# Vermeer 554XL, Bale Start/Belt Flip Problem



## bremma (Sep 2, 2014)

I have a vermeer 554xl with wide pickup.

If I attempt to start a bale at "full speed" ie roughly 4 miles per hour, sometimes the bale wont start and belt flips. I have tried pto from 300 rpms to 540 rpms, but sometimes it will not start the bale. So rather than chance pulling a plug, I have been starting bales with 400ish rpms and clutching once or twice within the first 15' so the core will spin, and basically no belt/ flips/plugs.

To be specific about plug, basically I encounter one problem: the bale fails to start and hay seems to wad up inside at the far right edge of the chamber (ie passenger side), causing the 14" belt to flip inwards on itself. The bale is not turning inside, but the belts are turning. It is always the right side belt that flips (ie passenger side of baler), and always flips inward with hay expanding up between the belt and chamber wall. I will look closer, maybe 1 or 2 teeth are missing at that location, but in general teeth are in good shape. Can anyone help me hone in on this specific belt flip/bale start problem. Local dealer does not have any "real" information, Tech at Vermeer said XL baler should not require "slow start or clutching", and I agree, I dont like clutching. I have been told to check teeth, cam bearings, starter roller clearance, and be sure the belts ARE turning with no hay in chamber. Per my other recent post, I am trying to check cam bearings, as I am not familiar with that.


Teeth are in pretty good shape, as i replaced about 1/2 of them a year ago (all that were weak or broke at that time). 
(2) 14" outer belts (very new), (2) 6" inner belts (still pliable and light texture) so belts seem good (all same length, 440")
Starter roller is turning, bolts are not sheared
Starter roller is within 2 3/4 to 3" of teeth (I plan to adjust all the way down to 2 1/2)
I have never run the baler with the wind guard on, as when i bought it used it was off, and the prior owner said "just one more thing to take off when it plugs" (he was having plug problems because of missing/weak teeth)
Does the wind gaurd help with any problems, I have it but just have not bothered to put it back on? 
Again, it is always the same belt and same side of belt that flips and thus plugs. So to me it seems like there should be an isolated problem??
Windrows do not seem to be the problem, as they are usually wider then 4' baler as i max out the wide pickup? I asked Vermieer tech if I was possibly putting TOO much hay on outside, and he basically said you can never put too much on the edges "pack the walls and the rest will take care of itself". But at the same time, if I recall, he said the belt runs to where there is not enough, and the belt is flipping inward?

Sorry for the long post, but I have read as many other related posts as I can, and I am trying to get to my specific problem.

Any specific advice on belt flip-no bale start is appreciated.


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## E220 (Feb 10, 2016)

Private message sent. First read through, the windrows must be no more than 4' on that baler. And in dry hay, that baler needs the windguard and it needs to be adjusted down to the top of the teeth.. It also needs good teeth.


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## Tx Jim (Jun 30, 2014)

E220

May I ask how wide the wide pickup is?


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## E220 (Feb 10, 2016)

64" tooth to tooth.


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## swmnhay (Jun 13, 2008)

I'm thinking you are trying to wad to much hay on the edge of the bale before the core even starts to turn and that could be causeing the problem.Once the core is turning it will suck the hay in alot easier.

If you are makeing your windrows 64" wide for a 48" baler??


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## bremma (Sep 2, 2014)

I was setting my v rake close to 60" so sometimes by the time the baler got to it was every bit "tooth to tooth", so yes wider than the 47" baler (which i also have restrictor plates in as I am pulling with a kubota 7040, and figured it would make it a little easier on tractor).

I assumed the wide pickup allowed you to make a wider windrow to "pack the corners" and have the best square shouldered bale, and of course the wider pickup to grab some spillage too. Sounds like I may need to shrink the windrow closer to the 48". Glad to learn more, and willing to change, I was just trying to "pack the corners for tight square bales" as I have read, I guess as is often the case, you can overdue a good thing.

One reason I was raking the wider row is that generally my windrows crown in the middle when I narrow the row, so I was going wider with the row figuring that extra width would be equal to the taller middle of the windrow, and thus produce an even bale with packed edges. I realize rake speed can adjust this some, but "generally" in my grass hay it tends to crown some in the middle.

I will adjust my windrow to 48, check the teeth, and put the windgaurd on as I bale dry bahia hay here in Louisiana.

E220 and SWMNHay, thanks for your suggestions.


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## Tx Jim (Jun 30, 2014)

E220 said:


> 64" tooth to tooth.


If one can't bale a windrow wider than 48'' with a 64'' wide pickup then why go to the added expense of having a wide a pickup. I know I'll get tromped on but I dang sure can bale a wider windrow than 48'' with my old worn out 467 with 61'' MW wide pickup


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## Posm (Sep 8, 2016)

This is an aggressive starting baler if set up correctly.

Check cam bearings. Shake teeth. They should only move a small amount. If they flop, then cam bearings need changed. That is a very easy change. Access plate on both sides to reach the 5 ( ten total) cam bearings

Check cam timing. Teeth should fall out between stripper band bolt centers

Throat clearance is critical. 2 3/4 to 3 1/4. No more or less. Shoot for 3

Insure teeth are stout. Aftermarket teeth from farm stores are NOT the same as VERMEER OEM teeth. If you have ANY missing or weak teeth, it can not shove the hay in to start the bale. Got o Dealer and buy 20 double teeth ( 40 tines)and replace the ones at the edge of the chamber.

Pull on starter roller shear bolts with pliers to insure they are not broke. Close starter roller to shear knife clearance until it just starts to touch.

Wind guard is not needed in this baler like vertical chamber Vermeer balers.

Make windrows about 48". What you can get away with in lighter crops does not work in heavier crops. It has rained a lot in LA and the crop is most likely rank. After core is started, you should be able to weave and pack edges. If the hay is 64 inches wide, it must make two 90° turns within 6 inches at 5MPH! That works if there is somewhere for the crop to move to, but not if crop is heavy and/or wet.

Make belts as loose as possible soft start spring (small spring near tires) should not be collapsed on inner stop tube.

Cam bearings, cam timing, good teeth, throat clearance, chamber width windrows, starter roller shear bolts, and loose belts equal aggressive starts


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## E220 (Feb 10, 2016)

Tx Jim said:


> If one can't bale a windrow wider than 48'' with a 64'' wide pickup then why go to the added expense of having a wide a pickup. I know I'll get tromped on but I dang sure can bale a wider windrow than 48'' with my old worn out 467 with 61'' MW wide pickup


Prepare for your tromping! 

Fair point. This baler does not have the capacity of the newer versions.

However, once the core is started, the baler will never plug. The problem he is having is getting the core started if i'm understanding correctly.

As far as the width of the pickup, the only Vermeer balers I know of that call for a 5' windrow on a 4' baler in the operator's manual are the chopper balers. On our chopper balers the rotor evens out the mat so that it makes nice bale no matter what the windrow looks like. On the fixed chamber baler, we also get a horizontal compression if the windrow is over-width.

You are correct as far as what is the point of the wide pickup if you can't use it all. I think that is true of any round baler. Where the hay goes in the pickup/rotor is pretty well where it will be on the bale. Anything wider than the reasonable packing of the side walls or gathering of shaggy windrows is marketing department fodder.


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## Tx Jim (Jun 30, 2014)

E220 said:


> Prepare for your tromping!
> 
> Fair point. This baler does not have the capacity of the newer versions.
> 
> ...


May I ask the age of the 554XL My 467 is an '05 model but the baler I traded for present 467 was a '99 or '00 model. I'm not stating my operators manual calls for a 4+wide windrow but my baler will handle it without plugging. IMHO on the open throat balers I baled with unless one hits a damp spot it's difficult to plug them after core is formed.


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## bremma (Sep 2, 2014)

Checked the cam bearings this evening, basically missing 7 of 10, missing 4 of 5 on the right side which is side that belt was flipping on

So I need to get some bearings, and it looks like remove big drive sprocket from wide pickup, then do bearings ust fit through inspection hole?


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## swmnhay (Jun 13, 2008)

bremma said:


> Checked the cam bearings this evening, basically missing 7 of 10, missing 4 of 5 on the right side which is side that belt was flipping on
> 
> So I need to get some bearings, and it looks like remove big drive sprocket from wide pickup, then do bearings ust fit through inspection hole?


Well that explains alot of things!

I'm pretty sure you just replace the bearings threw the inspection holes,E220 would know.


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## Tx Jim (Jun 30, 2014)

Yes the lack of brgs could adversely affect how effectively pickup can gather hay. I hope the cams don't have too much wear. But if each bar had only one brg on either end the teeth should still flip & pickup hay correctly


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## E220 (Feb 10, 2016)

That baler uses a split pickup. There is a separate set of bearings on each end.

I think if you want to spend the money, the Vermeer# 1732004 bearing is a double race roller bearing and is a bit higher quality with a lot higher price. 510501816 is a cheaper alternative. I'm pulling those numbers from memory. I'll double check when I get to the shop.

Get new bolts for the bearings. They are not expensive. Use locktite on the jamb nut and bolt when reassembling.

And yes the bearing and bolt slide in the inspection hole.


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## bremma (Sep 2, 2014)

E220, I am suppose to have some Timken/Fafnir 202npp9 on order. I assume that is the right ones, listed as double sealed and on Timken brochure it says typical use baler cam follower.


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## Tx Jim (Jun 30, 2014)

E220 said:


> That baler uses a split pickup. There is a separate set of bearings on each end.


Do you mean the tooth bars are 2 pieces for each row of teeth and just meet in the middle but aren't connected directly together?


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## E220 (Feb 10, 2016)

That should work.


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## barnrope (Mar 22, 2010)

yes Jim split in the middle.

Glad to hear you found your problem. Its been 7 years since Ive had mine but did have some of the same problems. I had to start out slowly to get the bale started, and then could run about as fast as I wanted. Getting the belts untwisted in that machine was a pain. i took a piece of twine and wrapped it around the belt folded in the opposite direction of the belt and ran it past the next roller to untwist it. The M and newer models are a lot easier to work with.


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## bremma (Sep 2, 2014)

I replaced the cam bearings. Baled with no problems. Thanks to all for your help and input.


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