# Bermudagrass for hay and grazing. Mostly a copy and past



## hay wilson in TX (Jan 28, 2009)

There are many factors which affect SOM under Bermuda&#8230;some were identified in that discussion. Noble says Bermuda doesn't need lime unless pH is 5.5&#8230;.I say look at the need for Ca/Mg as related to soil percolation/tilth infiltration.

North and west of I-44 has been in extended drought for several years. The bulk of SOM is delivered to soil during good growing seasons&#8230;.losses may occur in drought.

Healthy well managed Bermuda is a good weed suppressor&#8230;if one is having issues with weeds and a need to spray every year, then the problem lies in past management&#8230;.extent and timing of disturbance which releases weeds&#8230;or lack of grass plant diversity early season.

Earthworms will be a cool season animal in the southern great plains&#8230;.less of a role player than up north. Dung beetles are summer active and will do the bulk of soil work if fresh manure is there and free of 'lethal chemical residues'.

Bermuda height and root depth are not straight forward observations&#8230;.runner grasses can grow over and do well with only 4" soil over solid rock or highly intense grazing in season rain areas. Some call this 'Seringetti Grazing'&#8230;where it was discovered for native Bermuda. The merit of using Bermuda as a soil cover/enhancer is to remove less and leave more canopy for shading, cooling, and less evaporation&#8230;or as a managed 'cover crop' for. I grow just as good of Bermuda in 6" of topsoil @ 4.5% OM as 10+" deep topsoil @ 3.5% SOM&#8230;.like any other soil nutrient, SOM can leach deeper into the profile for a 'net dilution' effect in 6" soil test. One of the posters addressed this in a way, but didn't explain how I see it.

If one is committed to SOM build under hay meadows&#8230;several options are available:

-rotate hay cutting over fields over years

-use manures for bulk of fertility need

-graze more and cut less

-intensely graze Bermuda during growing season, stockpile late summer into fall, graze intensely through January

-use winter small grain/legume mixes (rye/triticale/wheat + hairy vetch) is a simple one&#8230;mob graze or hay then summer graze

-buy someone elses's hay and bale less of your acres

-own a fertilizer COOP&#8230;sell fertilizer to cover costs of your own

If one is committed to SOM build under hay meadows&#8230;several options are available:

-rotate hay cutting over fields over years

-use manures for bulk of fertility need

-graze more and cut less

-intensely graze Bermuda during growing season, stockpile late summer into fall, graze intensely through January

-use winter small grain/legume mixes (rye/triticale/wheat + hairy vetch) is a simple one&#8230;mob graze or hay then summer graze

-buy someone elses's hay and bale less of your acres

-own a fertilizer COOP&#8230;sell fertilizer to cover costs of your own

Really hard to address these issues on a forum without a field visit&#8230;independent correspondence.

HERE the Ca/Mg ratios are pretty well set for us with our calcareous clay soil.

SOM can accumulate during wet seasons, this may be the year for accumulation. When I was big into Kitchen Garden I would use 6" or more of old hay for walkways. Nice when buddy but will all burn up in our Annual Summer Drought.

Nice thing about droughts with a bermudagrass hay farm is the grass does not become tall enough to harvest during our droughts.

Bermudagrasses are not all alike, though they may look alike.

For sprigging we have above ground stems and below ground stems. You can imagine the grass confusion If you spring above ground stems by sticking them in the ground before greening up. About as bad as spreading under ground stems on the soil surface, during the growing season.

I like his idea of buying hay from a hay farmer. I tell many of the hay buyers that they have way too many cows if the need hay other than maybe February. A Cow Calf owner can not make money feeding hay to their cows. Not and pay what the real worth of the hay is, unless you are milking the cows.


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## TJH (Mar 23, 2014)

My dad insisted that we graze our hay fields once every three years. He said cattle needed to "rough" them up to maintain a good stand, not to mention the "organic nutrients" they put back in.


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## somedevildawg (Jun 20, 2011)

I like the idea about forming a coop......as high as the requirement for NPK is, I can see the validity. Have seriously thought of the idea myself.....


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## hay wilson in TX (Jan 28, 2009)

Good Old Dawg, Excellent Idea. EXCEPT. Get to gether with a group of farmers and build a corperation to be your buyer and of fertilizers and chemicals.

Sell for less than any coop ever thought of doing!

The it will still make money and pay the investers dividends.

Does well until the original investers get old.


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## somedevildawg (Jun 20, 2011)

Now Bill you done got me thinking again.......that can sometimes be dangerous and expensive......thought provoking I tell ya.....


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## bluefarmer (Oct 10, 2010)

SOM??? 
Soil.......management ???
Growed "muda" grass all my life. That's what it's called around here!


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## somedevildawg (Jun 20, 2011)

bluefarmer said:


> SOM???
> Soil.......management ???
> Growed "muda" grass all my life. That's what it's called around here!


That's funny, guess we call 'muda" too sometimes, depends on what neck you from.....soil organic matter


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## bluefarmer (Oct 10, 2010)

Chicken litter is real good SOM!


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## somedevildawg (Jun 20, 2011)

bluefarmer said:


> Chicken litter is real good SOM!


I agree! Just leads to some PON......


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## deadmoose (Oct 30, 2011)

Is this speaking in a secret Reb language? 

Pon?


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## somedevildawg (Jun 20, 2011)

Lol.....Pissed Off Neighbors


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## FarmerCline (Oct 12, 2011)

Yep, that's the trouble with chicken litter for me......I would love to use it as it is readily available and good for the ground but since I'm in a pretty heavily populated area with houses all around the fields I can't because the neighbors would hang me because of the smell.


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## Grateful11 (Apr 5, 2009)

Just had 3 big spreader loads spread yesterday and it disced in today but last night you could smell it almost 1/2 mile away as we came down the road after getting something to eat. I figure we have to put up with the leaf burners every year they might as well put up with a few days of chicken poop smell. I'll admit it does stink, I'd take cow poop smell over chicken any day. My wife planted corn in that field today and saw a couple chicken carcasses in the field.


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## somedevildawg (Jun 20, 2011)

Now you're gonna laugh at this, but I heard it and who am I to argue the point......but, here goes

Had a lady call me last year from an affluent horsey neighborhood, wanted to know if I used chicken litter, "no" I answer... Good cause we've had several horses die from E. coli and it's been followed to a hay supplier that uses it


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## rajela (Feb 15, 2014)

somedevildawg said:


> Now you're gonna laugh at this, but I heard it and who am I to argue the point......but, here goes
> 
> Had a lady call me last year from an affluent horsey neighborhood, wanted to know if I used chicken litter, "no" I answer... Good cause we've had several horses die from E. coli and it's been followed to a hay supplier that uses it


 DUH............


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