# Grain Sorghum/Milo



## FarmerCline

I have decided to plant some grain sorghum instead of double crop beans. I'm hoping that between our usual summer drought and the damage that deer do to soybeans that the grain sorghum might work better on most of my ground. This is going to be my first time growing it.

I'm going to be no tilling it with a 1590 JD drill. I'm trying to decide if I should plant it on 7.5 inch rows or tape off every other tube and plant on 15 inch rows. Which would be the better?

Should I apply all the nitrogen broadcast at planting or do a split application with part at planting and come back and top dress with liquid nitrogen? I have been told I need 80-100 units of N.


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## luke strawwalker

I've seen a lot of drilled sorghum in various places around the country-- it never seems to do as well as sorghum planted in rows. If I had the option of planting in 30 inch rows that's what I'd do. I wouldn't plant it on 7.5 inch rows unless I was planning on baling it instead of making a grain crop. Covering every other drill meter and planting in 15 inch spacings would DEFINITELY be better than 7.5's. If it's wet, you can make a crop on narrow rows, but if it's dry, it just seems to compete against itself and doesn't make. Wider rows prevent that. We used to grow sorghum on 40 inch rows (all our equipment was 40 inch for cotton) and even in the driest years it made SOMETHING... sorghum is drought-tolerant but not drought-PROOF... I saw a lot of fields in Arkansas and Missouri a couple years ago in drought that were drilled on 7.5-10 inch rows that were completely blank-- no heads at all, or only headed out on the low ground. ZERO yield on drier ground.

Fertilize it like corn, basically. Loves nitrogen. If you're going to drill it, or go 15 inch rows, I'd just put down all the N now and plant. You're gonna have a heck of a time trying to get back in there without flattening out a bunch trying to put N on later in narrow spacings. On 30-40 inch rows, IMHO it's better to split-apply to get the best bang for yer buck on the nitrogen; we used to put half on pre-plant and the other half sidedressed at layby.

If you're double-cropping, be sure you get a quick-enough maturing variety so you don't get caught by frost, but I'm sure you know that anyway...

Later! OL J R


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## luke strawwalker

https://www.pioneer.com/home/site/us/agronomy/library/grain-sorghum-planting-rate-considerations/

http://texassorghum.org/narrow-row-grain-sorghum-increase-the-seeding-rate-probably-not.html

http://www.hindawi.com/journals/ija/2012/238634/

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=14&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=0ahUKEwjvwsb-0b7NAhWJeCYKHVylBdk4ChAWCC0wAw&url=https%3A%2F%2Fgrdc.com.au%2Fuploads%2Fdocuments%2F2010ASGCPowerPointPresentationsPDF%2FSerafin_RowDirection_slides.pdf&usg=AFQjCNFw9vKFVjj6IKcRce-nnUunp8HZ9g&sig2=Cdh48vu77zAFPzYKakH1Qg&bvm=bv.125221236,d.eWE

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=13&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=0ahUKEwjvwsb-0b7NAhWJeCYKHVylBdk4ChAWCCcwAg&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.aces.edu%2Fpubs%2Fdocs%2FA%2FANR-0502%2FANR-0502.pdf&usg=AFQjCNFpPf2vpCNk2Jcwk84bf9jlWLnXMA&sig2=7UQbuwxNoHkUkhXn4RAZxg&bvm=bv.125221236,d.eWE

http://www.noble.org/ag/soils/grainsorghum/

http://www.aganytime.com/Sorghum/Pages/Article.aspx?article=813

http://www.arkansas-crops.com/2015/03/02/getting-grain-sorghum/

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=17&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=0ahUKEwjvwsb-0b7NAhWJeCYKHVylBdk4ChAWCEEwBg&url=http%3A%2F%2Futcrops.com%2Fsorghum%2Fsorghum_images%2FMidsouthGrainSorghumProd.pdf&usg=AFQjCNFpciMpLP47XUskxyHKHJB147tt_A&sig2=lqjBsmm_G3S8keo_IQK6Rw&bvm=bv.125221236,d.eWE

https://www.google.com/?gws_rd=ssl#q=grain+sorghum+row+spacing&start=10

There's some info for ya...

We used to shoot for about an 80,000 population.

later! OL J R


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## Tx Jim

I hope you do get invaded with Sugar Cane Aphids similar to Texas.


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## Vol

Tx Jim said:


> I hope you do get invaded with Sugar Cane Aphids similar to Texas.


Why is that Jim?

Regards, Mike


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## Vol

http://www.noble.org/ag/soils/grainsorghum/

Regards, Mike

Some folks are going to 20" rows for the better weed and grass control...or 22.5" rows in your drills case. I plant in 30" rows with a planter....I can control the broadleaves OK with 2-4d, but the grasses can be a real pain....especially Giant Foxtail....that is why the 20" rows.


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## Tx Jim

Vol said:


> Why is that Jim?
> 
> Regards, Mike


lubbock.tamu.edu/files/2015/05/SCA-Management-Guide.pdf


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## Colby

Tx Jim said:


> I hope you do get invaded with Sugar Cane Aphids similar to Texas.


I believe he meant do not get invaded


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## FarmerCline

I don't have a planter so it is going to have to be drilled. The seed rep is who suggested that I tape off every other row to have 15 inch rows......the reason he suggest though is because he didn't think I could get the drill set low enough to plant 5 pounds on 7.5 inches. I looked at my drill chart and with a half speed sprocket I could get to about 7 pounds on 7.5. So I guess I will plant on 15 inches unless I need to go even wider to 22.5?

I ordered seed treated with concept so I can spray dual magnum preplant for grasses.....not sure how long of a residual control it has though. I'm kind of concerned I may have a problem with volunteer small grain(oats).


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## Vol

Tx Jim said:


> lubbock.tamu.edu/files/2015/05/SCA-Management-Guide.pdf


Yep, know about the aphids, but could not figure out why you hoped that he WOULD get invaded with them....but I am assuming that Colby is correct in that you made a typo and left out a keyword in "not".

Regards, Mike


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## luke strawwalker

FarmerCline said:


> I don't have a planter so it is going to have to be drilled. The seed rep is who suggested that I tape off every other row to have 15 inch rows......the reason he suggest though is because he didn't think I could get the drill set low enough to plant 5 pounds on 7.5 inches. I looked at my drill chart and with a half speed sprocket I could get to about 7 pounds on 7.5. So I guess I will plant on 15 inches unless I need to go even wider to 22.5?
> 
> I ordered seed treated with concept so I can spray dual magnum preplant for grasses.....not sure how long of a residual control it has though. I'm kind of concerned I may have a problem with volunteer small grain(oats).


I dunno. Not sure. All we ever used was Atrazine broadcast right behind the planter. We'd use a rope wick applicator to smear on 33% roundup solution for any johsongrass escapes once they were taller than the crop (which didn't take long). Cultivated for everything else.

I'd check with your agronomist and see what they recommend in your area for weed control. BIL uses "Sure Start" on corn but not sure if that can be used on sorghum (many corn herbicides are also used on sorghum, but not all-- why you have to check). Sorghum hasn't been a 'big money crop' and so not as many things "labeled" for it as corn.

Hmmm... 5 lbs per acre... we used to plant about 8 lbs/acre on 40 inch rows, as I recall. Course once I installed Kinze meters on the old 7100 Deere planter we bought and ditched the plate bottom hoppers and plates, we went by population-- Kinze brush meters will plant sorghum like a sewing machine (and cotton and soybeans... even heard of guys using them to plant wheat...)

I think I'd start with the 15 inch spacing by blocking off every other cup. Especially if yall have been having dry weather. Maybe experiment a little and pull the tape off the blocked meters on the last pass or two just to see what it does.

Don't know much about the aphids-- we didn't have them when I was still row-cropping sorghum. Biggest problem we had to deal with was sorghum midge (especially if there was johnsongrass nearby, which acts as a host plant for it-- they're TINY orange flies that lay eggs in the sorghum blooms on the kernels then hatch and hollow out the kernels. The other problem was head worms or web worms, but I never personally had any problems with them, though Dad did when I was a kid. When I had a scout checking our cotton, she went nuts one year telling me to spray Furadan for aphids in cotton under that special Section 8 exemption or whatever, but when I read how bad Furadan was, I decided it wasn't worth the risk (or expense, frankly, because the aphid outbreak was mostly a result of the prolonged dry weather we were having at the time-- the same dry weather that was threatening to make for a very lousy crop anyway, so why pour more money into a lousy crop just to control aphids that thrive and reproduce rapidly in hot dry weather? Their fast reproduction means they rebound quickly after spraying, and spraying generally kills off the beneficial insects that feed on them, which is IMHO the best control method anyway. I waited another week or two and when it FINALLY rained, the hot, wet weather caused the aphid population to crash in a matter of days (they're highly susceptible to pathogens like bacteria and fungi killing them in wet weather, spread by raindrops from aphid to aphid, causing population crashes). The beneficials cleaned up the rest to non-damaging levels and kept them that way, and we still made a decent crop without having to make an expensive spray application of something that will turn you toe up if you weren't careful...

Later and good luck! OL J R


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## Tx Jim

Colby said:


> I believe he meant do not get invaded


Thanks Colby YES I meant not invaded!! Danged OLD Timers or poor proof reading.


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## TJH

We used Dual when we were growing Milo, it will give you very good control until a canopy forms. It kind'a looses it punch later in the season.


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## vhaby

It is apparent that you have done your research on grain sorghum in preparation for planting. Concept II was developed to biologically protect grain sorghum injury when Dual Magnum is used for weed control. Will DM control grasses and broadleaf weeds? If it will not control broadleaf weeds and you need to spray them with 2,4-D, or need to cultivate or spray for insects, you will need wider rows to accommodate tractor tires or have pesticides applied by air if they are labeled for this method.

Going waaay back when I was a teenager, we used to lose the first 50 feet or so in from the fence, all around the field, to deer grazing on the grain sorghum heads in SW Texas

Good Luck with your new venture. Let us know how grain sorghum works out for you.

Vincent


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## FarmerCline

vhaby said:


> It is apparent that you have done your research on grain sorghum in preparation for planting. Concept II was developed to biologically protect grain sorghum injury when Dual Magnum is used for weed control. Will DM control grasses and broadleaf weeds? If it will not control broadleaf weeds and you need to spray them with 2,4-D, or need to cultivate or spray for insects, you will need wider rows to accommodate tractor tires or have pesticides applied by air if they are labeled for this method.
> Going waaay back when I was a teenager, we used to lose the first 50 feet or so in from the fence, all around the field, to deer grazing on the grain sorghum heads in SW Texas
> Good Luck with your new venture. Let us know how grain sorghum works out for you.
> 
> Vincent


 My understanding is that the dual magnum is better on grasses but also works on small seeded broad leafs like pigweed as well. If I have a broadleaf problem I will have to come back and spray 2,4d or dicamba. I can't use atrazine because of rotation restrictions.

If I have to spray for broadleafs or insects or I decide make a top dress of N instead of applying it all at planting I will end up driving over part of the crop but that wouldn't be any different than soybeans since I use a drill to plant them as most others around here do as well. Would the wheel tracks amount to more damage in grain sorghum than it does in soybeans?

I have my fingers crossed that the deer won't do too much damage......it can't be any worse than soybeans. My understanding is that the deer only like the grain on the milo and not the plant while on soybeans they start eating them as soon as they break through the ground so maybe that they won't have time to do as much damage to the milo.


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## Vol

FarmerCline said:


> Would the wheel tracks amount to more damage in grain sorghum than it does in soybeans?
> 
> I have my fingers crossed that the deer won't do too much damage......it can't be any worse than soybeans. My understanding is that the deer only like the grain on the milo and not the plant while on soybeans they start eating them as soon as they break through the ground so maybe that they won't have time to do as much damage to the milo.


Milo will stand back up in the early stages of growth....your right about deer and grain heads....they don't bother them much until they get out of the dough stage and the seed sets.

Regards, Mike


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## FarmerCline

Well after raining almost every day for the past 10 days it looks like it finally going to be dry enough to plant the milo tomorrow or Monday. I'm worried though that it might be too late to plant it now so it will mature before frost. I was advised to get it planted by the first few days of July or I might need a shorter season variety. My seed salesman is out of town on vacation so I can't get his input until middle of the week and then it would take a few more days to get a different variety of seed.

The variety I have says its 70 days until bloom but doesn't say how many days until the grain is mature. How long does it take for the grain to mature after bloom? I'm trying to figure out if it will mature by the last week of October when we typically will have our first frost.


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## Vol

It would be very close Hayden.....milo practically stops growing when temps get below the low sixties.

Regards, Mike

https://www.pioneer.com/home/site/us/agronomy/grain-sorghum-management#PlantingInformation


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## FarmerCline

Vol said:


> It would be very close Hayden.....milo practically stops growing when temps get below the low sixties.
> 
> Regards, Mike
> 
> https://www.pioneer.com/home/site/us/agronomy/grain-sorghum-management#PlantingInformation


 That's what I was afraid of......when I have grown sorghum/sudan for hay it grows well up until about the first of October but then hardly grows between then and the first frost due to the cool nights. I will have to calculate how many growing degree days I would have.

Might be better off exchanging the milo seed for soybeans on Monday......I have planted soybeans as late as July 9th and still had time for them to mature before frost......only by about a week though. Really wanted to give milo a try though but can't afford losing it to frost.


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