# Massey Ferguson 4600 series



## longmeadow farm

I've been looking at buying a new utility loader tractor. I have looked at New Holland, Kubota, Deere and Massey. All the same class tractors 60+ PTO HP. Drove the Massey yesterday, a 4608 with Cab. I thought it was somewhat nosier compared to the NH & Kubota... the Deere was noisy also. Any one have any working experience with a 4600 series Massey with cab? Other than the gear shift getting in the way when I turned around.. I thought it was a nice tractor. Thanks


----------



## Fireman355

I when with the 2670 HD series with cab MF, works great. My Neighbor got the 4610 with a cab he likes it, I think my cab is nicer.......


----------



## hog987

That new 3 cylinder engine is the massey is noisy. But not a whole lot more noisy at full rpm than at idle. I have the chance to demo a new 4610 and put about 5 hours on it today. Not a bad tractor. Lots of hydraulic power for the loader and the 3 point hitch. As I run it more I can update what I find.


----------



## longmeadow farm

Thanks hog987. I've delayed my choice a number of times. I've gotten close to buying a NH T4.75, but stopped short... Just not comfortable with the choice I guess. I discounted the Deere (old technology and reliability problems) and the Kubota( too light and limited for my application) The 4600 series has a longer wheel base and is a bit heavier and the engine technology appears to be quite superior... Finland(MF) vs Italy(NH). I'll await your assessment. Does the demo unit have a cab?

..and thanks again.


----------



## cornshucker

Dealer we bought our square baler from had a couple on the yard said he thought that Massey 4600 series was going to be a good tractor. Dealer said 5400 series and the new 5600 are very good tractors but to expensive to compete with Kubota.


----------



## Vol

longmeadow farm said:


> Thanks hog987. I've delayed my choice a number of times. I've gotten close to buying a NH T4.75, but stopped short... Just not comfortable with the choice I guess. I discounted the Deere (old technology and reliability problems) and the Kubota( too light and limited for my application) The 4600 series has a longer wheel base and is a bit heavier and the engine technology appears to be quite superior... Finland(MF) vs Italy(NH). I'll await your assessment. Does the demo unit have a cab?
> 
> ..and thanks again.


Curious as to which model Deere you considered?

Regards, Mike


----------



## memory

When we were shopping for a new tractor, we considered the MF 4600 series. I have heard they are supposed to be good tractors. I believe they have the Perkins engine and we have had good luck out of Perkins. We have two older tractors with the Perkins and they have been good to us.

One reason we didn't go with them is because of the dealer. The closest MF dealer to us would not return our call. We told him we are serious about buying one and never did call us back. That dealer is known to be hard to rude. I think if the dealer was willing to deal, we would have bought the MF instead of the Case Farmall 95C.


----------



## Waterway64

We have a CIH JX95. It sees lots of use every day more than all our other tractors combined. It has been nearly problem free. Mel


----------



## cornshucker

Memory that dealer must already be rich enough LOL. Still I think there is no better substitute than a good dealer who is willing to work with you and provide prompt service after the sale. If this dealer was not willing to return your call before the sale he sure as heck would not be no good after the sale.


----------



## somedevildawg

Longmeadow, have you checked out the McCormick tractors in that hp range? Look good and priced right, if you have a dealer....


----------



## hog987

longmeadow farm said:


> Thanks hog987. I've delayed my choice a number of times. I've gotten close to buying a NH T4.75, but stopped short... Just not comfortable with the choice I guess. I discounted the Deere (old technology and reliability problems) and the Kubota( too light and limited for my application) The 4600 series has a longer wheel base and is a bit heavier and the engine technology appears to be quite superior... Finland(MF) vs Italy(NH). I'll await your assessment. Does the demo unit have a cab?
> ..and thanks again.


Yes the Demo has a cab. It is not a bad cab. I think they have the weight on this tractor in the right place. The demo has no add weight to the rear end. I could pick up 2 4x5 heavy second cut alfalfa bales (1100+ pounds) no problem and not feel very light in the back end. It was not until I pick up 2 5x6 bales (1200 pounds) that it finally felt light. But than again the 4610 is not that heavy of a tractor for its horsepower. It feels firmly planted to the ground.

I also looked at the NH T4-75. It is a nicer version of my workmaster tractor( they both have the same motor) It looked like not a bad tractor till I read about the gears in the transmission. Unless you want really slow gears there is no advantage to the 12 speed cause those 4 extra gears over the 8 speed are all slower than first on the 8 speed. Also the T4-75 seems to have a gap in the gears in the 4-6 mile an hour range. Where is where I end up doing a lot of my field work.

The massey has a nice increase in speeds on the transmission. Every gear a bit faster than the next in both hi and low range. It has a high top speed of about 24 miles per hour so it cuts down on travel time(6 miles an hour faster than my workmaster). Also reverse speeds are slightly slow than forward which is nice.

So far the only things I have really done is feed cattle and move bales of the field through some very deep snow. But I must say it is a nice loader tractor. Just trying to run it some now to get a handle on how much fuel it uses.


----------



## hog987

memory said:


> When we were shopping for a new tractor, we considered the MF 4600 series. I have heard they are supposed to be good tractors. I believe they have the Perkins engine and we have had good luck out of Perkins. We have two older tractors with the Perkins and they have been good to us.
> 
> One reason we didn't go with them is because of the dealer. The closest MF dealer to us would not return our call. We told him we are serious about buying one and never did call us back. That dealer is known to be hard to rude. I think if the dealer was willing to deal, we would have bought the MF instead of the Case Farmall 95C.


The massey 4600 series has a 3 cylinder sisu(agco) engine. The same motor in the new 5600 series. One thing I like is that it meets the new emission standards with out an exhaust filter. Doing a bunch of loader work loading hay and feeding cattle in the winter I really don't want an exhaust filter cause it will be cleaning its self more than normal. At least it does on my truck. I can go four times as far between cleaning in the summer as in the winter.


----------



## longmeadow farm

Let me respond to a number of questions

McCormick is manufactured ARGO (not AGCO) who also builds Landini... nice tractors, but my local dealership is not the best. But I'll take another look. Landini is a nice tractor and McCormick uses a Perkins which is a great engine.

The SISU diesel in the 4600 et al, is manufactured in Finland. SISU is owned by AGCO. Very nice diesel engine reputation. As hog987 has stated it is Tier 4 compliant without the need for an exhaust filter. If SISU can engineer a tier 4 this why..what about the other manufactures???

Hog987 is correct..Deere, Kubota and New Holland all provide 12 speed power reverser transmissions with very poor "field" speeds. The Massey is the exception and that is way I'm looking at it. However it is important to "adjust" the ground speed to the 540 pto rpms. When you adjust the New Holland T4.75 to the 540 regular and economy PTO rpms you get a different picture of what ground speed to expect. But the Massey is by far the best "field" grade tractor of the lot.

I've looked at tractors in the 50 - 53K price range. Cab, 4wd, loader, dual rear SCVs, power reverser/wet clutch, extendable lower links, radio, epto, etc.. The models looked at are Deere 5075E, New Holland T4.75, Farmall C75 (same as the New Holland), Massey 4608 and the Kubota 7060. The Deere 5083E is not available any more so you have to look at the 5085E.. at 58K it is way too expensive... but a bit heavier than the rest.

I presently own a 5000 series Deere that has been a maintenance nightmare.. hydraulic pump, oil cooler, fuel pump and delivery lines, radiator, engine clutch, spun bearing in the bell housing, Pto and engine clutch cables both snapped, AC compartment cover seal was not installed correctly from the factory..leaked..what a mess in there. Hydraulic lines not mounted using a cushion mount.. resulting in wear holes.... I could go on... The new 5000 series Deeres have hydraulic relief valve problems resulting in overheating of the hydraulic system...melted fuel tanks etc.. The new 5075E cab version doesn't have a flat floor. If I swing my legs to the right I collide with the range shifter..my knee that is..the AC drier is beneath the cab and the electrical connections can become covered with cow "S#!^" or mud if you prefer. The hydraulic lines beneath the cab are much too exposed to be "safe". The 2013, 5075E cab version is a piece of garbage and I don't know how Deere gets away with selling a Tier 2 engine in 2013. My understanding of the "standards" is that a tier 3 is required. But Deere has published that Tier 2 is OK.. seems that they are making up their own rules. The Massey is a little more $$$, but a lot more tractor for the money.. just check the engine torque vs the rest.


----------



## Vol

Maybe you might want to consider a different Deere series.....such as the M. I definitely would not recommend the E series to anyone. I believe the M series(5075M) in the 60 PTO class will be right in the price ballpark that you have stated(50K-53K). Either way, sounds like the the MF may be right for you.

Regards, Mike


----------



## Fireman355

Have you looked at the 2600 series Massey Ferguson????


----------



## hog987

I think or at least I hope. If massey is onto something with this motor than in the future the diesels will all be less complex. Not having to add the urea or have exhaust filters. Some of it has to do with the 3 cylinder engine. Iam not excally sure what?? But I hope they are onto something to make it better for all of us.


----------



## custom farmer

I own a MF 4610 for about 8 months now. I bought it from a JD dealer with 96hours on it. In some ways it has been a great tractor, but it is not perfect.

Here is a list of pros and cons from about 150 hours of use, mainly with loader work or round baling:

PROS
* Controls and levers positioned very nicely

* Hydraulics are fast, especially on the loader

* Tractor is about right for hp to weight ratio

* No emissions maintenance

* Cooling system is more than adequate to keep the engine cool in hot weather under full load

* Heater works very well

*Nice progression of speed thru all the gears.

*Frame, chassis, 3 point, built heavy and strong.

CONS
* 3 cylinder engine has an awful lot of vibration and is noisy. Depending on load (if you lug the engine down some), and at just the right rpms, everything in the whole cab vibrates to such an extent that I have spent hours searching for ways to tighten things and to find ways to minimize noise, to no avail.

* Cab is very noisy, see above

* Air conditioning is weak, cannot keep up in normal conditions

* Engine has very low power until it is fully warmed up. I think this is controlled on purpose by the engine computer.

* Engine is made in China. While Agco bought Sisu in Finland, and Sisu designed this engine and it bears the Sisu name - Agco built a new factory in China just to build these engines for the 4600 series. So the tractor is made by Iseki in Japan, but the engine is made in China with the Sisu name









* Really dislike the transmission. Granted, I put thousands of hours on tractors with hydro transmissions, and my last one was an advanced 6 speed hydro (so I am biased) - this transmission is NOT user friendly. 1. It is VERY hard to shift. When speeding up or down I can almost never get it into 4th on the first try. 5th is better, 6th always feels like it only goes in halfway, and I have had it pop out. 2. The power shuttle is a great idea but is not smooth. Especially if you do anything with the clutch. If you are in an open space and just shuttle it isn't bad. But if you ease into a spot, press the clutch, shuttle the lever, and then let the clutch out - there is a delay where nothing happens and then it engages from 0% to 100% in an instant, causing violent jerks. 3. The clutch has no sweet spot. It is all electronic and although it moves quite a distance, it goes from 0% to 100% in about 1/2" travel. Also, if you try to feather it all the tractor makes you deaf with an ear splitting warning beep and it says you are riding the clutch pedal. You almost cannot back up to a piece of equipment without it doing this to you. 4. All of the problems with the transmission described above are worse in cold weather.

* Rear hydraulics - 1.They do not have float function on the levers. Dealer said it wasn't available when I bought mine, but is now. 2.The rear couplers are not push/pull connect. They have no break away either. If your implement unhooks you will damage something. You also CANNOT disconnect or connect anything under even a slight pressure. Having no float on the levers makes it worse. You must stop tractor and jiggle lever to depressurize so you can unhook.

* Front headlight shrouds are cheap plastic and fell off. Warranty replaced them but dealer made me pay shipping. New ones they sent are somewhat improved design. Still cheap plastic.

* Fuel tank is WAY too small. 24 gallons on a 90 horse tractor? get real. I can kill the tank in about 8 or 9 hours with my round baler in normal load conditions. There are actually two tanks with one fill point and the connector between is small. That means you fill real slow and wait for fuel to siphon to other tank and then top it off again, repeat about 6 times to get tank full.

* Too many error codes. Engine has given me a number of different error codes, mainly with fuel system. Had dealer here with computers to try to resolve. Fiddled around half a day to diagnose. Had to pay next day air charges on a part from Agco in the middle of hay season. Got problems resolved that time but ever since tractor has noticeably less torque. Plus warranty paid for only 30 minutes of the service guy's time, and no travel charges. (my dealer is not real close.) Now just today it threw another error code about fuel system, different one this time. Still unresolved.

* Starts hard in cold weather. The tractor has no block heater and no glow plugs. It has a lame air intake heater which is mostly worthless. If it gets below 20 degrees F you will have some trouble getting it running. It has always started but sometimes took multiple attempts.

So there you have it. That's where I'm at. I don't know how all of this compares to JD, Kubota, or NH. I think the others may not be any better if you compare $$ and hp. Kubota is known to have undersized cooling systems and their engines always overheat (personal experience), NH is known to have poor ground speeds and poor control layouts, JD also is known to have some issues, especially in the E series, and is usually more $$.
Would I buy Massey again, probably, but I will never buy a 3 cylinder this size again. There is just no way a 3 cylinder can run as quiet and smooth as a 4, 5, or 6. My choice would be the 5600 series with the 4 cylinder Sisu actually made in Finland with the Dyna 4 transmission. Totally European tractor, not Japan and China. Way better cab. If you can afford it, definitely step up...
PA farmer


----------



## deadmoose

With that many cons vs pros I would think ANY other brand would be better. Sorry to hear of your woes.


----------



## somedevildawg

Welcome to haytalk custom farmer....appreciate your unbiased evaluation of the tractor


----------



## red501

NEWBIE PROVIDED A VERY GOOD REVIEW OF THE MF 4610. I HAVE A NEW (70 HRS) 4608.

I AGREE WITH THE PRO'S AND CON'S HE HAS SEEN BUT WOULD ADD: IF HE THINKS THE CAB AIR DOSN'T WORK IN PA HE SHOULD TRY IT IN THE MIDDLE OF ARKANSAS IN THE MIDDLE OF AUGUST...


----------



## somedevildawg

Welcome to haytalk red501....


----------



## slowzuki

Kind of a shame, these little brand engineering lines of tractors never turn out as well as in house equipment, adds a layer of trouble too with solving issues at the dealer where it isn't really MF's tractor like a 5600. I can just imagine the trouble trying to get a dealer issue to iseki to get a response. Same issues with the indian made deere's and the LS made landini's etc.


----------



## timberjackrob

I agree with some of the cons especially the beeper on the clutch pedal but I have not had any problems with feathering the clutch at all shuttle works great also. It is a little noisier than I would like but after installing some dyna mat it has reduced the noise level and also helps keep the cab a lot cooler have owned a 4610 since July it is easy on fuel for what I use it for which is cutting hay clipping pasture and feeding cows.it has been good tractor so far wish it had a light to tell u when it is in 4wd I have not experienced any problems shifting the gears seems to be a good tractor for the price.does anyone know the location of the beeper seems to be in the top of cab I'm definitely gonna find it and tone it down soon?


----------



## timberjackrob

Forgot to add the block heater is available installed one before winter works great. Not had any trouble starting the tractor without it down to 15 degrees a few times not tried it below that without plugging it up just easier on the engine. Mine is equipped with float valves and have not had any error codes yet dealer told me they had a little trouble last winter with some fuel gelling on some 4600 series I have been using plenty of conditioner no problems yet been down to zero a couple of times looks like will have a good test on that in a few days calling for sub zero temps. Mine does not have quick connect couplers on hyd either but think I will change them out


----------



## CCW13

I have a MF 4610 and just wanted to share my experiences. I have just over 100 hours on it. I had problems with it not running well especially in the winter. I sent it in for the 100 hour service and they said it required a computer program update. They did this update and it came back a new tractor. It runs smoother now and it never skipped a beat this winter. I hope it keeps running like this because for the price I paid for it you can't beat it. I do have some complaints with it but no one makes a perfect tractor....not even John Deere


----------



## somedevildawg

Easy CCW


----------



## CCW13

somedevildawg said:


> Easy CCW


Lol sorry.....all in good fun.


----------



## JD3430

Wow just read this thread first time. Custom farmer is awesome for divulging downside to his MF. Wish everyone would do that. As far gaps the tractor goes, I'd be furious if I had a tractor with that many issues. 
I mean, thought my Kubbys had a few annoying problems....
Now I feel a little better.


----------



## timberjackrob

700hrs on the 4610 now and no issues been a great tractor for the money.


----------



## JD3430

MF tractors always intrigued me. They look heavy built, but they seemed to always use an "off" brand of Diesel engine and nobody runs them here.


----------



## CCW13

The MF 4610 was my first tractor purchase. I used the Equine Savings program and saved money. I also used the program to save money on my eXmark mower. I got my 4610 for thousands less than the JD 5085e , Kubota 8560 and the New Holland T4.75.


----------



## JD3430

I bet they can save a lot of money having parts made in China.


----------



## CCW13

JD3430 said:


> I bet they can save a lot of money having parts made in China.


Well evidently you took my post as something negative against the other brands or your brand. I was saying I saved money because of the Equine Savings program. Just trying to pass on possible helpful information to someone possibly looking at the Massey Ferguson.


----------



## JD3430

CCW13 said:


> Well evidently you took my post as something negative against the other brands or your brand. I was saying I saved money because of the Equine Savings program. Just trying to pass on possible helpful information to someone possibly looking at the Massey Ferguson.


Oh, sorry. It wasn't meant that way. All brands are saving money by making in China. In this thread I was referring to the MF having a Chinese mill under the bonnet.
I just bought a brand new Deere CX-15, whole damn thing is Chinese parts assembled in Mexico....
Wasn't much cheaper, either!!! Lol


----------



## CCW13

JD3430 said:


> Oh, sorry. It wasn't meant that way. All brands are saving money by making in China. In this thread I was referring to the MF having a Chinese mill under the bonnet.
> I just bought a brand new Deere CX-15, whole damn thing is Chinese parts assembled in Mexico....
> Wasn't much cheaper, either!!! Lol


Understood. I thought maybe I had offended you when it wasn't my intention. I understand what you are saying though. The motor is assembled in China but I believe the parts are still brought in from Finland. I think...I may be wrong though. I'm currently in the market for a used baler and rake. I had sticker shock looking at new balers!!!


----------



## timberjackrob

I wasn't aware that perkins diesel was an off brand engine??


----------



## CCW13

timberjackrob said:


> I wasn't aware that perkins diesel was an off brand engine??


Maybe he was referring to the Sisu engines. But I don't really think they could be considered off brand either. Maybe not mainstream but not an off brand.


----------



## timberjackrob

yes you could be right ccw13 but like you said a company that has been in business since 1931 could hardly be considered an off brand either.


----------



## cornshucker

We have had better luck with Perkins than any diesel we have ever run. (Including Detroit, International, Deere). the early 60's models were prone to leak oil but the latter models usually stayed dry.


----------

