake is that there is not a center kicker and since the bottom of the windrow doesn't get moved it holds moisture. I knew before I bought it that there wasn't going to be a center kicker but since I had never had a center deliver rake I didn't think it would be an issue for me.....I was wrong so that is my fault.

I went and watched a new Vermeer r2800 rake earlier this year in SC and it didn't seem to have the roping issue......but that was in grass hay so I can't say how it would work in tedded alfalfa. I agree that the Vermeer using the same basic raking principal as the Twinstar so you would think if one worked the other would as well. The Vermeer frame is quite a bit different though and the baskets are mounted differently so maybe that's the difference? Vermeer also has a center kicker option. I should have bought the Vermeer......I debated hard between the two. At least if I wasn't happy with the Vermeer I could have sold it without having to take it back across the country. Actually Vermeer offered me a demo so if I want happy I would not have had to buy it.


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## carcajou (Jan 28, 2011)

I would love to see your rake working with tedded hay. Any video?


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## FarmerCline (Oct 12, 2011)

carcajou said:


> I would love to see your rake working with tedded hay. Any video?


 Nope, don't have a video.


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## Gearclash (Nov 25, 2010)

Having used the Vermeer twin rakes since Y2K, I am convinced that FarmerCline is not way out in left field about why his Twinstar is not working to his satisfaction. Twin bar rake work awesome in most conditions, but teddered alfalfa would be the one thing they just wouldn't do well.


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## mike10 (May 29, 2011)

I think any rake which moves hay at an angle from front to back will be subject to roping to some extent. The tines of the rake are moving upward as they contact the hay lifting the hay and pushing it towards the opposite end of the rake causing the windrow to start to rotate. As the rake moves forward the rotation continues. Naturally, the wider the swath being raked, the more rotation the outer portion of the swath will experience and the tighter the roping affect. Grass hay is lighter than alfalfa and has more of a tendency to break apart and not pack as tightly as alfalfa does as the rake moves forward.


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## somedevildawg (Jun 20, 2011)

They's a reason they're popular out west......I think I'd send it "west" and see what happens, turn bad money into something more productive. Surely there are some reputable auction companies that would take the rake and try to sell it, but they would damn sure have to be reputable.....may be lookin' for one of them Unicorns however.....I ain't had the best experiences with any of them but one, and that was Demott Auction Co. down here in my neck. The would try to get top dollar ifn it was here....and around here, these folks would just look at it kinda funny and turn to each other and say "Charles, what the hell is that?" 
Finding the right auction company is key, but then we have to ship the cussed thing back across the country.....anyone on the east side lookin' for a road trip?  I'm out btw, too many "irons in the fire"


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## FarmerCline (Oct 12, 2011)

somedevildawg said:


> They's a reason they're popular out west......I think I'd send it "west" and see what happens, turn bad money into something more productive. Surely there are some reputable auction companies that would take the rake and try to sell it, but they would damn sure have to be reputable.....may be lookin' for one of them Unicorns however.....I ain't had the best experiences with any of them but one, and that was Demott Auction Co. down here in my neck. The would try to get top dollar ifn it was here....and around here, these folks would just look at it kinda funny and turn to each other and say "Charles, what the hell is that?"
> Finding the right auction company is key, but then we have to ship the cussed thing back across the country.....anyone on the east side lookin' for a road trip?  I'm out btw, too many "irons in the fire"


 I called a few auction companies in the western states back in the summer but the response I got was depressing. The problem is my rake is a 27' instead of a 30'.......apparently the 27' rake is not desirable and would be a tough sale. Out there they said only the 30' rakes are desirable and sell good.....who would have thought that 3' would make that big of a difference. It's going to cost about 6k to get it hauled out there and I can't spend that considering the auction companies said it might only bring less than half what I paid for it.

If not out west I don't know where in the hell this rake would be desirable....starting to think this is another white elephant.


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## glasswrongsize (Sep 15, 2015)

Cline, I hate to bring up what has surely been tried and seems to be too obvious to me, but just in case...

I assume you have tightened the top turnbuckles all they will suffer? This will tilt the baskets back. I would think it is the same principal as my old bar-rakes. I can tilt my old bar rakes back too far and it makes a windrow so loose I have to slow down to keep from throwing the windrow too wide.

I'm sure you already tried that, but I wasn't going to let it go unsaid. Looks like a dang-nice rake and I hate it for you that it won't work. It LOOKS like it should.


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## FarmerCline (Oct 12, 2011)

glasswrongsize said:


> Cline, I hate to bring up what has surely been tried and seems to be too obvious to me, but just in case...
> I assume you have tightened the top turnbuckles all they will suffer? This will tilt the baskets back. I would think it is the same principal as my old bar-rakes. I can tilt my old bar rakes back too far and it makes a windrow so loose I have to slow down to keep from throwing the windrow too wide.
> 
> I'm sure you already tried that, but I wasn't going to let it go unsaid. Looks like a dang-nice rake and I hate it for you that it won't work. It LOOKS like it should.


 Yes, I have the turnbuckles adjusted all the way back to where it was supposed to make a fluffy windrow. Initially I had them adjusted about middle ways but I kept adjusting them farther back trying to get a fluffy windrow but I never could get that in the tedded alfalfa.


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## glasswrongsize (Sep 15, 2015)

FarmerCline said:


> Yes, I have the turnbuckles adjusted all the way back to where it was supposed to make a fluffy windrow. Initially I had them adjusted about middle ways but I kept adjusting them farther back trying to get a fluffy windrow but I never could get that in the tedded alfalfa.


I figured so; I was hesitant to even bring it up as I was sure you had tried that and hated to state the obvious. I think each of us are grasping at straws trying to help you make it work. If it is THAT frustrating for us to try to figure out the rake, I can only imagine how frustrating it is for you.

Mark


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## luke strawwalker (Jul 31, 2014)

FarmerCline said:


> (snip)
> 
> Actually Vermeer offered me a demo so if I want happy I would not have had to buy it.


Nothing beats an honest to goodness demo in your crops and conditions...

If a dealer isn't interested in letting you try something out, then IMHO he's not serious about wanting to make the sale.

If you're trying something new, it's always a good idea to demo it first.

Later! OL J R


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## luke strawwalker (Jul 31, 2014)

FarmerCline said:


> Nope, don't have a video.


I think he means have YOU shot any video of YOUR rake at work in YOUR alfalfa?? That might help a lot for guys to understand what's going on...

Later! OL J R


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## luke strawwalker (Jul 31, 2014)

glasswrongsize said:


> I figured so; I was hesitant to even bring it up as I was sure you had tried that and hated to state the obvious. I think each of us are grasping at straws trying to help you make it work. If it is THAT frustrating for us to try to figure out the rake, I can only imagine how frustrating it is for you.
> 
> Mark


What about tongue height?? Have you measured it??

With things like tilt, they can be extremely sensitive to tongue height (drawbar height). If the drawbar is too low, the thing can be tilted all the way back on the adjuster and STILL be tilted too far forward...

You've probably looked at that too, but I thought I'd throw it out there for consideration... Just in case.

Best of luck and hope you don't take it in the shorts too badly on it.

Later! OL J R


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## Gearclash (Nov 25, 2010)

luke strawwalker said:


> I think he means have YOU shot any video of YOUR rake at work in YOUR alfalfa?? That might help a lot for guys to understand what's going on...
> 
> Later! OL J R


I have can well imagine what is going on, having raked light alfalfa that was still in swaths with a twin basket bar rake. The basic problems is that the hay doesn't unroll like it should when it exits the baskets. I offered some advice earlier in this thread about adjusting a twin rake, but when the realization that FarmerCline was raking teddered alfalfa set into my slow brain, I agreed the job just won't work well.


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## Gearclash (Nov 25, 2010)

Here is a picture of a poorly formed windrow from a twin basket rake.








And here is a properly formed windrow.








Both pictures were taken in alfalfa, different fields. The key problem in the first picture is that the rake was traveling too slow. The hay may have been wetter than ideal as well. The problem with teddered alfalfa is that the entire rake is rolling the hay, so there is little hope for the hay to unroll at the exit of the baskets, unless the rake is traveling quite fast and the hay is quite dry, both no no's for raking alfalfa. Someday I need to upload some video I have of this rake to youtube.


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## luke strawwalker (Jul 31, 2014)

Gearclash said:


> Here is a picture of a poorly formed windrow from a twin basket rake.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Yeah, see a lot of the first pic around here... and a lot of "saddleback" bales sitting by the road for sale-- one joker wants $50 a roll for 2 year old saddleback bales that are starting to collapse on themselves from water intrusion/rot. I wouldn't give him $10 a bale for that stuff!

I don't know much about alfalfa, being on the Gulf Coast; we do mainly grass hay and sometimes haygrazer (sorghum/sudan). Did soybean hay a time or two as well.

I'll take your word for it that you've been up and back with this thing and it just won't do the job you need. Kinda rare but it DOES happen-- but I'm just used to seeing a lot of guys doing it "wrong" or improperly operating or setting stuff up and then complaining that the machine is junk or being upset and surprised when it's worn out or broken too fast/too much.

Here's hoping that you don't take too much of a bath on the thing and that you get something that will work well for you with tedded alfalfa...

Best of luck! OL J R


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## Hank- in or (Feb 12, 2009)

Is the 1st pic of the windrow behind the Twinstar? What was your ground speed?

I run 2 sets of the Twinstar 2030G2's which are the 7 bar baskets and I also have all 3 sets of teeth in them. We will get a windrow that is shaped like the top pic when running too slow or the hay is too wet as you mentioned (3 to 4 mph) or the baskets are not close enough on the back. We run the rakes with the basket angle as flat as they will go and the baskets about 1 ft apart at 6mph. Your baskets may well be running to slow as well.


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## 8350HiTech (Jul 26, 2013)

Hank and Luke, you're talking to Gearclash but it isn't his rake.


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## Hank- in or (Feb 12, 2009)

8350HiTech said:


> Hank and Luke, you're talking to Gearclash but it isn't his rake.


I see that now, guess I lost track of who started the thread.


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## Gearclash (Nov 25, 2010)

Hank- in or said:


> Is the 1st pic of the windrow behind the Twinstar? What was your ground speed?
> 
> I run 2 sets of the Twinstar 2030G2's which are the 7 bar baskets and I also have all 3 sets of teeth in them. We will get a windrow that is shaped like the top pic when running too slow or the hay is too wet as you mentioned (3 to 4 mph) or the baskets are not close enough on the back. We run the rakes with the basket angle as flat as they will go and the baskets about 1 ft apart at 6mph. Your baskets may well be running to slow as well.


Sorry for causing confusion, FarmerCline has the Twinstar rake that isn't working to his satisfaction, I posted some pictures of our Vermeer 2300 in an effort to explain to other what can be done wrong with a twin bar rake.


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## Jay in WA (Mar 21, 2015)

Some guys like the windrow in the top picture because they think the hay can dry faster. I don't because if I have to turn the double row that style of row cant be properly turned.

From my experience roping is caused by raking hay that's too wet. Just like Hank I have two sets of 7 bar 2030 Twinstar rakes with the 3rd set of teeth. I run the baskets as close together as I can. I want the tallest narrowest windrow I can make. Dew comes into them slower and easier to turn if I have to.


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## Hay diddle diddle (Nov 17, 2017)

Old Allen ran behind a little 240 massey. Ground speed was dictated by gearing and horsepower (lack of). The Berrima i use behind a 100hp case now. Ground speed is an easy 12kph, windrow width is always set for full width (or more) of chamber in baler (be that square or round). Allen use to leave 2 rows side by side. New rake does not. I would try setting the rear of the baskets higher and also increasing basket speed ( should be at least 95rpm)


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