# Big & cheap HP for 3x4?



## JD3430 (Jan 1, 2012)

I have decided to go 3x4 square baler. I will continue to make round bales, too. I can make $10/per ton more for 3x4 squares over rounds according to all my mulch hay buyers. At 5-600 tons that's another 5-6k per year. Plus the hassle of stacking on trailer and shipping becomes almost easy compared to rounds. Will make another 100 tons of rounds for my COW guys.

I think I have located a few Hesston and MF 3x4's as candidates.

On to what will pull it: JCB could pull big square, but I will leave JCB as tractor for Pottinger front mower and for manure spreader. JCB will also pull CX-20 pasture cutter. It could also pull the big square baler when prospective big tractor breaks down-which Im sure it will.

I have to be cheap as a skin flint on this so here's what I've found so far: I cant realistically do this for over $20K.

1. http://www.tractorhouse.com/listings/farm-equipment/for-sale/10677503/2001-massey-ferguson-8250

I can buy it and get it shipped to port of Baltimore for $20k, but is it enough HP?

2. http://www.tractorhouse.com/listings/farm-equipment/for-sale/9767095/2004-challenger-mt655

Have to get more info from seller on exact extent of damage and hours.

3. Also have a bunch of Boxcar Magnums to chose from in the 25K range with 6-7K hours.

I just started scratching the surface.

What do you think of the 2 tractors I found? Would the 8250 be enough at only 165PTO HP? Is a Valmet 7.4L diesel a good one?

Challenger is plenty of power, but needs hood and rear outside duals. Is a Sisu 8.4L diesel a good one?


----------



## Lewis Ranch (Jul 15, 2013)

Lots of folks on here are gonna shoot you down on this but I've been looking at the same thing. Old cheap horsepower can be reliable for as much use it will get baling hay less than 100hrs a year. I have no idea on your two listed tractors but I've looked at older articulating 4wd tractors with pto because they can be had cheap and the bigger tires will handle the soft ground better. No help here but good luck


----------



## carcajou (Jan 28, 2011)

I'm thinking the same way. Going to try a Case Steiger 9250 on a 3x4 next season. More power and weight for the hills and i can get more use out of the tractor.


----------



## Rodney R (Jun 11, 2008)

I've seen a few pics with guys pulling a big baler with a bend in the middle tractor. If that's all a guy is going to do with it, that might be the way to go, especially on hills/soft ground. You really wouldn't need the duals.

Rodney


----------



## MFSuper90 (Jun 26, 2015)

I've seen guys running a lot of 7130's and 40's Magnums on the big squares. Might be a bit out of your price range but they're reliable and versatile


----------



## OhioHay (Jun 4, 2008)

Know a guy that runs a john deere 8650 articulate on a big square and loves it. Says he can go on any hill without any worries. We run a weighted down John Deere 4640 on a 3 x 3 on big hills without a problem, but wouldn't want to try it on a 3 x 4.


----------



## CowboyRam (Dec 13, 2015)

I am pulling a 3x4 with MF2745. seems to pull it just fine; I am on fairly flat ground. I don't know what it would do if I added an accumulator, or if I was on hilly ground.


----------



## mlappin (Jun 25, 2009)

I'd be afraid of that Challenger if the dealer admits it's rough.

Valmet is a hell of a engine though, the one in our MF seems to be plenty torquey.

You want cheap HP look at a ole White 2-135, dual it up and go, factory claimed 135hp, about every one thats been hooked to a dyno around here has topped 200hp, the Continentals in em can be thirsty at 200hp though.

Could always get a White 4-210 as well, a lot of parts like hydraulics, PTO, etc are interchangeable with the 2 wheel drive and FWA versions.

18 speeds forward, 6 reverse, built in park right in the gear selector so no chances of the "help" baking the parking brake. 3208 Cat, some hate em, we have four 3208's on the farm now and only ever had one chuck its guts, three in tractors and one in a grain truck, cheap and plentiful replacements abound. Bought a old Ford yard tractor for $900, sold the steering box, transmission, rear axle and fifth wheel, then hauled the rest in for scrap, kept the turbocharged 3208 out of it. Will yank the turbo and turn it down to 210hp, turbocharged blocks have cranks with larger mains and extra webbing in em.


----------



## mlappin (Jun 25, 2009)

Gave it a bit more thought, if the dealer admits its "rough" in all actuality it's a piece of shit.


----------



## deerezilla (Nov 27, 2009)

I would like to add to much power not allways better I have a krone 1290 high speed 3/4 baler I'm numbing it with a Jd 8370r it's to much power I'm twisting the pto splines on the baler.
160 hp tractor will run a 3/4 baler all day long. If it was me I would look for a jd4850 or 4650


----------



## endrow (Dec 15, 2011)

Here a plus for us when looking for cheap HP IRON. Right nearby me there's a guy that specializes in working on Case IH or IH tractors he is reasonable and stocks a good line of used or aftermarket parts


----------



## carcajou (Jan 28, 2011)

deerezilla said:


> I would like to add to much power not allways better I have a krone 1290 high speed 3/4 baler I'm numbing it with a Jd 8370r it's to much power I'm twisting the pto splines on the baler.
> 160 hp tractor will run a 3/4 baler all day long. If it was me I would look for a jd4850 or 4650


Lol yeah 360 pto hp might be a little bit of overkill. Those are expensive hrs pulling a baler.


----------



## Teslan (Aug 20, 2011)

A guy around here used to run a Hesston 4x4 baler with An International 3588. http://www.tractorhouse.com/listings/farm-equipment/for-sale/10745233/international-3588


----------



## deerezilla (Nov 27, 2009)

I use it because it has ifs and ivt. It might be expensive hrs but I have to have it to do all the tillage so I would rather see it run than sit in the barn.


----------



## bbos2 (Mar 20, 2015)

I ran a dueled up 4640 with 3x3 on hills and that's all it wanted. Guys kinda chuckled at me for running duels but I didn't want it any other way for soft ground and steep hills. Seems more guys are leaving the duels on now. I have seen 4 wheelers on big balers. They can be had reasonable . id leave all the tires on and run.

I broke down once with the 4640 and dad let me run pull the 3x3 with the 8295R dueled up front and back. in my experience the baler ran way smoother. Plugged less and missed less knots. Maybe it was all my imagination because I was in a tractor that was 25 years newer


----------



## Teslan (Aug 20, 2011)

bbos2 said:


> I ran a dueled up 4640 with 3x3 on hills and that's all it wanted. Guys kinda chuckled at me for running duels but I didn't want it any other way for soft ground and steep hills. Seems more guys are leaving the duels on now. I have seen 4 wheelers on big balers. They can be had reasonable . id leave all the tires on and run.
> 
> I broke down once with the 4640 and dad let me run pull the 3x3 with the 8295R dueled up front and back. in my experience the baler ran way smoother. Plugged less and missed less knots. Maybe it was all my imagination because I was in a tractor that was 25 years newer


 I ran my 3x3 all summer with my new MF 7720 and the baler plugged once. With my 98 jd 7810 it plugged much more often. Now I think this is kinda in my head also. But then you say something similar.


----------



## JD3430 (Jan 1, 2012)

Teslan said:


> A guy around here used to run a Hesston 4x4 baler with An International 3588. http://www.tractorhouse.com/listings/farm-equipment/for-sale/10745233/international-3588


Yeah, I dont think I want a snoopy. I have SOME basic needs for a tractor that looks good. lol

So I got a call from the dealer with the Challenger. MLappin nailed it- Its trashed. 9,000 hours and it starts slipping on the dyno after it hits 160HP.

I think my next tractor may be coming from Ireland, England or Canada.

Shipping isnt really that bad, but what about VAT? whats that gonna be?


----------



## Lewis Ranch (Jul 15, 2013)

I just saw on YouTube where onelomelyfarmer went and bought a couple in Europe, supposably saving quite a bit of money


----------



## PaMike (Dec 7, 2013)

JD3430 said:


> Yeah, I dont think I want a snoopy. I have SOME basic needs for a tractor that looks good. lol
> 
> So I got a call from the dealer with the Challenger. MLappin nailed it- Its trashed. 9,000 hours and it starts slipping on the dyno after it hits 160HP.
> 
> ...


Are you 100% sure you can get them imported without a problem?


----------



## JD3430 (Jan 1, 2012)

PaMike said:


> Are you 100% sure you can get them imported without a problem?


No, I am not.

Buddy of mine owns a custom roofing operation. High-end only. Slate, cedar & copper.

He bought a machine that makes custom copper roof panels out of Germany. Very big, heavy machine. Said he hired a broker and it showed up at his shop no issues. Saved thousands.


----------



## bbos2 (Mar 20, 2015)

Teslan said:


> I ran my 3x3 all summer with my new MF 7720 and the baler plugged once. With my 98 jd 7810 it plugged much more often. Now I think this is kinda in my head also. But then you say something similar.


I'm glad someone had similar experiences. As I was unsure if it mattered. I truly think more power creates less of a draw down of the motor during plunges. Rpm's stay up, and consistent. More even and constant feed into baler. Also might make knotters more efficient . just a thought but there is something to it. I definitely had less issues.


----------



## slowzuki (Mar 8, 2011)

Vat is euro for sales tax. If paperwork is done correctly stuff exported from European Union has no vat.


----------



## woodland (May 23, 2016)

I'd be suspicious of the hours on the Massey just judging by the condition of the seat and the age. Maybe the hour meter is on it's second time around? I remember a friend stopped out one day while we were grinding bales and looked at our loader tractor and said it looked kinda rough for 4,000 hours. He changed his opinion when I told him that was short a "1" in front of that.


----------



## endrow (Dec 15, 2011)

woodland said:


> I'd be suspicious of the hours on the Massey just judging by the condition of the seat and the age. Maybe the hour meter is on it's second time around? I remember a friend stopped out one day while we were grinding bales and looked at our loader tractor and said it looked kinda rough for 4,000 hours. He changed his opinion when I told him that was short a "1" in front of that.


 Got several like that an our Barn. The sky is not the limit here tractors wear out even ones that are well maintained. We still have some Ih66 series tractors here on our farm, I had a good life and lots left yet. They didn't get the used because uz they did not have good cabs. We got some 86 series tractors that are used everyday since the late seventies. Madison weight is in a dairy farm some of those tractors get used every day feeding and manure and then it's crop time again. They were parked inside well maintained but did whatever job was put in front of them. They are getting to the point they are worn out t


----------



## JD3430 (Jan 1, 2012)

woodland said:


> I'd be suspicious of the hours on the Massey just judging by the condition of the seat and the age. Maybe the hour meter is on it's second time around? I remember a friend stopped out one day while we were grinding bales and looked at our loader tractor and said it looked kinda rough for 4,000 hours. He changed his opinion when I told him that was short a "1" in front of that.


Usually newer tractors have a "10,000th" digit, don't they?


----------



## mlappin (Jun 25, 2009)

bbos2 said:


> I'm glad someone had similar experiences. As I was unsure if it mattered. I truly think more power creates less of a draw down of the motor during plunges. Rpm's stay up, and consistent. More even and constant feed into baler. Also might make knotters more efficient . just a thought but there is something to it. I definitely had less issues.


Always noticed that with our small square baler, A super 77 or 88 would run it in a pinch, the Oliver 1600 ran it better, you could really get some hay baled if you had 80-100 hp on it, but we were also dragging 250 bale thrower wagons behind it.


----------



## JD3430 (Jan 1, 2012)

woodland said:


> I'd be suspicious of the hours on the Massey just judging by the condition of the seat and the age. Maybe the hour meter is on it's second time around? I remember a friend stopped out one day while we were grinding bales and looked at our loader tractor and said it looked kinda rough for 4,000 hours. He changed his opinion when I told him that was short a "1" in front of that.


Yeh, thought same, but 260hrs per year isn't abnormal. I got more pics from dealer. Looked ok.


----------



## slvr98svt (Jan 18, 2011)

What kind of weight are we talking about tractor wise for a big square? 16-18k pounds enough?

Kind of a pipe dream but I've always loved the old Ford 9600's. Dual'ed up and weighted down with the smoke screw turned up a little bit, do you think it would run an older 3x4 on plate glass flat ground? I don't have any hills where I would be able to use a big square.


----------



## 8350HiTech (Jul 26, 2013)

slvr98svt said:


> What kind of weight are we talking about tractor wise for a big square? 16-18k pounds enough?
> 
> Kind of a pipe dream but I've always loved the old Ford 9600's. Dual'ed up and weighted down with the smoke screw turned up a little bit, do you think it would run an older 3x4 on plate glass flat ground? I don't have any hills where I would be able to use a big square.


Have a neighbor that runs a 9700 on his 590 3x3. You'd be asking a lot to go to a 3x4 but maybe not impossible.


----------



## slowzuki (Mar 8, 2011)

I like the old whites but no way I'd run a big square in hills with one. The 3 speed free wheels in low I think it is and a few of the failure modes of the over under leave you free wheeling.

Maybe a big old AC powershift like an 8070 mfwd


----------



## carcajou (Jan 28, 2011)

Massey 1100 series tractors are like that too.


----------



## JD3430 (Jan 1, 2012)

Whatever you guys do, don't look at tractors overseas. The temptation is unreal. Its like 50-70 cents on the dollar. Shipping is about the same as shipping a piece from CA to PA. Probably about $3,000-$3,500.

Most tractors have air brakes, air & hydraulic brakes for trailers. 50KPH speed, front axle suspensions and massive rubber.


----------



## Teslan (Aug 20, 2011)

JD3430 said:


> Whatever you guys do, don't look at tractors overseas. The temptation is unreal. Its like 50-70 cents on the dollar. Shipping is about the same as shipping a piece from CA to PA. Probably about $3,000-$3,500.
> 
> Most tractors have air brakes, air & hydraulic brakes for trailers. 50KPH speed, front axle suspensions and massive rubber.


 I think you need a tractor shopping European vacation


----------



## slvr98svt (Jan 18, 2011)

JD3430 said:


> Whatever you guys do, don't look at tractors overseas. The temptation is unreal. Its like 50-70 cents on the dollar. Shipping is about the same as shipping a piece from CA to PA. Probably about $3,000-$3,500.
> 
> Most tractors have air brakes, air & hydraulic brakes for trailers. 50KPH speed, front axle suspensions and massive rubber.


What sites are you using to look at these so called tractors?


----------



## JD3430 (Jan 1, 2012)

slvr98svt said:


> What sites are you using to look at these so called tractors?


"So called" tractors?
Oh believe me, they're real tractors.


----------



## OhioHay (Jun 4, 2008)

No matter what brand or model of tractor, or what country it comes from; I would spend the least possible I could on the tractor. This is so I could spend the most possible on the baler. Money well spent!


----------



## JD3430 (Jan 1, 2012)

OhioHay said:


> No matter what brand or model of tractor, or what country it comes from; I would spend the least possible I could on the tractor. This is so I could spend the most possible on the baler. Money well spent!


That's the only thing giving me pause on the 3x4. All I hear about are repairs, repairs, repairs. Now on a round baler, I've had 2 minor repairs and one big one (on board computer box). All in all, not too bad. 3x4 gives me the impression that I'll be fixing it every day. It also seems like it's more difficult to repair by oneself.


----------



## Teslan (Aug 20, 2011)

JD3430 said:


> That's the only thing giving me pause on the 3x4. All I hear about are repairs, repairs, repairs. Now on a round baler, I've had 2 minor repairs and one big one (on board computer box). All in all, not too bad. 3x4 gives me the impression that I'll be fixing it every day. It also seems like it's more difficult to repair by oneself.


If buying a used one you will probably have quite a few adjustments and repairs that will need to be made before it can kind of be trouble free. Plus your learning how the thing works. Everyone around here that I see buying a used one (mostly 4x4s) generally has a rough go of it the first field or so they try and bale. Broken bales and missed knots is what I see. I'm sure that varies depending on how used is used. I would say if you find one that hasn't been gone through by a reputable dealership or knowledgable baler repair guy to get that done before you try and bale with it. Especially depending on the bales through it.


----------



## JD3430 (Jan 1, 2012)

Teslan said:


> If buying a used one you will probably have quite a few adjustments and repairs that will need to be made before it can kind of be trouble free. Plus your learning how the thing works. Everyone around here that I see buying a used one (mostly 4x4s) generally has a rough go of it the first field or so they try and bale. Broken bales and missed knots is what I see. I'm sure that varies depending on how used is used. I would say if you find one that hasn't been gone through by a reputable dealership or knowledgable baler repair guy to get that done before you try and bale with it. Especially depending on the bales through it.


And as we all know, even a few broken bales in a miserable PITA.


----------



## Teslan (Aug 20, 2011)

JD3430 said:


> And as we all know, even a few broken bales in a miserable PITA.


I've been lucky I feel with our 3x3. We bought it new though. Man they've gone up in price since 2011. But really no problems from the start as to breaking bales or missing knots that were not user instigated problems. I agree with the thought of buying the best baler you can afford first then tractor second. At least you have your JCB you could use in a pinch.


----------



## JD3430 (Jan 1, 2012)

The JCB really has me conflicted. It has 7400 hrs on it. Feels strong. Pretty healthy. I can't decide if it's got enough life left in it to do both the cutting and the baling though. 
I'd like to get into a place where I have a tractor hooked up to one implement and it pretty much stays there. Would make life a whole lot easier. Especially when it comes to a big square baler.
Thought I was in heaven with 2 tractors. Now 4 tractors would be the goal.


----------



## Gearclash (Nov 25, 2010)

JD3430 said:


> And as we all know, even a few broken bales in a miserable PITA.


Yea, but on a 3x4 you can miss a string or 2 and still move the bale just fine. On a 2x3 we only worry about rebaling if there are at least 2 strings missing and one of them is an edge string.


----------



## OhioHay (Jun 4, 2008)

JD3430 said:


> That's the only thing giving me pause on the 3x4. All I hear about are repairs, repairs, repairs. Now on a round baler, I've had 2 minor repairs and one big one (on board computer box). All in all, not too bad. 3x4 gives me the impression that I'll be fixing it every day. It also seems like it's more difficult to repair by oneself.


Bought a used 3x3 three years ago. It had 11,000 bales on it at the time. Local Dealer actually went and found it for me. Then went completely over it before bringing it to me. Have had only minor problems. Each winter I send it back to the dealer to go completely through it. Spend a couple grand a year on it, but really minimizes down time.I spent two and a half times more on the baler than the tractor pulling it.


----------



## PaMike (Dec 7, 2013)

Also keep in mind your round baler you bought new, the square baler will be used...I wouldn't expect the same reliability of a used sq baler as a new round baler...


----------



## Bgriffin856 (Nov 13, 2013)

Magnums are bulletproof from what I hear. See alot advertised on tractorhouse with 15-18000+ hrs. Hold there value quite well

Watch some YouTube vids of farming across the pond. Might rethink importing anything from there


----------



## JD3430 (Jan 1, 2012)

Bgriffin856 said:


> Magnums are bulletproof from what I hear. See alot advertised on tractorhouse with 15-18000+ hrs. Hold there value quite well
> Watch some YouTube vids of farming across the pond. Might rethink importing anything from there


Why is that? 
I think my style of farming is more like European in that I'm driving field to field and on smaller fields. Also, most of my fields are bumpy or steep.


----------



## Gearclash (Nov 25, 2010)

Bgriffin856 said:


> Magnums are bulletproof from what I hear. See alot advertised on tractorhouse with 15-18000+ hrs. Hold there value quite well
> 
> *Watch some YouTube vids of farming across the pond. Might rethink importing anything from there*


Same thought has crossed my mind. The Euros are rather fond of pulling the snot out of their tractors with a monstrous fully mounted plow or whatever. Makes me wonder about the condition of final drives and rear axles. Thing is, the Euro tractors have some highly desirable options.


----------



## slowzuki (Mar 8, 2011)

They tend to run them to 15,000 hours like that. Ones with final drive issues become well known, not a super common problem. Lot of them never have loaders installed as farmers there tend to think that is too abusive on a tractor. Lot of telehandlers instead.



Gearclash said:


> Same thought has crossed my mind. The Euros are rather fond of pulling the snot out of their tractors with a monstrous fully mounted plow or whatever. Makes me wonder about the condition of final drives and rear axles. Thing is, the Euro tractors have some highly desirable options.


----------



## endrow (Dec 15, 2011)

slowzuki said:


> They tend to run them to 15,000 hours like that. Ones with final drive issues become well known, not a super common problem. Lot of them never have loaders installed as farmers there tend to think that is too abusive on a tractor. Lot of telehandlers instead.


 Guy about a mile-and-a-half from me, him and his kids, buy about three of them from time to time. The ones they are I always need extensive repairs but he is a super good mechanic along with his sons maybe they make out pretty good.


----------



## slowzuki (Mar 8, 2011)

They probably get them for a song. Beat tractors in europe and UK don't sell for much money.



endrow said:


> Guy about a mile-and-a-half from me, him and his kids, buy about three of them from time to time. The ones they are I always need extensive repairs but he is a super good mechanic along with his sons maybe they make out pretty good.


----------



## JD3430 (Jan 1, 2012)

endrow said:


> Guy about a mile-and-a-half from me, him and his kids, buy about three of them from time to time. The ones they are I always need extensive repairs but he is a super good mechanic along with his sons maybe they make out pretty good.


Is this HTR you speak of?


----------



## PaMike (Dec 7, 2013)

Bgriffin856 said:


> Magnums are bulletproof from what I hear. See alot advertised on tractorhouse with 15-18000+ hrs. Hold there value quite well
> 
> Watch some YouTube vids of farming across the pond. Might rethink importing anything from there


Yup, and lots of guys in Lancaster County that fix them for cheap if there is an issue. Guys can tear a powershift completely apart and rebuild it for $40/hr. These shops have aftermarket parts machined to keep costs down. I know a couple guys that actually make aftermarket parts and sell them to Hoober for their techs to use in tranny rebuilds.


----------



## Vol (Jul 5, 2009)

Saw this.

Regards, Mike

http://www.agweb.com/blog/machinery-pete/record-prices-on-northwest-iowa-farm-auction-today/


----------



## PaMike (Dec 7, 2013)

Vol said:


> Saw this.
> 
> Regards, Mike
> 
> http://www.agweb.com/blog/machinery-pete/record-prices-on-northwest-iowa-farm-auction-today/


Sounds kinda crazy until you go price new equipment and see how much the prices are going up...

On skidsteers I am selling the SAME machine I sold 3 years ago for 1 to 2k more now, and the machine is 3 years older than it was back then....


----------



## Wyo_1 (Nov 8, 2016)

Vol said:


> Saw this.
> 
> Regards, Mike
> 
> http://www.agweb.com/blog/machinery-pete/record-prices-on-northwest-iowa-farm-auction-today/


Shit I'm going to mach. Pete right now and see if I can find a 17 year old skid steer for 25k


----------



## Bgriffin856 (Nov 13, 2013)

JD3430 said:


> Why is that?
> I think my style of farming is more like European in that I'm driving field to field and on smaller fields. Also, most of my fields are bumpy or steep.


From what I've watched which is mostly silage and haymaking operations which alot of farms over there have custom operators do alot of work. Just seems they run pretty hard. Maybe I'm just too used to babying the old worn out equipment we use along cause I'd rather have money for other important things than new equipment every couple years


----------



## endrow (Dec 15, 2011)

So a pretty nice row of used balers the other day


----------



## Farmerbrown2 (Sep 25, 2018)

Zimmerman's in Bethal PA ?


----------



## PaMike (Dec 7, 2013)

farmerbrown said:


> Zimmerman's in Bethal PA ?


Looks like it to me. I bet he was there checking out the skidsteer buckets.


----------



## endrow (Dec 15, 2011)

PaMike said:


> Looks like it to me. I bet he was there checking out the skidsteer buckets.


Yep


----------



## labdwakin (Jun 21, 2016)

Farm manager keeps pushing me to get an 80-100HP skid steer... who can afford one these days?


----------



## Gearclash (Nov 25, 2010)

endrow said:


> So a pretty nice row of used balers the other day


Hey! I spy a D1000 in that line! Looks like an earlier sn.


----------



## stack em up (Mar 7, 2013)

Gearclash said:


> Hey! I spy a D1000 in that line! Looks like an earlier sn.


I saw that too!


----------



## JD3430 (Jan 1, 2012)

Buying a baler from a dealer seems like such a "set up" for a buyer. Dealer probably knows what's wrong with it. If you ask them to go through the machine, they will find 5k worth of problems. Seems like best machines to buy are the ones you can see working on the farm, not sitting in a parking lot. Of course I'm stating the obvious, but with balers it's really tough because unlike a tractor which you can start, drive, shift, etc, you can't bale hay with a used baler in a sale lot.


----------



## Teslan (Aug 20, 2011)

JD3430 said:


> Buying a baler from a dealer seems like such a "set up" for a buyer. Dealer probably knows what's wrong with it. If you ask them to go through the machine, they will find 5k worth of problems. Seems like best machines to buy are the ones you can see working on the farm, not sitting in a parking lot. Of course I'm stating the obvious, but with balers it's really tough because unlike a tractor which you can start, drive, shift, etc, you can't bale hay with a used baler in a sale lot.


I would rather buy a used piece of farm equipment from a private owner also. I would hope they would be a little more honest with me about it's condition. But maybe a private owner wouldn't be in such a disclosing mood with a dealer when they are trading it in. I know I'm not. When I traded in my JD 7810 I didn't tell the dealer about the increasing whine in two of the gear ranges. Up from just one whiny range the year before. I didn't tell them about the little bit of oil seemingly leaking from the top of the engine. I did tell them about the o rings on 2/3 hydraulic remotes (I had replaced one set and gave them the replacements I had, but hadn't put in yet). If I had chosen to sell the tractor on my own I would feel I would have to tell a potential buyer everything. I feel a dealer should check out a tractor enough before offering their trade value.

I always feel with a used baler sitting in a lot that it's sitting there used for a reason. A private sale many times is because a guy is retiring or changing their operation. Not so much because it's a used baler and doesn't work so well so it's time to sell it.

Hopefully dealers go through balers before reselling them. But really no one really knows how one works until it's baling. Not even the new ones. My baler didn't have any problems brand new, but I've heard about those whose balers have had trouble even when brand new.


----------



## Bgriffin856 (Nov 13, 2013)

Then you get people like us that if it's for sale there isn't much life left in it.....


----------



## JD3430 (Jan 1, 2012)

Teslan said:


> I would rather buy a used piece of farm equipment from a private owner also. I would hope they would be a little more honest with me about it's condition. But maybe a private owner wouldn't be in such a disclosing mood with a dealer when they are trading it in. I know I'm not. When I traded in my JD 7810 I didn't tell the dealer about the increasing whine in two of the gear ranges. Up from just one whiny range the year before. I didn't tell them about the little bit of oil seemingly leaking from the top of the engine. I did tell them about the o rings on 2/3 hydraulic remotes (I had replaced one set and gave them the replacements I had, but hadn't put in yet). If I had chosen to sell the tractor on my own I would feel I would have to tell a potential buyer everything. I feel a dealer should check out a tractor enough before offering their trade value.
> 
> I always feel with a used baler sitting in a lot that it's sitting there used for a reason. A private sale many times is because a guy is retiring or changing their operation. Not so much because it's a used baler and doesn't work so well so it's time to sell it.
> 
> Hopefully dealers go through balers before reselling them. But really no one really knows how one works until it's baling. Not even the new ones. My baler didn't have any problems brand new, but I've heard about those whose balers have had trouble even when brand new.


Right its not like theres some freshly raked hay out back and you can hook a tractor to it and make a dozen bales. like a tractor you can start up and run it around for a while and make sure its pretty much OK. .

What I'd like is to find a dealer that offers a baler that you could use a while with some kind of warranty that it will make straight, honest bales or they come take it back. Who wants that kind of headache when you drop the pickup and she wont bale?

When I bought my JCB last winter, Deere Country gave me a 1 year power train warranty on it. I thought that was a great way to boost confidence in buying a 7000 hour used tractor.


----------



## endrow (Dec 15, 2011)

In Lancaster Farming newspaper


----------



## JD3430 (Jan 1, 2012)

Already have the JCB
Baker looks nice.


----------



## stack em up (Mar 7, 2013)

The baler is only 3x3 though. You want a 2270 XD. It's Masseys Xtra Density line with a longer bale chute, heavier load arms, and a bunch of other little nuances to make a tighter bale. Some places sell their own version of an XD, but the load arms are where they lack. At service school a couple years ago, they showed arms someone tried making super dense bales with, they were bent and actually compressed a little. .


----------



## JD3430 (Jan 1, 2012)

I wonder how my JCB would handle, and how long it would last in front of a 3x4....


----------



## stack em up (Mar 7, 2013)

JD3430 said:


> I wonder how my JCB would handle, and how long it would last in front of a 3x4....


Refresh my gray matter, what Fasttrac do you have? I don't think hp is going to be your biggest concern as much as weight is.

Had a customer pulling a 7433 Hesston with a 4430 Deere. His reply to me when I asked how it worked, he said, "it works..... kinda"


----------



## JD3430 (Jan 1, 2012)

Its a 185-65

188HP, but turned up a bit. Probably closer to 200HP and probably 185 at the PTO (5.9L turbo/intercooled Cummin(g)s)

Weighs 14,500 + 1500lb rack of weights and I have the whole front hitch & PTO so my guess is it weighs 16,500.

Also has 4 wheel disc brakes, so stopping shouldnt be any problem. It was made to pull heavy wagons, has air & hydraulic brakes to rear, but I dont think the balers Im looking at would have brakes, right?


----------



## stack em up (Mar 7, 2013)

No, unless it's an option since I left the dealership. I would think you'd be on the lower end of hp, but unless you have hills, you'd be alright.


----------



## PaMike (Dec 7, 2013)

endrow said:


> In Lancaster Farming newspaper


I saw that same ad the last couple of weeks and thought the same thing...


----------



## endrow (Dec 15, 2011)

AC http://www.agweb.com/article/petes-pick-of-the-week-1982-allis-chalmers-8070-naa-greg-peterson/


----------



## JD3430 (Jan 1, 2012)

Wow look at the old girl!


----------



## slowzuki (Mar 8, 2011)

A little prettier than my 7010. These ac's are cheap I hope I never find out why with mine!


----------



## JD3430 (Jan 1, 2012)

I've seen a lot of them with blown motors.
We're the motors junk?
Doesn't appear to have as much HP as my JCB either


----------



## stack em up (Mar 7, 2013)

JD3430 said:


> I've seen a lot of them with blown motors.
> We're the motors junk?
> Doesn't appear to have as much HP as my JCB either


The 426 was a great engine, however, the rpm they cranked it to in the 7080 and the 8070 did not bode well for longevity. And they also used a counter balanced crank that was not shot peened so the early days a lot of the cranks broke the nose off.


----------



## slowzuki (Mar 8, 2011)

From what I've seen its pretty easy to put an 8.3 Cummins in them as long as you don't go crazy with the hp and tear the thing up.


----------



## endrow (Dec 15, 2011)

stack em up said:


> The 426 was a great engine, however, the rpm they cranked it to in the 7080 and the 8070 did not bode well for longevity. And they also used a counter balanced crank that was not shot peened so the early days a lot of the cranks broke the nose off.


 There was some of othose in the neighborhood and L Gleaners. I would hear them screaming all day long and Blowin Smoke is black as coal. I ask guys if they turned them up and they said nope they roll coal from the factory


----------



## 2270XD (Jun 5, 2017)

7130 on two 2270XD balers. We run diamond tread plate in our chambers and make 1000 lb dry (10%) straw bale at exactly 8 feet. Those old magnums are good rigs.


----------



## JD3430 (Jan 1, 2012)

Yeah that's what I was told to buy, but I didn't listen. Haha. 
One of my neighbors told me a local BTO with a boxcar and a NH 3x4 is retiring and probably going to offer me his equipment and his ground. Sounds like fantasy. That will probably be a nice day for me, but I'd doubt it will ever happen.
Around here, if you're not a "millionaire farmer" and you make big squares, you run a boxcar magnum. 
If you run a round baler, you're probably whipping it around with a 100-135hp Kubby.


----------



## mlappin (Jun 25, 2009)

endrow said:


> There was some of othose in the neighborhood and L Gleaners. I would hear them screaming all day long and Blowin Smoke is black as coal. I ask guys if they turned them up and they said nope they roll coal from the factory


We had a 5.9 in our little MF 8560 rotary, thing would eat beans all day long and just roll the coal, replaced injectors and pump, told em wanted the pump set at factory, still ate beans all day long and rolled coal as well.


----------

