# Frost Seeding



## Fowllife (Sep 10, 2010)

Ok, it's getting to be that time of year when some of us are going to be thinking about frost seeding. What have you guys done in the past that has & has not worked?

I have an alfalfa/timothy field that I seeded last spring that due to weather didn't turn out the best. Alfalfa came in real nice but no grass at all. What types of grass work to frost seed?

I also have a pasture that I think I want to frost seed some clover on. Whats your favorite type of clover to frost seed?


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## prairie (Jun 20, 2008)

_The following is a reply that I sent earlier today to someone from SW Wisconsin on a similar question on another discussion group that participate in._

It just so happens that I was reading a very good frost seeding article when I received the discussion group e-mail.
You can read it at the link below. Although it is geared for Ohio, it is very good frost seeding info for anywhere.
http://beef.osu.edu/...eefJan3013.html
For your area I would recommend a mix of 2/3 red clover 1/3 white clover @ 5-8 lbs/acre if the seed will fairly easily get to the soil.
I have had excellent luck with alfalfa, but most don't.
Birdsfoot trefoil has not frost seeded well on my place, but does OK if it is drilled. Most have decent luck, but you need to be patient and not expect the near instant results you see with red clover.
I have contacted the three main inoculant companies that we purchase from about viability when frost seeding. I got answers from "totally a waste of time" to "it is better than none". Inoculation is probably best, especially for the less common legumes for your area, but it is up to debate how much survives the weathering. 
Timing is critical! I feel a lot of frost seeding is done too late, especially if livestock are not used to incorporate it. For you, anytime between now and the end of March should work. The later end of this time period would probably greatly benefit from hoof action.
I like to spread seed when there is snow cover, especially if you have never done it before. You can see where you have been and the spread pattern.

We can help you with both seed and a spreader if needed.

Brad Young
Prairie States Seed
NE Nebraska
866-373-2514
www.prairiestatesseed.com


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## rjmoses (Apr 4, 2010)

I've had good experiences frost seeding on soybean residue. I have not frost seeded over an existing stand. My concern doing that would be that the seeds would not get in contact with the soil. Do you have enough "bare" ground?

Trying to frost seed timothy over alfalfa might work because the seed size is so small that it will fall through the alfalfa and make contact with soil. Same thing with clover in the pasture. Big seeds, like orchardgrass, will have trouble getting in contact with soil.

Frost seeding works by the freeze/thaw cycle opening and closing the ground such that it sucks the seed down under the ground about an 1/8 of an inch.

Hope this helps

Ralph


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## brandenburgcattle42 (Sep 6, 2012)

If we have non snow covered pastures we are gonna broadcast a three year red clover then run our furest harrow over it then run our 30' brillian pulverizer over it then cross fingers.


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## rjmoses (Apr 4, 2010)

The doc that Brad references is a much more complete explanation. Suggested reading.

Thanks Brad.

Ralph


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## Fowllife (Sep 10, 2010)

Great info guys. Thanks.

Brad, thanks for the link. I need to get on there newsletter list. The last bullitin they had didn't seem as complete as that one.

I have not really heard of anyone having any luck frost seeding timothy. It looks like rye may be my best option for the alfalfa field.

The pasture has grazed fairly low in the fall so the clover should have good soi contact. I'm going to need to take a look at the alfalfa feild & see how that looks. From what I remember though I think I should be fine on that one also.


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## prairie (Jun 20, 2008)

Fowllife said:


> ....I have not really heard of anyone having any luck frost seeding timothy. It looks like rye may be my best option for the alfalfa field....


Timothy can frost seed OK. I have had ranchers in the Sandills of Nebraska spread timothy and legumes on their wet/sub-irrigated meadows. They spread in January with fertilizer, when everything is frozen solid so they don't get stuck. Reasonably good success, but not as reliable as red clover.
I would would consider ryegrass instead of rye for your alfalfa field. If you want to do rye, I would drill it in as soon as you can get a drill in the ground. It will germinate with near freezing soil temps.


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## rjmoses (Apr 4, 2010)

We had 4" of snow Saturday night. Temperatures over the next week call for highs in the 40's to low 50's, lows in the 20'. No heavy rains called for.

This means the freeze/thaw cycle will be working pretty good. So I had some bluegrass seed on hand that I over-seeded into my front yard yesterday on top of the snow.

Real easy to see where I had spread and how much. Fun to watch the seed melt right through the snow.

Perfect frost seeding conditions (IMO)!

Ralph


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## prairie (Jun 20, 2008)

Ralph,

Those are ideal conditions. As you have noticed the darker colored seeds melt right down through the snow. I have never had a case where I thought the seed washed away. I prefer to spread on top of snow and let it melt in.
I did have one instance where the grass seed blew away. The snow was dry powder on a very short grazed pasture and the wind blew it clear within 24 hours.

Brad


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## rjmoses (Apr 4, 2010)

prairie said:


> Ralph,
> 
> Those are ideal conditions. As you have noticed the darker colored seeds melt right down through the snow. I have never had a case where I thought the seed washed away. I prefer to spread on top of snow and let it melt in.
> I did have one instance where the grass seed blew away. The snow was dry powder on a very short grazed pasture and the wind blew it clear within 24 hours.
> ...


Yep. I did notice that - Cool! Our snows usually aren't _that _dry but I waited yesterday until there was a little melt going on.

Ralph


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## hillside hay (Feb 4, 2013)

I did ryegrass and timothy on some wetter ground last winter when it was still frozen. It came on nice in the spring but we had a wet spell in mid-June so was unable to get it at the peak. I broadcast it then went over with a cultipacker.( tines up)


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## pengs68 (Jul 3, 2009)

Anybody ever try frost seeding Orchard grass or Brome grass. Thinking of trying a a field or 2 here in Upstate NY.


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## rjmoses (Apr 4, 2010)

Yepp! Done it several times over soybean stubble. Had best stands ever! It is my preferred way (most of the time.) But you have to make sure your ground is loose, level and well drained.

Ralph


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## pengs68 (Jul 3, 2009)

rjmoses said:


> Yepp! Done it several times over soybean stubble. Had best stands ever! It is my preferred way (most of the time.) But you have to make sure your ground is loose, level and well drained.
> 
> Ralph


 Well it is level. Not so much loose or well drained.Its heavy clay ground.


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## hayray (Feb 23, 2009)

I have good luck frost seeding clover and timothy on pasture ground that is mostly clay and trampled down pretty good. On hay fields I direct drill trefoil and red clover into sod before green up. Tetraploid Italian ryegrass works good for broad casting into new legume seedings that are thin.


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## swmnhay (Jun 13, 2008)

Up here frost seeding doesn't work as well.We tend to go from winter to summer.So not as many freeze thaw days to work seed into the soil.So for interseeding guys around here will use a drill or spread it and run a drag over it.Just enough to get a little dirt over the seed.

One seed co has recomended notilling in fall right before freeze up.Dormant seeding.I've never tried it myself and do not know of anyone that has.


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## prairie (Jun 20, 2008)

Frost seeding works almost anywhere the ground freezes. If it is not working because you don't get enough freeze/thaw days, it is most likely because it is spread to late, or there is to much plant material/thatch preventing the seed from getting seed to soil contact.
Here in NE Nebraska, I like to frost seed from Dec 1 through February, usually the earlier the better. Unless you have very steep slopes, don't worry about the seed washing away with snow melt. Early March can work some years, but other years late February can be almost to late. this year frost seeding conditions are still good and should be so at least until the end of February. The farther north you go the later you can spread.
I sell seed to customers nationwide, but most in a 15-20 state area surrounding Nebraska, and frost seeding has worked well in all areas. If the ground is prepared properly, and the seed applied in a timely manner, frost seeding is a very viable option. If it is borderline to late, better options are a drill , very light tillage, aggressive harrowing, or best and cheapest of all, mobbed livestock impact.


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## NHDeb (Sep 7, 2015)

What to frost seed in NH in poor pastureland? ( Hand seeding )


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## Fossil02818 (May 31, 2010)

Red and white clover are usually dependable candidates for frost seeding up here. If the soils are more acidic or wet you can try Birdsfoot Trefoil though it is difficult to establish if you have turf type grasses. What do you define as "poor pastureland"? You may want to check out Granite State Graziers for workshops and other resources nearby. Good folks who have no till seeders for rent and lots of experience developing improved pastures up here.


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