# Rented ground and perennial crops



## FarmerCline (Oct 12, 2011)

I was just curious to see what everyone's opinion on this is. If you were renting a field and planted it in a perennial crop such as alfalfa and the ground was being sold or rented to a different individual would you leave the alfalfa crop that you planted for the next guy or would you kill the alfalfa so the next guy wouldn't be reaping the benefits of the crop you planted? I have a hard time thinking about leaving in alfalfa for the next guy to harvest.....no one would even think about leaving a crop of corn or beans for the next guy to harvest so why would alfalfa be any different?


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## Vol (Jul 5, 2009)

I would probably leave it under most circumstances.....it could be added to your column under doing the right thing. Stuff happens, maybe a new owner or leasee could have a change in plan and want someone to "take it off" for them.

Regards, Mike


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## glasswrongsize (Sep 15, 2015)

Maybe "leave it how you found it"? You were probably a good steward of the ground and maybe even will have to leave the property with better soil health than when you found it. In my spiteful mind, by answer would be "depends". If it is your choice to end the rental (I know you said it might be sold or rented to another, but I didn't read into it as to whether it is your choice or not), I would leave it in the best way that I could...meaning I would leave the alfalfa. If I were being forced from the land due to a change of agreements, I would take my alfalfa with me. To me, the owner will be reaping the benefits of your work by renting it to someone else.

If he's getting a higher rent because YOUR alfalfa is there, that's not fair to you

If he's NOT getting a higher rent because YOUR alfalfa is there, then your burning it to the ground will be no loss to him.

On a side note, around HERE, land rent agreements have to be ended in writing and the tenant has the right to get his crop out (unless otherwise bought out in the agreement). I think alfalfa usually has a 5-year rental agreement and, like an easement, follows the property and not the owner.

Mark

PS, I'm under the weather and a little (or a LOT) crabby today, so a grain-of-salt might be in order.


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## mlappin (Jun 25, 2009)

By law new owner has to be notified of an active lease, I never plant alfalfa unless I have at least a 7 year lease.


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## somedevildawg (Jun 20, 2011)

It depends on why I lost it.....and I would go to the other renters/owners and see if they wanted it (for a fee), if not.....is it round-up ready?


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## FarmerCline (Oct 12, 2011)

Well the deed has already been done as I made the decision to terminate the alfalfa today and sprayed it with roundup and clarity. I was just curious to see what others opinion on this was.

To give a little more info about the situation.....it was not my decision to terminate the lease.....it was the landowners decision not to renew and they mentioned they could possibly be selling the land but I kind of doubt they actually will. Without getting into too much of lengthy details they didn't go about ending the lease in the best way and were not sympathetic with the fact that I limed the land back in the fall and haven't got any return on that. There wasn't a formal written lease on the land....it was just a handshake agreement and exchange of cash. Honestly I didn't feel the need for a written lease with these land owners but I guess I was wrong.

The land is already in much, much better condition than when I started farming it and I have spent a small fortune on lime and fertilizer to get the land to produce and the next person will already be getting the benefit of that for the next few years. I made the decision to kill the alfalfa before I got off because I didn't think it was fair for another farmer (my competitors) to reap the benefits of a crop that I spent the money on planting.


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## Lewis Ranch (Jul 15, 2013)

I'd do the same.


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## luke strawwalker (Jul 31, 2014)

FarmerCline said:


> Well the deed has already been done as I made the decision to terminate the alfalfa today and sprayed it with roundup and clarity. I was just curious to see what others opinion on this was.
> 
> To give a little more info about the situation.....it was not my decision to terminate the lease.....it was the landowners decision not to renew and they mentioned they could possibly be selling the land but I kind of doubt they actually will. Without getting into too much of lengthy details they didn't go about ending the lease in the best way and were not sympathetic with the fact that I limed the land back in the fall and haven't got any return on that. There wasn't a formal written lease on the land....it was just a handshake agreement and exchange of cash. Honestly I didn't feel the need for a written lease with these land owners but I guess I was wrong.
> 
> The land is already in much, much better condition than when I started farming it and I have spent a small fortune on lime and fertilizer to get the land to produce and the next person will already be getting the benefit of that for the next few years. I made the decision to kill the alfalfa before I got off because I didn't think it was fair for another farmer (my competitors) to reap the benefits of a crop that I spent the money on planting.


I agree with the sentiment, BUT...

Seems a little like cutting off your nose to spite your face...

How much did the Roundup/Clarity cost per acre?? Application cost??

Sometimes it's better to just 'walk away' and cut your losses, IMHO...

Course, if they just flipped it to a bigger "competitor" who waved some more cash under their nose (probably because he KNEW you had really put a lot into it and improved the soil's condition) and you'd be watching them hauling hay off to sell from a crop YOU put in and fertilized, (and probably undercutting your price at the same time since SO much of the work was already done for them, they could afford to sell it cheaper and STILL make a nicer profit) then I can certainly see the point in wiping it out and leaving them with an (improved) clean slate.

Sorry to say but the days of "handshake agreements" went out decades ago... people nowdays have NO loyalty OR honor for the most part... PEOPLE SUCK!

Later! OL J R


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## FarmerCline (Oct 12, 2011)

somedevildawg said:


> It depends on why I lost it.....and I would go to the other renters/owners and see if they wanted it (for a fee), if not.....is it round-up ready?


 Not RR.....beautiful two year old stand. Made me kind of sick to my stomach spraying off such a nice stand.


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## FarmerCline (Oct 12, 2011)

luke strawwalker said:


> I agree with the sentiment, BUT...
> 
> Seems a little like cutting off your nose to spite your face...
> 
> ...


 I thought about that but the cost of the chemicals and spraying was only a few bales an acre of last years alfalfa hay so I figured I would rather spend that than see someone else step in and harvest 'my' alfalfa crop like you said.


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## mlappin (Jun 25, 2009)

We lost 80 acres next door because we always thought a handshake was good enough, and it was with the original owners, it was always understood we had first right of refusal if it came up for sale. The last parent passed away and somebody put a bug into their prick of a sons ear and he decided to divide it and auction it off. Ended up costing the little shit enough he actually made less than if he sold it to us in the first place.

How do you tell people in their eighties though that your pretty sure their only child is a c*nt, you don't trust him and we'd like the agreement in writing?


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## Vol (Jul 5, 2009)

I can understand you ending your alfalfa stand. Especially with the loss of your agreement.....and it sounds as if someone may have placed a bug in the lessors ear.

My mother always said "leave nothing to chance".

Regards, Mike


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## TJH (Mar 23, 2014)

Vol said:


> I can understand you ending your alfalfa stand. Especially with the loss of your agreement.....and it sounds as if someone may have placed a bug in the lessors ear.
> 
> My mother always said "leave nothing to chance".
> 
> Regards, Mike


Mom is always right.


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## SCtrailrider (May 1, 2016)

Myself I would have thought about buying a tank of diesel and making it hard for anything to grow for a while... but I'm spiteful when given the shaft...


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## somedevildawg (Jun 20, 2011)

Spiteful, it reminds me of a story.....guy and his wife get divorced in town, they have a very nice house, nice hood, beautiful lawn with a small hill sloping up to the front of the house....about two weeks into the divorce he noticed the grass in the yard turning brown with the distinct shape of ASSHOLE in 10' letters across the hill in plain view for all the neighbors....little did he know at the time, but the chick was purty smart....she used liquid nitrogen . The gift that keeps on giving


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## sethd11 (Jan 1, 2012)

I would've sprayed and killed it also. I would assume someone else saw your nice stand of alfalfa and offered higher rent on it. Especially since you did all the improvements. If you had a written lease there would've , could've been a legal ramification for land owners because of your high cost of improvements.


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## glasswrongsize (Sep 15, 2015)

This may be a good time to also illustrate that it is very important to know your state's laws regarding land rent whether you are the owner or lessee. In the state in which I live, one would have had recourse in being removed from the alfalfa ground and/or could have recovered your input costs.

This is a copy/past of the law as it is written in Illinois:

"Notice to terminate tenancy of farm land. Subject to the provisions of Section 16 of the Landlord and Tenant Act, in order to terminate tenancies from year to year of farm lands, occupied on a crop share, livestock share, cash rent or other rental basis, the notice to quit shall be given in writing not less than 4 months prior to the end of the year of letting. *Such notice may not be waived in a verbal lease*. The notice to quit may be substantially in the following form:
To A.B.: You are hereby notified that I have elected to terminate your lease of the farm premises now occupied by you, being (here describe the premises) and you are hereby further notified to quit and deliver up possession of the same to me at the end of the lease year, the last day of such year being (here insert the last day of the lease year)."

Food for thought and something to look up this winter while you're bored for a few minutes and have nothing better to do. It's worth knowing whether a owner or tenant.

Mark


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## bbos2 (Mar 20, 2015)

Here typically the field is prorated and the new tenet pays for the costs of the hay field to get control of it. I've seen it happen many times here from alfalfa to tillage. Maybe there were some written agreements but I'm pretty sure there isn't one every Time . the new tennet should have definitely paid you a pretty good percentage for a 2 year afalfa field.


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## r82230 (Mar 1, 2016)

mlappin said:


> How do you tell people in their eighties though that your pretty sure their only child is a c*nt, you don't trust him and we'd like the agreement in writing?


I would suggest you consider something along the lines of this in your conversations with landlords:

"We have what I think a GREAT relationship for _________ number of years, with me renting/leasing your farmland, I would like to continue to have the same great relationship with your heirs. But sometimes without your heirs liking, there could be an ATTORNEY involved (with or without their choosing). Is there anyway that you would consider putting a little something in writing to HELP me, IF someone like an ATTORNEY gets involved and doesn't completely understand the dynamics farming/good stewardship of land? Don't get me wrong, I really have valued our gentlemen's / handshake agreement and wished we didn't ever have to do the written stuff in today's world."

This way you are not accusing the ________ _________ children of anything and could structure a rolling lease agreement.

Larry


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## SCtrailrider (May 1, 2016)

@ FarmerCline ... be sure to keep us updated with any vocal or otherwise pertaining to the spraying & killing of the field, would like to be a fly on the wall .....


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