# Elk Farm



## swmnhay (Jun 13, 2008)

Delivered Bale Film & Netwrap to elk farm today and got a tour.Click threw the pics.

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=1240673019278741&set=pcb.1240673969278646&type=3&theater


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## swmnhay (Jun 13, 2008)




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## Vol (Jul 5, 2009)

I suppose they sell the bulls to the shooter farms.....where they take the fat ass city boys out and walk their tenderfoot ass around in a circle for a hour to get them lathered up and then turn a nice shooter bull out and whisper to him...."there's your bull...heeza dandy!" Bang. $10 grand.

Regards, Mike


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## glasswrongsize (Sep 15, 2015)

Thanks for sharing that, Cy. Your climate is a little better than ours for elk farms, but we have a few fairly close; two are within 10 miles of me.

It is not widely known (not that it's a secret or anything), but the elk hereabouts are actually not true elk as they are crossed with red-stag. I think the cross is to make them adaptable to our weather and possibly temperament? I wonder if those are crosses, as well.

Either way, they are neat animals which can be very aggressive. People tend to forget that they ARE NOT domesticated animals and are very unpredictable. One of the local farms had a female and her antlers stayed in velvet year around. I reckon her lady-parts weren't what they should be; she had a bad attitude ALWAYS. (Sounds like some of the other "females" I've heard of on TV and cake shops around the country  )

I'm guessing that people pay your customers to come "hunt" them?

73, Mark


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## Lostin55 (Sep 21, 2013)

Cool pics.......don't even get me started on the whole game ranch topic.


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## stack em up (Mar 7, 2013)

Is that the one by Albert Lea? I think there is one out by Slayton too. Boss thinks she needs elk now. Thanks a lot....


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## swmnhay (Jun 13, 2008)

stack em up said:


> Is that the one by Albert Lea? I think there is one out by Slayton too. Boss thinks she needs elk now. Thanks a lot....


It's by Montgumery.

North of Slayton by Lake Shetek a guy has a few head.The place I was at had 250 hd.

There is one at Wilder and a small one near Ellsworth.


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## stack em up (Mar 7, 2013)

Never knew there were elk by Wilder. I'll just not tell Boss there are elk that close by....


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## swmnhay (Jun 13, 2008)

stack em up said:


> Never knew there were elk by Wilder. I'll just not tell Boss there are elk that close by....


yea they been there 20 yrs or so.Next time going by look for the high fence to the east side of town.Or go threw town,there is a highway that goes threw to the north.You will drive right by the elk.There might be more Elk in Wilder then people?


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## swmnhay (Jun 13, 2008)

Vol said:


> I suppose they sell the bulls to the shooter farms.....where they take the fat ass city boys out and walk their tenderfoot ass around in a circle for a hour to get them lathered up and then turn a nice shooter bull out and whisper to him...."there's your bull...heeza dandy!" Bang. $10 grand.
> 
> Regards, Mike


I think she said they had 6 going to game farms.I think most are actually sold as meat.I bought some Elk jerky,brats,and sticks.Jerky is damn good.More tender then beef jerky actually.

They have them for sale at $5.15 lb hanging wt.processing included.


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## Lostin55 (Sep 21, 2013)

swmnhay said:


> I think she said they had 6 going to game farms.I think most are actually sold as meat.I bought some Elk jerky,brats,and sticks.Jerky is damn good.More tender then beef jerky actually.
> They have them for sale at $5.15 lb hanging wt.processing included.


Cheaper than an elk hunt typically is.


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## haybaler101 (Nov 30, 2008)

I sell hay to a guy with about 25 head. I had some steaks a couple of years ago, good eating. He also has a really nice gun shop. Traded 6 bales of alfalfa for a Colt .380 last week. Needed something a little smaller than my 1911 for the pocket.


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## glasswrongsize (Sep 15, 2015)

swmnhay said:


> I think she said they had 6 going to game farms.I think most are actually sold as meat.


That's how one of these local elk farms did it. You COULD shoot one there; but basically you picked the animal that you want butchered and you COULD shoot it if you wanted to. More or less, they were just sold for the meat. A couple of times, someone (big city type)would want to shoot one themselves so that they could mount the "trophy" in their office and be able to say that they shot it. That's the same kind of person that would cheat at solitaire and feel good about "winning" a hand!!
BUT, I'm guilty of shooting one of them once, myself.
One of the bulls got a stretch of high tensile wire wrapped around his antlers and it got tighter and tighter. It started cutting into his hide under his jaw and something needed to stop the suffering.
I was the only one that had a gun suitable for the job (I tend to get involved in some of the craziest crap; I didn't even know the owner, but I was found for the job for some reason).
I went to the farm and shot the elk and he went down; my uncle and I got to work with the bolt cutters and got the wire from his antlers and neck. Then we packed the wounds with salve and gave him a shot of antibiotics. Next we waited for the tranquilizer to wear off; he staggered back to the herd like a drunken sailor returning to his ship.
I may very well be the only person in this little county to have ever shot an elk...catch-and-release style.
It probably is "no big deal" to most folks, but it was 10 years ago, and I still think of it from time to time. I tried to upload some video of it, but the HT site give me an error that that kind of file is not allowed.
73, Mark


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## stack em up (Mar 7, 2013)

swmnhay said:


> There might be more Elk in Wilder then people?


Shouldn't be hard. Think the population is 70 now?

I guess what they say is true: Windom is wild, but the next town west is Wilder!!!!


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## Vol (Jul 5, 2009)

Elk is great table fare....and I don't blame the person for selling the bulls for gain....but it just hurts those of us that enjoy the purity of Fair Chase hunting when some nerd kills a Elk on a canned hunt then brags to their co-workers which turns folks off about hunting.

The pursuit and the outdoor connection is what makes Fair Chase hunting so special to me. I still hunt but not near as much as I used to.....but I still have the dream of one day soon drawing a Rocky Mountain Bighorn Sheep tag....I am very close.

Regards, Mike


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## azmike (Jan 4, 2015)

Really not too different than farming catfish/bass or other "game" fish. We did a bunch of steel work at the local USDA approved meat plant. They had a deal for so many tons of Red Stag meat sent to Colorado. The critters were plumb crazy--we built up alleys that were fine for full size cattle!


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## swmnhay (Jun 13, 2008)

Shooting tame animals on a game farm is similar to buying show animals to show at the fair.Spend any amount of $$ just to win,or out do someone else that actually worked for it.

I hope he gets huge money from the idiot that wants to shoot the biggest one to brag about it even tho it's tame.

It's like living a lie like a large part of are society unfortunately.


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## stack em up (Mar 7, 2013)

It's like shooting fish in a barrel.


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## chazhk (Apr 17, 2016)

We have a hunting ranch in south Texas where we sell Whitetail hunts; and no, we don't run them around for an hour to "lather them up" then turn them out and tell the fast ass city slicker..."there's your buck". And no we don't hunt over supplemental protein feeders; those are shut down mid September and put back in mid January after the rut when the deer are at their weakest state. It helps them to bounce back faster to a more healthy condition. The brush is thick down there so you're not going to stalk a buck with any degree of success like you would in the west or in more open country. We have tower blinds as well as bow blinds; we now have more bow hunters than rifle hunters. It's taken 10 years to get our herd where it is today and still takes a lot of time and $$$ to keep a healthy herd. We don't take a buck unless he's at least 6.5 yrs old, unless its a cull. Then we take him out once we see he will never be a trophy. We keep the doe herd in check as well. The meat goes to families in the town close to the ranch. They take all we will bring them. We also keep a predator guy on the payroll, we've lost several large bucks to coyotes which equates to big dollars. We don't always have a successful hunt; as an example last year we had a guy coming to take a 200+ buck (not one of those behind every bush!) but we could never put him on one (they don't always do what we think they will). Refunded his entire payment even though we provided room and board and guide service. $16K...not sure how many bales of hay that equates to but at any rate its a lot of money. We keep it ethical and we try to make sure the hunter goes home happy and enjoys his stay. Times change, methods change, and economics change. I'm not for taking a hunter into a 40ac trap to shoot an elk (that's just an example, not sure that happens) but I don't have a problem taking a hunter onto 640acs and taking our chance on locating his buck of a lifetime. Doesn't always work, but we give it our best. There are a lot of people who make a lot of money but don't have a week or two to take off and go hunting. Our hunters are usually owners or executives of large companies so they want to take a weekend and go where they have a good chance to come home with a trophy. We try to provide that. We're not all hay farmers but we all have our ways of making an honest living, providing a service, and paying the bills. Chaz


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## Lostin55 (Sep 21, 2013)

And exactly how is this any different than raising cattle? 
Well I guess cattle still have protein blocks during hunting season...
Can't find one once on a while? Hmm . Never seen a cow hide in the brush during a round up I guess.
It's different because your deer are worth a lot more per head.....
A whole 640 acres huh? Must be able to really tire out a horse or a jeep in there?
Never mind..... let's stick to haying....


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## chazhk (Apr 17, 2016)

Great idea lostin55...


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## Vol (Jul 5, 2009)

chazhk said:


> We have a hunting ranch in south Texas where we sell Whitetail hunts; and no, we don't run them around for an hour to "lather them up" then turn them out and tell the fast ass city slicker..."there's your buck". And no we don't hunt over supplemental protein feeders; those are shut down mid September and put back in mid January after the rut when the deer are at their weakest state. It helps them to bounce back faster to a more healthy condition. The brush is thick down there so you're not going to stalk a buck with any degree of success like you would in the west or in more open country. We have tower blinds as well as bow blinds; we now have more bow hunters than rifle hunters. It's taken 10 years to get our herd where it is today and still takes a lot of time and $$$ to keep a healthy herd. We don't take a buck unless he's at least 6.5 yrs old, unless its a cull. Then we take him out once we see he will never be a trophy. We keep the doe herd in check as well. The meat goes to families in the town close to the ranch. They take all we will bring them. We also keep a predator guy on the payroll, we've lost several large bucks to coyotes which equates to big dollars. We don't always have a successful hunt; as an example last year we had a guy coming to take a 200+ buck (not one of those behind every bush!) but we could never put him on one (they don't always do what we think they will). Refunded his entire payment even though we provided room and board and guide service. $16K...not sure how many bales of hay that equates to but at any rate its a lot of money. We keep it ethical and we try to make sure the hunter goes home happy and enjoys his stay. Times change, methods change, and economics change. I'm not for taking a hunter into a 40ac trap to shoot an elk (that's just an example, not sure that happens) but I don't have a problem taking a hunter onto 640acs and taking our chance on locating his buck of a lifetime. Doesn't always work, but we give it our best. There are a lot of people who make a lot of money but don't have a week or two to take off and go hunting. Our hunters are usually owners or executives of large companies so they want to take a weekend and go where they have a good chance to come home with a trophy. We try to provide that. We're not all hay farmers but we all have our ways of making an honest living, providing a service, and paying the bills. Chaz


Good for you doing it ethically.....many do not.....especially with Elk. Do you have a "high fence" around your 640 like many others do that offer whitetail hunting in your part of the country?

Regards, Mike


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## somedevildawg (Jun 20, 2011)

Lostin55 said:


> And exactly how is this any different than raising cattle?
> Well I guess cattle still have protein blocks during hunting season...
> Can't find one once on a while? Hmm . Never seen a cow hide in the brush during a round up I guess.
> It's different because your deer are worth a lot more per head.....
> ...


I'm thinkin it's more profitable........


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## swmnhay (Jun 13, 2008)

Lostin55 said:


> And exactly how is this any different than raising cattle?
> Well I guess cattle still have protein blocks during hunting season...
> Can't find one once on a while? Hmm . Never seen a cow hide in the brush during a round up I guess.
> It's different because your deer are worth a lot more per head.....
> ...


id say the big difference in having a game farm and cattle is with the game farm you tell them how much you want to shoot one.

With beef we ask how much they will give us for the animal.


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## Lostin55 (Sep 21, 2013)

swmnhay said:


> id say the big difference in having a game farm and cattle is with the game farm you tell them how much you want to shoot one.
> With beef we ask how much they will give us for the animal.


...and there is a reward out for information leading to the arrest of the last person around here who shot a cow in a pasture.......
We should really stick to haying


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## glasswrongsize (Sep 15, 2015)

Aw heck, we can talk about "hay" in the other threads dedicated to such. This IS the chit-chat part and under the topic of Elk. For once, we have ACTUALLY stayed on topic ( I know I'm one of the worst at derailing, but trying to get better.) and critter farming is related to the topic at hand...So, I'm throwing in some of my thoughts, too.

I was a lucky young lad growing up with a father that could track a spider across a dry rock. I was taught to hunt and traps at a tender young age. I (barely) remember going with dad squirrel hunting when all that I could carry was a toy gun, then I got a Daisy bb gun; the bb gun was not squirrel-shooting quality, but I had something to carry. Next was a 410 and up to a Stevens 15Y single shot rifle.
"Hunting" is ingrained in the DNA of men and some sort or another of it is needed for a healthy mental state and feeling of self worth. The "hunting" does not have to be a critter; the hunt can be done on the NYSE floor on Wall Street....sometimes not.
The "problem" with hunting can be tied to one of the Seven Capitol Sins (AKA the 7 deadly sins); the sin of Pride. Pride is a finicky mistress. Not enough pride in your life, and you fall into sloth, and sometimes envy and anger. Ill focused Pride is its own pitfall; I can shoot a deer (or let one walk) and be proud of my hunt. Some people can't be proud of a deer unless it scores XXX...mostly they can't be proud unless they can tell others (the hunting stories), show others (the "trophy" on the wall), or some other way get "approval" from their peers. These people's pride does not come (so much) from within, but is given to them by their peers.
There are approx 12000 acres of river bottoms right below my house with nary a road or a house in it. My walk-out basement is the gateway to brushy beauty (can't see a hundred yards when the leaves are on the trees). I can shoot a deer every year and within earshot of the house (I have been deer hunting and heard the phone ring in the house) because I live with the deer. I know where they will be and when they will be there. The deer are used to me walking around and feeding the critters.
To some, the "hunting style" I do is ethical...but (and here is where the pride comes in). The next guy might say that it ain't fair that I shoot deer that flock my clover field (we can't "feed" the deer in this state, but food plots are OK) because it "ain't really hunting". OK, so I go down to a field in the bottoms (where the deer are not used to my presence to much) and shoot one with my muzzle loader. Someone is going to say that an in-line muzzle loader "ain't really hunting" and I should have used a flintlock. There would be someone that tells HIM that he ain't really hunting because he didn't cast his own bullets and make his own powder. Then, there will be somebody that tells HIM that he really ain't hunting because he didn't mine his own lead to melt to cast his own bullets. Next there will be someone that will tell HIM that HE really ain't hunting either because he was wearing storebought underwear while he was mining his own lead.
Hunting is PERSONAL and I believe the pride should also be personal. If I have to get someone else's approval of the story of the hunt or the B&C score wasn't what I had hoped, I am hunting for the wrong reason. For example, if you hunt a specific deer and have a good, clean, fair chase and an ethical kill and are ecstatic when you see the deer go down- you knees are shaking, you almost step out of the deer stand because you are so excited that you forget you're in a tree. That is personal pride and (I think) a healthy pride. You could go goose hunting with a lawn rake...you're in the clouds!!! If you reach the deer, look it over and realize that the rack doesn't score as you thought and your good feelings ebb....then you're not hunting for yourself, you're hunting for the approval of others. That's the wrong pride...the pride that is dependent on the approval of others.
If I shoot a nice deer and get some of the pride from the approval of others, someone that shoots a bigger deer cuts in on my glory; if they shot it and "ain't really hunting", it's even worse. Somewhere in our own hierarchy of hunters (of which we almost always put ourselves at the top) there are poachers, baiters, elk-farm hunters, compound bow users, recurve users, etc...
I can understand that someone (the type of person that can drop 16K to shoot a dang ole nasty deer) may have not been raised with the opportunities that I had; this may very well be his first day hunting, just like mine at the age of 5 or so. He has probably never fulfilled his desire to fulfill the primal urge which is embedded in our DNA. I say to that guy that could/did pay 16K to go hunt a penned deer, "good for you, you got that part out of the way. Next time, let's up the difficulty level." For all I know, in a few years, he might be hanging naked in a tree, covered in mud with his knife in his teeth, passing on little bucks and waiting on the big one to walk under the tree so that he can jump out, wrestle it to the ground, cut a notch in his ear on let him go.
Television has flat-out ruined deer hunting for a lot of people and made it good for a lot of people. For a lot of people, it has removed the self-pride from hunting and makes pride directly correlated to others' approval, size of rack, weapon used, etc.
IF a guy goes to a deer farm, elk farm, or whatever...why should it be any skin off of my ass? So, he didn't have to hunt as hard as I did? So what...I didn't have to spend 16K (I don't know what 100 gr of pyrodex and a hand cast 230 gr bullet and a sabot costs, but that's my input)
If that guy makes me mad, I have a problem...either with Envy (of the ease of his hunt or the size of the deer that he shot...or a combination) and/or with Pride in that my pride is derived from having others know the tale of my hunt or the size of my rack. If I am of the opinion that his easy hunt cheapens the way that I hunt and am jealous that he gets the same end result with less work...then I am hunting for the wrong reason. HIS hunt cannot effect MY hunt without the sins of ENVY and PRIDE.
He is legal, so he is far and above poachers. He is paying (dearly) his own way. He ain't trespassing on me. He got permission (so he paid for it) to hunt. He is fulfilling a primal urge the only way that he know how (never grew up around it and was never taught) The guy with the deer is making an honest living, just not with mainstream livestock. I don't see the problem...it just ain't my cup of tea, but neither have I ever had to be stuck in a big-city job with the desire to go hunting. I wouldn't want to have to walk a mile in the shoes of the man that has to pay to go hunting; I would give myself a buckshot-tonsillectomy if I couldn't hunt from my front yard if I wanted.
No offense Chaz, but I ain't got much in common with your clients...then again, I'm kind of an opinionated person with little regard of other's feelings. It's a good thing that I like to be alone and don't care if I see anyone from one week to the next.

73, Mark


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## somedevildawg (Jun 20, 2011)

I agree glass.....I love to hunt and fish but I ain't NEVER watched one of them shows on the boob tube....well, I have to take that back....I did watch Bill Dance when I was a youngun, not a whole lot tho....calling them "outdoor sports" and the competition and money that make up "sports" in general has really been devastating for the hunting community, to me.....but, I'm in the minority a lot of times when it comes to hunting issues. I foretold the leaders at the time with the Ga Dept of Wildlife that I wasn't in favor of QDM, it had been tried in one county and it was a resounding success they said.....what I saw was land prices skyrocketing and the skyrocketing has continued to the point that a man of middle income and children will have little money to spend on hunting, thus driving down hunter numbers......they adopted QDM and prices for land have risen every year since, along with declining numbers of young hunters......call it good or bad, just depends on which window you're looking out of......


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## Lostin55 (Sep 21, 2013)

I am going to chalk it up to this. I am blessed to live in an area of the Country that contains a lot of Federal land, both BLM and Forest Service, which is open and available for hunting. I am also blessed with the means to be able to take the aforementioned week long hunts into the backcountry for several different species of animals. We can and do hunt Elk, Deer and Antelope. If we are lucky we can draw a tag for Moose, Bighorn Sheep, Mountain Goat and Buffalo. We can also hunt Mountain Lion, Black bears and hopefully Grizzlies soon.

I do not depend on the approval of anyone for determining the measure of success on a hunt. Some of my most successful hunts were those that I came home empty handed on. I judge the quality and success of a hunt more on the friendships renewed, the time spent on the mountain, and the overall experience than I do on the rack of an animal. Of course, if I manage to shoot a good one I will generally show it off.

That isn't where the heartburn comes from. All of my life I have pursued game that is wild and free. It is called FAIR CHASE. A high fence does not allow fair chase and I really don't care if it is 40 acres or 640 acres. There is a reason that the record books do not recognize high fence animals. If you give any animal the benefit of good nutrition and little in the way of predators, they will mature to a ripe old age, and do it in peak condition. Ask my cattle.

Now, with that being said, I am not judging Chaz for making an honest living. Congrats to him for it. We are divided enough as hunters as it is, for exactly the reasons stated so eloquently above. While I will defend any type of hunting or Second amendment rights to my grave, I do not have to agree with all of them. To me, behind a fence isn't even hunting, yet you can bet I will defend it when it counts.

As to the expensive hunts, I went to Alaska for a little more than a 200" buck apparently costs in a fenced in pasture in TX. I managed to do a backpack hunt and came home with the meat from two critters. We enjoyed every meal of them both.

In the end, we will never all agree on this topic. I would personally love to see some of the deer that Chaz raises. I like deer. As for the chance of me ever wanting to shoot one? Aint gonna happen.


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## swmnhay (Jun 13, 2008)

It's not much of a sport to shoot fish in a barrel but look at the business side of it,take the money.If they want to pay $16,000 to shoot it,take it.

Call it what you want ninch marketing,etc.


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## azmike (Jan 4, 2015)

I have a state license as a game farm and bird shooting preserve. I don't work it too much but when I do I find a fairly realistic hunt. It is mostly to "tune up" dogs for wild quail that can be very elusive and frustrating for young dogs. A full size chukar planted in good cover will make a great confidence builder for bird dogs, but I've seen MANY experienced hunters botch the shooting and bringing to bag the game!

This is synthetic hunting but produces a fun opportunity for the dogs and hunters to enjoy, not the same as a day afield but has its place. Plus I get $10 bucks a bird!


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## Lostin55 (Sep 21, 2013)

azmike said:


> I have a state license as a game farm and bird shooting preserve. I don't work it too much but when I do I find a fairly realistic hunt. It is mostly to "tune up" dogs for wild quail that can be very elusive and frustrating for young dogs. A full size chukar planted in good cover will make a great confidence builder for bird dogs, but I've seen MANY experienced hunters botch the shooting and bringing to bag the game!
> This is synthetic hunting but produces a fun opportunity for the dogs and hunters to enjoy, not the same as a day afield but has its place. Plus I get $10 bucks a bird!


Birds are a horse of another color..... always good to get pups on game in a semi controlled environment.


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## Vol (Jul 5, 2009)

If the animal being pursued has no chance of getting away, then that is not "hunting"..... that would just be "shooting" and I am specifically talking about shooting Elk in a small acreage enclosure of high chain link fencing. What a individual does with his money is his business. But too many people confuse shooting with hunting. It's all about "Fair Chase"..... Which is a concept that is foreign to many. Birds can fly away....a 800 pound Elk stops at the chain link fence.

Regards, Mike


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## r82230 (Mar 1, 2016)

MIke,

Locally there is a 'hunt club', where the have ducks. One of the guys will go to the lake, call the ducks, they will follow him on foot, about 1/3 mile. Once they get a past the 'shooting' stations, the ground goes up hill about 50 feet. There are paths (just like a cow path) up the hill (hill is covered with shotgun wads), the ducks walk to a place where they get feed (fenced in, they close the gate once ducks are inside feeding area). After ducks consume there feed, they have to fly back to their lake right over the shooting stations!!!. Yea, they could fly away, BUT free food, is like a free 'Obama phone', almost no one turns one down.

Similar with pheasants, they are 'planted' (hunting party pre-pays for so many to be 'hunted') by the 'guides'. Guides know where to take the hunters, and the guides operate the dogs (hunt club owns the dogs). To make a few extra dollars guides will plant a 'few' pats (unusually 2 partridges for each pheasant), hunters have to pay 'extra' for each pat shot. Dogs fetch the birds, guides carry them back to the club house, you have a few adult beverages and are able to leave with processed bird(s), already chilled.

So yea, birds can fly, BUT............................. depends upon what you call hunting (or just shooting) or fishing, if you fish from their trout pond.

For the visitor's of this local hunt club, it's the only time their pickup truck sees a gravel road.

Larry


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## Vol (Jul 5, 2009)

r82230 said:


> MIke,
> 
> Locally there is a 'hunt club', where the have ducks. One of the guys will go to the lake, call the ducks, they will follow him on foot, about 1/3 mile.
> 
> Larry


Well I'll be danged Larry.....if you let a duck see you here, you couldn't get within rifle shot of them....you fellas must have the pied piper of duck callers.... .


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## azmike (Jan 4, 2015)

A "duck whisperer"!


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