# Question on raking with a rotory rake



## Longbow (Mar 8, 2012)

Greetings. This is my first post, however I have learned alot from reading numerous threads on making hay. Hoping someone can help me "see the light" on how to rake with a rotory hayrake.

I have a little over 50 acres of alfalfa in NE Mo. Last year was the first year it was baled. First cutting was put in round bales and wrapped. Second and third cutting was baled in big squares. This year I would like to do verything but the baling. I have a 1359 Hesston mo/co with 9'3" cut and rubber rolls for conditioning. I also have a tedder and plan to use it as soon as I get the mowing done.

My biggest question right now is what rake to go with. I have read and talked to a lot of folks about pros and cons of the many types of rakes available. I am leaning toward a rotory rake as I'm thinking this rookie could make better windrows and would be easier on the leaves than with a wheel rake. I have been looking at two kuhn rotory rakes, one is a 3 pt. rake with a sweep of 7.5' and total working width of 9.5' (GA 300 GM) and the other is a trailed rotory rake with a sweep of 9.5' and working width of 13.5' (GA 4120 TH). Obviously the bigger rake is a little more expensive, but price aside, which would be the better rake for my needs? The bigger rake has a heavier duty gear box and is a heavier built rake. For tedded hay, the bigger rake would obviously cover the field in less trips than the smaller rake. What I can't visualize (and I've tried laying it out on graph paper) is how to rake a 9' cut, 5' swath with a 4' windrow using the bigger rake. It seems like if you caught the left side of the swath with the edge of the 9.5' sweep of the rake, the windrow is going to end up on the next swath. If you run the curtain down the back side of that windrow, the hay under the 4' windrow never gets touched by the rake and seems like could cause problems. I know this can get hard to visualize, but what am I missing? If I run the curtain over the edge of the next swath initially, then come back the other direction to rake that swath into the same windrow, all the hay gets turned over by the rake. To to this however, you would end up overlapping the sweep of the rake by 5' and you would make the same number of trips as you would with the smaller rake. Anybody want to take a stab at describing the best way to run the rotary rake? Thanks


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## Jeff Fowle (Jul 28, 2011)

We use both wheel and rotary rakes on alfalfa and grass hay. With heavy hay and high moisture, the wheel rake is preferred. It will fluff the hay more and allow for quicker curing, however, you also have to consider your baler intake and make sure your windrows do not get to wide. If it is average yield, or curing is not an issue, the rotary makes a clean & tight windrow to bale. While the rotary is generally gentler on the leaf, many people begin raking to early with it and will trap the dew in the windrow. You can start raking earlier, with heavier dew, with the wheel rake and it is more forgiving. Having said that, you also need to stop raking earlier with the wheel rake as it will shed leaves on dryer hay, whereas the rotary can turn dryer hay with less leaf loss.

Bottom line, we use the rake that best fits the hay...yield, dew, etc.


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## SixesnSevens (Jun 19, 2011)

The goal of tending should be to spread your crop uniformly over 100% of the field. Once you ted, it should no longer matter whether your rake "matches" your mower. Match your tedder to your mower, and match your rake to your baler.

Scott


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## stickney farm (Jan 17, 2011)

Go with the 4120. Twice the rake and way more efficient. I've had both and the 300 is a joke in comparison. You wont regret it for the extra price and the resale value will be much better for the future if you ever sell it.


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## FCF (Apr 23, 2010)

What size tractor do you have? The 3pt. rake will require a heavier tractor or some front end weights if you have any hills and need to pick the rake up while going uphill. I have a 4120 and pull it with a 30HP tractor that would be too light for the mounted rake.


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## Longbow (Mar 8, 2012)

SixesmSevens: Makes sense to match rake to baler, but I may not ted every time (like in August) when it may be better to just lay as wide a swath as possible and not ted. That's when I'm not sure how the bigger rake will work on the small swaths.

stickney farm: Thanks. Figured the 4120 was a better way to go.

FCF: Am using a JD 5403 which is 65 HP. It should handle the smaller rake which is 3 pt., but the 4120 is a trailing rake so shouldn't be a problem. Still not sure how to use the full size of the 4120 on the small swaths without leaving the windrow on unraked hay.


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## Fossil02818 (May 31, 2010)

Longbow I have both a GA 300Gm and a GA 4120 TH. We only use the 3pt mounted 300GM on small tight fields otherwise the 4120 is the better tool for larger fields. Here, we have to run the tedder over the swath every time we cut or the alfalfa will not dry evenly. So with 100% of the field covered by fluffed hay the rake doesn't need to match the mower pattern. I don't see how you could skip the tedding and still get the consistent drying before you rake.


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## weatherman (Dec 5, 2008)

Fossil, I would agree that one should ted the hay before raking to allow more consistent drying. I used a New Holland 256 bar rake then switched to a Kuhn 3200 GT rotary rake and never looked back. In my opinion, the rotary rake fluffs the hay allowing air flow to help the final stages of drying. The rotary rake would "rope" the windrow. Sometimes in heavy windrows this would clog the baler. My neighbor uses twin New Holland 258 bar rakes. He doesn't ted the hay so it takes him an extra day to get it bailed. He bales for cattle, I bale for horses.


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## Longbow (Mar 8, 2012)

Fossil,

Thanks for the feedback on the two rotory rakes. A lot of people in this area round bale and plastic wrap the first cutting of alfalfa since the drying conditions aren't always the best in May. Since you bale at a much higher moisture for balage, would you ted?


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## stickney farm (Jan 17, 2011)

Longbow said:


> Since you bale at a much higher moisture for balage, would you ted?


It depends on your area and a lot of different factors. In my area sometimes we will ted for baleage to make it dry down within one day to keep as many sugars and starches in the grass as possible for the best quality feed.


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## Canderson012 (Jan 17, 2012)

Can't beat a classic 8 - 10 wheel V rake for the ease of use!


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## Longbow (Mar 8, 2012)

Canderson012,

Besides the rotory rake, I've been considering an 8 or 10 wheel rake for simplicity of use and reduced rake time. Thinking about a Kuhn SR108 or New Holland H5920 with kicker wheel. They both appear to be built about the same. Anyone suggest one over the other?

Thanks


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## hay wilson in TX (Jan 28, 2009)

If YOU will be doing the baling you will appreciate the windrow built by a rotory rake.

If speed of raking is a what you want then for the same money a wheel rake will get the job done faster just not as well.

The rotory rake fluffs up the windrow and seldom builds a wet slug. It will not twist your windrow into a rope.

For the same money you can in one pass build as large a windrow as you baler can handle. I advise using a pull type wheel rake not a 3 pt hitch, because a slight steering adjustment makes a large move on the three point rake.

It is possible to adjust a wheel rake it to not kick dirt into the windrow, but is seldom done. The trade refers to the extra DIRT as Ash. ( ! )

Just as with a roll bar rake damp hay can end up being more of a rope than a windrow. With a powered roll bar rake we can run the hay faster than our forward speed to avoid roping. That is not an option for a ground drive rake.

The secrete of good baling is great raking. I have a Custom Baler friend who will not bale a field that *His Wife Has Not Raked*.

I have a different friend who's wife does the raking. 
The wife claims any fool can wad hay but it take skill to do a good job of raking.

We all must agree that conditions differ with location. 
Not everyone has the same advantages and challenges we "enjoy" here in heart of Central Texas.

When I used a single rotor rotory rake much of the time I did not need or use the fence or curtain.

My favorite rake, on the farm, is the NH Rake/Tedder that rakes to the middle.

If I had the money I would have a Hesston combination Rake / Tedder that has larger rotors and can rake both to one side OR to the middle. 
Definitely need enough front end weight to counter the weight of the rake. My NH rake is lighter and it makes steering a challenge with the rake up.

*No rake system is self ideal*. 
It takes operator skills to build a good windrow using each style rake.

(_note to self, Spell Check will correct the bad spelling to a wrong word_)


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## Hand&Hand Farms (Feb 5, 2011)

More than one type of rake is a must for anyone in the hay business. Why fight a baler all day because you had the wrong rake in the field. Smaller fluffy windrows in thick hay made by rotary type rakes take less time to bale than heavy tangled windrows made by V-rakes. The best way to solve raking problems is to make the person bale what they raked. We don't have one of the newer type rotary rakes but I think they should work well in bermuda grass. We will keep one using the Kuhn GRS 21 as long as we can get parts. Don't spend all your funds on the wrong rake.


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## Barry Bowen (Nov 16, 2009)

The best way to solve raking problems is to make the person bale what they raked. 
AMEN TO THAT ONE.

If you have the same weather there that we have here in MD, the only rake you want is the rotary rake. Alfalfa rarely grows thick enough that you only have to do single rows. My method is a little more goofy, but here in terrible humidity land, it works pretty well
1, cut hay, 2 run old steel role crimper through and set rest of day, 3 run steel roles through next morning, then spin out. Evaluate late in day to see if almost dry enough, if so rotary just as the dew is hitting in evenig, if not leave and tedder in AM with some dew still on leaves, and then combo rake into windrows that evening. The day of baling, turn over in AM slowly. This will be the row you actually bale in the evening.

As to your row over laps with a rotary rake. The 11" wide rake does NOT rake a 11 foot windrow. It only does a 9 foot path, end of story. To make doubles, rake in the one direction, hang a tight 180 and kick back over what you made and add the next row to it. Do this correctly, and there is no unturned hay in the row. Try to take the full bite at the width of the rake, and you will leave unturned stuff on the bottom. THis is not a problem with the rake, it is a problem with the operator not doing it correctly.


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## Longbow (Mar 8, 2012)

Thanks guys. In trying to learn all I can about rakes before putting down the cash, I've come to realize the hay wilson is right when he says there is no rake that is ideal for every situation. I have leaned back and forth from wheel rakes to rotory rakes a couple different times, but can see the benefits of a pto driven rotory rake.

Barry Bowen: Thanks for your description of making double windrows. "Kicking back over what you made and adding the next row to it" answered my question concerning rotory rakes. I had visualized a number of ways to position the rake and you confirmed my thoughts on not leaving unturned hay on the bottom of the windrow. Am headed to the Kuhn Dealer tomorrow to see how sharp he can get his pencil. I really appreciate the knowledge and experience shared by all who responded.


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