# Customer relations



## kfarm_EC_IL

I've had good growth in our hay business this year. However as I reflect over the year I'm still searching for ways to handle the vast variety of customers.

One example is payment. Have one baling customer who hasn't paid and is in the feed business. Don't see him paying. Another always wanting us to hold checks. how do you deal with payment but not run off customers? I don't care for pushy salesmen and not wanting payment for the pto is put in gear. I would like to get paid.

How about every buyer wants a different type of bale. heavy, lite, long, short, pretty, ugly, etc. What do you shoot for A particular feed quality or type of customer?

Also more an more customers are not rural. Call at all times of the day and night. Got a call in church...why I had the cell phone with me I don't know. Calls on the combine etc. I like the idea on this forum about having set Saturday hours and may try that.

How do you guys go about bringing in new business? Advertise? I know word of mouth is the best and has worked for us so far. But the ads seem to work, maybe to good.

Thanks for the comments, I have a few more things that maybe you maybe will hit with your responses.


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## swmnhay

I NEED TO BE PAID FOR LAST CUTTING BEFORE I CAN BALE THE NEXT.If they need it baled they will come up with the money.If they can't you will just be owed more money.Have one guy thats always hard to get money from that I went to doing on shares.(I'm actually getting more $ for my work)


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## BCFENCE

Ive got to honest, You cant do it for free, If he doesnt pay the first time dont go back make him pay for the first before you bring any more, Dont keep supporting a money losing cause, you could sale to someone for half price before you sale to a cheap skate, As far as advertisment a good product and good PR will keep you in business, Just my two cents. THOMAS


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## kfarm_EC_IL

I agree. What do you use as good PR?


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## BCFENCE

I allways try to be on time and deliver what i say is there , If i have to take a customer 10 or 20 bales to get by for free delivery to get a good customer in the long run and most of the time it pays off well. Just take that extra step and go out of your way, people really appreciate it and also pays big dividens in the long run . Word of mouth is your best advertisment also , just be honest and sale a product you would want to buy and youll be fine. 
THOMAS


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## kfarm_EC_IL

Exactly, If I wouldn't feed it, I shouldn't expect anyone else to buy it either. I have been using local free deilevery. It is to a small race track that i'm hoping to get into.

How do you deal with repeat customers and holding hay? I haven't so far but maybe I should. I seem to get a lot of pricing calls...Well can you hold that for me until I pick it up. Which is only if they can't find it cheap elsewhere. Where does a person draw the line? We are still growing this part of the farm.
Mark


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## Wrenchbender

I'll second what the others have said.

Represent your hay to the best of your ability. Getting to know your customers takes some time. You can't always make perfect hay, it will get rained on once and a while. I have found there is a customer for all types of hay. Some want only top quality and will pay for it, others only care about price, some will feed just about anything. Just be honest and ask them what they are looking for.

Treating people right will give you a good reputation. Last year's short crop and high price proved that for me. I had people calling that had hay they thought was coming only too find out it had been sold to someone else. I told my regulars that I needed to raise the price because of the shortage but didn't hold them up. I told the new people that called I needed to wait and make sure I had enough for my regulars, then I would call them back. I gained a few new regulars that are good customers.

I've been lucky in not having much payment troubles. Only had to repossess hay one time, they wanted load the barn in the summer for a better price and then wanted to pay a little at a time. It got up in the winter and they still owed a good chunk. We showed up one day to take back what was left before it was all fed. They came up with the money, only had to bring about a pickup load home.

Just be fair and honest, treat people like you want to be treated and you'll get along OK. Good luck, WB!


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## swmnhay

I hold hay for regular customers all the time,deliver so much every couple weeks.I like it.Spreads out my work delivering and cash flow.As far as holding hay for someone that is just pricing if they don't call back in a couple weeks they probably won't.


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## PHD

My full time job is a collections officer at a bank; my advice firstly is to explain to the customer when payment is expected before you do the job. Secondly, if timely payment is not made ask for the payment-don't be bashful. (there must be a financial penalty to make them a believer.) And thirdly, if you think someone is trying to stick you, don't be afraid to engage the services of an attorney (depending on amount owed to you of course). 
We have a custom operator in the valley I work who is owed probably 100k-does great timely work-has had loan pmt issues for three months because of. You simply can't allow somebody to ride the trade on you. You are not their financial institution or lender. In addition the more time you have exposed on your recieables means more inerest expense to you as well as more risk exposure to potential bankrupcies where you lose it all


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## chetlenox

kFarm,

Maybe I'm too new (2 years) and small of an operation (sell 1500-2000 bales/year as a part-time gig) to really have that good of advice, but you asked...

1) Payment - I'll be honest, I ask for cash or check up-front before I deliver or load hay onto somebodies trailer. My only exception is my half-dozen or so immediate neighbors who I've sold to several times, for them I'm happy to deliver and take payment whenever they get a chance. But those are folks that I'm friends with, have had dinner at their house, that sorta thing.

2) Type of hay - Oh, I just bale the standard 50-60 lb Coastal Bermuda bale, standard length. All my customers are horse folks that due plenty of hand-handling, so they all generally want the same bale (dense and big enough to get their money's worth, but not so big as to be unwieldy).

3) Advertising - I live on a county-road and put a sign out, that gets 50% of my customers. Another 30% from my craigslist postings. Probably 20% or so word-of-mouth, although that number seems to be growing.

4) General customer service - I really think it's important to give folks good customer service (friendly approach, open to coming at all reasonable hours, help load and unload). I live relatively close to an urban area, so folks around here seem to really value convenience. What I mean by that is that they want to call, confirm I'm there, and show up in 10 minutes with a trailer and have me help them load it. I also have several customers who only buy hay 5-10 bales at a time. I've been a bit surprised, but even when I offer discounts for picking hay up off the field after I bale (so I don't have to put it in my barn), I just don't get that many takers. But then they'll show up a week later and buy the same stuff for $1/bale more out of my barn. I think many folks want the convenience more than the discount. Maybe that will change a bit with the crummy economy.

I'll be honest, I don't mind the value folks put on customer service. Since I'm just learning the business myself, I've done a lot of reading on hay quality and regularly test my soil and hay (because if I didn't, I wouldn't have any idea what I was doing). When I discuss the numbers with folks, many simply glaze over a bit and say, "Sounds great, I'm sure it's good stuff." but don't seem to care too much. I'm happy to be friendly, help load, and be flexible on times. It seem to work OK. I price my hay to about what other folks around here are pricing and it seems to sell out pretty quick.

Anyway, that's my thoughts.

Chet.


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## kfarm_EC_IL

Thanks everyone for the replies! Lot to think over. Does help to get other views to look at.
Mark


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## OhioHay

These are all good questions and good comments. I love to hear the differences and similarities and trying to learn from them.

Let's start with advertising. When we started the hay business 19 years ago, we went to alot of local auctions to sell hay. People get to know you when you are there on a regular basis. As time went on, we went to the auctions less and less as customers decided to just buy off of us privately instead of wasting time at the auction. We put an emphasis on service. We get the hay to them when they want it(even short notice, which can be a pain), we stack it, we guarantee it. We are not the cheapest around, but I like to think the service makes up for the price. Word of mouth has allowed us to grow to about 200 to 225 year in year out customers. The oldest has bought hay for 18 years and several are in the 10 to 15 year range. One thing that really helps keep the customers is holding supply for them. My guys know that when they call, they will get hay. 2007 was a short year, and we didn't take on any new business to guarantee our customers supply. Our guys were very happy with this. We turned down alot of business, but got the same comment alot....can I get on with you next year?

I do believe that we have been able to grow the business because we treat others how we want to be treated. As somebody else posted, if you wouldn't feed it, don't sell it as good hay. There is a market and a price for every kind of hay. Just be honest and don't misrepresent your hay, your services, or your price and your business will grow.

As for payment, this has become increasingly tough. We don't extend credit to any new customers. We do extend alot to regular customers. So far, most have paid.(all but 2 in 19 years). I have this theory, that if I don't give credit in a time of need, then a good customer may go find somebody else who will. If enough customers do that, I don't have a business. Many may disagree with this, but it has worked for us. This is all done locally within 75 miles. You have to be careful, but maybe I'm old fashioned, but a handshake and some kindness go along way in this business.


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## kfarm_EC_IL

Going to the hay auction does make sense, never thought of using it instead of it using me. Makes a lot of sense. For another related question do you base prices off of the weekly auction prices? I have been however some seem to not like the movement up and some don't seem to trust the down movement in price either. What are your thoughts?

How do customers feel about you picking out their hay? And I'll answer partly you only bring them good hay. So my question is that sometimes I will price haul due to what I consider a poor looking or lessor quality hay. Before hand do you discuss pricing and quality? I'm dealing in small quantities with a lot of customers, and I'm trying to come up with a consistant wait in which to deal with all of them which I know is some what impossible.

I agree with customer service and quality. We also guarantee our products, one question, is that I have yet to have anyone ask to replace hay. Will customers be honest and tell you or just get hay elsewhere? I really want to know how our hay is and what we can do to make it better. We always to ask our customers what they are looking for in hay and you get reponses all over the place. When making hay for a specific end use what avenues do you guys use to gather information about what is needed? (besides this site)

Thanks again for your help!
Mark


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## OhioHay

We do use the auctions as a pricing guide. We have an auction six days a week around here in different little towns. The results of the auctions are posted in the local paper each week showing the highs and lows for each cutting plus breaking it down between small squares, rounds, and big squares. We don't move our price every week. We look for up and down trends in the market. I won't move higher or lower based on a one week wonder. Normally watching the market every week, but not moving more than once a month and only if the market shows a clear trend. This year we haven't moved our prices since June because our market has stayed steady. We price ourselves in the top third of the market based on quality, service, and guarantee. I don't want to be the guy that people buy off of just cuz it's cheap.

when a customer calls,(alot we know their preferences already) we will ask first what cutting and squares vs rounds. Then we will tell them the mixes we have available. In first cutting, right now I have alfalfa orchard about 50/50, timothy/orchard and small amount of alfalfa and clover, pure timothy, and pure orchard. The customer would then decide which mix they would like or ask my suggestion. After that, we strive for consistency in the load so most bales are very similar. I have not had anybody have a problem with me picking their bales. I think this goes with our guarantee that we will replace any hay for any reason. Last year we replaced 11 bales out of over 40,000. I haven't ever had anybody ask for money back. We stress our guarantee and stress that if there is a problem, we can't fix it if we don't know about it, so give us a chance to right the sitution before switching suppliers. Price is typically discussed up front, though we sell all hay by the ton, so a customer actually orders a number of bales, then it is weighed on the way to delivery, so the customer doesn't know the exact bill until we arrive.

We also deal with many customers and small lots of hay. We live near MT. Hope, Ohio which has the largest Amish population in the world. 80% of our hay is delivered in 70 bale lots, because that is all the storage space they have. We then refill on a regular basis, some everyweek, every other week, once a month, and so on depending on the number of horses they own.

As for gathering info on what hay to grow, just talk to customers. To us, part of selling hay is talking as long as the customer wants to. Sometimes it puts us behind, but it builds a trust. We have learned that we have to grow many types and mixes of hay to satisfy the wants and needs of many. We also have learned that in our area, grass hay is preferred over alfalfa my a majority of the market, so that is what we grow and try to do a real good job of doing it.

I hope this helps some, feel free to ask anything else you think of.

Tim


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## Lazy J

Make sure you have business cards. It may seem trivial, but it makes an impression and gives a quick contact reference for potential customers.

We made a tri-fold brochure for our farm that outlines how we produce hay and why they should buy from us. It is a good one to put into your stacks of hay at hay sales.

Jim


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## OhioHay

I agree 110% with the business cards. Started using them 8 years ago or so and it has worked well.

I Like the idea of a brochure. I have thought about a quarterly newsletter for customers. Does anybody do that?


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## kfarm_EC_IL

I like the both ideas. My wife and I have thrown around the idea of a year ending newletter. Just haven't sat down to do it.

We have to get better at using the business cards.

We do use the Illinois dept of ag free hay list. I got a call today about straw from Nebraska!


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## chetlenox

Just as a note, www.vistaprint.com has a really handy on-line business card deal that lets you design your own card and order it up easily. Price seemed pretty good as well. I used them for ours and have been very pleased.

Chet.


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## wheatridgefarmMD

Does anyone write receipts for sales, cash, check, or credit? If so what do you use for forms? How does it work, any pros or cons? Also how do you go about keeping records of sales and projecting for future sales?

Ben


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## JD4755

I use quickbooks for all my business stuff, does the whole works as long as you pay attention to detail


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## Lazy J

We use Quickbooks for our Farm and our Feedstore. Would be sunk without it! We print an invoice for every batch of hay we sell, unless it is from an auction when we simply do a Journal Entry.

Jim


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## kfarm_EC_IL

You've asked a very good question.

I use an excel spread sheet. Well actually several spread sheets that help me with sales, invoicing, inventory, custom acreage, and the bottom line on the hay enterprize. It is still a work in progress and is designed for our business, but email me if you would like to look it over.

For us records are as important as what seed to plant. Without actruate records I believe we would already be out of business. Tracking sales helps me to see customers monthly needs therefore i can get a handle on what i need to produce to fully supply them. Sometimes I know more about the amounts customers are feeding than they might. Again that is helpful to our business.

I don't use recepts, but a fellow that uses the little hand written reciepts. Think it is a good idea and takes very little time. All hay operations (mowing , raking , baling, moving, & labor goes into a binder that I carry on the tractor. The goal is to be able to better understand cost of production and a break even or bottom line to price by.

How this helpful and I look forward to hearing how other keep records.
Mark


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## ButchAutomatic

I use a software called haytracks it keeps track of field production, storeage locations, Invoices, customers Info, Truckers. It was cheap and does a fairly good job.


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## OhioHay

We use Farmworks software for our entire operation, but have been looking at the haytracks for an easier way to do hay inventories.

Butch,

Is there anything you don't like about the haytracks, or really do like?

Tim


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## wheatridgefarmMD

Thanks for the replies, I have also started using excel spreadsheets in my own form. But it just seems way to simplistic to be right, seems like everything needs to be complicated in order to work correctly. I'll probably continue to use this until I see a need to update to another program. Thanks again all. 
Ben


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